Am I a fan or a Muppet?

Do Statler and Waldorf have company?



Am I a fan or a Muppet?

Block 113, here we come


Another season, and yet more wailing and gnashing of teeth from gooners, who are increasingly asking the question – am I a fan or a Muppet?

I think the reason why Mr van Persie has incurred such stick is he has acted like an employee of a business, and not as a player at a football club. In truth, I think if Thierry Henry was in the same position right now, he too would have faced the wrath of the Arsenal faithful. It all boils down to the fact that a lot of gooners are confused over whether we support a football club or a business.

We all like to think we support a football club. When I first started supporting Arsenal, it was the 1980s; tickets were as cheap as chips, there was none of that sitting down malarkey, and our captain turned up, signed his contract and went on his way (sometimes without reading it, from some accounts). In the mid-'90s, one of our directors dipped into his own pocket to finance the transfer of the most talented player I have ever seen grace the Highbury turf – that’s Dennis Bergkamp, by the way, not Chris Kiwomya.

These days, Arsène seems to run the club as a business, carefully managing the outgoings and incomings. He presides over a business that is financed purely by its fans, fans who are asked to pay the highest prices in the land but aren’t rewarded with any silverware. The club may sell the myth that we remain a football club and, in truth, the marketing department are quite good at it. Before every game at the Emirates these days, there’s a video leading up to kick-off featuring Highbury heroes of the past. Each new shirt is usually accompanied with some guff about how Herbert Chapman is glad you have parted with your hard-earned cash - never mind the fact that it’s redcurrant and not red, as if adding a redcurrant tint makes everything okay.

But the bottom line is we are not a football club anymore, we aren’t even fans – we are customers. Wenger woke up to the fact years ago, which is why he manages the club in the way he does. It’s not his fault; he’s got with the programme, and so should the customers.

And if we’re all customers, you can’t really throw a wobbly when one of the employees leaves.

Just pay your money in, like a good little Muppet.


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52
comments

  1. GG89

    Jul 28, 2012, 23:40 #24843

    You are a muppet if you beleive.... 1. Clubs will stop going into debt because Platini doesnt like it. 2. The Gooners can defend their own goal any better next season considering the signings or potential signings. 3. That Kroenke is a better owner than Usmanov. 4. AW still has all his neurons in the right place, we lose millions every year apparently and Wenger is over 60.... 7 seasons x 1 million, 7,000,000... about the same as Diaby's salary, funny that. 5. That Diaby will play more than 10 games next season.

  2. Andrew Cohen

    Jul 28, 2012, 8:25 #24835

    I look at what is happening at Rangers and Portsmouth and it sickens me. After 20 years of Rupert Murdoch's money we have home grown players the best of whom can't keep or pass the ball, and a league where, as Mandy correctly states, destruction is round the corner for many clubs. The league needs either nationalization or total administration of all clubs, with wages to be fixed at £100,000 a year maximum. Those players who don't like it, their contracts terminated by law without compensation, can leave. The financial madness would end and we could have our football back, albeit with fewer so called stars. Money doesn't buy you happiness, and the present situation is an excellent illustration of that. Paying through the nose to watch poorly coached players who couldn't care less about the club is like the death of hope, and your football club is about hope. It should take you away from your horrible job and the bills you can't pay for a few hours. There is no rational reason not to tear down the whole thing and start again, unless of course you worry about the livelyhood of a few agents. I look forward to people telling me that it can't be done, just like the power of the unions couldn't be broken, English Cricket couldn't get its self respect back or the Tour de France won by an englishman called Wiggins.

  3. UTU

    Jul 28, 2012, 0:49 #24833

    Graham Sinons is Bang On. The Club is a Business, fine but if the product is substandard don't continue to purchase it. The Answer for Arsenal fans is simple, don't give Kronke and Wenger your money. Arsenal FC need a change of ownership and management to compete for top honors in the future.

  4. West Stand Sidcup rob

    Jul 27, 2012, 21:17 #24830

    Spot on though kind on wengers role in this, he makes millions each year from this new "approach" to profit rather than seriously challenge. I have been a season ticket holder for almost 30 years but the change to watching Cray Wanderers FC is getting more likely particularly with todays financial constraints. And when I give it up Arsenal will treat me like i never even knew the club.

