Gift Wrapped

Online Ed: Victory at Sunderland



Gift Wrapped


There are two ways of looking at this result. One – Arsenal have sometimes struggled to get a win at Sunderland over the years. Two – Gus Poyet’s team conceded eight goals at Southampton the previous weekend and were there for the taking, so that it took two gifts from their players for Arsenal to score should be of concern.

With the current tide of understandable frustration amongst many Gooners at a somewhat underwhelming start to the campaign, mainly as a consequence of defensive issues, the reaction I have seen so far is that many are disappointed with the performance yesterday. There is no debating Sunderland look a very poor side at present. It is difficult to really understand how they put together the incredible sequence of results that saved their Premier League status last spring. This season, they again have the look of a doomed team about them. Goals like that presented to Alexis in the first half by Wes Brown are the last thing a struggling team can afford.

Arsenal certainly dominated the match, and effectively, the defence had a breather for the most part, such was the paucity of the home side’s attack. The game had to be won by hook or by crook and it was. For this observer, in isolation of the other matches played this season, that’s fair enough. I will never complain about a win. However, it is sometimes valid to point out problem areas, as even wins have lessons.

One thing that did not cost, but troubled me slightly was the profligacy towards the end of the match. There were a number of very excellent opportunities to exploit Sunderland’s lack of numbers as they pushed forward to equalize, but for some reason, the sharpness and accuracy of passing was absent when Arsenal broke, a trait we have seen a little too often of late from the Gunners. It shouldn’t have taken a Vito Mannone blunder to ensure the victory. Still, if a team can afford an off day in front of goal, then this was it.

The selection was a surprise, with both Ramsey and Wilshere being demoted to the bench. It allowed Alexis to play behind Welbeck in the centre with Cazorla and Oxlade-Chamberlain wide. One imagines once Theo Walcott finally starts matches, this positioning of the Chilean might continue. Certainly, it strengthened Arsenal’s game defensively, not least because there was a lot more pressing of Sunderland’s players in their own half. It was this that led directly to the first goal. So credit to Arsene Wenger for making a change that had tangible benefits.

The Gunners defensive solidity was aided by the selection of Arteta and Flamini in tandem, meaning more of a 4-2-3-1 formation after the 4-1-4-1 we have seen for much of this season. However, on defensive matters, one has to wonder why an evidently injured Kieron Gibbs was allowed to hobble on for far too long before being switched for Hector Bellerin. The defensive shuffle probably strengthened the team by moving Chambers into the centre and Monreal left. One more injury will probably see Flamini or Coquelin start matches at full back, but the lack of depth is well-worn territory. With Arsenal in theory having a run of more winnable matches, the club will hope to get away with it. All hope of a title challenge looks well and truly gone now though as the quality in depth at the back is patently not good enough.

There’s not much more to say about yesterday and with an issue of The Gooner to get to press by the day’s end, I will leave it there. Job done, but Arsenal can’t rely on assists from the opposition too often to win their points.

I am now on Twitter@KevinWhitcher01.

The current issue of The Gooner can be bought online here. There will be a new issue on sale at the home match v Burnley.

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Further Reading
A sequel to Arsènal – The Making of a Modern Superclub and entitled Arsène and Arsenal The Quest to Rediscover Past Glories has been written by myself and co-author Alex Fynn. It takes up the story of the club from the last update of the previous book, and can be bought online here. Use the promo code ‘Gooner’ to get 10% off the publisher’s price of £8.99.


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  1. Charlie George Orwell

    Oct 31, 2014, 9:58 #60387

    Exeter: I remember that wondefful insight from Wetlower where he said the current regime of players were better than the Arsenal teams of the 1930's (the era we all know that included 5 titles and an England game where there were 7 Arsenal players in the side). An utterly incredible statement from someone who shamelessly bends statistics to support warped viewpoints.

  2. maguiresbridge gooner

    Oct 30, 2014, 13:05 #60356

    Ron, the long departed AKB's don't know what their missing.

