A point gained?

Reflections on Sunday’s game



A point gained?


When we played Liverpool recently we were at the top of our game. Liverpool were under par and we came out on top looking impressive. Everton on Sunday played at the absolute maximum of their ability and whilst we were not on top form we were only a shade below it. They decided to attack us believing that if they sat back they would probably lose.

Teams realise if they sit back we have the quality to beat them and they will lose. All credit to them but for all that first half hour possession we remained resilient and barely threatened. Didn't that used to be us - all possession great football but little threat?

Everton also played a physical game breaking up our play when we were in possession not always legally. Our defence looked solid throughout and we no longer buckle when faced with a physical threat. At long last we seem to be able to combat this and in fact created the better chances throughout the game.

It is easy to be disappointed and feel frustrated but it was an exceptional goal that won Everton a point. It wasn't down to the team not being able to withstand a barrage of pressure or a defensive mistake that cost us. Sometimes you just have to accept the other team played bloody well and deserved a draw, galling though it is.

Yes, Everton were certainly on performance the best team we have faced this season but I doubt they can maintain that standard all season. That is another thing you need to combat. When you are top everyone tries that bit harder to gain your prized scalp.

There is no doubt that players need to be rotated but it does leave some doubt about who our best eleven are. Most would probably think Flamini should be ahead of Arteta, but it would seem the manager does not agree. Overall the manager has the knowledge of any injuries being carried and how players perform on the training ground but I would expect to see Flamini in that defensive midfield role.

We increased our lead at the top by one point. It may not be what everyone wants to hear but it was more important not to lose. Everton playing the way they did would have beaten us easily in the last few seasons. I think there were more positives to be gained from the game. If Giroud's last second strike had gone in the majority of comments would have been different.

We can barely pause for breath with the next three games testing us further. It is understandable that the team seems to have to pass a test almost every game after the false dawns of the last nine years. I would go as far to say they are the best group of players we have had since 2005. It is far too early to say we will win the league but we are top by five points and only once have we had more points during the Wenger years after fifteen games.


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57
comments

  1. The Fonz

    Dec 12, 2013, 12:09 #42762

    Oh Ron, you really are a very silly man. You call my response atrocious but I guess for guys like you its nigh on impossible to see past the end of your nose. You call me puerile and antagonistic, but you are unable to point your poor perception at your own comments, which are littered with repetitive negative and ill informed thoughts. Im more than happy to stand up to the likes of you, as are many others. But You might want to do something about the severely over inflated opinion of yourself, you clearly revel in your self anointed hubris but there is little substance in anything you write. Suggesting that you have someone how angered me with your silly bombastic and verbose nonsense is quite sweet, you actually invoke the opposite, laughter. I really feel sorry for fans like you, god know how muhc football you have watched over the years, yet you still dont understand and that is so sad but as I have said before there is little reasoning with tribalist fans like you. Thank you for hanging yourself firmly by your own petard, with your pithy remarks but you are in the small minority thankfully. What a very sad and monotonous life you must live. Iv realised whilst reading your comments again that you are simply Myles Palmer in poor disguise, oh dear Ron, oh dear...

  2. BADARSE

    Dec 11, 2013, 19:04 #42727

    Ah but jjetplane remember, 'It was twenty years ago today, Sergeant Pepper taught the band to play!' Then they said, 'What! Won nothing in twenty years? Time for you to go!' So they did, and we're all the poorer for it.

  3. jjetplane

    Dec 11, 2013, 18:17 #42726

    Think I'll pack it in/Buy a pick-up/Take it down to Highbury.

  4. Ron

    Dec 11, 2013, 17:06 #42724

    The Fonz - I'd suggest that your atrociously written reply pretty much makes it my case rested, as your usual puerile antagonism's pour forth true to form. Seeing as youre apparently tired of my type, youve given a fair time to vent your sleen there yet again and your anger is betrayed in every line of that rant. The veins in your forehead must have bulged like Roy Keanes used too? Are you sure its me that needs to grow up? Perhaps we 'll let others be the judge of that shall we. Ive made my point to you. For the record, BADARSE and myself often have exchanges, many in aligment, many not. Hes no gripe with anything ive referred to vis him here, then hes different to you for the reasons that shine out like a beacon in your reply. PS What does 'giving a rats arse' mean? Sounds like a form of deviant habit?