  5. GoonerGoal!

    Jul 27, 2012, 11:05 #24806

    So I and people who share similar views on the way the club is going are narrow and boring without anything original to say, not intelligent enough to see the bigger picture, and apparently a sheep. It seems the voices of the AKB’s are becoming louder and more vitriolic in exact proportion to their diminishing numbers. We will see just how loud they are at the Emirates as the season unfolds. I’m expecting us to struggle to “achieve” even a UEFA Europe League spot, but unlike me, those “intelligent enough to see the bigger picture” will probably claim that as yet more “success”!

  6. Gooner S

    Jul 27, 2012, 7:53 #24805

    @Save I agree that going to a premier league game is expensive. But looking at prices for spurs and Chelsea we seem to be comparable. I will be paying on average 45.00 per game for my season ticket and that includes 7 cup games. Spurs and chelsea do not include these games. Not sure who you are comparing us with. 45 quid is a lot of money but who else is going to pay for a workforce on thousands of pounds per week? If we want to competent we have to pay the money as fans/customers.

  7. Les

    Jul 27, 2012, 1:24 #24804

    Interesting article and true. RvP is an employee and what employee would not move to a company who are prepared to pay two or three times his salary. From the other perspective though what company would take care of an employee who is on the sick for so many years? One good season in eight and he wants to go. Na$ri only had half a good season and scarpered. Employees have no gratitude

  8. GoonerRon

    Jul 26, 2012, 22:30 #24803

    @ Gooner S - you are absolutely spot on.

  9. Save

    Jul 26, 2012, 21:12 #24802

    Fan or customer? A state of mind? I could afford to watch arsenal in the 80s. I can't afford to watch arsenal today. Our prices are double those of other premier league clubs. For me, as a customer, that is rational.

  10. Gooner S

    Jul 26, 2012, 19:56 #24800

    Football clubs have always been businesses, those who think otherwise are just being naieve. When did Arsenal put corporate boxes in at the old clock end? When was the bond issue? When did shirt sponsorship start? These are just 'recent' examples. In terms of players leaving Frank Stapleton is an example in recent history of a player in his prime jumping ship for elsewhere. What about Charlie George? What about ray Kennedy? It isn't new! It happens. At the risk of pointing out the blindingly obvious you pay your money to watch a game of football. There are no guarantees of a win in any game. It is expensive to watch Arsenal but they aren't pulling the wool over anybody's eyes. If you don't like it don't pay your money and don't go! I have sympathy for those that would like to go and can't because they can't afford to. In the 80's I couldn't afford to go so for me, at that time, tickets weren't "cheap as chips". Beeing a 'fan' is a state of mind. It isn't entierly rational. If you have paid to watch Arsenal then you were a customer you just didn't realise it or think of it in that way.

  11. fozzys mate

    Jul 26, 2012, 18:27 #24799

    Hayes - what's a BSM? Come to think of it what's an AAA as someone once called me on here? No need for the spats all opinions are valid. What winds us all up is superior behaviour calling other posters stupid or daft. We all have the right to cast ideas without being AAAs or BSMs whatever they are? Like when someone like Joshua starts spouting off about people knowing nothing about business and finance. Any of us could be experts on anything. Let's exchange views not barbs and insults.

  12. billthered

    Jul 26, 2012, 17:40 #24798

    Lets start by saying all the AKB,s have something in their thoughts that ring true.You must all agree that he does know what he is doing,and must be the best manager ever.Let me explain one or two things,firstly he runs a very tight ship with regards the financial aspects of the club which I think no other manager in world football has to do,and that is why the owner loves him to death.Secondly how many other managers could get fourth position with some of the dross that we have turning out each week at the Grove,think about it we argue about our lack of talent but not the special one or old blue nose could have got us champions league football with these players think about it.

  13. dave

    Jul 26, 2012, 17:40 #24797

    Stop paying the prices. Where is the protest? What are the supporters groups doing about it?

  14. Theo's Bikini-Line

    Jul 26, 2012, 17:26 #24796

    Hayes: my little mutton. Did calling you an AKB really upset you that much? Aaah, you sensitive soul you. I'll try not to be so harsh next time to spare your feelings.... xxx

  15. ppp

    Jul 26, 2012, 14:22 #24795

    do me a lemon - so players never left the club in the past? you just got old and don't look at things childishly anymore. the club has always been a business - players have got better agents and the power is with them - some might say correctly.