  3. Ron

    Oct 29, 2014, 23:50 #60335

    Oh Jeff, you do make me laugh at times mate. The swapping for the 'emirates exp crowd for strictly' being no different. So funny and apt! Its like Bard says on here, there are some good cracks by posters. Long may it last.

  4. Bard

    Oct 29, 2014, 18:59 #60330

    Westie, You should know by now that I do like a wind up. Its half the fun of being on here. I enjoy the humour immensely and there are some very funny posters on here. I have trouble with the whole Wenger thing. Listening to you and others you would think he had liberated the Western world. He has been a pretty good and I would add lucky coach. He has produced some really good football, some good and a few great players but I couldnt really care less about him one way or another. You dont carry around memories of managers just players and games. I love Arsenal and the players but managers I can take or leave. For 8m quid a year I expect him to do all of the above and if he cant get someone else in who can. All this veneration of him is bizarre. I have contributed to his salary in a small way for the whole of his tenure I dont owe him anything. If hes not up to the job get rid and move on. 10 years on from our last big trophy we look farther away from being a top side than I can remember if thats not cause for a job review then I dont know what is. And before you post it that doesnt mean Im in favour of sacking coaches every year Russian style.

  5. Exeter Gunner

    Oct 29, 2014, 18:50 #60329

    Westlower, I don't equate 'letting off steam' with losing my temper. I don't feel like that and it seems rather humorous on here amongst most of the critics, deconstructing Wenger and his disciples. There's plenty of good, rational analysis going on and I for one don't expect AFC to win every game. It all comes back to the unaddressed, neglected, repetitive stuff that got me fed up with Wenger. I realise others see it another way, find comfort in the constancy.

  6. Westlower

    Oct 29, 2014, 17:34 #60325

    @Exeter, I appreciate the 'letting off steam' angle as it's a normal reaction that I also did for most of my life. Having been made redundant 7 years ago I had to change my act as betting on the horses during the flat season (Apr-Nov) became my new source of income. Losing my temper and striking out didn't change the fact I'd backed a loser & lost money. To survive, I had to understand that backing losers was part & parcel of betting, so rationalising why I lost replaced losing my temper. I can now lose and remain calm. To cut a long story short I have made a good profit every year. This year has been the best yet making a profit of 88% on my turnover. I've backed 87 winners & 110 losers. So I get plenty of practice coming to terms with losing. It's liberating & good for blood pressure not expecting to win all the time. Horse racing also proves that form is temporary, class is permanent. After saying all that I'll be p*ssed off if we don't beat Burnley well on Saturday. Some traits never change but I'll remain in control. I'm sure Kevin will be spot on with his match analysis but I'll post my version on Sunday. The ongoing Arsenal injury crisis remains a mystery to me. If we'd had 5 different managers in the past 10 years would it have been any different. We can only guess?

  7. Exeter Gunner

    Oct 29, 2014, 15:46 #60323

    Westlower, what it achieves, for me and others, is letting off steam! The post of yours I had in mind re: Chapman was the one where you said the Wenger teams of the last decade were better than the ones of the '30s - because the '30s teams didn't always finish in the top 4. It was quite a long time ago but it stuck in the mind because it was so astonishing. And of course I think injuries play a part. What beggars belief however is thinking these season on season injury crises have nothing to do with Wenger. They must have, players and even medical team members have come and gone - he's been the only constant. Having the smallest and lightest team in one of the hardest leagues in the world offers a clue, though it seems no one knows what it is exactly. And as I've said before, things at AFC aren't 'bad', they're exasperating.

  8. maguiresbridge gooner

    Oct 29, 2014, 13:43 #60320

    Bard, so much for this standing shoulder to shoulder that we kept hearing from one of the arsene luvvies, so much for comradeship.

  9. Westlower

    Oct 29, 2014, 13:08 #60319

    @Bard, You completely misread between the lines as I would never tell you to f**k off anywhere. It's not me posting should you receive such a missive. It was simply my clumsy way of saying I'm proud of my club, warts & all. I don't sit easy with our manager being ripped apart by Gooners on a daily basis. I don't believe it happens in any other sport as it's so pointless. The average football fan has been wound up so tight by the media it's scary!