  5. maguiresbridge gooner

    Dec 11, 2013, 16:42 #42722

    The Fonz, I hear what your saying, none of us come on here to fall out with fellow gooners even though we don't even know each other. Some of us may have different views, see things differently, and some of us speak our mind, and very importantly are not afraid to do so, and this is probably what upsets others who disagree and like to toe the party line. Personally if we won thirty games on the trot and we lost our next one because of mistakes i would criticise those mistakes and why they happened and whose fault it was, and why not? As much as we're all enjoying this great run we're on (and long may it last) should there be no criticism because of it? should we all just forget about mistakes made by the players and manager and not mention them because we're on top of the league? As you say we've all been here before and that's why a lot of us aren't getting carried away and won't until it's in the bag. And if it's not and it's another false dawn there will be an inquest into the managers future alright, but that has been happening for five, six, seasons now, how many judge me in Mays have we had with the same outcome, if nothing changes this season it's never going to and i think a lot of Arsene fans know that, but others have thought that for a lot longer. Will it be any different this time? It's to early to tell but yes hopefully this will be the season where it eventually comes to fruition (where have i heard that before) and we all can get carried away and really celebrate that's if we remember how to. Let me be the first to wish everybody a merry Christmas.

  6. Joe F

    Dec 11, 2013, 16:39 #42721

    Sorry Ron, what the needle with The Fonz here? I agree with him and West Lower, to many negative fans out there who clearly still have an agenda against Wenger. For what its worth, Im of the view that if he fails again this season he has to go, but I’m with the boys 100%, are you?

  7. BADARSE

    Dec 11, 2013, 16:17 #42720

    Forward Arsenal. Together, together, together.

  8. The Fonz

    Dec 11, 2013, 15:59 #42719

    Ah Ron, you encapsulate everything that is wrong with the fans of your ilk. You are clearly limited in your overall knowledge of the game, a pure partisan and tribal fan with little room for opinions other than your own myopic views, why pay to go and watch football if you are concentrated only on the negative? I I don’t feel the need to be part of your old wives club, and shamelessly massage each other’s rather punitive views, so thank you for ensuring that I am fully excluded from the likes of you, no doubt you meant this as an insult but I see it as a compliment. I would suggest you reread ALL of the comments on this thread, because there are those who chose to denigrate Everton as a club, I wasn’t naming names but you have clearly taken offense, grow up mate! I enjoy reading your rather generalised and sweeping statement about “those who follow my type of line”, what an amusing and ill informed judgement. You may attempt to sit upon some sort of moral high ground but on the face of it you are yet another one who espouses negative vitriol at any opportunity, I tire of having to argue with your sort, but thankfully you really are in the minority and this board has become a default home to your type, which is perhaps why I feel the need to keep reading your woeful diatribe. I have no issue and never have done with fans criticising the team and the manager, I have on many occasions but I (like many many others) wait until there is just cause, rather than drawing upon what is a clear lack of any foresight or experience of watching games and digging the knife in because it’s your raison d’etre. I have been a season ticket holder for a long long time, I don’t need to pull out my card to qualify my opinions, it’s a shame you do. I am well aware that BADARSE is a fairly new comer to these posts, and I mean that with no ill will, I find his posts are a nice tonic to those like you, but I feel that in this instance, him siding with me (SHOCK HORROR I KNOW!) has somehow riled something in you, which for a grown man (I assume) is pretty silly. Good of you to patronise him so publicly, how noble of you! I really don’t give a rats a$$ about what you say Ron, I read your comments and I want to bang my head against a brick wall………ignorance doesn’t really do justice to your kind of mindset you, shame you can’t open your very narrow mind and maybe accept you don’t really know as much as you think you do.

  9. BADARSE

    Dec 11, 2013, 14:15 #42717

    Ron, I love fruitcake!

  10. Ron

    Dec 11, 2013, 13:42 #42715

    A bit more conciliatory today then Fonz? Or is that because BADARSE finds favour with your insults? Yesterday, your stance was one where any poster having the temerity to cast even the smallest doubt on Wenger or the Clubs prospects were either limited in their 'understanding' at best or 'ignorant' at worst, the implication being that worshipping at the feet of your like ie totally Wenger compliant in your views and non committing about anything, was the actions of just fools and ravers. From what i saw there wasnt one poster who 'denigrated' Everton either nor was there any which suggested 3 pts was a formality. The trouble with you and those who follow your type of line, is that you read a post, select something tenuous that carries just a hint of criticism of the status quo and then you get all childishly defensive, branding such posters as anti Arsenal amongst other stuff.You ought to try reading posts before you switch your 'i feel uncomfortable' button on, then you might find a few other observers who really dont see you as wanting a fight every time. Youve a way to go yet though fella. PS BADARSE for all his unique, wider than football, perceptions from time to time does have a propensity to align himmself with the odd fruitcake and more specifically the Jamie's of this board and others of your ilk too, so i shouldnt get too much of an inflated view of yourself. A few of us who criticise, have been match goers for many decades and have levelled critisism for years, though i can see that your condensing a deferral of any view into this one season is very convenient for you i suppose right now isnt it.