  16. underacheiver

    Jul 26, 2012, 13:58 #24794

    I`m a muppet because:- I think wenger is actually going to buy a few more players. I think Bould may improve the defence I'm getting optimistic about the coming season I live in hope

  17. RJ

    Jul 26, 2012, 13:48 #24793

    @ Hayes, @Theo B_L - Calm down lads, we've all had a few...

  18. Mark

    Jul 26, 2012, 13:26 #24792

    ive enjoyed all these idiots who didnt think fab was going then didnt think nas then didnt think rvp. these are the fans who still today dont know what makes arsenal club tick.

  19. Hayes

    Jul 26, 2012, 12:48 #24791

    @Theos B-L Poor lamb. Did calling you a sheep insult you? Aaah...petal xx

  20. Tony Evans

    Jul 26, 2012, 12:39 #24790

    Good stuff Graham - the heart and soul has gone from the club and for the first time that I can remember I am not even looking forward to the start of the season.

  21. Theo's Bikini-Line

    Jul 26, 2012, 12:03 #24789

    Hayes: Remind us all again who threw the first insult by calling those of us complaining 'sheep'? Now you compound it by claiming you're somehow more 'intelligent' than the critics because you can see the bigger picture that we morons obviously can't while along swallowing the bull-crap being served to you by the club!! Sorry matey but whether you like it or not, that is AKB behaviour. 'Methinks thou doth protest too much'!!

  22. Hayes

    Jul 26, 2012, 10:29 #24788

    @Theos B-L & GoonerGoal - So if my opinion is not exactly the same as yours I'm an AKB?? What a narrow minded pair you are,unfortunately that is the way some fans/this Forum are turning recently,agree with us or you're an AKB. Think of something original to say or do,it appears from your posts you are just jumping on the same negative ship! You're BORING!! Unfortunately with the amount of money in football these days sound business judgement is needed or you fail to survive, I don't agree on all decisions and would like the cash splashed, but I am intelligent enough to see the bigger picture. GG - applaud you on a clever/witty response, but please I'm a fan of The Arsenal, not an AKB or BSM.

  23. Wombledin

    Jul 26, 2012, 4:53 #24787

    Wenger is so obsessed with running the club on business terms that he has put himself on a huge high horse about financial fair play which in his mind absolves him of all blame for his perennial failure to win trophies. Arsenal F.C. has morphed into Arsene Corporation Ltd all the while feeling morally superior to its oil rich rivals. Its the perfect excuse to keep investing as minimally in the squad as possible to squeak into CL qualification from year to year. We sacrifice trophies for finance while our rivals sacrifice finance for trophies. Ironic.

  24. DW Thomas

    Jul 26, 2012, 4:37 #24786

    We are muppets, so true. Who else would spend significant $$ on this team unless you just kept hoping for a change? Wenger has won nothing for 7 years now. Where is the pressure to win trophies? How does he continue to make his grand salary with no recent success? Tired of hearing about how great he is/was. No man should have free reign in his position, even with his past glories. We are the muppets and Arsene the master puppeteer. Yet his words for some years now ring so false and reek of ego! Time to cut the strings!

  25. Son of a Gun

    Jul 26, 2012, 2:53 #24785

    This is the first season of my life when I just know we don't stand any chance of winning the title. Wenger out now!

  26. Theo's Bikini-Line

    Jul 26, 2012, 0:00 #24784

    Excellent retort GoonerGoal to the usual - but not unexpected - AKB nonsense trotted out by the likes of Hayes!!

  27. goonercolesyboy

    Jul 25, 2012, 22:48 #24783

    The positive comments come from the fans, the negative ones come from the muppets....simples

  28. Mandy Dodd

    Jul 25, 2012, 22:37 #24782

    Since the much venerated David dein and a few others helped dream up the premiership, most but the lucky few mainly unsustainable clubs have had to become businesses to survive. Whatever the rights and wrongs of this situation, arsenal have done better than most. Some clubs will over the coming months and years will cease to be clubs of businesses, I am sure we would all hate to ever see an arsenal newco. Nostalgia is a wonderful thing, but it must be seen for what it is..