  10. Bard

    Oct 29, 2014, 12:45 #60318

    Westie; I do like a Hector rather than a Bully. But if Ive read between the lines correctly Im being told to F*** off down the lane, which I always find vaguely amusing and somewhat mirrors our dear old leaders responses to being pulled up. His usual rant is against those who have 'never worked a day in football 'but its the same thing. Sorry you didnt enjoy Zulu, what about the Battle of the Alamo with John Wayne ?

  11. Westlower

    Oct 29, 2014, 12:02 #60315

    @Exeter, What does your daily rubbishing of Wenger achieve? Have you managed to get rid of him yet? Do we have a new DM yet? The common denominator we share is that we both support AFC with our blinkers on, you're looking in one direction & me the other. We can't change the past & I strongly suspect we won't be able to influence the future. Love is too strong a word for my feelings towards any Arsenal manager. I experienced wonderful moments with Mee, Graham & Wenger, Yes, we haven't tasted much success in the past 10 years but we haven't fallen away in the manner of previous Arsenal sides. Reading your posts tells me that you and I stood alongside each other on the old North Bank so we're not totally different in our experiences of AFC. You've also known crap times in the past, mine being a 17 year trophy free period. You criticise me for posting that Herbert Chapman went 5 years before winning a trophy. That's not my opinion, that's a historical fact. The season before Bruce Rioch took over we lost 17 league games, we are on schedule to lose 4 or 5 this season. Life isn't as bad as you make out. I question your doubts that injuries don't play a part. Of course they do, no team ever improved by having their key men unavailable. It beggars belief that some hold Wenger responsible for injuries - how does that work? Ask Maureen & the Swansea manager if refs don't influence the outcome of football matches. One things for sure, AFC will be getting a new manager in the near future so why not enjoy the football & leave the politics to the hot air brigade?

  12. Exeter Gunner

    Oct 29, 2014, 11:03 #60312

    Westlower, if you and your ilk want people to believe you're aware of the shortcomings and don't love Wenger then you're not doing a very good job! You constantly make excuses, you keep trying to intimate those that criticise / moan aren't AFC supporters ('how strange'... 'AFC fans outnumbered on this site...'), and it is always - always - something or somebody's else's fault.

  13. Westlower

    Oct 29, 2014, 10:50 #60311

    @Bard, You're making yourself sound like the leader of the school playground bully boys. If you don't join our gang we're going to beat you up. Behave yourself or I'll call you Al Capone! Convert to what exactly? We're all Gooners aren't we? You thrive on a daily moan up & I just give a different perspective (often tongue in cheek). It'd be a pretty boring site if we shared the same views. We all see the same things, we are all aware of AFC's shortcomings, you moan, I don't! Contrary to popular belief we don't all love Wenger as Badarse tried to tell you on numerous occasions but we weren't listening & not listening still. We all want to be the best club with the best players, managed by the best manager but down here on planet earth...life goes on regardless of who's moaning about what. If you can find a better club to support than AFC then thank your lucky stars! They'll do for me, thanks very much. I hate watching Zulu anyway, that Michael Caine never had any tactical nous + his team had too many injuries & not a big enough squad to cope with the demands of a pitch battle.

