Is Englischer Fussball to blame for the lack of love for Özil?

Does the star signing need to develop the physical side of his game?



Is Englischer Fussball to blame for the lack of love for Özil?


There was the first real beginnings of a more vociferous anti-Özil feeling after the Bayern game, and they have been coming for a while. It wasn’t the penalty that did it as such, but the real moment people started to articulate this anger was in relation to Özil not tracking back, and at more than one occasion when he just waved a leg in the direction of a Bayern player who promptly ghosted past him for another 2nd half attack. In contrast, the recent praise for Sanogo seems largely down to the fact that he ran a lot, closed down balls and generally made a nuisance of himself, and while he showed a lot of willing, it can’t honestly be said he was skilful or penetrating enough to realistically trouble Bayern, whereas Özil obviously has it in him to do so. But despite Sanogo’s rawness and shortcomings, he is given some plaudits, while the eminently better footballer Ozil is coming in for criticism. Is that down to expectation levels, or is it down to something fundamental that football demands of those who play on these shores? Is it reasonable to ask ALL players to give blood sweat and tears for the shirt, or is it a bit like asking a Ferrari to go cross country and then being surprised when it breaks down?

This beginnings of discontent for Özil raised an interesting question for me, as to whether this is to do with Özil particularly, or whether it is more to do with something more fundamental regarding the cultural differences and expectations of English football, and what the fans require and value most from all their players. This requirement applies equally and especially to those players whose job is to provide flair and skill. Rather than be happy for those players to concentrate on doing what they do best and providing moments of magic and not much else, English fans demand they at least show they are capable of putting it about in a way that doesn’t seem to apply on the Continent.

Why aren’t we just happy to let a player like Özil bide his time, and applaud the one or two moments of great passing and trickery, and leave others to do the dirty work? Another player recently linked with Arsenal in January, Dimitar Berbatov, has been similarly constantly viewed with suspicion through his career, it is as if we cannot allow a hugely talented, but rather languid player to exist on the pitch just to provide moments of class to win a game. It simply doesn’t compute. They have to provide something else, even though it could be argued that is someone else’s job, and when they don’t they are routinely accused of “being lazy” or “not trying.” But if the point of them being in the team is to provide or score goals and make goal scoring opportunities, why should they have to run 40 yards to chase down a goal kick, or boot a ball into row Z? I don’t know, but that is what English football demands.

While there is no need for Özil to become like Flamini, it seems important in English football to have the wherewithal to put it about a bit and show he understands and buys into the frantic and more physical Premier League. In Madrid or playing for Germany he could drift in and out of games and wait for his moment during the rather more patient ebb and flow of Spanish and International football, in the Premier League there is no time to do that, you just end up getting lost in the chaos and the constant “you attack, we attack” hurly burly.

Things have changed a bit since the arrival of real quality European flair players such as Bergkamp, Zola, Cantona, and the change in emphasis on defending and the encouragement and love of creativity. Arsenal have been at the forefront of this, and indeed have changed the most from the 80s in terms of embracing this side of the game. The joy of watching Wengerball in its glory was wonderful to behold, and we all enjoyed and praised players of skill and craft. And yet especially at Arsenal given the Graham years, but in English football in general, fans still yearn for players who get stuck in, battle and do the nasty things required, and as a result we subconsciously demand that all players have that within them, even if that is not their role. The moments of a game that often get the biggest cheers and applause are not when someone does 10 step overs, a Cruyff turn and a nutmeg, but when a player runs helter skelter for a lost cause and succeeds in deflecting the ball for a throw on, or when someone scythes a player down the crowd roars like nothing else.

The best creative players knew how to do the dirty and more basic parts of the game (none more so than Bergkamp), and they were loved as much for that as for their skill. In fact, it was a necessity that they show that side of their game, because without it, in England, you are always considered a lesser player. Even Pires put in the odd tackle, most famously against his old team mate Vieira. The ones who don’t realise this end up a disappointment and sometimes objects of derision. For Arsenal, both Reyes and Arshavin didn’t fully appreciate that they needed to show grit and fight, not just great skill, and in the end it did for their Arsenal careers, both somehow not having the right stuff when it came to succeeding in the Premier League, and being considered by fans as not “trying hard enough.”

But all is not lost for Mesut. It takes time to adapt to English football, it always seems so fundamentally different to that played on the continent. Wenger mentioned that Özil is bulking up in the gym, Mertesacker is on hand to explain what is required and has pointed things out to him before, so at least there is an awareness of the issue. It is still very possible for Mesut Özil to become an Arsenal legend. From the fan’s side I feel we do need to give him a bit more time, and perhaps be a bit more willing to understand that he may not do much for 75 minutes of a game, but will provide one or maybe two moments worth the entrance fee alone. However, this cultural attitude isn’t going to change overnight, so Özil will in the short term at least need to meet us halfway, and show he understands what is required of a player in an English team - that even though they are there to provide the moments of flair and magic, they need to roll their sleeves up occasionally, chase down a hopeless cause, put in a “strikers” tackle and show they at least have it in them to battle with the best of them. I hope Özil will start to show some of that side of the game, because it will keep fans onside even when the tiredness has set in and the passes aren’t quite working. If he does this, I’ll be there with everyone else screaming with glee “Go on Mesut, chop his legs!!! Have him!”


NEW! Subscribe to our weekly Gooner Fanzine newsletter for all the latest news, views, and videos from the intelligent voice of Arsenal supporters since 1987.

Please note that we will not share your email address with any 3rd parties.


Article Rating

Leave a comment

Sign-in with your Online Gooner forum login to add your comment. If you do not have a login register here.

139
comments

  1. Ozzie

    Feb 28, 2014, 5:19 #46575

    I sat stunned time & again over the years at the endless penalties at the death awarded to manure & later chel$ea while the gooners continually had their ankles kicked out from under them for no reward. Arsenal need a bully in the side.

  2. ed l

    Feb 27, 2014, 14:40 #46539

    Suarez who we bid for certainly had shortcomings but no one can deny his work rate and skill level. Ozil has barely convinced on the former point but its early days. DB let plenty of games pass him by . Lets just say Ozil has work to do before he gets a statue.

  3. WeAreBuildingATeamToDominate

    Feb 27, 2014, 12:16 #46531

    For what it's worth my take on the Fergerson/Moyes thing is this:Fergie might have been a few things but was no mug when it came to managing a football team. He knew when to get out,leaving his successor to pick up the pieces (ageing defence, little creativity in midfield etc) thus ensuring his place in MU folklore. With no Fergie to scare referees, guess what, 50/50 decisions are going against them. Moyes, a character who I personally don't know but who does come across as a real sourpuss, doesn't have that fear factor about him. His Everton sides were a poor man's version of the GG sides of the late 80's early 90's. He seems to be rapidly turning MU in that direction. Given the fullness of time, he may be viewed more kindly by their fans, as the man who was left to sort out the mess Fergie left behind. Never thought I would say this, but Roy Keane is about the only "pundit" not afraid to toe the corporate line about the "best league in the world" - it isn't and hasn't been for some time now. We're about equal to Ligue 1.

  4. jjetplane

    Feb 27, 2014, 11:17 #46527

    Bang on Westie about the Giggs thing and I have never heard it mentioned anywhere that he was/is the greatest whinger we have seen in our lifetime. I almost image Keane probably disliked him. Remember the Utd thing many moons ago though only remember one in my year! maybe a coupla of spuds, a little Chelsea contingent and 90 + % Arsenal. Simple really! Saw Giggs at his first highbury outing from the westlower! and was impressed. That soon went away when I noticed how much time he spent on the pitch whining to the ref. Horrible.

  5. Silly Billy

    Feb 27, 2014, 11:13 #46526

    westflower i just backed it at 9-1 50p ew

  6. Ron

    Feb 27, 2014, 9:54 #46525

    Westie - Im with you all the way there pal. Very succinctly put too. The love in with anything Man U related started late 50s early 60s didnt it. Youre maybe like me and recall being considered off beam at scholl if you didnt say you -'supported Utd' PS Worcs on Friday night next mate - Albert Lee Gig with his Heroe's band. Never seen Alb before, Hes 70 now!. One of the greats on guitar, yet many not familiar with him. BARD - Good point taken too mate. As an english coach, the media have led a love in with Moyes for years havent they really. I know many Everton fans who feel that despite the PL positions he reached for most of his years, they feel that he actually held them back with his tactics, albeit he brought good players into the Club.

  7. Westlower

    Feb 27, 2014, 9:28 #46524

    @Ron, Moyes is also missing the Ryan Giggs factor. This is the most unsporting footballer that's ever walked on planet earth. Throughout his career his chief role is to complain to the ref/officials and dispute every, & I mean every decision that's ever been awarded against Man U. Over time it puts doubt in the officials minds and lo & behold 50/50 decisions start to flow in favour of Man U. The media have always turned a blind eye to his behaviour. Rio Ferdinand is not far behind 'loveable' Giggsy & I won't even get onto the Scholes tackles he has been allowed to get away with over the years. All these factors add up to why the Glaswegian thug was so successful in the UK. Not so much in Europe as the Euro refs are made of sterner stuff & don't buy into the Man U love in.

  8. Bard

    Feb 27, 2014, 9:25 #46523

    I dont buy into the Fergie conspiracy simply because he's not that bright. These are football managers after all. Wengers the same for all the publicity surrounding him. Ive rarely heard him say anything meaningful other than platitudes and in.I could never understand the logic of the Moyes appointment anyway. He never did much at Everton.

  9. chris dee

    Feb 27, 2014, 9:20 #46522

    At last some good news in the papers today. Johan Djourou has stated he wants to stay in Hamburg next season. Phew!

  10. Westlower

    Feb 27, 2014, 8:55 #46521

    @Silly Billy, Your namesake runs at SOUTHWELL 5.20.

  11. Ozzie

    Feb 27, 2014, 2:31 #46518

    The more you knock him down the more you bring down his value when it comes time to move him on. Don't forget that 'thought is energy.' A good manager would have sat him on his bum and had a good heart to heart by now. Remember how Bobby Pires was always there for a tap in? Perhaps Ozil could watch some old tapes of that great man?

  12. Silly Billy

    Feb 26, 2014, 21:42 #46517

    real madrid are crap without ozil

  13. Chris

    Feb 26, 2014, 21:09 #46516

    The idea that the Man Utd board bought into 'Fergie's idea' of signing a crap manager after him to make him look good has to go down as one of the funniest things I've read on here for a while! Did I actually arrive in the David Icke forum by accident?