  29. jjetplane

    Jul 25, 2012, 22:05 #24781

    Things just get weirder with possible transfer movement and Theo thinking 'what me gunna do' - Rob whatya thinking? er who are these people sitting in our seats? Talking/laughing with the prof. getting all paranoid - Stan is luvvin' it - get some new fish Arsene! get those 'muppets' on their toes. oh f... Chelsea now have a squad bigger than Barc and City are nowhere, and MU are looking like Leeds and and Its the arse! like the old Arse scrapping away, getting pissed on boiled chicken Wake up you Muppet! New Season!

  30. The Noise

    Jul 25, 2012, 21:41 #24780

    Dazza... SPOT ON MATE!!!

  31. norfolk gooner

    Jul 25, 2012, 20:50 #24779

    podolski has no squad number, is he waiting for the number 10 shirt!

  32. Stroud Green Road Boy

    Jul 25, 2012, 19:09 #24777

    KJS is spot on with his comment. The club treat us as customers yet expect us to react like loyal, unquestioning supporters. Wenger is outraged to be criticised by those who are funding the business model that keeps him in a job he'd never still have under any other model e.g. one where the target was trophies.

  33. Greg71

    Jul 25, 2012, 19:05 #24776

    @GoonerGoal You may be the count,the club think that the list of counts who support/pay out and attend is endless ! This year the worms have turned and not just down to the price,come renewal time it was always bread and water for a month or two and nights in because the ticket came first,second,third and even fourth !

  34. Unbeaten 03/04

    Jul 25, 2012, 18:34 #24775

    We are definitely muppets....by Arsenal Club of course!!!

  35. fozzy's mate

    Jul 25, 2012, 18:11 #24774

    I'm in the same boat as you but prefer going kermit than around tescos with the mrs. I have been saying the same as most on hear for years. Unlike some I think OGL actually likes the business model as it means he is under no real pressure to deliver silverware - actual not the trophy he says we win every year. I heard us described as a drifting club with a has been manager who has lost his way. I actually think that is a decent definition of post 2006 Arsenal.

  36. RJ

    Jul 25, 2012, 17:44 #24773

    Graham - Your piece started off well, and is better than many of the recent string of doom on this site. I like you started going in the 80s. For me, I remain a fan of Arsenal Football Club, and whilst I can afford to, I will support it and its players by going to the Emirates with my boy (or girl about 50% of the time) on our season tickets, cheering the boys on (even the Muppets), going to away games when I can, getting frustrated and cross and enjoying the good times when they come. As you rightly say, the modern football fans dilemma is that we support a concept (football club) that is AND SADLY HAS TO BE run as a business - regardless of whether Kroenke, Gazidis or my Old Dad (which is unlikely as he died not a rich man 16 years ago) are in charge, you have to make the books balance - otherwise it is Rangers, Leeds, Portsmouth when the cash runs out. Muppet - yes - but not for handing over cash to a business, but for falling into the blind emotion of the love of a football club. To close by misquoting the song you allure to "Am I a Spud, or am I a Gooner - If I'm a Gooner, I'm a Gooner of a Man, but if I'm a Spud, I'm an inexcrable piece of ****"

  37. GoonerGoal!

    Jul 25, 2012, 17:37 #24772

    @Hayes... Unfair on sheep! Sheep do not usually complain about what they see around them. Sheep never refuse to accept the status quo, even when it would clearly be in their own interest to do so. Sheep have never reluctantly removed themselves from their surroundings in order to escape what they are expected to accept. Sheep have never thought about boycotts of fields, withholding wool, or any other positive action that might force their owner to take a long hard look at what they lay before their sheep. Instead, sheep usually do nothing, say nothing, follow every direction they are given, and generally behave like good little sheep, even as their prize lambs are taken from them. So you tell me who are the real sheep? The AKB’s or the ever restless growing majority? All too often fanatics and dictators commandeer the will of the people. Do not believe what you are told, look at what’s happening before your eyes and decide for yourself. Just because a particular doctrine is endlessly repeated does not make it valid. Protest the submissive surrender of football‘s greatest ideals, in favour of blatant profiteering. VIVE LA REVOLUTION! To which I'm sure you will answer... baaa baaaa

  38. Rob

    Jul 25, 2012, 16:36 #24771

    Short, Sharp and very much to the point. The truth is that most of us still think we are 'fans'. We would - desperately - like to be and remain, 'fans'. But for the 'Club' we are ' customers ' and it's the 'Match Day Experience' not the match, that counts. That's the main reason I no longer go. I can stomach under performing players getting exorbitant and ill-deserved wages - (at least to a point). But if I want to make Kronke richer, I'd sooner spend my money at ASDA and get something tangible in return.