  14. jeff wright

    Oct 29, 2014, 10:36 #60309

    Kolo was never that great,he only looked good with Campbell alongside him and Spunky got him out of jail a few times. Most average CB's would have done as well in the Prem with those pair backing them up. Campbell was one of the 'lucky' moments in Arsene's glory days ,now days he would have ended up at City or worse Chelsea. Times have changed ,Wenger is still the same,but not as 'lucky' and the players from France are no great shakes these days . He did well signing Sanchez but where are the others? You know the top GK,the strong holding midfield player , a proper winger... they are out there but at other clubs ... never mind though it's Burnley up next and a routine bit of fast track bullying with lots of smug smiles from Arsene ... high fives and silly goal celebs will send the Emirates Experience crowd home happy... many will leave early though so as not to miss the start of Strictly ... it's just swapping one show for another to them. Old Clatterbug is in strife again after another gaffe or two on and off the pitch following on a string of them with his reffing of our game v City being one where he missed the fact that both our goals were off-side and denied City a clear cut penalty ... Arsene never saw the incident though ... ! Clatterbug is a typical example of the modern celebrity Ref bred by the Sky TV money ,these guys see themselves as being stars and relish the power that they hold in making big decisions in football games watched by millions.

  15. Exeter Gunner

    Oct 29, 2014, 10:35 #60308

    The AKBs seem to be trying to suggest that Wenger is actually a good defensive coach. Which begs the question, why did he stop bothering with it then?

  16. Tony Evans

    Oct 29, 2014, 9:43 #60306

    Polecat - Ashley Cole. Keown was a valuable sub who was also inherited. Campbell was a perfect Wenger purchase i.e free but I will acknowledge that Lauren and Toure were good buys. You try and explain our woeful defending since 2006 then!

  17. Bard

    Oct 29, 2014, 9:10 #60303

    Westie, youre sounding more like Michael Caine in Zulu as the days go by, outnumbered,desperate and firing all over the place. Youre surrounded having been deserted by the good and the faithful. We have been strengthened by the return of the old gunslinger Ron after his sabbatical in the wilderness. Its only a matter of time before you convert. I will warmly embrace your conversion to the dark side. I realise that might cause a bit of grief from the missus but the truth is always painful.

  18. Rancid Polecat

    Oct 29, 2014, 9:07 #60302

    Remind me, how much of the Invincibles' defence did Wenger inherit?

  19. Tony Evans

    Oct 29, 2014, 8:31 #60301

    Gooner Ron - Some good points raised there and I do give Wenger credit where its due. The difference between 1998-2006 and 2007 to date is so stark though that the only conclusion I can come to for his early success was indeed a mixture of luck, with the inherited well drilled defence, and the fact that France was producing some great players back then and Wenger had good knowledge of the French transfer market to put him ahead of the game. Keeping Arsenal top four since 2006 has been a great achievement, and many other clubs would have gladly taken that but if we want Arsenal to really be challenging for the title / CL it just is not going to happen under Wenger in my view.

  20. Westlower

    Oct 29, 2014, 8:04 #60300

    @JJ, Good to see Jenks playing well but he'd have been condemned in an Arsenal shirt for galloping down the wing in the final minute with a 2-1 win in the bag. Lack of discipline & not being coached properly would have been the likely comments. So much praise for other clubs, so little for AFC, strange? Sods law that Jenks would have got game time at AFC given Debuchy's long term injury. Hope you had an enjoyable 'happy hour' browsing through the undies section of the M&S website, just click & collect. Don't let wordsmith Ron get you so excited next time.

  21. Westlower

    Oct 29, 2014, 7:09 #60299

    Must read Martin Samuel article in today's Daily Mail under the heading 'If Arsenal REALLY want Klopp they may have to move Wenger upstairs'

  22. maguiresbridge gooner

    Oct 28, 2014, 22:06 #60298

    Bard, he seemed more at ease being interviewed by the lovely Amy (not sure of her surname possibly Barlee Bariee and that's not been sexist)with plenty of smiles after sunderland maybe it was the questions as she didn't want to hurt his feelings, or maybe he was briefed before hand not to make another prat of himself and was on his best behaviour, or like I said before she was a brunette.

  23. jjetplane

    Oct 28, 2014, 22:02 #60297

    Interesting DARTFORD see Jenks bombing up the field to try and score in the last minute - such confidence and he must be loving it! Song has never looked better and is probably the result of his time at Barca. Wenger is looking stuck in the mud as someone like Alladyce is meeting all the challenges and playing direct incisive football against the champions. Contrast that with Sunderland sitting off and Arsenal still passing sideways even with the door wide open. Nightmare!

