Transfers and policy

Does Arsene Wenger have to make more than he spends on transfers?



Transfers and policy

Sagna: Another one the club are winding down?


Recently, we have heard many concerned comments relating to our transfer-policy and the annoyingly large number of player-contracts being allowed to run into their final year. The case of Bac is now being quoted, as his contract will run into the final year at the beginning of next season. Will we learn from the past, with players leaving on a reduced transfer-fee or a free?

Clearly, the last question shouldn’t even need to be asked. It’s not a case of learning, as we keep repeating, and as it’s happened so often now, it can only be deemed to be an actual policy decision.

Call me a cynic, but given our track-record with “sustainability”, or sweating an asset as I now prefer to see it, this would be just another way of keeping player-costs down, irrespective of the potential damage to the long-term sustainability of the team’s competitiveness. Surely, when taken in the context of today’s track-record, someone high up has decided - well, a contract’s a contract, and why negotiate early and pay more (irrespective of the known consequences if we don’t), the logic being that, if A.N. Other has a contract of say £100K per week for four years, it equates to an expected (and hence budgeted) outlay of 4 x 52 = 208 weeks x £100K = £20.8 million over the length of the contract.

If we renegotiate this (as is the norm in many cases at other clubs) at the beginning of year three, to say £120K per week, it then increases the total outlay by 104 weeks x £20K or a little over £2 million, an increase of 9.6%. By holding on and not negotiating, we keep that cost down, or alternatively we come up with an offer that is obviously unacceptable to the player (no matter what we in the real word may think of the sums involved).

The only time this “policy” seems to be reversed is in the case of the absolute gems of our younger players - who, by Premier League standards anyway, are on the “poorer money” compared to the rest of the first team, the Ox being a current example, and Wilshere a few years ago. The calculation here is that the increase on a lower weekly amount is worth investing in, as the player’s replacement would have to be top quality and hence incur potentially both a transfer-fee and a higher salary.

That’s not to say we shouldn’t hold players to contracts, but we all know that in today’s world we can’t, the result being that the club gets a double boost, i.e. they keep the wages at the same level for year three, and then sell and still be in profit before year four starts. Occasionally, this has gone wrong and a player has left on a free. However, what’s the betting that, this time next year, Bac is plying his trade elsewhere, having seen out year three on his original terms whilst bringing in a transfer-fee and showing a trading profit to the club. Does anyone know if AW has terms in his contract for a bonus award on the basis of a percentage of the club’s transfer/trading profit? Like I said, please don’t call me a cynic…


NEW! Subscribe to our weekly Gooner Fanzine newsletter for all the latest news, views, and videos from the intelligent voice of Arsenal supporters since 1987.

Please note that we will not share your email address with any 3rd parties.


Article Rating

Leave a comment

Sign-in with your Online Gooner forum login to add your comment. If you do not have a login register here.

23
comments

  1. Ron

    Sep 12, 2012, 16:47 #26298

    Mike - Agree, though our 'best'(most since gone) players trying to win those Carling Cup finals in 07 and 2011 and reach highr levels in the EPL while being asked to do so in the Co of Rosicky, Diaby, Traore and Co did hinder them i feel. I take your point though. Its a good point in that those who have left to improve their lot all proved to be a bunch of chinless, losing bottlers to a great degree. In that sense, what have Arsenal lost really? I say not a lot! Many disagree of course as theyre entitled to do.

  2. maguiresbridge gooner

    Sep 12, 2012, 12:34 #26296

    Mike agreed maybe if we'd won those two and one or two more most of them might still be here.

  3. Mike

    Sep 12, 2012, 10:12 #26294

    @Maguiresbridge - these are the same players, who as a group had the opportunity to win the Carling Cup at least, and majority of them could have won the European cup but couldn't - as a team they failed but yet they want to go onto teams that show more ambition???. where was their ambition when it was up to them to finish it off - they played in cup finals They could have had the Silverware with Arsenal if they were up for it....That about sums up their ambition to me....