  11. The Fonz

    Dec 11, 2013, 13:13 #42712

    Thanks for the support BADARSE, I do enjoy you’re erudite comments! I’m not trying to pick any fights fellow gooners but we should all have watched enough football by now to know that it’s never as simple as it sometimes should appear. On paper you think Everton at home, 3 points should be the minimum but sometimes on the day it doesn't turn out that way. Say what you want about them and you can denigrate them as a club all you want but they are a very impressive team this season and I have no qualms about applauding their performance, yes they overstepped the mark at times but they also played with quality and we don’t have a problem leaving our foot in at times! The problem with our plight of no trophy for getting on 9 years now, means that there are (understandably) fans that refuse to be drawn in by another promising run which could lead to yet another false dawn, but I see no purpose in criticising the manager or the players right now. If we fail again this season then that is the time to be forcing an inquest into the manager’s future, but right now the team is looking like a team worthy of Arsenal FC. One that is finally built on the same defensive stability (seemingly) that took us to our last 3 titles, and that is the fundamental difference this season with this team. Ozil may have grabbed the headlines, but we have always scored goals and played "attractive football" but following some 4-4's none of us felt safe watching us with any type of lead, and it’s great (and a relief) to watch this team and feel secure that they won’t capitulate!

  12. maguiresbridge gooner

    Dec 11, 2013, 13:07 #42711

    Welcome back BADARSE, us old boys take longer to recover from the benders now

  13. jjetplane

    Dec 11, 2013, 11:31 #42707

    Great post DW. Barkley has that consistent economy of movement and if a back flick is required he knows when to supply. Wenger's vision is way too romantic and post match lately shows starry eyes and yet the test/s have only just begun. The hunger in Martinez is all too apparent and i see Everton as a top 4 team. Like others have said, Gibbs is a fine youngster but Nacho is class and intelligence. Bit like a young Cole. Kos I agree is perhaps our best player at the back and his breaking up of opposition movement is excellent. Bobby Pires hey - what a geezer!

  14. BADARSE

    Dec 11, 2013, 10:37 #42704

    Thank you Peter. I saw a well disciplined side play us, with a fair amount of ability, who pushed the legal boundaries. Barry should have easily seen red, then we have a different game, agreed? I expect Everton to claim a CL berth. Our team is a good side, a good squad. We shall never attain perfection although many posts on here have that criterion as a measuring stick. Get real gentlemen. We play in a highly competitive forum and the opposition are not going to roll over and lay down. We have to roll them and put them down, sometimes that doesn't happen. Games can be decided on a choice of moving left or right, shoot or hold off, a movement of the ball to carry it inside or outside the post. I believe this squad is amongst the best we have had. I wouldn't have said that before the season began but Ozil-and his effect-Flamini, his effect too, Aaron's step-up and a general maturing and development from the younger guns as in Sir Chesney, Gibbsy, and Gnabry. We see a remarkable understanding developing between Kosh and the BFG, with the latter morphing into a 'Tone'. OK, you all may disagree with my observations, but I also see a bonding going on here, a unifying of our troops. To me it is self-evident. It may have an eggshell veneer it's true, but I don't think so. In truth I am pleased that these players wear the badge and carry my hopes and dreams with them. We can do this. I am enjoying the way the season unfolds, this could be my last-it could be your last one too. Seize the day people, enjoy.

  15. GoonerRon

    Dec 11, 2013, 9:14 #42701

    @ Danny - so we get pissed in tonight do we by a tactically better manager? Is that same team managed by the same manager who were absolutely battered at The Emirates earlier in the Group? Great to hear such positivity from our supporters.

  16. BADARSE

    Dec 11, 2013, 8:19 #42697

    Been away for a few days, good to see all those in the trenches forming a bond. This is definitely an 'esprit de corps' time guys. Ironic as I have read and decided a line to post, then to see criticism of the line I was about to align with. The Fonz, I have read your posts and wanted to nail up that I agree with pretty much all of your attitude and approach. There! So clearly two Gooners who love AFC and agree are not on the money. Really? I see Ron/jeff wright/CG all in a clique encouraging the same line. Not wholly negative but with little sense of an upbeat theme. I think you guys are red and white without question, however clearly groups on here see things differently. Respect.