  24. jeff wright

    Oct 28, 2014, 22:02 #60296

    The introduction of Mad Mario by Rodgers ( he's a tactical genius after all ,well spotted Westie !) made a difference and ,along with a diabolical decision by the Ref that had shades of retro good old days at Anfield about it ,well for the home supporters that is, turned the tie in the scousers favour.

  25. Exeter Gunner

    Oct 28, 2014, 21:40 #60295

    Well, Westlower, as you couldn't / wouldn't answer them I thought I'd try myself! As you have no actual argument of your own, just your 'unconditional support', all you can do is exaggerate and misrepresent the arguments of others.

  26. Dartford gooner

    Oct 28, 2014, 21:36 #60294

    How strange Jenks is looking a very good defender at Westham, maybe fat sam is coaching him how to defend, something that did not happen under Arsene

  27. jjetplane

    Oct 28, 2014, 21:35 #60293

    And WESTIE lives in a bubble which looks like a hedgehog.

  28. Westlower

    Oct 28, 2014, 21:26 #60292

    I've learnt so much this evening. 1. Arsenal is a football club. 2. Teams with the best players win games. 3. Brendan Rodgers suffers from coaching & tactical inadequacies. 4. Wenger can learn much from Jeff Wright & Ron, who are probably the best two coaches in Europe. 5. Exeter Gooner likes to answer his own questions. 6. Arsenal supporters being outnumbered by others on this site. 7. AFC must not tolerate any player who gets injured or loses form.

  29. Hiccup

    Oct 28, 2014, 21:04 #60291

    Ron, I have always given wenger credit for what he achieved. I see where you're coming from though with this he got lucky, inherited a defence etc, because he has had the tactical hallmarks of a buffoon for many years now. And it does start to make you wonder? It makes me laugh though, where you get criticised for this, the AKB's put the last few years down to 'bad' luck. Injuries, refs etc. But their argument falls down straight away with the injuries card. We are supposed to have the best midfield on paper, and plenty of cover for injuries. Up front, wenger has always gone with only one recognised forward each season. That's incompetence on his behalf. Got away with it last season, and has got away with it again this season, as thankfully giroud got his injury before the deadline. And the fact that wenger starts the season with just 2 centre backs and 50% of them are out injured, that's not unlucky, but once again plain incompetence by wenger. He's been running arsenal like a runaway train for far too long now, and the only hope of success is if we get lucky, because if left to tactical acumen and sensible squad depth, we don't have a prayer.

  30. jeff wright

    Oct 28, 2014, 20:59 #60290

    The case for Wenger needing top players to help him out is overwhelming Ron , otherwise as you say where have the tactical skills gone.Just been watching Liverpool v Swansea and it's the same scenario with Rodgers ,he is trying to get average players to play football that is beyond their abilities to play. Now if he had Suarez up front they would probably be 3-0 up !

  31. Ron

    Oct 28, 2014, 20:24 #60288

    G Ron - quite right too. I think everybody gives AW the credit in those early years and he did up the scoring ratio. Memory tells us that without the stats doesnt it. He rode a crest of a wave in those days when the French market place wasnt shopped at very often by the other Clubs. His work in improving fitness was excellent too. Did he really have a material effect on the defence though? I dont think so. They had been drilled for so long, it was auto pilot really. They did adapt to a protective wall though afforded to them by Petitt and PV. That prolonged the longevity of it. The point now is that if Wenger wasnt lucky as you say, where have his tactics gone that created that extra shield which was there while the goals for tally increased? His years since 05 have just so far departed from his tactics |(if they were his)in a period when hes needed them most surely ie a period where the game has changed and the quality of his forwards and defenders has declined. It makes no sense other than to say his Barca lite years led to such a departure that hes still sticking with. Wheres the logic to it? Less able players yet he tries a more expansive game? His luck has been bolstered in the last 4-5 years given a general decline in the quality of the PL in my view. Its now arguably recovering and our team is hanging in there in an increasingly desperate fashion it seems? There is a pattern it seems.