  4. maguiresbridge gooner

    Sep 11, 2012, 21:23 #26288

    Mandy and Ron 28823 can't disagree with what you said.And all that extra dough from the two mancs is hard to turn down but maybe if we'd shown more ambition over the last seven or so years and shown these players that we can win silverware and then go on to actually do it maybe it would have been easier to persuade them to resign.

  5. Ron

    Sep 11, 2012, 14:48 #26282

    Mandy - I reckon youre right there. A good many of them seem to think the Clubs should follow them about begging and pleading while offering them improved terms every time said player does a fancy backheel that actually comes off! The Clubs get the stick for contracts running down and the player makes himself out to look hard done too. Its a combination of Bosman and the skewed balance of power between Club and player thats caused all this contract rubbish, but your right, of course players run them down so they can bargain harder.

  6. Mandy Dodd

    Sep 11, 2012, 12:40 #26279

    Suerly in the case of the more valued players, it is the players running their contracts down through refusing to sign, as opposed to a club policy of letting contracts go into the final year. RVP and Nasri had deals on the table long before they got to the final year. This clubs transfer / contract issues have been far from perfect, we all hope they have learned lessons, however, surely running down contracts is more down to players and their agents?

  7. JoeS.

    Sep 11, 2012, 7:22 #26273

    In full agreement M.W, there is method at work in these contract dealings, the result of blatent policy decisions. Regarding Sagna with two leg breaks and not getting youmger the club would consider signing a long term deal this early as high risk. Arsenal seam to be following a trend which has become common in the USA where the owners are again at odds with excessive player demands which have been eating into their persnal profits.Thus Liverpool's owners have traded their three biggesr stars at the Red Sox because they were considered too expensive to hold on to. IT's all about the business. Good Luck to Sagna for sceaming out and not going quietly.

  8. billthered

    Sep 11, 2012, 7:13 #26272

    Time to get real lads,AW has a degree in finance but is also a gambler that is why he gives lesser players good contracts hoping that they come good and as most gamblers will tell you they hardly ever do.But on the whole I think AW has been terrific for the owner and made him bucket loads of cash whilst on the pitch things have'nt gone to plan.I really think in the next few years we will see improvement in the team as supporters are getting a bit fed up with the lack of silverware,but I am sure we are ahead of schedule when it comes to the repayments on the ground and when that happens the future will look a lot more rosey.But do not under estimate AW when it comes to finance he is probably the only manager who runs a football club from top to bottom that is why the yank can stay over the pond safe in the knowledge that AW will make him a whole lot richer.

  9. Ali

    Sep 11, 2012, 6:46 #26271

    Cynic! Cynic! Cynic!Cynic! Cynic! Cynic!Cynic! Cynic! Cynic!Cynic! Cynic! Cynic! You are cynic!! but you are right, the issue is of real concern.

  10. GaryFootscrayAustralia

    Sep 11, 2012, 5:02 #26270

    In answer to your sub - heading, yes.

  11. the_drizzle

    Sep 11, 2012, 1:52 #26269

    I personally dont see the point in extending/modifying contracts at the 2-year point: all it does is limit our flexibility while at the same time leaving the player free to hold out. A recent example of this is Marouane Fellaini, who still has three years left on his contract but recently decided that he has other plans (#Wishlist). Look at Ronaldo too, even 200k a week cant feed a pig these days. So again, whats the point of these stopgap bonuses if we accrue all the risk, establish untenable precedent, and will likely lose the player as soon as he overperforms?

  12. Peter Wain

    Sep 10, 2012, 18:25 #26268

    Frankly the who;e transfer policy is a total mess. Players are being left too long without their contract being renegoatiated. Walcott is a classic case. Whether we should have offered him a contract or not is a moot point but if he will not sign the contract on offer he should have been transferred last year. Why keep him and not RVP? RVP is aplyer we did want so we sell. Wallcott is a player we are not prepared to offer a contract he will sign so we keep him until Janaury and sell him for a reduced fee or he leaves next year on a free. If this happens the whole of the board and the manager should resign as this is appalling management. He may leave for free but no one will go and we will see the same scenario played out next year. That and the fact that we cannot now win anything with the current policies is the only thing that is certain.