  17. Dark Hei

    Dec 11, 2013, 5:00 #42696

    Everton played so very well. Ross Barkley was able to find space time and time again between lines and then stretch play with balls out wide. Ramsey and Arteta couldn't get a hold on him, which shows how well he did. The only thing keeping them at bay in the first half is our defensive shape. Credit to the team for keeping calm and maintaining it. It would be easy to get frustrated and go ball hunting in an uncoordinated manner. Better to keep calm and carry on. Also, it is not very generous to beat Gibbs for that goal. We as fans are talking with the benefit of hindsight. The Barca boy, was closed down with no angles to shoot. It didn't make sense for Gibbs to get any tighter and risk a penalty given the opponent is nimble on his feet. No angles and he still got a powerful dipping shot off, lets just say the opponent did fantastic. To make it sound like Everton is good only because we are ****e is not doing them justice.

  18. DW Thomas

    Dec 11, 2013, 1:15 #42695

    Couple things. Barkley was silky and strong at times and bossed most everyone on our team. Gibbs and others lack the ability or know how to put pressure on the ball to force errors, not necessarily directly winning it. Flamini and Kos get this. They do it and then some, understanding that consistent pressure on a player gives him little to no time to make decisions. The best players see better than others and make the fastest decisions. That's why I love(d) Cesc so much. He saw things many don't. Ozil is similar. And just once in a while. Ramsey is showing signs of this ability and vision this season too. You Can destroy teams if you have three or more of these type of players playing together. Like Messi, Iniesta, and Xavi. Sure, they are once in a generation that group, but we should try to emulate that with a solid defense. At least that's the ideal. Maybe Wenger promotes it, but his teams seem way too lethargic too often these past few years. Bergkamp's book is a good read. He talks about wanting that perfection and to be that player with the creative edge to take over games. He is Arsenal's best example of a player who had fantastic technique, vision, and toughness. Then add Henry, Pires, Freddie, and a very good defense and keeper and no wonder they excelled and won, a lot. We have been close to that again, often, but lack the last two or three pieces. That is the thing that lingers in my mind when I support this club and gives my opinions. Can we finish the puzzle? Or will we forever be close? And who is that final piece that gives us a Rennaisance?

  19. Danny

    Dec 11, 2013, 0:18 #42694

    we were lucky to get a draw against a good marshaled team that's has a good coach. Our downfall is happening tomorrow against Napoli were I believe we get pissed on, and then the dreaded Citeh and Chelsea games. Zero points there chaps why the negativity?. Simple, Wenger is tactically clueless and up against 3 of the best coaches who will prepare theirs teams to do battle.

  20. Peter Hughes

    Dec 10, 2013, 18:57 #42693

    CanadaGooner- I would have agreed with you in the past.I don't think Villa would win now with that approach.Everton would have studied us & decided in our present form that their best chance was not to sit back. They did have the benefit that their whole team played as one & when a good team clicks like that they are a match for anyone.Their approach actually left us with the better chances throughout with several 1 on 1 opportunities. You could argue that Everton chose the wrong approach as if both teams had taken the clear opportunitys that fell their way we would have won.Their gamble paid off & they will be the more relieved of the two teams with a point.We were already defending well under presure & look comfortable enough to deal with sustained pressure nowadays. Dortmund was the final lesson & we have tightened up on getting caught on the break since then. When the opposition punt a long ball up front we often conceded goals. The players possitional play is exceptional now & seems to have stopped this route one of conceding goals. I am sure we will get caught out occasionally but it is not the problem it once was.

  21. bobbybigb

    Dec 10, 2013, 18:36 #42692

    Succinct and to the point. Left the game with initial disappointment but quickly concluded that we cant possibly win every game and this hard fought point will be more than some of our closest rivals will gain against a motivated and talented Everton.I took great pleasure in our new found steel that is increasingly apparent this season.We are looking like the real deal.

  22. jeff wright

    Dec 10, 2013, 17:58 #42691

    Everton are good side but not as good as some are making them out to be. I can't recall Chesney having to make a save in the first half . Wenger's team selections and predictable tactics made things easier for Everton. I don't see them as being a top 4 candidate. Last seasons league table up until December 31st makes interesting reading . Club P GD PTS Man Utd 20 22 49 Man City 20 19 42 Chelsea 19 21 38 Tottenham 20 10 36 Arsenal 19 18 33 If a week in football is a long time then a year must be an eternity.

  23. Ron

    Dec 10, 2013, 16:51 #42690

    GR - Perhaps its slightly negatve, granted. Im not having a go at the performance on Sunday, just parts of it.We did OK. Looking at the game though, we see different things clearly. I saw a home team with pretensions supposedly of wining the league, looking very much so as if they were an away team v an opponent who never contemplate a title win to be honest and who couldnt do much about it. We ll need to get used to that, as playing a willing horse as one up front is going to allow the better and more physically equipped sides to pen us in and boss us. Its a good thing we met them at home and not at Goodison Park.