  32. jeff wright

    Oct 28, 2014, 20:15 #60287

    GR, you are right in your points about other managers ,apart from Wenger, inheriting players that helped them to win trophies. Mourinho benefited from having John Terry in his back 4 and still needs him even now . The stats on goals conceded can be misleading ,stats comparing different eras often can be , it would be interesting to see what GG's ones were compared with Wenger's against top opponents .GG was more successful in Europe by actually wining a trophy, whereas Wenger has failed miserably to win one , and he has had far longer than the Scotsman did to win them . A lifetime more - well it seems like a lifetime! I don't think that it is unfair to claim that Wenger is not very good tactically and he got away with this deficiency when he had better players than he did when he decided he could make the stars , rather than buy them. He has certainly needed Sanchez, the star that he was forced to sign after his youth policy that he doggedly and stubbornly pursued had failed to produce any stars at all! Ramsey flattered to deceive and has gone out like a damp firework on bonfire night . Wenger really is too old and tired now to motivate average players to punch above their weight , and was never much good at doing so against top sides anyway. The saving grace for him regarding 4th place is Rodger's at Liverpool,he is another Barca bonzo imitator struggling to get his side to play the passing possession game - deja vu Arsene. Suarez last season glossed over the inadequacies in Rodgers coaching and tactics ,without him they are exposed for what they are, rubbish. Sanchez is, although not to a title tilt chance, like Suarez did,doing the same for Wenger . I think that Chelsea and City will finish first and second and United will get into the top four . Wenger will fight it out with Rodgers for the other place . Perhaps Sanchez will be the difference between Wenger and Rodgers chances of claiming it. Nether manager looks like they have a snowball's chance in hell of winning the European Cup or Prem.

  33. Red Fred

    Oct 28, 2014, 20:05 #60286

    Bring back Lee Chapman, the good old days! Turn up at Highbury, pay yer money at turnstile and stand on the North Bank. Hardly ever saw us on TV and we used to have an average 25,000 crowd. AFC vs Forest in League in March 83 was a big game and crowd was 22,000,the away kit was green and looked **** but how we loved being a GOONER.

  34. Bard

    Oct 28, 2014, 20:00 #60285

    What intrigues me is what those within the club make of all this. There is a consensus in all the blogs I read and believe me I waste too much time reading them. They cant fathom the transfer policy particularly the recent one and the absence of a defender, they cant fathom the tactics and wonder why we always have so many injuries to name but a few. These arent micro issues, you know a picky debate about why we always play one way or why player X doesnt get a game, these are huge gobsmacking issues. I just cannot believe that behind the scenes board members and staff members arent wondering whats going on. The players are all keeping stum apart from Ozil who has voted with his feet or rather his knee. It all seems quite bizarre. The reason the AKBS have deserted in droves is understandable, the club is a basketcase at the moment, any other manager would be getting slaughtered but such is Wengers standing he is getting a free ride and when dear old Annie Oakley challenges him he throws his toys out of the pram.

  35. jjetplane

    Oct 28, 2014, 19:59 #60284

    I was a Finsbury Parker myself for many years and was born just south of. Spent two great years in Exeter and Bournemouth are looking like the new kids on the block. The old Silver Bullet & Tavern - you wot! Mad days.

  36. Exeter Gunner

    Oct 28, 2014, 19:50 #60283

    jjetplane, not an 'Exeter boy' as such, only been here a couple of years, born and raised in Finsbury Park, walked down St Thomas's Road for many years to stand then sit in the North Bank. Been to a few (very) lower league games, e.g. Bury Town FC. Stood on the terrace with a pint - marvellous!