  14. Ron

    Feb 26, 2014, 21:02 #46515

    Jeff - i d take Fergies 'stitch up' even beyond the level that you do. Im of the view that Ferguson needed a patsy not only to leave him to pick up the remains of what was once a fine squad, but also needed a guarantee that his successor was an utter failure and thus leaving the impression that Ferguson was so great that the decline was all because the greatest wasn't there. I think the Board at Manure bought into this and Moyes fitted the bill perfectly, a young(ish) greenhorn who hadn't won so much as an egg cup, who was naive enough to fall for the 'theatre of dreams' myth and the cash rewards and not look honestly at the size of the task he faced with that crap, aged squad that even us fans could see was knackered out.Manure can now move on, sack Moyes, hes on the scrapheap, likely to end up managing Norwich (no disrespect Canaries and i love your recipes Delia)and they get a 'name' in to rebuild properly. Ferguson can then say ' ah, i was too big and too great to follow, they've had to go for a 2nd choice etc etc ?The big arrogant drunken sod ( never could stand champagne socialists! ha)

  15. jeff wright

    Feb 26, 2014, 18:23 #46514

    Hey Franky ,the turnip was a bit of jest swedes ,turnips,carrots lol... this assist passing is not as hard as suggest and Wenger's tactics are more set up to walk the ball into the net than to have a player hit the front man with a long raking pass as we see Liverpool do with Sturridge and Suarez. Suarez provides a lot of assists to Sturridge and others apart from scoring a shedfull of goals goals himself... so if Wenger had signed him it would be a case of buy one get one free ... no Ozil required 42m saved !

  16. jjetplane

    Feb 26, 2014, 18:04 #46513

    GH remember that Wrighty incident and was below the dressing room windows at the time. Same match we had a Blackburn fan in the Club propped up on a table - giving him all sorts of stag-related abuse. Always liked him as a player but those final games saw the spoilt, celebrity rear it's tiresome head. Now every dick is at it - even in the Conference! Must say that Wrighty on the radio is awful and in the same league as Savage. On the other hand Corky Keano is a blast when hes slagging off United. Flat flat very very flat - that's United. I'm begging yer Drogba! .... Ozil - time to build up your yellow collection. Dennis had that elbow in the locker. Wot you got? Who remembers GG at the Makita in the sunshine, Limpar in hand ... oh days.

  17. frankytheswede

    Feb 26, 2014, 18:00 #46512

    well alot of back and forth on here sum it up ozil is our best player and jeff you think wilshere rosicky arteta are pass masters youre words not mine do me a favour please arteta is a poor mans cesc and rosicky turns it on sometimes but alas to no great effect and as for jack the lad i look at him and sometimes feel he would be more suited to fusball lol we like to think we play a game of pass and move ala tiki taka but our success this season is down to one thing our defense because we are not outplaying anyone this season it has been a case of the result over the perormance id argue we need a player like ozil more than ever. ramsey is another player who we miss alot because of his runs from deep his energy and it looks like he actually wants to score unlike the frigid giroud and whats with the turnip lol

  18. jeff wright

    Feb 26, 2014, 17:25 #46511

    Thank you reverend Westie ,I have no problems with Gazdis getting a bonus if he earned it,selling players and not replacing them to get one though does not in my view meet that criteria. Ferguson stitched Moyes up,he knew the team was going down hill and left him to sort it out and take the blame! l

  19. Westlower

    Feb 26, 2014, 17:18 #46510

    @Jeff, The game has evolved beyond the 'old school' way of a running a football club. Bonuses will always be paid to key employees deemed to be meeting financial targets - it's the way of the world. Remove Stan and what happens? Another multi-millionaire fills the void, Usmanov or whoever. Be thankful Stan hasn't loaded us with Glazer size debts & associated high interest repayments. Interesting development that Moyes is odds on with 3 bookies to be the next manager to be sacked amid rumours an announcement on the NY stock exchange is imminent re Man U. Here endeth the lesson, bless you my son!

  20. jeff wright

    Feb 26, 2014, 17:11 #46509

    Cabaye looked like a typical Wenger type Ron, he is French for starters and one that Arsene thought that due to circumstances he could get for silly money. Same scenario with Suarez, in both cases though their clubs stood up to Wenger’s attempted robbery and he missed out on both. I’m absolutely convinced that Ozil at 42m was not a Wenger signing anymore than that Korean striker was. Of courseWenger had looked into the possibility of signing Ozil previously but that’s all it was, he also looked at Mata and Hazard and numerous others but the price tag attached put him off , as it did with Cabaye and Suarez. Sanago is a Wenger signing so is Kallstrom .

  21. Ron

    Feb 26, 2014, 17:06 #46508

    GH - Different times werent they mate. Loved Wrighty. Football was full of characters like him once wasnt it.It made the match going and fan experience at Highbury (for me anyway), far better than it is in todays sterile and corporate money governed climate. It was about what went on out on the pitch that counted then and little else.Can still capture that to an extent on away days, but 'The Emirates'. No thanks and the name says it all. Look at it now. Its like flaming snooker! Full of dullard players, with their media scripts all honed when ever they speak, all towing the TV and sponsors lines. Keane hit the nail on the head last night about the PL. Branded well. Quality poor, as he lambasted Carrick for his insomnia curing interview. A bit unfair on MC as theyre nearly all like it, but bang on i thought re his PL view.

  22. jeff wright

    Feb 26, 2014, 16:58 #46507

    Wesyie,I was refering to Ivan paying himself a £600,000 bonus based on profits that were made from the sale of players - while ticket prices for supporters continue to rise and no sign of any silverware to be seen. The only difference between Ivan lining his pockets at the club's expense and GG is that Ivan robs us legally!Actually what GG and others used to do is legally done now by managers who have clauses written into their contracts that allow them to get paid a percentage from transfer deals. It's usually about 3%. Rooney is a commodity he gets paid what the market dictates he is worth, right and wrong and other moral issues don't belong in football . Stan is just a hustler out to make a buck from his investment in AFC he has not as you claim actually put anything in to the club from his own pocket anymore that the Glazer's whom he admires have at United .These sort, that Hillwood once said we don't want at Arsenal, never do. That's why they become rich . The sugar daddy types who splash the cash on ego trips rather than to try and make a few million that they don't need are another matter. Stan though has not baulked at taking millions from these cretins when it was offered to him by them. I suggest that you save the moralizing sermons for the Sunday Church service Westie.

  23. Green Hut

    Feb 26, 2014, 16:54 #46506

    Westlower- Not surprised George had a problem motivating players at the end if they suspected he was making a personal profit from their transfers! Wrighty certainly was a one-off, the ultimate showman (albeit with a definite edge), still enjoy watching him on TV now, not that there's much technical analysis but you gotta love the enthusiasm. It's right and proper that he should be revered as an all-time Arsenal legend but I remember relations were a bit frosty between him and the fans during his last few months at the club. It's all a bit vague but off the top of my head seem to remember a game against Blackburn where he got a needless yellow that caused the team some problems going forward and he ended up having a shouting match with some fans from the dressing room window which made the papers. He used to mention the fans often but didn't again once before he left. Soon as he began media work though and started referring to Arsenal as 'us' and 'we' all was quickly forgiven and forgotten.

  24. Ron

    Feb 26, 2014, 16:43 #46505

    Nobody will really ever know if Ozil signing was to placate fan angst after the Villa beat us or not, but i do think that had Wenger have bought Cabaye, he would have landed the signing he really and truly wanted.

  25. WeAreBuildingATeamToDominate

    Feb 26, 2014, 16:30 #46504

    It's all a matter of opinion, but an AFC supporting pal I've known for a long time, who shall remain anonymous, told me that he considered GG a better manager than AW because he won the same honours with worse players. I can identify with his logic. He's been watching AFC since the late 1950's.

  26. Ron

    Feb 26, 2014, 15:59 #46503

    Whatever people say about GG and there was undoubtedly the relative down period at the scrag end of his time as well as the many up s under Goeorges tenure, no team ever got a free ride with us. No team ever considered us as a soft touch or suspect to bullying. Whether we were poor technically or just a one trick Cup team or not, we were still a tough team who didnt lie down easily. 1994 in the midst of GGs team decline realised a top european trophy on top of a domestic Cup double, when our league form was inept. In my view GG took the Club to where he did, from a position much further back in the pecking order than ever AW has done since succeeding BR, who in my view would also have done well at Arsenal had the Club not shafted him.

  27. Westlower

    Feb 26, 2014, 15:56 #46502

    @Jeff, Understandably GG is remembered with affection but strange you condone his actions in accepting payments as part of transfer dealing. The difference between Stan & GG is that Stan poured millions into the club to give us financial stability, while GG lined his own pocket. Who is the corrupt party? Because of his huge financial outlay Stan is entitled to a dividend from his investment. Why invest money without the prospect of a return? Ivan & AW combined, earn half of what Rooney is now paid. Hardly the stuff of overpaid robbers that you portray them. The first two named are responsible for the day to day running of AFC, Rooney is merely a member of a football 25 man squad, albeit a talented one.

  28. jeff wright

    Feb 26, 2014, 14:26 #46500

    Who really knows what goes on behind the scenes MG. You are right about GG carrying the can for what was the normal rules of engagement for managers such as Clough and co . GG didn't notice that the lights had changed and got caught out by that these big bonuses that Ivan pays himself are a form of legal corruption in my view because they are based on him making profits,and in the past he has resorted to selling players to make one and the cash was never reinvested in the squad such as after the sale of players toCity for some 40m this money disappeared into the club accounts and stayed there.While ticket prices, already the highest in football were raised even higher. Stan's heroes the Glazer's have taken millions from United while saddling the club with huge debts . Even Chelsea with sugar daddy Rom have in reality been placed into a debt situation because Rom set a holding company that all the money he loans to CFC holds the rights to claim back. Everytime he goes up in his helicopter the possibility that this might happen is up in the air with him. Sooner or later the brown stuff will hit the fan for some club,I on't think that it is likely to be us though,we have the Uzbek for back-up and the stadium is located in central London making it an attractive option for the Sultan of Bruni or some such type , the spuds in downmarket N17 have a far less attractive profile and Bermuda Joe would be better off turning the gaff into a supermarket .

  29. Chris

    Feb 26, 2014, 14:24 #46499

    SGRB - I think it's less likely but I wouldn't rule it out. We are supposedly in the market for a top striker now, after buying Ozil - if we bring one in in the summer, who's to say we wouldn't have brought that investment forward? The notion of a 'panic purchase' isn't applied wisely to these kinds of buys - reacting to changing circumstances (both positive and negative)is very different from 'panic buying'. Surely that's reserved for something which is ill-judged (as the errant Jeff would have us believe the Ozil purchase was) or ill-considered (which we know the Ozil buy wasn't because Arsene had been after him for years....