  24. GoonerRon

    Dec 10, 2013, 16:29 #42689

    @ Ron - you have to admit the term 'handed' is so unnecessarily negative - it gives no credit to the accuracy and flight of Rosicky's cross, Walcott pulling away into space, his vision to pick out the supporting players, or Ozil timing his run into the box. And I have to disagree on us not being robust - I can't imagine any team winning (I think) 16 out of 18 away games in all competitions without being able to withstand physical pressure from the opponents. Ok, so maybe Everton out-muscled us for parts of the game, but any point did we buckle or did our goal come under a barrage of pressure? Not at all.

  25. maguiresbridge gooner

    Dec 10, 2013, 15:45 #42688

    Ron, yes mate still as relevant today and just as important if we want to win anything especially the Premiership as Sunday proved. To be fair i think we have toughened up of late certainly more than we used to be, but we're going to have to show it more especially against certain teams whether the holier than thou brigade like it or not.

  26. Anti-Wenger

    Dec 10, 2013, 15:35 #42687

    For me, a draw was a better result than a win because it puts us under pressure to get something out of the two games against City and Chelski. If we got that 7 point cushion, we would probably relax knowing we can afford to loose both games and still be top. Now we must get something out of at least one of the games( which i think we will), to keep our title credentials alive.

  27. jeff wright

    Dec 10, 2013, 15:24 #42686

    Having a team of small technical players does place us at a physical disadvantage when we play sides of equal technical ability, but who are bigger and stronger physically. It looks at times like Snow White's dwarfs having a ruck with a team of paratroopers.

  28. Ron

    Dec 10, 2013, 14:45 #42685

    Gooner Ron - Sorry mate. Misunderstood what you were asking. In context of us scoring i use the term 'handed' to make the point that Everton wouldnt have been too pleased defensively to allow that one and that it was a game heading for an entertaining 0-0, with perhaps no clearly merited winning team until then, with such little time left on the clock. Thats all.I query your 'robust'description though. Theres nothing robuust about Arsenal. Merter and Koschielny have upped their robustness no doubt, but as a team, a 20 year old was bullying them on Sunday as was a midget (Piennar). We havent done robust since 2005! Its what that midfield needs. A quality and powerful Essien type (at his peak) and sell Cazorla (he s another Hleb - he finds a hole in the pitch to crawl down v every team who pose a physical presence.Until we get one, we ll be bullied.

  29. Ron

    Dec 10, 2013, 14:31 #42684

    Gonner Ron - They were handed a goal by a full back who was unwilling or unable to get at the attacker quickly enough. Hae another look at it. Check out his body language. The forward had 2-4 seconds to set himself. Believe me, a defensive coach would have slaughtered him in private. Everybody has been blinded by the quality of the shot.

  30. GoonerRon

    Dec 10, 2013, 14:21 #42683

    @ Ron - how were we 'handed a goal' as you put it? I don't remember Everton players forming a guard of honour down the middle of the pitch and letting someone shoot into an empty net? Credit where credit's due for crying out loud. For all of those bemaoning two dropped points, it is impossible to say at this stage whether it will come back to haunt us or not. The flip side is that a less robust Arsenal team could have lost the game in the first half but we held firm when not playing well (which can happen sometimes you know) and earned a point from the game. It could be a great point come the end of the season. Lastly, I think Gibbs is getting some really unfair stick to be honest. Don't get me wrong, Monreal is pushing him all the way for his place which is exactly how it should be, but I still think Gibbs has the edge defensively and therefore would still be my pick for the key league games coming up.

  31. radfordkennedy

    Dec 10, 2013, 14:06 #42682

    John gooner....with you mate regarding monreal I said something similar a few threads back that he's very sansomesque in that he's defensively minded and positionaly aware and knows when to stick or twist when we are going forward..Fonz..I'm neither bitter or sour my friend,but after going through the turnstiles for 45 years if nothing else its earned me an opinion,whilst I would have indeed snatched your hand off to be where we are right now,it is my humble opinion that we are going to come up short against both City and Chelsea purely because they will out battle us,and the fact they have more firepower,there's nothing sinister or doom.laden in that its just my thoughts mate,when you look at our only real striker and don't get me wrong I love the man but Giroud spends 90 per cent of the game heading balls facing chesney,will this game plan be enough to outscore city and chelsea

  32. jeff wright

    Dec 10, 2013, 14:02 #42681

    The Fonz obviously spends too much time admiring himself in the mirror Ron.