  13. Angry & Frustrated

    Sep 10, 2012, 16:57 #26267

    All footballers are greedy mercenaries these days, and hence any football club is in a very difficult situation regarding when or if to renew contracts. It's a case of damned if you do and damned if you don't, especially when things like long term injuries are added into the mix. With Arsenal however we have rewarded supposed potential with outrageously generous contracts in the past, and we are now paying a very heavy price. We now have a plethora of Winston Bogarde's on our books whom we are not able to shift, who continue to not only stink the place out, but are extremely financially draining. Therefore to a certain degree I can understand the clubs current policy, as it's a case of once bitten twice shy. The only problem is that Wenger was bitten by about 10 players all at once, and it's cost the club dearly, not just in wages but ultimately success too!!

  14. Bard

    Sep 10, 2012, 15:56 #26266

    It does seem as though its policy but there seems to be a shift on the player side. Agents just hawk them around for the best deal and see what transpires. Eg RVP and Nasri. Arsenal do operate risky policy but I am not convinced negotiating deals earlier makes any difference. If they get offered more money elsewhere they take it contract or no contract.Wally is waiting to see what's on the table elsewhere and if its more than Arsenal are offering then he will most likely go. All the other stuff about ambition and medals and love of the club is all PR bull****.when was the last time anyone left Arsenal for less money ( Fabregas ? ) But I read that Arteta signed for less.

  15. maguiresbridge gooner

    Sep 10, 2012, 15:28 #26265

    It's certainly not a case of learning by their mistakes because like you said it is club policy and it's all down to saving money and the hierarchy's favorite subject profit.There's no savings or profit to be made in extending a players contract and giving them a pay rise when they still have a year left especially when they intend to sell them for a far bigger profit.I don't know about the terms of arsene's contract or anybody else at board room level but this policy is making dough for somebody.

  16. johnnyhawleyloovinggooner

    Sep 10, 2012, 14:48 #26264

    tricky with Sagna with his fitness in doubt. no excuse for not sorting jack or the Ox. fact is two years is now the time to sort out a new contract or sell on. RVP would not sign so we had a year to find and replace. Theo wants too much so they seem happy to let his deal run down. note Ox started a head of theo for england, he may see the writing on the wall at Arsenal too.

  17. Ron

    Sep 10, 2012, 14:01 #26263

    You assume that all plyers wd ask for the pen and where to sign just because theyre approached early. They wouldnt. Sagna has been injured a lot over the last two years. Hes as good as gone next Summer in my view.Arsenal have given long contracts to many less than average players for too long. We all know who they are. Im not saying Sagna is one of them either. Hes been a good servant. Leaving the contract late to renew when the players has his bargaining power otimized, it call s for a level of loyalty on his part to renew it. If there s no loyalty he leaves. Ive no problem with it. I know the rules and reasons but as a priciple why shd a player be rewarded for years on end with a future contract when he a good way from finishing the existing one? I cant see a plausible reason for it to be honest. When you sign say a 3 year contract, you dont contemplate a new and better one in 12 - 18 months! It means you lose players for sure but for me, the non loyal brigade can all bug--r off.Its better than having the likes of Bendtner and Djourou et al signed up for years when we all on know theyre garbage. PS The rvp sale was a good one for club and player. He'd given decent service on the whole and i dont blame a 29 year old going up for a go at OT from Arsenal these days. The two clubs are light years apart now and its a gap that wont be bridged any time soon. Sorry for raining on the why dont we keep our best players party parade, but these footballers on their wages need to get real or sod off. How many of them in the game today are really that good? Not many in my view, and those that are play abroad and will never, ever see the inside of the door at Arsenal never mind a contract.