  30. maguiresbridge gooner

    Feb 26, 2014, 14:00 #46498

    Talking of bungs how do we know it's still not happening, as Ron has said it was rife back in GG's day and he was made a scapegoat and took the fall. i know times have changed since the brown bag in a motorway cafe where the cash was easier traced, we now have the internet, and there are now numerous more ways to set up accounts, false accounts, and make payments and launder money than before. There's now easier access to numerous banks all over the world, although using your pet dogs name might not be the brightest idea but what else would you expect from the gormless spiv concerned. There's talk of managers having shares in clubs, shares in players, is bonus's not another form of bung? i'm sure there will be plenty of chairmen happy and greatfull if the manager keeps them in the prem this season? I know managers are in a different world now salary wise and all millionaires, but you know the saying. We've already had TV documentaries and investigations.Would we be surprised if news broke of a top manager taking a bung, payment, or whatever you want to call it? shocked maybe but surprised?

  31. jeff wright

    Feb 26, 2014, 13:53 #46497

    Jack thanks for unsolicited opinion but I look nothing like Jack, you are more like him because like yourself he talks nonsense.In Durham's case he gets well paid to do so ,and it's just a wind-up to annoy fools like you , who listen to him and boost his audience and phone-in calls to his show. Were you not aware of this? That's yer daily Arsenal ! You couldn't make it up. Enough of this nonsense though,how about Stoke ,will Ozil be thrown into the fray to take on Charlie Adam ... will Mert and Tommy cope with Crouch on set pieces ... will there be a rematch between old sparky and Arsene on the touch line... I'm going for us to nick a win somehow...anyhow..

  32. Stroud Green Road Boy

    Feb 26, 2014, 13:07 #46496

    Chris, of course it's just my opinion, but I base it on the circumstances as they were - that is, when Ozil was actually available, not some hypothetical 'if he had been available earlier' scenario. I do not believe AFC would have bought Suaraz and then also bought Ozil. Do you disagree?

  33. Jack

    Feb 26, 2014, 13:04 #46495

    Jeff Wright you are the Adrian Durham of this board

  34. Westlower

    Feb 26, 2014, 12:59 #46494

    @GH, I never missed a game at Highbury in GG's reign and nobody appreciates his successes more than me. It became frustrating that whenever we appeared ready to dominate English football we went backwards. In early 1995 coming back on the tube from an Eric Clapton concert at the Albert Hall, GG sat opposite me and he got off at The Arsenal stop, presumably on his way to Highbury. This was approx. 11.30pm and I remember thinking GG must be having problems. Shortly after he left the club stating he could no longer motivate the players (quote from The Official Illustrated Arsenal History 1886-1996). Witnessing John Jensen scoring his one & only goal was the highlight of a very poor season. I thought at one stage we might get drawn into a relegation scrap. On a brighter note, Ian Wright's much earlier introduction turned us into a formidable Cup team but at the expense of Alan Smith effectiveness. If Wrighty didn't score we struggled, although Smudge scored a memorable goal in Copenhagen from our only worthwhile attempt on goal. Cue Anelka replacing Wrighty and we became a dominant league team again. A team with a single great goal scorer is no substitute for a balanced team. Like every other Gooner I loved watching the 'Ian Wright show' but it soon became apparent that we'd never win the league relying on one goalscorer. So pleased for him that he belatedly managed to bow out with a winners medal. The man was total box office and is an Arsenal legend but is proof you cannot build a team around one man, however good he may be.

  35. Green Hut

    Feb 26, 2014, 12:53 #46493

    Chris- Fair enough what you say if Wenger only talked about mental strength just before games, but it's when he bangs on about it shortly after games in which his team have only shown mental weakness that it sounds ridiculous. The players and public at large can see through that and surely it simply negates the intended effect when it's really needed.

  36. Chris

    Feb 26, 2014, 12:51 #46492

    SGRB - "Had we already bought Suarez, and possibly if we hadn't lost to Villa, Ozil would not have been bought or even considered." With respect, this is just your subjective opinion based on how you wish to see the subject. We don't know for sure that's the case - if Ozil had been available to us earlier, maybe he would have been top priority ahead of Suarez. Who knows? (Will resist the temptation to reply to Jeff's latest dozen or so fantasies, false statements etc except to ask - why emphasise 'lowly' Sunderland? Presumably it was because they are so lowly that Wenger knew we'd win without the world class Ozil)

  37. maguiresbridge gooner

    Feb 26, 2014, 12:44 #46491

    Head Tutor, in that case so would you, because unlike you and a lot of us jeff wright turned up on time for the exam, not a day late.

  38. Stroud Green Road Boy

    Feb 26, 2014, 12:17 #46490

    On this Ancellotti 'character' quote, Jeff says he meant 'lacked character', Amos says he meant 'different sort' of character. Unless one of you has got clarification from Ancellotti, neither of you know which he meant. They're both just subjective interpretations stemming from how you both wish to see the situation. On Ozil, the fact that Wenger tried to sign him 3 years ago (and of course he's the type of player Wenger loves) doesn't preclude him from being a 'panic' (perhaps 'opportunistic' is a better word) buy last summer. AFC spent the entire summer trying to buy a striker. AFC saw the opportunity when Perez needed to sell in order to part-fund his 'signature' purchase of Bale for his new term of presidency. Had we already bought Suarez, and possibly if we hadn't lost to Villa, Ozil would not have been bought or even considered.

  39. jeff wright

    Feb 26, 2014, 12:14 #46489

    Amos, I have no desire to get involved in another of your tedious pedantic point scoring tete a tetes, suffice it to say that you interpret Ancelotti’s comments on Ozil differently to what I do. Lack of dynamism and character was Ancelotti’s view of Ozil . And from what I have seen of the little man I concur with those views. Regarding Ozil’s going missing in big games this has been claimed by various people in the media , I have heard it said on TV and on the radio and read it in those newspapers whose reliability on such matters you place so much faith in. Also so far , from what I have seen of Ozil, he has not even turned up in big games such as the away at City when fellow national side player Mertesacker had a pop at him afterwards for snubbing our supporters and was he the poorest of the poor at Anfield. No dynamism on show from him in those big games when we needed it. . Even old arm waving Flam had to bawl him out in the BM game when Ozil stood like a traffic cop waving Robben on by toward our goal. Wenger himself is not happy with Ozil’s performances either , particularly his lackadaisical approach to taking spot kicks, and even dropped him in the game against lowly Sunderland. There was no sign that he was missed . As I pointed out to effervescent Chris last night on here Bale in comments made last October, you can easily google them, said that the Madrid players were not missing Ozil .. They are currently 3 points clear at the top of La Liga with Ancelotti leading them to a possible title win. I should point out though that I do not blame Ozil for our poor performances against top sides, these have been happening for sometime now. I just do not see him as being the man whom we needed to reverse this trend.

  40. Bard

    Feb 26, 2014, 12:02 #46488

    All this Ozil stuff is a little premature surely. He hasn't been with us long enough to judge. Just because we paid silly money for him doesn't mean he automatically can put in world class performances. Let's make a judgement next season. It might be relevant that he had Ronaldo up front while at Madrid rather than a willing workhorse like Giroud.

  41. jeff wright

    Feb 26, 2014, 11:43 #46487

    Green Hut, I doubt that GG would have survived 9 years without winning anything. It's true that things did go wrong in the league at the end of his tenure,but GG still won a trophy , the European Cup Winners Cup in 1994. Wenger has never won any Euro Cups , despite being at AFC for 16 years.

  42. DJ

    Feb 26, 2014, 11:37 #46486

    Just a view of George Graham: he should never be forgiven for selling Rocky and Limpar and replacing them with McGoldrick and Jensen,, I won't even mention Hillier! Although, as mentioned on here 1987 semi-final at the Lane was the greatest game I've ever been to as if we had finally seen the light after a decade in the darkness!

  43. Amos

    Feb 26, 2014, 11:36 #46485

    @jeffwright. At the risk of appearing pedantic (as if I care !)you're misrepresenting the argument. Ancelotti didn't say Ozil lacked dynamism or character any more than he said Di Maria lacked skill. (And where, anywhere, can you find anything that supports the claim Ancelotti thought Ozil went missing when it mattered? Any direct quotes worth considering?) He was simply saying that those characteristics were more useful to him in a squad that had just bought Bale and Isco. He had to sell someone. He didn't have the choice to keep them all any more than he had the choice whether to buy Isco and/or Bale. We do know what Real supporters, his former manager and key players thought of him though. Ozil played more than 50 games in each of the 3 seasons he was at Real under Mourinho. Now from what you might understand about the preferences of Mourinho is that scenario likely if Ozil were 'lackadaisical' or 'went missing in big games'? As for the 'panic situation' myth. Wenger tried to buy Ozil 3 years ago before he joined Real as both Ozil and Wenger have confirmed. Of course we needed another creative midfielder. The fact that Ozil has created more assists and goal scoring attempts for us than any other player suggests that it wasn't a good decision. I offer these observations not because I'm keen to change your mind but simply because others may wish to consider opinions that have some support or evidence basis. There is a balance of probabilities in such exchanges that others might wish to give weight to while others will prefer to remain wedded to their views.

  44. Green Hut

    Feb 26, 2014, 11:33 #46484

    Westlower- Wenger would be allowed to get away with whatever he wanted if he won 2 trophies as George did in 92/93, a feat in being the first club ever to win both domestic cups in the same season that has never been given the recognition it deserved. And as you know, in 94/95 the bung scandal rumbled on from October till Feb when Graham was sacked so no surprise we finished in a lowly position.

  45. jeff wright

    Feb 26, 2014, 11:07 #46483

    Wombledon, if Ozil is such an hotshot, who is too clever for us dumbass English ,then why is he playing here and not in the more rarefied atmosphere of super-duper Europe? The answer ,according to Ancelotti, who I suspect knows a bit more about football than you do, although to be fair most other ordinary folk probably do so as well, says that it was his lack of dynamism and character that was the reason why he chose to play the less talented De Maria over Ozil . So it was not a skill factor that was involved but other ones. Going missing in big games was claimed to be one of them. Players who like dyanmism and character usually struggle in the English league . . I think it was a panic situation by both parties that led to Ozil ending up here. ,Perez and Stan both had reasons to do the deal . We all know that Suarez was the player who Wenger really wanted because he has said so. Wenger already had the players to provide the ammo for Suarez . Was anyone claiming when it that if Wenger signed Suarez that he would need to sign a a new midfield player as well ? I never saw anyone say that all the suggestions were that Wenger needed to sign some new players in other positions. I saw saw anyone suggest that Ozil was the player that we needed. There is a touch of being wise after the event about this now and attempts to make it look as though it was a planned shrewd move by Wenger that has gone temporally wrong ,but will be all right on the night. A bit odd this because Ancelotti sold Ozil because he reputedly came up short in the big games when it mattered. Anyway plenty of them to come for us so a chance for Ozil to prove Anceloti wrong .