  33. Ron

    Dec 10, 2013, 13:49 #42680

    CG - I think youre very nearly there with that matey. Closer to the real mindset was that Wenger had chosen to ignore or disregard Evertons results this Season. We know as a fact he ignores other Clubs tactics and styles and just looks at ours (madness i know). He sent us out thinking he could win that game with his famed handbrake on, thus 'saving' players for the perceived harder tasks. The reality is that theres none harder than Everton right now, but Wenger wasnt to know. Hes only on 7 Mill pa and isnt paid to heed other Clubs. He started to realise, theyre a real team and sought to step it up just before half time (as he does when hes in lethargy mode and has done for years). He reacted for the 2nd half, after effectively wasting the 1st half. Youre right on the goal. Total lack of bravery and positionally awful. It looked a great goal and was, it was a sound hit that few keepers would have reached, but as you say, the guy had 5 mins to shape himself pre getting his shot away. What does Wenger focus on? Lukaku, perhaps being offside and a few tasty, but fair tackles. He always seems to want to underwrite his own players failing to deal with the basics sadly and then wonders why they repeatedly do.

  34. Bard

    Dec 10, 2013, 13:40 #42679

    John :,I agree wholeheartedly about Nacho. He deserves a run. Gibbs has stalled at the moment. Nacho offers a bit more going forward. A draw with Citeh would be good result. Would be good to see a more pragmatic approach from us instead of the usual arrogant and sometimes suicidal attacking. If we go for a shoot out we'll get murdered and that will serious damage us. But then again it's like hoping he'll buy a top striker in the jan window, it ain't going to happen.

  35. CanadaGooner

    Dec 10, 2013, 13:37 #42678

    What Wenger does over Summer has been his downfall in the last 9 years. Once the season kicks off, I dont have any problems with 99% of his decisions - the players earn so much money these days, they simply should perform. On sunday, our players didnt turn up from the kick off and everton did. Simple as. The equaliser should never have been a goal; we allowed a player in a stationary position enough space to pick his spot and kick the ball into the net! Really shambolic indeed. I would have been happier with someone diving in and conceding a penalty (as opposed to just standing there, not attempting to hack the ball away; and then allowing the fellow to stroke it in!). Nothing Wenger could have done about that.

  36. Ron

    Dec 10, 2013, 13:34 #42677

    MG - Hi mate. You could have been writing that (minus the Everton references)at any point, at any stage of any of the last 8 years. All sound points though and needs to heeded by AW in particular. Mind yourself though, you'll have the holier than thou brigade, who operate on a higher moral level that do you (in your 'ignorance') and who 'understand' things far more deeply than do you! check out The Fonz (above you). Brace yourself matey, as youve just committed heresy.

  37. maguiresbridge gooner

    Dec 10, 2013, 13:25 #42676

    We may have been on top of our game against Liverpool thanks to Liverpool allowing us to do what we do best, Everton didn't allow us that luxury on Sunday with their manager getting their tactics right, and a lot of others will now do the same, if our first half performance was only a shade below our top performance i'd hate to see our worst, we were out passed out fought we could hardly string a couple of passes together at times passing it to opponents and even passing it out of play only waking up with three minutes left. I agree Everton were the best team we've faced so far this season but we will face others, certainly ones that will play an even more physical game and be an even bigger physical threat and we're going to have to be prepared for that,(legal or not)and up to/for it if we're to remain at the summit and our manager standing on the touch line doing the penguin rap at every hard tackle isn't going to help. As i've already said we're there to be shot at, or be scalped if you like, and we're going to have to get used to it. It was disappointing not to get three points and one to keep us out ahead is certainly better than none and it's still all to play for. There's still a lot of work to be done before yet another false dawn can be prevented and we can start by keeping the Comanches at bay.

  38. The Fonz

    Dec 10, 2013, 13:11 #42675

    Completely agree with you're sentiments West Upper, you cant please some of sour and bitter fans who seem intent on waiting for us to slip it, its a real shame that the current form of the team cant be enjoyed by those who ignorant s who populate much of the arsenal social media. I really question how many of our fans actually understand football, I see comments on twitter and here on the fact we dropped 2pts against everton......we didn't deserve 3 points, not because we were poor but because they matched us, if you think we are going to win all our games then maybe switch to a children s sport! Some of our fans seem to think that our rivals will win every game, despite the heavy evidence that's not the case this season.....if you had offered us this position at the start of the season 100% of all gunners would have bitten your hand off, but somehow there are those who refuse to see it that way.....lets just hope those that have this mindset decided not to frequent the Emirates this season!

  39. Mike

    Dec 10, 2013, 12:53 #42674

    Have to filed the strongest side possible against City - City have put 7 past Norwich, 6 past Spurs, 4 past united, 4 past Newcastle, 3 past Everton at home - a draw there would be a brilliant result

  40. Ron

    Dec 10, 2013, 12:48 #42673

    John Gooner - Dead on matey. Monreal is braver, stronger, better tackler, better defender all round and is very canny when he goes forwards, plus he uderstands when to advance and when not to and importantly, sees and understands what his left side midfielders are doing and when theyre doing it. Regular games would see him become a very tidy player indeed.