  37. jjetplane

    Oct 28, 2014, 19:36 #60282

    We have won an FA cup in the last decade so let us concur to all intents we have been managerless for ten years. The ten before that we were undermanaged and hat is why we have no CL win to show for it. Went to every CL game at Wembley and Highbury and was never confident with our set up. That was when we really needed a coach. Stop the rose tint - it makes you blind. EXETEr do you ever go to St James's or is that a silly question. Watched them for a couple of years and went to Wembley (and Btrentford) with them! fantastic support!

  38. Exeter Gunner

    Oct 28, 2014, 19:10 #60281

    I'd like to add that Arsenal is a football club, not a counselling service. If an individual loses form, you drop him. If he's injury prone, you don't give him a new 5 year contract. If the modern games passes your manager by, you don't keep supporting him in eternal gratitude for what he's done in the past. Sometimes having a 'bad time' is just 'being bad'. In the end you have to decide whether your priority is AFC the institution or the individuals currently within it.

  39. Bard

    Oct 28, 2014, 19:03 #60280

    Some excellent posts. Really good stuff Exeter. Westie I would also like a copy of the book as long as its in picture form, words and arguments confuse me. Westie I think you are surrounded having been deserted by those wibbly wobbly AKBs, even well ard Jamie has done a runner. Gooner Ron I agree Wenger made a lot of his own luck and for a time was well ahead of the game. I love a fact as much as the next man. Is it 9 years since we won the PL? Surely thats the key fact.

  40. Exeter Gunner

    Oct 28, 2014, 18:24 #60279

    Westlower, you haven't addressed what I've actually said regarding the inherent flaws in your 'stance', instead making a separate point about supporting individuals having a 'rough patch', as if that's all that's going on at AFC at present. I guess I didn't expect anything else - you can't argue against what is unarguable. If you don't remove the needle, the needle remains stuck.

  41. Westlower

    Oct 28, 2014, 17:45 #60278

    @Exeter, I get great satisfaction from encouraging anyone who is going through a rough phase at AFC, such as long term injury or loss of form. My support for them intensifies in the bad times. Slagging off personnel who are at a low ebb is unhelpful to the individual & consequently the team. Yes, you are correct in assuming Klopp will get my total support should he be appointed as the next Arsenal manager. Every coach/manager has their own individual strengths & weaknesses and he is no exception. I'll applaud his strengths & be understanding of his weaknesses during his tenure at AFC.

  42. GoonerRon

    Oct 28, 2014, 17:42 #60277

    A few quotes in some of the recent posts "a lucky, lucky fella in the right place at the right time / AW basically got lucky / having stumbled on the magic, trophy winning formula / he'd got GGs frame in place he fashioned it up with such as Overmars Petitt and Co and the formula just worked." I find it really sad that some of you are so bitter that any type of credit is just so begrudging, if at all. GG's defence was terrific but Wenger took it, prolonged it and gradually replaced it without degrading the defensive performance of the team. From 1990 (when Seaman, the last piece of the famous 5, was purchased) to 1995 when GG left, we conceded an average of 0.9 league goals per game and scored an average of 1.5 GPG. From 1996 to 2002 (when the remaining members of the famous 5 retired/left) we also conceded an average of 0.9 GPG but increased our scoring rate to 2.0 GPG. So not only was our attacking potency significantly improved but Wenger also maintained the defensive efficiency despite the relative decrease in appearances of the famous 5 up until the departure of Winterburn and Bould in '99 and Adams, Dixon and Seaman in 2002. Even looking at Wenger's entire tenure our GPG rate of conceding is still 0.9 (the same as GG) and our scoring rate is 20% higher than GG's time. This isn't about saying GG's teams weren't good because I loved that time too, but it is about plugging facts into these discussions to add some much needed context. As for Wenger stumbling over a trophy-winning formula, do people really believe this can actually happen? So when Mourinho does it. it's because he a stone cold winner, but Wenger is just lucky. No balance here people.