  46. Green Hut

    Feb 26, 2014, 10:57 #46482

    maguiresbridge- Apologies for flouting the rules mate, I was aware but was hoping I could sneak it through. Agree that s**rs is a nickname/term of affection that should never be used but to me although spuds is a kind of putdown it's a bit too jokey to use in reference to the evil that lurks in the Middlesex marshland, which is why I keep to the formal t*******m. Not going to disrespect the general concensus though so I'll find another way to label them, that is after I've used my second strike!

  47. jeff wright

    Feb 26, 2014, 10:36 #46481

    Ah! Another pseudo intellectual 'Head Teacher' pops up with his 'erudite' comments . However,you are fooling no one with your attempts to appear intelligent Head Case because everyone knows who you are,and you are no head teacher . There is no examination taking place on here, this is a football forum and not a quiz night at your local pub, the Old Posers Arms, where a glass of Teachers is about as near as you ever get to any scholar like activities. As for you being a head teacher it's actually really a case of you being just a big head and no brain. On me 'ead son! And remember that just because you are paranoid it doesn't mean that they are not watching you. Have a nice day now.

  48. Ron

    Feb 26, 2014, 10:00 #46480

    Alsace - Agree so much there on Cazorla. Hes the one to make way for Ozil for me, if there has to be a choice.Ozil does lack physically right now as most do in the 1st season, but Cazorla s had time and for me, he s a 'hider'. Doesnt like close marking and wilts in front of physically imposing teams. Ozil has the class to be like Cesc and use his brain to cope with physically inclined opponents.

  49. Alsace Lorraine de Totteridge

    Feb 26, 2014, 9:48 #46479

    Ozil has never worried me. In my view he is a class player, very rarely caught in possession and sees the killer passes. It's his first season in the mucky gaff that is the premiership FFS. I'm not that keen on Cazorla as a player and would always rather see Rosicky on the pitch but at least he tries hard, as they are all doing. Our biggest worry isn't on the pitch, its at the side of the pitch wearing an oversized coat.

  50. Wombledon

    Feb 26, 2014, 9:48 #46478

    Look at all the ****ing idiots on here lambasting a truly class player. Ungrateful fans like you lot picking on a stand-out quality international like Ozil should be ashamed, lamenting him because he doesn't "track back" properly. It's all about not being 'lazy' and running around like some lager lout is all you English care about. That's why the English football team is so **** year in and year out, because all they care about is all guts and effort when skill and class are more important. Common garbage fans who don't deserve one of Europe's best passers and assister's ever seen. It's Wenger who is to blame by confusing Ozil on what he should be doing and not providing the proper defensive support. Instead you gump fans harange him like common school yard bullies for not spending all the game 'tracking back' and tackling like any old Sunday common league player can. Wenger destroyed Andrew Arshavin and is now destroying Ozil.

  51. radfordkennedy

    Feb 26, 2014, 9:46 #46477

    Westlower..Ron..morning fellas,with regards to Stroller he never really learnt from the mistakes made by Bertie did he,as you said Ron the 90-91 team where magnificent,but instead of building on it we very quickly went from Rocky,Thomas and Davis to Hillier Selley Jensen etc,and with the addition of Wrighty who i loved,i think it had an effect on Smudger and his partnership of sorts with Merse,so the quality was allowed to slip but his teams still had a doggedness about them insamuch as going from title contenders to Cup Kings.The one thing he did learn fron Don Howe though was to build a team from the back,make that solid first then move through the team building the offensive side of things rather than a never ending patch work quilt job where you never get it quite right,something that i think weve suffered from over recent years,just as we get it right to a degree at one end it falls apart at the other.Incidently i heard a radio advert this morning on talksport by Manure advertising the availability of VIP and corporate packages for up coming games including the City game!,and if you add to that the recent very un-manure like statements from the club saying they have untold millions to spend this summer on this and that target,it really does suggest a slight hint of panic from the owners,could it be that the club are deliberately making the noises the fans want to hear so as to protect the ST renewals and corporate box sales,sounds a bit familiar doesnt it

  52. WeAreBuildingATeamToDominate

    Feb 26, 2014, 9:45 #46476

    Westlower @9.18: mate, don't forget the season before when AFC had the best of both worlds, 74 goals for, 18 against. Admittedly many of those were created Seaman to Smith, flick on to Campbell - but that was football in England for much of that period. If it wasn't broke (and English teams in that season had just been readmitted to Europe - no European Cup though) why fix it. That 90/91 side was an the best example of method football that I've ever seen. The problem happened when in the following seasons the method stopped working.

  53. Joe S.

    Feb 26, 2014, 9:43 #46475

    How boring. Ozil gives Arsenal one of the few touches of class it has. Take him out of the squad and you have an even bigger group of average players. Look around. Who else could provide those passes. That he should be doing it more often would be a big plus, but so would the addition of real footballers like Eddie Hazard and Cavani in place of the likes of Giroud or Arteta. I'm sure Ozil's interest would increase a notch then. Also why doesn't anyone get on Carzola's back for his inability to produce in big games.

  54. Westlower

    Feb 26, 2014, 9:18 #46474

    @Ron, GG was never comfortable playing attacking football. The one exception was in 91/92 when we scored 81 goals and conceded 46, winning 19 games from 42 played to finish 4th. Limpar was star man for most the season but GG never fancied him and he was invariably the first player substituted, much to the crowds displeasure. GG lost his nerve for playing flair players after that season & reverted to type the following year, Goals for 40, goals against 38, 15 wins from 42 games, we've already won 18 this season from 15 games less. We never got thumped under GG because the team emphasis was on defending (the offside trap in particular). AFC became labelled Boring, Boring, Arsenal and the tag was justified as we witnessed some of the most mind numbing football ever seen at Highbuy. Yes, we had had some great times & success mixed in with the dross but we certainly were a yo-yo club in that period. As you say, we should have kicked on after GG's last league Championship win but sadly we fell away until AW turned up.

  55. Chris

    Feb 26, 2014, 9:17 #46473

    I would have thought it was bleeding obvious that Arsene went on about the mental strength precisely to try and instill it (and/or the importance of it) in his players. I firmly believe that you can take a technically excellent player and instill fighting spirit / hone their mental strength more easily than yo can take some with a great mentality and teach them to be technically perfect. Obviously to be right at the top of the game, you need both but I believe Wenger's 'technique first' way is correct. Unfortunately, like GG as Ron mentions, AW hasn't been shopping in the top tier (albeit partly for different reasons) so the raw material has often not been as good but still he has maintained a consistent level of high (if not he highest) acheivement, as we all know....

  56. Ron

    Feb 26, 2014, 8:26 #46472

    Morning Westie - hiya mate. Of course it cant and like ive said footballers have changed really into a being a large raft of pampered babies across the board at PL level in many cases, not just at Arsenal. There was a quite a bit of limited technical ability even in GGs best sides really wasnt there, but he knew how to eke the best from even his most ltd performers. I think he knew the strengths and weaknesses and worked within them so players knew their role better than does Arsene. Arsene tends to encourage a level of excellence from players who cant give it in my view mate. When that fails, it affects the collective very much so, in any team, even at lower levels. Those team s of 93-95 reflected GGs periods of being a naughty boy, where his gain took precedence over the teams needs in my view. They were poor, but not in my view flaky. Arsenes teams over the last 5 years do have quite a lot of stand out games where they've visibly wilted and situations where they've clearly not fancied it have led to many reverses. There were no doubt some poor defeats in the seasons you mentioned. I cant recall really, but i cant recall too many thrashings to highlight? I think that GGs times and actions refected the poor salary he was on vis other coaches at top clubs. Had he have been properly paid maybe he wdt have made the mistake he did (the idiot!) and in my view would have been a great manager for many many years and Arsene may never have arrived. Its all academic isn't it. Have a good day mate.All good stuff. His 1991 team really should have kicked on but as we do, the Club stalled didn't it.

  57. Head Tutor

    Feb 26, 2014, 7:52 #46471

    If this was an examination jeff wright has failed miserably. He shows no aptitude for the subject.

  58. Westlower

    Feb 26, 2014, 7:41 #46470

    @Ron, GH, What happened to the great mental strength in GG's teams in 92/93; P42, W15, D11, L16, Pts 56 Pos 10th: 94/95; P42, W13, D12, L17, Pts 51, Pos 12th. AW wouldn't be allowed to get away with these moderate performances. Maybe the team lacked technical ability at this time? Mental strength cannot always overcome lack of ability.

  59. Edmund

    Feb 26, 2014, 7:12 #46469

    Are some of the comments from true gooners? We are still in it for silverware this season and yet some are calling for Ozil and Wenger's heads. Gervinho and Arshavin were great players who lost their confidence due to poor support. Why else did we have better away than home record the past few seasons. During Bergkamp or Viera's time these guys were probably calling them to get the boot for the odd off game too. Stand behind your team and the manager. Let Emirates be like Anfield or Celtic Park and we will win titles.

  60. radfordkennedy

    Feb 26, 2014, 7:02 #46468

    Mornin all..I gotta say I always thought that the 'Kipper and the Corpse' was the funniest comedy script ever written,but the exchanges on here have been hysterical..Jeff don't forget Amos neglected to place you under caution so don't worry mate,mind you it might be beneficial to you to state that 'for the benefit of the tape you are leaving the room'when you put the kettle on.

  61. Ozzie

    Feb 26, 2014, 5:43 #46467

    I agree with you that Ozil should...put it about a bit. Maybe he should take lessons from one Giroud:)

  62. maguiresbridge gooner

    Feb 25, 2014, 23:50 #46465

    Green Hut, i'm pulling you up for the use of a dirty word in 49416, there's a lot of us adhering to the non use of it on here, ( everybody welcome to join)) i had to pull BADARSE up on it the other day, as you probably weren't aware of it i'll let you off, spuds seems to be the favorite but not the other five letter word either which i'm told they like, but you can use your own providing the moderators deem it ok. It's a three strikes your out two warnings and the third time you buy/pay for a round of drinks for everybody when we meet up at the end of the season.

  63. maguiresbridge gooner

    Feb 25, 2014, 23:19 #46464

    Ron, Green hut, Gorgeous and his teams knew what real mental strength was alright and there was no need for him to keep trying to convince everybody else of it, as we could see it for ourselves.

  64. you couldnt make it up

    Feb 25, 2014, 22:28 #46463

    we dont need joey campbell, we've got postman pat sanagoo.

  65. WENGER OUT

    Feb 25, 2014, 21:42 #46462

    Is Joel Campbell the one Wenger wants to sell to Olympiakos?