  41. John Gooner

    Dec 10, 2013, 12:41 #42672

    This may be a controversial view, but I believe that Monreal should be our first choice left back. With his recent performances, I think he has shown himself to be a more capable all round player than Gibbs. 2 games spring to mind where Gibbs' poor decision making has cost us points - The Dortmund game (woeful positional play) and Sunday against Everton (not closing down quickly enough) - Would John Terry or Ashley Cole have let that shot past them?

  42. West Upper

    Dec 10, 2013, 12:31 #42671

    Honestly - some people are never satisfied. Everton are without doubt the best side we've had at the Emirates this season and a very decent side, whose record this season is very good - including against our supposed rivals. We're 5 points clear at the top of the table, consistently picking up points while our rivals drop them. Isn't this exactly where we wanted to be 12 (or even 6) months ago?! We're not only in the title race - we're leading it. Give the team (and the opposition) some credit

  43. Ron

    Dec 10, 2013, 12:24 #42670

    It was a point gaimed in the end as Everton were the better side. Title winning teams, handed a goal like we had, when we got it, would have nailed the battens down and hung on for a fortunate win. Instead, we did as we ve done for years and sqaundered it.Justice to the game was done and a draw salvaged at least. Put it like this, had we have been at Goodison and lost to a goal like ours, having played like they did, we would have been spitting feathers. We ve now played 3 top end teams. We ve won, lost and drawn. We now have to get a point at MC (if not better) and beat Chelsea to lay down any marker of note. I think AW will break his duck v the preening Chelsea dick and beat them and maybe, just maybe, the loss of the 2 pts v Everton will drive us to a result v MC. My Forecasts: Arsenal 3 Chelsea 1. Man City 1 Arsenal 2. We re due a win at Man City. If it was me, i wd send a scratch team to Napoli. We only need to avoid a 3 goal loss and theyre not brilliant, plus we cant win that CL.

  44. mike

    Dec 10, 2013, 11:58 #42669

    Its not the defence but the midfield where the problems lie and not becuase of the lack of talent. When Cazorla and Wilshire were unfit Rosicky, Ramsey and Ozil to me seemed a lot more fluid - the much anticipated Ozil/ Cazorla partnership has yet to flourish and at this stage I would prefer Rosicky to start ahead of Cazorla. As for the Arteta/ Flamini debate , Artea took us through a tricky patch of games when Flamini was suspended/injured and both were on the field when Everton scored on Sunday

  45. Westlower

    Dec 10, 2013, 11:52 #42668

    For any serious punters out there who want an insurance bet tomorrow in Naples, I suggest the following. Napoli are 6/4 to win tomorrows game, so it's possible AFC could lose by one or two goals and still qualify. It's one of those rare win/win situations for an Arsenal supporting betting man. Any result other than a Napoli win and Arsenal win the group. If Napoli win, you win financially; If Arsenal win the Group, you win emotionally. Simples!

  46. TT

    Dec 10, 2013, 11:51 #42667

    Flamini or Arteta. Football is a squad game these days and Wenger this season seems to be selecting teams a bit more tailormade for the opposition and its something we should have done a while ago but you could argue we never had the squad for it. I always feel we should look to stamp our game on the oppo but you have to respect the qualities of the opposition. City away is a classic example where both are needed, City are brilliant at home and in attack, we need the two to organise, sit, tackle, sweep and in particular with Arteta get the ball and try to control the tempo. I agree Flamini was probably the better starter for Everton though, think Wenger got it wrong there but hindsight is a wonderful thing.

  47. TT

    Dec 10, 2013, 11:39 #42666

    You know what, the organisation and quality of our defending is something to really get you believing. Whatever has gone on in the last year and I dont really care if its Wenger adapting, Bould or Banfields influence or the players themselves but whatever has changed its working. Szszney is growing in stature, the back four is a back four, unified and organised, the protection of the back 4 is far better, the lads are WILLING to knuckle down probably out of fear that Flamini will slap them but Arteta, Ramsey and Wilshere have all grown in that department. Strangely only Hansen picked up on just how solid we were, its been Arsenals downfall for many years that we had an unreliable back four prone to collective and individual errors. If this has improved we have every chance of going close this season.

  48. Stevo433

    Dec 10, 2013, 11:36 #42665

    Don't worry,those two dropped points won't come back to haunt us, if you think we had a tough Nov/Dec, check out Feb/March ! Wenger will have buggered it all up by then and will be scratching around for fourth place . Fans have such short memories,didn't the last eight years teach you all anything ?