  18. RJ

    Sep 10, 2012, 13:33 #26262

    Dunno about Wenger's contract - I would not be surprised if he has some element of pay based on financial performance as is only appropriate for a senior manager in the "business". However - I seem to remember that we tried to start talks with Theo and RVP at the beginning of last season, and they both "wanted to see if we got CL footbalL". Well we did, but RVP tossed off anyway, and Theo is learning that he is not wanted anywhere really at the price he is after. Heaven's sake if we had renewed Theo at £100k a week a year ago we would have been shouting for Wenger to go. As for Bacary - he is a class player, but has been out for a significant part of the last 9 months - why would we renegotiate that contract now? he is just posturing for a go, and whilst I would rathe rhe stay, bigger and more important players than him have been told theyu are not bigger than the club.

  19. divingrooney

    Sep 10, 2012, 12:40 #26261

    All pay hikes are pre-dated. So, if Sagna signs a contract on 1 st Dec, then his hike would be calculated from 1st July. He may even get a sign on bonus. Of course, all this relates to a player's pull. Sagna missed 70% of last season, and still injured. If we sign for 4 more years, and he is injured for the rest of his career, so would say Wenger is stupid and loves French players. So, we have to wait, and see if he has recovered, before offering him that 4 yr contract. Of course, he can leave after he gets fit in Dec, but what ever Wenger does is always wrong, so why should I argue?

  20. Dan h

    Sep 10, 2012, 12:32 #26260

    Interesting subject the club tried last year with RVP he didn't want to know.The biggest assets they do try to start to negotiate with two years left on a players contract.It comes down to how much the player himself actually wants to stay take the cases of Koscielny & Vermaelen both had two years left on their contracts both wanted to stay both straightforward renewals.The actual length of contract is the issue agents favour 4 year deals gives the player security of income should major injury occur & two year cycle of signing & then renewal.The clubs themselves Arsenal & other top teams upon signing a major player look for an initial 5 year deal protects asset & the club for the first 3 years are under no pressure to negotiate a new deal though the agent will be pushing even after 2 years!I honestly think with Sagna they are waiting to see how he recovers after a second leg break in a season.It then becomes a dangerous game should Arsenal wait too long we sometimes try to sit down with a player with around 12-18 months left on a deal at that point it obviously favours the agent in negotiations.It really is down to what the player wants the agent will make money either by player being transferred or by contract renewal people believe only by the player being moved on the agent really benefits not so!Best deal Arsenal did in recent years was when Cesc Fabregas signed a new 8 year contract within 18 months of him signing it his agent was 'replaced'i think most of you know who it was!No idea on AW getting a bonus for PT profit it has been the case with other managers.If a player bought for say £5m then is transferred for example £10m they may get a % of the profit some managers are on those types of deals more than an overall profit of all player trading but those go on more on an individual player basis.Hope that partly answers your question Mark!

  21. Tony Evans

    Sep 10, 2012, 12:25 #26259

    Clearly it is Arsenal policy now to allow contracts to run down to the final year before negotiating. Whilst this does have a certain financial logic to it the club does not take in to account the destabilising effect the policy has overall. It unsettles both players and supporters (not that Gazedis and co give a stuff about that) and for me sends out a clear message that we are nothing but a feeder club with no real ambition.

  22. mjc

    Sep 10, 2012, 11:54 #26258

    When it was revealed that Rednapp had a deal whci included a percentage of player trades, I recall that Wenger said that was wholly wrong, and that there would never be such a clause at Arsenal. As to your other points, the problem is that, when increased terms and contracts are offered you can just as easily end up with unoffloadable Bendtners and Denilsons as sold early Walcotts and Sagnas. We can all be geniuses in retrospect....

  23. Georgaki-Pyrovolitis

    Sep 10, 2012, 10:38 #26257

    cynic!