  66. Green Hut

    Feb 25, 2014, 21:11 #46461

    Ron- All fair comment mate, and at the end of the day I'm far more pro-The Arsenal than anti-tottenham so best to remember the good times, and the 1987 League Cup semi-final replay (OK against them again) was the best atmosphere I've ever been a part of (incl Anfield 89) so thanks to George for the many good times, although Arsene in his early years undenialbly gave us some fantastic never-to-be-forgotten experiences.

  67. jjetplane

    Feb 25, 2014, 21:00 #46460

    We want Joel Campbell back! Whey hey!

  68. Ron

    Feb 25, 2014, 20:38 #46459

    GH - I know mate. In fairness though he was scapegoated by our Board and they joined the witch hunt over the Hauge scandal and lets face it, there were many other coaches sweating as GG took the fall for them all really. He was the biggest scalp and the Board offered him up willingly, as it masked them having to ease him out because the team had rotted like an old badger carcass on the road side. I just reckon he needed to re affirm his professionalism to himself by going to the spuds and doing a job there. Took some guts to do it didnt it though. Privately, would he have enjoyed it? On one hand yes, as it was fingers up to our Board. On the other, not very much i wager. Probably indifferent to it. Be nice to ask him wdt it!

  69. jeff wright

    Feb 25, 2014, 20:37 #46458

    I'm not trying to squirm out of anything on technicalities Chris. The article asked was English football to blame for Ozil's problems. I correctly pointed out that Ozil had been forced out of la liga with allegations being made about his attitude and lifestyle . No one other than Amos could possible claim that it was an amicable departure. Of course some former team mates when asked would have paid tribute to him at that time when tabloid journo's were looking for a quote to stir up trouble for Ancelotti by claiming that his selling Ozil was a mistake. However ,Amos as usual was being selective in his choice of quotes regarding this and comments made by Bale in an interview in October when he was asked if the Madrid players were missing Ozil monkey boy said no that they were not missing him and had now moved on. The same clowns who are coming on here telling us that Ozil will come good are the same ones that told us that Gervinho would also do so. They have have gone quiet about that now though ,so let's hope they are right about Ozil. I won't be holding my breath on this happening though because asphyxiation is an horrible way to leave the building. I liked your analogy Ron we could do with a defensive plan like that to thwart Ribery and co in the Fussball Arena ...well it worked for Chelsea there ! Although they did have Drogba and he didnt need a 40 pass move to score a cross from a corner sufficed for him to get the Chelsea goal - sometimes it's best to just keep things simple .

  70. Ron

    Feb 25, 2014, 20:26 #46457

    JJ - Yes, Young Messi. Could watch him all day couldn't you. Hes one of them players who when hes on song, its almost a privilege to have your team tortured by him! Like Bestie years ago. Great sport, humble and genuine too, as Bestie was too. The guy Messi's got the lot, the lucky sod. Mourinho's looking a bit of a turkey right now isn't he. Hes not so sharp as he was when here last, esp with this last lot to the French press. Bet Arsenes having a glass or red to the latest bungle of Jose s.

  71. Green Hut

    Feb 25, 2014, 20:26 #46456

    Ron- Agreed, George knew what it took to win trophies (6 in 8.5 years compared to Wenger's 7 in 17.5 years in case anyone believes Wenger's record is unsurpassable) but I find it difficult to forgive him for managing and winning a trophy for the filth down the road so it's a difficult one for me. I loved him too but I so wish he hadn't done it, whatever his misgivings with the Arsenal board. He certainly knew how to instill proper mental strength though, with Wenger it's simply transparent, lip service.

  72. ITK

    Feb 25, 2014, 20:17 #46455

    Here's the question. Who would you drop from Jack, Flamini, Ramsey, the Ox, Santi, Giroud for Ozil? Ok Ramsey is not fit, so replace him with Rosicky. Question is still valid. I would play all above before Ozil and I've not thrown Theo & Podolski into the mix! Ozil must not be selected against Stoke. We need 11 men on the pitch for a war.

  73. jjetplane

    Feb 25, 2014, 20:09 #46454

    Ron I have followed a few too including two years with Exeter City, a few Brighton games and ah a year watching College basketball in the states with Kansas Jayhawks (Allen Fieldhouse) and that year they won the big one! I put it all alongside Tony Adams sticking into the north bank net to match the iconics of Charlie at Wembley. Talking of footer that pass thing that Messi does when he repeats the action like he was in a 'pride of cats' Kept doing it to Toure till he was punch-drunk. Fascinating s... and this is a weird season. Must be all that money. It's turning Maureen into one clown(ness)! He did Wenger one massive favour. Here's hoping Galatasarasy tear 'em to bits.

  74. Chris

    Feb 25, 2014, 20:00 #46453

    Jeff - One of the many differences between you and the more rational contributors to this site is that your version of 'pedantic' means sticking to reality/the facts & not contradicting yourself. But then you yourself try to split hairs and squirm out on a technicality. It's a good job both you and Ron are on the wrong side of the argument or he'd be all over you like a rash, assuming the moral high ground and pontificating about the nature of knowledge and reality....

  75. Ron

    Feb 25, 2014, 19:58 #46452

    Thats a far better analogy than mine mate. GG at his best wasn't it. Loved GG. If Wenger had ever been able to weld some of the fibre and bottle of GGs into AW s teams, we d have ruled Europe years ago. I often wonder what GG thinks when he hears Arsene waxing lyrical about mental strength of his lads these days? GG never needed to talk about mental strength.It was a given. I've often thought Arsene says it to convince himself its there today, but deep down knows it isn't. Footballers are different now though. Too much easy money and its there win lose or draw.

  76. Ron

    Feb 25, 2014, 19:45 #46451

    JJ - Thats great news for your boys. Sounded a cracker of a game.Ha. I love non league as you know mate. I like the Championship too. Im like a nomad really. Like going to Brighton occasionally (good stadium that) plus Kidderminster Harriers a few times each season. Best non league game i ever saw mate was back in 89. Tamworth v Sudbury town. I d been to the Vase Wembley Final 0-0 where Sudbury were very unlucky. Replay Tamworth won 3-0 or 3-1. It was close to the time when we won the title at Anfield. Tam had a few old pro s then. What an atmosphere! People who don't sample other such football are missing out aren't they. The Prem stuff for me now is just so cosmetic nowadays. Its OK now and then for a good Gunners away day though. Ian Moores (an ex spud) and one or two others played for Tamworth then. Mate is a big Kidder Harriers fan. Great Club. Nice little ground. Hope you can win the Vase mate.Best of luck.

  77. Green Hut

    Feb 25, 2014, 19:43 #46450

    Ron- I reckon Parma 94 sums it up pretty well mate, Jeff's on his own up front without the suspended Wrighty, with Selley and Morrow in midfield and battling Zola, Asprilla and a slim Brolin in the oppositon attack. Deliver an early blow then defend like billy-ho against the defending champions for the remaining 70 minutes. Only wish I hadn't booked the coach trip for that final!

  78. jjetplane

    Feb 25, 2014, 19:17 #46449

    Ron just what I was thinking! Hit Man Wright! Like that AC thing and remember a drunken trip to see a Milan Derby more than twenty years ago. Gladiators you bet! And the odd Vespa on fire! With Wrighty and yourself all the way but still like Ozil and hope he does become half-a-Pires. But your Walcott and readies would have done us for Suarez. Sure of that. Just to say as you are a man for watching the non leaguers. Was witness to Vase match last saturday that had 3 yellows and 1 red in first 2 minutes! We were then 4-0 up by half time. Second half their whole team was booked and 2 more sending offs leaving them with 8! and we scored twice for a 6-1 meaning Eastbourne Utd are 2 away from Wembley! Here's to a double! Not quite like Highbury.

  79. Ron

    Feb 25, 2014, 18:56 #46448

    Ha Ha . Good old Jeff! Green Hut - Just trying to think of an analogy for Jeff. I reckon hes like Inter Milan circa 1972, the waves of attacks threaten yet a stiff rearguard action, tried tested and relied upon for years, flavoured by a few choice tackles (a few over the ball!) holds firm. Breaks out only when it seems safe to try and sting his adversaries on the break!Jeff - You're tonight 'Catenaccio Jeff' - ill expect to see the intro of your new handle when next you post matey! What a fight, just like Ali v Foreman. Your 'rope a dope' held firm buddy! Just lacked a few 'is that the best you got's' here and there.

  80. Amos

    Feb 25, 2014, 18:44 #46447

    @jeffwright. There is a significant difference between the direct quote and the newspaper reports portrayal of what was said. "It's true, that maybe Di Maria has less quality than Ozil but on a profile of dynamism, character and help to the team I preferred Di Maria. With the arrival of Bale it was better to have Di Maria than Ozil." What Ancelotti is commenting on is the difference in character not whether either lacks character - a preference for a particular type in the context of the squad - following the acquisition of Bale. It may be useful to contrast Mourinho's treatment of Mata as Chelsea boss with his treatment of Ozil as Real boss if you really want to get some genuine perspective on Ozil as a character. No you didn't say the Perez's claims (formally denied long before you posted them) about Ozil's lifestyle were true you simply stated them as though they were in an attempt to support of your claim. Seems you've relied rather to much on what you've read in the newspapers. Ironic really. :)

  81. jeff wright

    Feb 25, 2014, 18:20 #46446

    Amos,I was using quotes from a newspaper about Ancelotti's views on Ozil Obviously you only believe the ones in the papers that suit your own pedantic arguments. "Coach Carlo Ancelotti has admitted Mesut Özil is more talented that Andel Di Maria, but he decided to sell the German because he doesn't have enough character. Özil left the Spanish giants for Arsenal on transfer deadline day in a club record £42 million deal. The move was prompted by Gareth Bale's arrival at the Bernabeu, but Di Maria has continued to play an important role so far this season with the Welshman injured for much of the campaign. Explaining his decision to sell Özil, Ancelotti said: "I decided the departure of Özil. I prefer Di Maria for the balance of the team. "It's true, that maybe Di Maria has less quality than Özil but on a profile of dynamism, character and help to the team I preferred Di Maria." This clearly states that Ozil's dynamism and character were less than what the less talented Di Maria's are. I also never claimed that the allegations about OZIL'S PRIVATE LIFE WERE TRUE,THEY MAY BE OR THEY MAY NOT BE. Fottballers use legal threats to stop these stories whatever the truth I said that Perez used this to help drive Ozil out.GH,Ive had enough,i'm out of here!