  49. CanadaGooner

    Dec 10, 2013, 11:22 #42664

    @ Peter Hughes; good article Peter, but I am a little confused. Teams come to Arsenal knowing if they play free-flowing football like Everton did, and attack us, we'll cut them to ribbons. Not sure where you got the reverse-analysis that teams come to Arsenal knowing if they sit back we have the quality to beat them??? That is very inaccurate. In fact, the first game we lost at the Emirate underlines that; and subsequently, we have lost to teams like Aston Villa, who sat back and then cut us open in the final minute of the game. Swansea did the same with Michu.

  50. jeff wright

    Dec 10, 2013, 11:08 #42663

    radfordkennedy, yes due to the dynamics of the forthcoming fixture list with Chelsea at home to Palace, when we visit Poundlands, the whole scenario at the top of the table could change if we fail to post a good result at lunch-time on Saturday. Even Liverpool could be on our case ,although I don't see them as being title candidates, but if Suarez stays fit, and they make a couple of decent signings in January - then they must have a shout of nicking a top 4 place with United struggling in the league this season. I suspect that it could look mighty crowded around the top of the table come January . That two points we dropped at home to Everton could come back to haunt us.

  51. Ron

    Dec 10, 2013, 10:17 #42662

    AW is a masive Arteta fan, especially so as he was bought at the time of a real crisis and did well for us. He still does do well. AW sense of loyalty will always see him still favour MA over MF, though the latter should always be played when fit. Im a big fan of MA though. Always have been.Great for Everton as a creator and AW should have gone for him 4-5 years earlier, but the fact that we had Cesc stopped that i suppose. He does just lack the physicality and speed needed to perfect the job of a DM though. MA is i a strange stage of his career. Hes only 31 yet doesnt have the legs or pace to relive his Everton days and lack the power to become a recognised defensive middle man. Still does a great job though. Has a few dodgy games like all of them do, but hes become a real Arsenal man nontheless. We have to accept that he and Flamini will share the job as lets face it Flaminis fitness record is pretty poor.

  52. radfordkennedy

    Dec 10, 2013, 10:10 #42661

    Jeff wright post no 45549...absolutely spot on mate I couldn't agree more,Everton was a must win game because we needed to be 7 points clear because of the impending two defeats against City and Chelsea.As much as I love to see us up there challenging I'm a realist and it is very plain to see that our team is all about the midfield plus BFG and Chesney,if Ramsey or Ozil don't score can we really depend on anyone else?,City have the second best striker in world football in Aguero,plus goals from at least 5 others,Chelsea will beat us because they will foul us on the halfway line to stop us and they will just sit back and hit us on the break using pace and muscle neither of which we possess in any quantity.honestly I'm not a pesimist I just can't see us winning or drawing either game,but ill pray to god I'm wrong

  53. jeff wright

    Dec 10, 2013, 9:37 #42659

    Incidentally it should be pointed out that we only gained a point against Chelsea - City won a point same as us - so no advantage there - and Liverpool gained two points on us in second place.

  54. jeff wright

    Dec 10, 2013, 9:26 #42658

    It was two points dropped against Everton - we had a one goal lead with a few minutes to play but were unable to hold on to it. No matter how anyone tries to dress it up that is the reality. The fact that our two main rivals at this point in time failed to win their away games is irrelevant other than regarding that we failed to take full advantage of this, everyone was saying that we needed to win the game before it was played . It's not really that surprising though that some change their perceptions afterwards to fit the disappointing result and our own performance . Do we really have 'best defence in the calender year'? Only against the lesser sides unfortunately - with clean sheets against the better ones being almost as rare as the sight of Wenger parading some silverware around the Emirates.

  55. Mike

    Dec 10, 2013, 9:08 #42657

    Martinez has inherited a settled defence even without Baines -Very much like ours these days - Man united don't know who their best defence is hence their problems and this has been a long time coming even with SAF at the helm -totally agree with this post

  56. Tony Evans

    Dec 10, 2013, 8:50 #42656

    It is a damn shame Wenger can't really rest a few players on Wednesday night, but to avoid the big guns in the last 16 we probably need a point against Napoli. City have no chance against Bayern and I think will field a weakened team with the game on Saturday in mind, and a meek acceptance of 2nd place in their CL group. This will certainly make for an even tougher game in Manchester. The draw v. Everton was a fair result, although I was gutted we couldn't hang on for the win. Still I haven't felt as positive as this for ages and it's feeling good, but I am trying hard not to get too carried away with it all.

  57. underacheiver

    Dec 10, 2013, 8:17 #42655

    Yes we do have a very good defense again, thank the lord. Before everyone goes too overboard about Martinez, a word of caution. He is renowned for his attacking teams but his defense in the past have been poor. He has inherited a good defense at Everton. Does that remind you of anyone?