  39. Noz

    Jul 25, 2012, 15:37 #24770

    Good, enjoyable, pretty spot on article. Funny, I described myself as a muppet when I renewed my season ticket. Maybe this is why I cannot stand Wenger or The American now because despite being a lifelong, committed, vocal fan I do feel like Gonzo et al by filling the pockets of businessmen rather than investing in the love of my life.

  40. D

    Jul 25, 2012, 15:01 #24769

    I felt like a muppet for reading that depressing piece

  41. Ronster

    Jul 25, 2012, 14:36 #24768

    Photo: Silent Stan to Ivan.....''I see your boys whipped England at The Oval...no clue what's going on mind...care to explain the no ball(s) rule......!!?

  42. Hayes

    Jul 25, 2012, 14:35 #24767

    I bought my ST and I'm not a muppet, I'm a fan....just because people have a different outlook than you doesn't mean they're muppets even if the desire for our team to succeed is the same ?? Think of something original to write instead of bleating a load of tripe like some of you sheep do !!

  43. Dymond

    Jul 25, 2012, 14:02 #24765

    Spot on.

  44. nobby

    Jul 25, 2012, 13:50 #24764

    Muppet perhaps?

  45. alfy

    Jul 25, 2012, 13:48 #24763

    I AGREE 100%,BUT I STILL PAY MY S/TICKET EVERY YEAR WATCH ALL THE HOME GAMES,GET DEPRESSED AND THE END OFF THE SEASON, SAY NEVER AGAIN ,BUT I STILL RENEW.

  46. GoonerGoal!

    Jul 25, 2012, 13:47 #24762

    If I am to be a Muppet, then I am The Count, counting down on the reign of Wenger. One season... Two seasons... Three seasons... Four seasons... Five seasons... Six seasons... Seven seasons.... soon to be Eight seasons, no doubt!

  47. Peter Wain

    Jul 25, 2012, 13:45 #24761

    I do not blame RVP for wanting to move away I blame the owner board and manager who sole aim is fourth place in the premier ship. We need a clear put and a fresh start with people at the helm who are prepared to invest in the club so we can at least compete.

  48. maguiresbridge gooner

    Jul 25, 2012, 13:43 #24760

    A good picture of the directors box to accompany your piece.If RVP was to change his mind and stay (which he wont)after a goal against man u or a hat trick against the spuds all the haters would be singing his name again.Your right we all support a football club but it's being run as a business and the most important thing about this business is profits.The chances of one of our so called directors or owner ever dipping into their own pockets to help bring in a player in the class of DB10 are zero.

  49. chris

    Jul 25, 2012, 13:42 #24759

    if we were customers we would all be entitled to a full refund. we pay these stupid prices ( my season ticket £985 ) because we are fans and are also constantly reminded of the st waiting list is there so you give up your season ticket at your own peril. how many of us would renew every year if we knew we could buy a season ticket anytime we felt like it? so the answer to your question is that we are most definatly muppets of the highest order, just thank god your not a spud!!!!

  50. KJS

    Jul 25, 2012, 13:41 #24758

    Dont disagree with the sentiment of the article at all, but if we as fans have to buy into the idea of being a customer, then so do the club. If they want to treat us as consumers then they can't complain when we start behaving like consumers, which means when its **** we are gonna tell you its ****. If you get served a crap meal in a restaurant, you don't worry about whether you damage the chef's confidence when you send it back telling him its **** and you don't wanna listen to how he showed great mental strength in preparing your meal despite previous complaints, or how we would know if its **** seeing as we havent worked in a kitchen for more than half a day !!

  51. Mikie

    Jul 25, 2012, 13:30 #24757

    Spot on son,Spot on

  52. Dazza

    Jul 25, 2012, 13:22 #24756

    Spot on. The club are taking us for mugs but sadly 80% of our "fans" still don't see it. Propaganda like "we don't buy superstars we make them" and "4th is like winning a trophy" is used as a way of lowering expectations of Arsenal supporters. And now we are expected to be happy with mediocrity. Many of the new breed of Arsenal fan forget that we were actually the 3rd most successful club in the country pre-Wenger. The way they talk makes you think that we were a club with no history of silverware until Wenger took over.