  82. Le Spinmeister Generale

    Feb 25, 2014, 17:59 #46445

    @ Stroud Green.. Its all about context though isnt it - If I ask someone for evidence... then someone provides evidence and I go "was that from the sun" (quite disparagingly as the Sun is sorta noted for printing trash..) and then later I go "I dont believe everything I read in the papers"... then what logically follows.. is you would believe I dont think too highly of newspaper evidence. So I think its quite logical for someone to then ask.. well what evidence do you accept exactly??? What Jeff is trying to do is get out on a slight semantic difference, a technicality.. But we all bloody know what he is up to. Its called spin

  83. Amos

    Feb 25, 2014, 17:56 #46444

    @jeffwright. Ancelotti wouldn't have direct experience of Ozil's character he'd never managed him. I see you've put "he lacked character" in direct quotes - a mistake that even the Sun wouldn't make - and a flagrant misrepresentation. Ancelotti said nothing of the sort - simply that he had a preference for the type of player Di Maria was given his need to balance the squad that he was presented with. You also have contrary statements of his character not only by those who played with him but also the man who managed him at Real for 3 years. Similarly you have relied on newspaper reports of Perez's opinions on Ozil's lifestyle without reference to the official statement, following the threat of legal action, issued by Real on the 13th September denying that any such comments were ever made by Perez or anyone associated with the club.

  84. Green Hut

    Feb 25, 2014, 17:56 #46443

    jeff wright- You are a hero, getting stick from all sides but you keep coming back for more. If Wenger had had more players with your never-say-die attitude we might have actually won something over the past 8 years. Keep fighting the fight mate, a wonderfully entertaining day on the board. I salute you, sir!

  85. jeff wright

    Feb 25, 2014, 17:55 #46442

    le gen ..RVP WAS SOLD 2 SEASONS BACK ... your analogy is rather flawed ... but then again so is every thing else that you post .Tbh I have no idea what you are forking going on about!

  86. Stroud Green Road Boy

    Feb 25, 2014, 17:49 #46441

    @ lee afc, that's not actually a contradiction, though it looks like one. If Jeff says 'I don't believe everything' it follows that he may believe some things, just as 'I never said I do not believe everything' means he may believe some things. I admire Jeff's stamina whilst he's increasingly being ganged up on. The pedantry from some quarters is remarkable: 'that's an opinion not a fact', 'that opinion is not verifiable'. People are often writing in an off the cuff manner in colloquial English; it's a football blog not an exam!

  87. jeff wright

    Feb 25, 2014, 17:44 #46440

    leeafc, SLOWLY NOW... I said , I don't believe EVERYTHING that is printed in newspapers, not that I don't believe ANYTHING that is printed in them , that Le Genral claimed that I said. Easy to understand so why are you still here struggling with it. Goodbye .

  88. Le Spinmeister Generale

    Feb 25, 2014, 17:43 #46439

    @ Jeff You cant edit comments right on this very page. You asked for links... someone posted the quotes that said links would provide. Then you had problems with newspaper evidence. are you really expecting hollywood style coverage of ronaldo in tears begging for ozil? a quote should more than suffice in parathesis should more than suffice for anyone who knows anything about what newspapers are and are not allowed to report. As for ex players, players departed and Ozil. You actually made the link but it seems confuddled yourself. The logic went: Real Madrid sold Ozil + Real Madrid currently doing fine in the league = Ozil is crap Regardless of whether you feel RVP forced the sale: Arsenal SOLD RVP TO MANCHESTER UNITED + Arsenal 1 point off top and doing well in FA Cup = RVP is crap. You typed those words, not me Jeff.

  89. lee afc

    Feb 25, 2014, 17:30 #46438

    @Jeff wright....at 14.43 you stated to me that 'I don't believe everything that is printed in newspapers'....at 17.06 you stated ' I never said that I do not believe everything that I read in newspapers....give it a rest mate...every gooner is laughing at you but you can't see it.

  90. jeff wright

    Feb 25, 2014, 17:25 #46437

    Le General ,my comments about Ozil have nothing to do with other players our ones or others . However, as far as I aware Van Persie forced a move to United by stating that he wouldn't sign a new contract with us . He then went on to win the Prem last season with them. What any of this has to do with Ozil only you know. Bale said in October that the Madrid team were not missing Ozil when he was asked about that. RM with Ozil in the team did not win la liga last season,so if they are runners up this time then his absence will have made no difference to that.If they win it then everyone will say how shrewd Ancoletti and Perez are. Ozil need something to happen,other than you and a few other AKB's who used to tell us all how Gervinho would soon come good, the same old. The man he needs to convince most though is Wenger because he's not looked that overjoyed with the little play-boy lately and as others such as Poldolski have once they fall out of favour with Wenger it is not easy to get back in it with him.

  91. lee afc

    Feb 25, 2014, 17:09 #46436

    Jeff has tied his self up in so many knots....I'm surprised he can keep typing on his keyboard. Admit you are wrong and just move on.

  92. jeff wright

    Feb 25, 2014, 17:06 #46435

    Le General ,I asked Amos if he had read the comments in a newspaper or if he had seen them else where ( perhaps on Sky) then could he show me a link for it. I never said that I don't believe everything that I read in newspapers ,not that I don't believe anything. You made that up .Now if you do believe that everything you read in them is true then bully for you. This though probably explains why you suffer from delusions. Not least that you believe you are making intelligent points when in reality you are posting nonsense.

  93. Le Spinmeister Generale

    Feb 25, 2014, 16:53 #46434

    @ Jeff The season has not concluded for either RM or Arsenal. You contended that as RM are doing well in their league without Ozil - obviously as it stands - the implication is they were right to get rid. Arsenal are in a better position in the league now than at any point when RVP played for us. Ergo by your logic he is ****e and not missed. Even though you include him in your list of ex players "going on to win things". So which is it Jeff?

  94. jeff wright

    Feb 25, 2014, 16:49 #46433

    Amos,I don't need to rewind back I stick with my comments that Ozil was driven out of la liga because of his lackadaisical ways and life style. You cunningly omitted the bit from Ancelotti's comments that he made about why he sold Ozil where he says that the main reason was because" he lacked character". This referred to his going missing in big games when the pressure was on . Perez also slated Ozil for his play-boy life style - with him jetting off to see his girl-friend when he should have been training before games. So along with the fact that Ancelotti clearly had desire to have Ozil in his side because of his character I fail to see why my comments that he was driven out la liga due to his lackadaisical ways regarding his football character and his lifestyle are not reasonable ones.

  95. Le Spinmeister Generale

    Feb 25, 2014, 16:41 #46432

    @ Jeff... If you dont believe what you read in the papers... what logic is there in asking Amos to back up his assertions with links???? What type of evidence would these links be pointing to? Are you expecting direct audio feeds? Phone taps? Text message logs? I suppose you could then claim these are doctored to. Voice spoofed etc "There Are None So Blind As Those Who Will Not See". Your spin is actually quite amusing though I will give you that.

  96. jeff wright

    Feb 25, 2014, 16:18 #46431

    Le Spinmeister Generale,I had read some comments attributed to Ronaldo in a newspaper but as I said I don't just believe what I read in newspapers,it may come as shock to you living in your ivory tower viewing the world from your telescope , to learn that newspapers often print stories that are made up or taken out of context . I asked Amos for a links to direct comments he has not provided any. Instead he suggested that I surf on Youtube to find them. So what is your problem Le Generale apart from you suffering from an obvious deluded Napoleonic persona of grandeur ? As for Ozil I repeat my advice to you ,come back and tell us about it when he , or if ever, he starts to look like a 42million signing. Considering that we have not won anything for 9 years during which time Wenger has sold our best players ,many of whom such as Fabregas,Clichy,Nasri,RVP Henry,etc have on the other hand gone on to win trophies with their new clubs,your comments on this make you look like a fool.

  97. Croker

    Feb 25, 2014, 16:15 #46430

    Keep him away from penalty duties (unless it is sudden death in the Champions League Final) and Ozil will be fine. Arsenal need to up the tempo and get some mobile strikers to get the best from a fantastic player.

  98. Le Spinmeister Generale

    Feb 25, 2014, 15:58 #46429

    @ Jeff Wright you chat such absolute ****e its unbelievable. You asked for links to comments from Madrid players, Amos provides you a series of quotes and then you say... you already knew that?? Wtf. And then the fact that RM are still doing well without, also means he is crap and not missed? I suppose every player Arsenal have sold since 2005 is crap then as we currently find ourselves in a better position and in contention for more trophies than at any point since then? Its actually astounding to read!

  99. Amos

    Feb 25, 2014, 15:52 #46428

    @jeffwright. You need to rewind a bit jeff. You asserted that Ozil was 'kicked out of La Liga' for being 'lackadaisical'. Ancelotti had no choice as to whether to keep Ozil in preference to buying Isco and Bale because he wasn't given the choice - Bale and Isco had already been bought. I've simply demonstrated that the reasons for Ozil leaving Real were more complex and nuanced than your assertions allow for. You can hardly complain if you're subsequently picked up on them - though you have and will of course. I agree with you about big name signings often not living up to their hype though but it isn't confined solely to the English game. You'd think it would give the 'spend some money' brigade more pause for thought sometimes. It's certainly better to buy or develop them before they become 'hyped'. I can understand your frustration with lee afc's comments. They're bound to make you feel rather uncomfortable. :)

  100. jeff wright

    Feb 25, 2014, 15:44 #46427

    Franky the swede ,you come over as being more like a turnip, it’s you who doesn’t have a clue.. It was a Suarez type striker that we needed to be signed, and not another pass master midfield player. We already have enough players who can make defence splitting passes for a quick striker to latch on there was no need for Wenger to sign Ozil… he was a waste of money and is struggling anyway to cope with the physical demands of the English Prem … it’s not just about us not having a striker he would be struggling anyway even if we did have one and if we had one we wouldn't need Ozil anyway ! Real Madrid don’t need him, Germany do though and that looks to be the side where he is best suited to play his game.

  101. jeff wright

    Feb 25, 2014, 15:31 #46426

    Amos, I never said that Ferguson had a choice about selling Ronaldo,I said that he did not want to do so. As for contradictions you are the king of them,you say that Ancelotti preferred to keep Di-Maria for the balance of the team over Ozil , although he did not want to sell Ozil who he ( Ancelotti ) said was the better player. So how does this contradict my view then ,if what you claim is true, that Ancelotti did not want Ozil in his side and that if he were still at Madrid then he would be playing in the reserves.Because according to you Ancelotti obviously saw Ozil as being just a bit part player in his plans and Ozil was never going to accept that situation so had no choice but to leave. Anyway,the fact is that Ozil was sold by Ancelotti and Madrid have not missed him .So Ancelotti has been proven right . You using leeafc to support your argument just shows how desperate you are. I reiterate when Ozil starts to live up to his hype and price tag tell us about it . I suspect though from what I have seen of him that it could be a long time or perhaps even never. The English game is littered with an history of failed big name signings Ozil could easily be another one. Sh*t happens.

  102. Ron

    Feb 25, 2014, 15:29 #46425

    Green Hut - Absolutely mate. Mr Beck, the very one. The guy who invented leaving longer grass vis the rest of the pitch on pitches in the sector near to corner flags so that the ball slows up as its punted there for timewasting exercizes.In fairness the FA probably thought they were getting Mr Beckham after processing his CV!!

  103. frankytheswede

    Feb 25, 2014, 15:26 #46424

    jeffwright sorry but you havent got a clue, take a step back and look at what youre saying. when every top football player around is bigging up ozil, why would you question his quality. you have to be blind not to recognise or appreciate the mans ability. he needs time to adjust to the premier leaague and well a few greedy goal scorers at the club would help aswell, maan its like you have an amazing player with wonderful vision and technique and nobody wants to give him an option or a outlet they just stand there. if walcott was fit all season and if we had bought higuain we would be miles clear in the league. giroud will never be a top centre forward hes good but not good enough for a player like ozil.the guy played with ronaldo benzema dimaria and higuain last season look who he is playing with now

  104. lee afc

    Feb 25, 2014, 15:23 #46423

    Well said Amos...Jeff 'contradictory' wright also stated 'its what the manager thinks and does that counts' ...so why oh why is Jeff constantly attacking and vilifying Arsene Wenger.

  105. Gus Caesar's Curvaceous Bottom

    Feb 25, 2014, 15:21 #46422

    Can't help but admire Jeff - Proved wrong and continues to fight the good fight, an admirable quality to be sure. Jeff, you mention that Arsene assures us that Sanogo is going to be the new Anelka, could you link us to some quotes to this please - Obviously once you've found them, they will be discounted for being in the Sun, or not direct quotes, so I'm afraid unless it's a sworn affadavit signed by Arsene himself, in blood, I will choose to discount them, as I'm sure you will understand and appreciate.

  106. Amos

    Feb 25, 2014, 15:12 #46421

    @jeffwright. Ferguson didn't have any choice other than to sell Ronaldo (take a look at his autobiography if you are genuinely interested - though we both know you're not). Ancelotti didn't have any choice as to whether he bought Isco and Bale and/or whether he lost Ozil. As Ancelotti said himself (google it if you have to)that while Ozil was the better player he chose to keep Di Maria for the balance of the team given that Isco and Bale would play in his position. My advice to you would be to read your own posts before deciding who is making themselves look silly -especially when, as lee has demostrated, your contradictions are so blatant. :)

  107. jeff wright

    Feb 25, 2014, 15:11 #46420

    It may have escaped your attention Amos,with you watching and listening to all that Spanish TV and radio and perusing Youtube for Spanish clips,that Ronaldo and others do interviews in English on our TV and radio football shows,I was referring to that when saying that I had seen any direct qutes from anyone regarding Ozil's sale . As I said though the stories are probably true but the decision to sell Ozil by Ancelotti and Perez will be judged on results and the same criteria applies to Wenger buying him . So far it looks like a waste of 42m that could have been put to better use. That's what many believe ,but hey ,you and leeafc are geniuses right so what do we mugs know!

  108. jeff wright

    Feb 25, 2014, 15:00 #46419

    Amos, Er, Ferguson did not want to sell Ronaldo ... Ancelotti did want to sell Ozil... can you spot the difference here ? My advice to you is to give up on this nonsense before you make yourself look even sillier than you already have, leeafc is hardly doing your case any favours either . When Ozil lives up even remotely to his hype and 42m price tag,learning to take spot-kicks will be a good start,then come back and tell us sceptics about it .

  109. Amos

    Feb 25, 2014, 14:59 #46418

    @jeffwright. You'd have needed access to Spanish radio and tv to have been able to pick up the interviews from which the direct quotes were taken. If you don't then you'll have to rely on direct quotes reported in the press which can only include quotemarks if they can be quoted directly! There're are still a couple of clips on youtube if your Spanish and/or German is up to it though. It's also worth remembering that Real won La Liga (and a couple of domestic trophies too) with Ozil in the side so the fact that they're doing ok now isn't significant. Let's face it - in a two horse race it's hardly surprising that the other horse wins occasionally - no matter which jockeys or trainers they have.

  110. jeff wright

    Feb 25, 2014, 14:43 #46417

    leeafc, you are confusing newspaper quotes with direct ones from players such as in TV live interviews . I read those quotes but have not seen any interviews on TV or heard them on the radio where anyone said these things . They are probably true , I don't believe everything that is printed in newspapers but you obviously do. However , the fact is that Ancelotti did not want Ozil in his side and let's face it sunshine,he is not being missed at Madrid and has not made a massive impact with us either . Wenger was the one who dropped him against Sunderland ,not me. Also despite your AFC add on, I was not aware that you were a judge of who Arsenal Football Club wants supporting them. Anyway keep blathering away but it might help iff you posted something that made sense.

  111. Amos

    Feb 25, 2014, 14:35 #46416

    @lee afc. Yeah - jeff has a tendency to make it up as he goes along. Claiming Ancelotti thought they would be better off without Ozil is like claiming Ferguson thought they would be better off without Ronaldo - yet ManU still won the title without him. Often in such matters the decision makes itself. As I've said there's plenty of balanced perspective out there for those who want it. Surprisingly not everyone does though.

  112. lee afc

    Feb 25, 2014, 14:26 #46415

    Hey Amos...Jeff wright must have a slight short attention span because at 12.43pm he stated that 'I never saw any Madrid players come out and say that they were gutted that ozil was sold' and then requested some proof of this. At 13.51pm, he knew all along about these comments. Sorry Jeff, but its people like you this club could do without.

  113. jeff wright

    Feb 25, 2014, 14:21 #46414

    Leeafc, it's what the manager thinks and does that counts and Ancelotti thought that he would be better off without Ozil and his view was supported by Perez ... what anyone else thinks is what they think.. however as it stands Ancelotti's side are 3 points clear of Barcelona at the top of La Liga and in the KO stages of the CL... so Ancelotti obviously knows his spanish onions better that those whom you quote ... so just what exactly is your point then.. it surely can't be that Ancelotti and Perez were wrong to sell Ozil ?

  114. Amos

    Feb 25, 2014, 14:14 #46413

    @jeffwright. The player quotes are direct quotes which are not confined to the press media. As Ancellotti had to fit in Bale and Isco he had no real choice other than to sell Ozil. If you were genuinely interested (you aren't of course but others might be)in some input into that decision you could look out an interview Mourinho (as his former manager) gave shorty after. It's pretty well confirmed that the deal was arranged directly between Ozil and Wenger and both the player and the manager have openly done so. Of course Kroenke would have had a part to play if only to have sanctioned the payment/deal. Who are these 'others' who have said Ozil was a panic buy? Bloggers? Or Newspapers? Any direct quotes worth considering?

  115. lee afc

    Feb 25, 2014, 14:10 #46412

    @Jeff wright....just keeping on the quotes and comments that you maybe had your head in the sand or too busy reading the 'sport, sun' star, mirror' tabloids...Jorge Valdano... Real Madrids sporting director was also quoted as saying ''if they gave me the choice, I would put the ozil/angel do maria pairing before Gareth bale. I would certainly put ozil before bale'' . Along with the comments from ronaldo, Ramos and arbeloa, they can't all be bigging up a player if he's as bad as you so wrongly make out.

  116. maguiresbridge gooner

    Feb 25, 2014, 14:09 #46411

    He certainly needs to up his game big time if his price tag is anything to go by unless we were completely ripped off (and it wouldn't be the first time)whether we like it or not in this day and age especially with such a price tag and reputation you don't get time to settle you have to produce straight away and indeed some will argue rightly so. But i don't think Ozil chopping someones legs, or having him, will endear him to us anymore, or screaming with glee if he does. After all we've been on the end of some of those ourselves and know what it's like and do we want a player with that reputation. Leave that to the players that have been coached that way like the Shawcross's and other neanderthals of this world.

  117. radfordkennedy

    Feb 25, 2014, 14:03 #46410

    Amos you're quite correct mate that FACT only exists in my head and won't appear in any almanac

  118. Green Hut

    Feb 25, 2014, 13:58 #46409

    Ron- 'The Charles Hughes coaching manual will never be ripped up I fear'. Never a truer word was said mate, the FA spend £120m on building a national football centre and then employ John Beck to train coaches working towards their UEFA B Licence, ending the national team's hopes of winning the World Cup for another generation. You couldn't make it up.

  119. johnnyhawleyloovinggooner

    Feb 25, 2014, 13:54 #46408

    it is hard for ozil to fly like an eagle when he is has a forward line of prize turkeys. If we had two marquee forwards who could read his play then things maybe different. Sure our forward line work hard but none are in the rooney league.it is also a team game and the manager perhaps should of taken him off against BM yet the stats show he was an effective player. He also choose to come here unlike RVP or cesc who choose to go. can those fans suffering from bradyitis stop coming to matches and telling opposing fans RVP and cesc are coming back next year? we had sunderland fans on the radio stating arsenal fans had got shirts with these players names on and telling them that they would be arsenal players next year. How embarrassing is that?

  120. Amos

    Feb 25, 2014, 13:48 #46407

    @radfordkennedy. It is indeed all, well mostly anyway, opinion (except when it's verifiable of course) but fact only came into it when you claimed, in caps, as fact that Ozil is no more than a good player. But you're right that everyone's entitled to an opinion whether it can be supported or not.

  121. Matthew Bazell

    Feb 25, 2014, 13:36 #46406

    Ozil would not get a game for Barcelona. They work harder without the ball then when in possession.

  122. Amos

    Feb 25, 2014, 13:19 #46405

    @jeff wright. The Madrid player comments were widely publicised at the time. You don't even need to stick to the Sun - the Independent, Times, Guardian et c., if there any more credible, all published the same stories. To save you some trouble though Ronaldo was directly quoted as saying: ‘The sale of Ozil is bad news for me. He is the player who knows best my movements in front of goal. I am very unhappy about the sale.’ Sergio Ramos said 'I’ve always had a real feeling with him, and it’s a shame. He’s a great footballer, unique....if I were to decide what was happening at Madrid he would be one of the last who would be going.' Arbeloa said.‘I’m a little surprised about the transfer. It’s a shame and a big loss in our locker room, personally and in footballing terms.' Of course there's a reason why Perez sold Ozil (and then tried to justify the sale in the wake of the protests). It doesn't really even any need explanation.

  123. radfordkennedy

    Feb 25, 2014, 13:13 #46403

    Amos..mate the whole point of this wonderful forum is to exchange opinions since when did fact come into it,recently people debated Anfield 89 as the greatest night where for me it was Anderlecht 70 or WHL 71 but that's just my opinion..and its not the receiving manager who would benefit but certainly the selling manager his previous clubs and assorted agents,don't forget a lot of managers have significantly lower salaries than AW but stand to take 20 per cent of the sell on profits on a players fee..but I still stand by my opinion though that Ozil is a good player but no more than that

  124. TimG

    Feb 25, 2014, 12:55 #46402

    Hi, thanks a lot for your comments and thoughts - The article was more an observation about perception and expectation in English football, rather than criticising Ozil as such, does he or do we need to adapt the most to get the best out of him? I did read about Ozil covering the distance against Bayern - but he certainly wasn't praised for that during the game (especially by Flamini!) Walcott is indeed a big miss, as with him we would have seen the full effect of Ozil's passing ability. Having said all that, if he clatters Shawcross on Saturday all is forgiven!!!!

  125. chris dee

    Feb 25, 2014, 12:49 #46401

    Wow!The bloke has helped us to our best league position in 5 years ,we're in the quarter final of the FA Cup with a chance (slim) of winning a trophy.But a slow corrosive antagonism towards him by some is definately building.Let's all take it easy and see how the season panns out before slaughtering him.Remember Bob Pires's first season and how he irritated us with his lack of 'fight'.Well it turned out it wasn't lack of 'fight' but a case of getting mentally and physically stronger for the Prem.And although he didn't go around head butting Roy Keane he became a giant for us. Ozil is not a Vieira,Palour,Petit etc,it's Arsene job to add players like that to the team which would help him.He's the same type of creative player as Bob Pires and don't forget he was older than Ozil when coming to the Arsenal.

  126. Amos

    Feb 25, 2014, 12:48 #46400

    That Ozil is only a good player and not even as good as Ray Parlour is opinion and not a fact. A more justifiable fact is that in some aspects of the game he has been better than anyone else we currently have. Quite amusing to think that what might have attracted Wenger most was his price tag though. That really does take some imagination.

  127. Unchives

    Feb 25, 2014, 12:47 #46399

    @Radfordkennedy,Spot on my son. He couldn't tie Bergkamps bootlaces. Either he rolls up his sleeves, sweats and fights for this team or stick him on ebay. £42 million to pass a decent ball or two, we could have got cabaye for less then half the price to do that, and he also goes forward. What an utter waste of money.

  128. J hughes

    Feb 25, 2014, 12:45 #46398

    Good Article. One game in particular stands out in my mind that Ozil can be more than justa creative spark. In the closing stages of the 1 - 0 result against Villa, many of the midfield were rushing forcing passes playing on grit and given the ball away. I was screeming keep hold of it, run it to the corner flags let's see this out. Only Ozil did this. he can be the calming influence and know how on how to win the title this year, he just needs to get over his currnet funk.

  129. WENGER OUT

    Feb 25, 2014, 12:43 #46396

    Ozil is a luxury player at the moment, not a true team player. What concerns me is that his attitude is something you're born with, not something you can change with a bit of gym work. Messi and Ronaldo don't shirk their defensive duties the way Ozil does! It comes down to professional pride and a level of competitiveness you're either born with or you're not - A competitive person will see Robben skip past them, limp wrists flapping all over the place, and will think "NO! I'm not having that, I'm putting a foot in - I want that ball!" - Rooney is a prime example of someone who provides sublime moments of skill and still puts in a shift, because he doesn't have it in him to give less than 100% in all areas of the pitch. Ozil reminds me of Nasri in his first season, although I think perhaps Samir always had fight - Just look at his cheeky trip on Barton. I hope that Mesut can change his DNA, but I doubt it. That said, I still think there is room for him in the team, just not the same team as Cazorla.

  130. jeff wright

    Feb 25, 2014, 12:43 #46395

    Amos, I never saw any Madrid players come out and say that they were gutted that Ozil was sold ,can you post the links please - or is this just something that you read in The Sun? There must have been some reason why Ozil was sold if he was as good as those stats claim and the claims coming out of the Madrid camp from Perez that Ozil want missing against the top sides appear from what we have seen from Ozil so far of him to be true . Also for 42m we should not expect to be told that he needs time and will come good. I expect that for an inexperienced French lad ex-postman that Wenger signs who he assures will soon be the new Anelka -then again Wenger claimed that Gervinho would amaze us with his skills.So I will take a rain-check on Sanago's alleged prowess and give him a chance to show if Wenger is right or wrong . Ozil though should be doing better than he is ,all that running around that he did against BM obviously did not include tracking back - because he was nowhere to be seen when Robbin constantly waltzed past him en-route toward our goal.These stats can be made to prove anything however the ones of three 3 missed penalties is not something that one expects from dur sprung technic German national side players.

  131. Ron

    Feb 25, 2014, 12:43 #46394

    Good post. English football has always been the same. The Charles Hughes coaching manual will never be ripped up i fear. The manner of playing football here is something of a demonstration of ones macho credibilty as ive always seen it. Ripping a guys shin open is better than a thoughtful creative pass etc etc and so on. The irony is that whenever english teams have historically faced really intimidating and fearsome, physical opponents theyve almost always come up short. Its no secret why england cant win tournaments, yet they blame tiredness. Its quite laughable really isnt it.Charles Hughes is the guy whose theories are the reason why we live in a Country that thinks Samm Allardyce is a 'top' and 'successful' Coach. Football here has little to no hope really. Having said all of this, i think Mesut Ozil wasnt a player Arsenal needed and in turn needs 5-6 top calibre players around him to tap into and reap the reward from his skills.

  132. radfordkennedy

    Feb 25, 2014, 12:32 #46392

    Fellas please can we stop this nonsense,if its not the winter or our style of play its something else,the FACT is Ozil is no more than a good player,the club took a gamble and lost and there's no money back special with this particular punt,yes he can pass a ball but so what,that's why he gets paid,he in my opinion is no better than anyone else at the club and for my money isn't even close to being as good as Freddie or the Romford Pele:he's just no more than good as simple as that really,but as we all know football is full of greed and avarice so what makes him attractive to managers and agents is there's plenty of percentages up for grabs when a player moves for 42 million

  133. MarkH

    Feb 25, 2014, 12:28 #46391

    Robert Pires was not seen tracking back much, and he did not even both to wave his leg. Did not stop him being one of the best players to ever play for Arsenal. And one of my all time favorites. Please, lets give Ozil a bit of time. And lets never sully this website with talk of Robbie Savage again,He was anti football!

  134. plive

    Feb 25, 2014, 12:21 #46389

    rather than wanting excellent players to perform, the media prefers them to flop doesnt help when you have m****f*****'s like micheal owen who seem to be jealous of arsenal buying such a player. doesnt help that BT sports have owen commentating on games where he is so happy arsenal are losing ( liverpool vs arsenal) it was actually disgusting that you pay for subscription only to hear a so called expert loving the fact his ex club is winning. giroud was mocked last season by the press, jack wilshere earlier this season was questioned if he was good enough, ramsey had his leg broken by shocking football tactics, but the media made him the enemy rather than the innocent victim he was, the media wanted to see him fail. Go to liverpool they can spend millions on downing, carrol, allen all expensive flops but no criticism them. wayne rooney, wants to leave UTD , no mention on how unprofessional his behaviour has been, signs a deal £300,000 a week, what does he deserve that for, he isnt no messi, ronaldo, falco, ibrahimovic. Why hasnt the media criticised him. its double standards, as for micheal owen i really dont understand where his hatred for arsenal and ozil comes from

  135. vintage gooner

    Feb 25, 2014, 12:17 #46387

    I very nearly stopped reading this at the first paragraph because the article is based on a false premise. In fact Ozil ran a greater distance than any other player on the pitch bar one (inevitably Flamini). So much for not putting a shift in covering back given the match context of 10 men against 11 for around two thirds of the game. However all was forgiven just for the use of the word languid which is both beautifully descriptive and accurate. Failure to roll sleeves up and get stuck in is certainly not easily forgiven or soon forgotten in English football culture. So interesting points with some validity on our football nous even if a return at the end to the same flawed premise that Ozil did not work hard enough left a regrettable taste in my mouth at least.

  136. Joe Fitzpatrick

    Feb 25, 2014, 11:50 #46386

    Amos has made some good points in his comment, I would also add that Ozil is known for creating chances with perfectly weighted through balls and the lack of pace and movement from our strikers doesn't really allow him to do this very often. Giroud is slow and static while Podolski hardly gets a chance up front, Everyone was salivating at the prospect of Theo getting released by Ozil but imagine if we had someone like Suarez or Aguero for the talented German to feed?

  137. Amos

    Feb 25, 2014, 11:37 #46384

    If Ozil had a lackadaisical attitude in La Liga it wasn't apparent to his team mates, many openly regretting his departure, or Real supporters who were chanting for him to stay at Bales unveiling. As Ozil is the clubs leading assist maker, creates more scoring attempts than any other and passes more frequently and more accurately for the club while making more passes in the attacking third than any other PL player then maybe the greater part of any lack of love is because many didn't really appreciate just what we were buying?

  138. Westlower

    Feb 25, 2014, 11:33 #46383

    The British are clinging to the old values of how they perceive football should be played. We remain a nation of pub footballers. Early in our childhood we quickly learn that the stronger, tougher boys knock nine bells out of the slightly built boys. Some of my peers who were exceptional footballers were snapped up by the professional clubs and were promptly coached into how to take an opponent out of the game. Improving technical ability wasn't on the agenda, consequently the skill factor became less important than the physical element. I was once knocked unconscious for 10 minutes by a airy arsed centre back who thought he'd done a good job on me. The final straw was playing in a pre-season friendly which was abandoned after 20 minutes due to the number of fist fights that occurred up to that point. I gave up in despair of ever being able to compete physically against these 'bouncer' types. That was when I decided to watch AFC on a regular basis instead of receiving my weekly beating. England have only won one tournament in the entire history of football - I wonder why? One can only hope Mesut Ozil is allowed by Gooners to maintain his highly technical game over becoming a headless chicken. God knows we've tolerated enough of those in the past 50 years. Robbie Savage or Mesut Ozil, no contest.

  139. jeff wright

    Feb 25, 2014, 11:17 #46381

    Why blame English football for Ozil's shortcomings when he was kicked out of La Liga because of his lackadaisical attitude and lefe-style. He looks better playing in the Deutschland national side with their big physical players around him. Ozil might be one of players who struggles to replicate his international form at club level and it's odd if he is Germany's best player, as has been claimed why he is not then at a top Bundesliga club. As far as I'm aware Ozil has not actually won anything with the German national side and I can't see that changing in Brazil either. All much ado about nothing really, unless you like watching the German team keep losing to Fabregas and co. The boys from Brazil and the Argies are also lurking now.