  43. jjetplane

    Oct 28, 2014, 17:41 #60276

    WESTIE I want a signed copy and look forward to the follow up - How I became a Dark Moonie. Remember many moons ago (Wenger was a young ecomomics student then) having a pint in the East Stand and who should walk past looking every inch the football star - Petit. The man was a tower of style and if you stick him with the others (Viera et al) could anyone seriously imagine these blokes listening to psuedo-scientific twaddle enveloped in some French third wave of deconstructive gobbledegook. Of course not. The science was on the pitch and came from Adams, Bergkamp and Pirez with everyone else knowing their part. Oh to have a Parlour now. Wenger and Ozil may have more in common than they think. Behind the mystique lies something numbingly ordinary. A good test will be to see if the present lot can control the Burnley game from start to finish. It really is a test. If things drag on it will be worrying for Alexis. Get the feeling Wenger is too self absorbed (age) to recognise what is good for the whole.

  44. maguiresbridge gooners

    Oct 28, 2014, 17:08 #60275

    If the wengerites haven't returned before this Saturday we now know where they'll be.

  45. maguiresbridge gooner

    Oct 28, 2014, 16:44 #60274

    Tony Evans, good post such was the size of his ego then, and the air of invincibility he had and the standing he then had with the fans (and I include myself in that)and board members and just everybody I suspect he thought he was god and so did we, and could do what he liked, and did and was allowed to and let away with it. How wrong we were.

  46. Exeter Gunner

    Oct 28, 2014, 16:38 #60273

    Westlower, I reckon you do know what you're watching, but your 'stance' - unconditional support for the Arsenal manager, simply because he IS the arsenal manager - hobbles your reasoning process. Let's say one of the replacements mooted that you've denigrated (i.e. all of them, most recently Klopp) actually got the job. Presumably you would suddenly switch your view and instantly 'respect and support' that individual. Can you see the flaw in your 'stance' yet? The other problem with this 'stance' is it obliges to you always blame externals for anything that goes wrong - refs, fixture lists, sheer bad luck and 'coincidence' for the seasonal injury crises - and make out this current team is playing 'exciting, expansive' and 'morally superior' football (the others play 'anti-football'). It just isn't credible and is why, as anyone who can follow an argument can see, you keep getting your arse kicked on here. You've also shown yourself willing to downplay the achievements of previous AFC managers (like GG or even Chapman) in order to place Wenger on an even higher pedestal. Will you do the same to Wenger's achievements for the next manager? I doubt it. And you wonder why people accuse you of Wenger love. You need to apply the same critical eye to Wenger you do to the horses. You're backing a lame old nag.

  47. Tony Evans

    Oct 28, 2014, 16:05 #60272

    Ron - I agree that more should have been achieved with the amazing mixture talent and tenacity Wenger had at his disposal 1998 to 2006; at least one CL and maybe another title? I think the experienced heads in the team and those with the balls to stand up to Wenger got him out of jail on numerous occasions (I seem to recall Martin Keown saying that they often played their own game) and as you say once that was lost and was replaced with kids who needed proper coaching it all fell apart. Wenger obviously deserves credit for the successes but I still firmly believe he was a lucky,lucky fella in the right place at the right time and his deficiencies now are there for all to see.

  48. Ron

    Oct 28, 2014, 15:45 #60271

    Tony - with hindsight now there must be a case to say that all credit to the teams of that earlier period is due, but that AW basically got lucky. Yes, full marks for the French influx of players between 96 and 98 and what followed, but ive always thought the team of 2001 to 2004 in many ways ad libbed in so many games. As you say he d got GGs frame in place. he fashioned it up with such as Overmars Petitt and Co and the formula just worked. Voila! It might explain why the purple halcyon period was so short lived and didn't win really half of what it should have done? I think many of the top coaches of the time would have bagged at least one CL trophy with that team plus a bit of adjustment to it. By 2003 it was in my view becoming an arrogant team ie 'we turn up, we win, the other team folds'. It was that which proved its undoing. Wengers reign as King Midas ended at Highbury when Chelsea won in the CL qtrs in my view. Hes dined out on a myth ever since and still doing it. They speak of Utd ending his hegemony but ill always recall a 2-2 at Bolton when they got right in Arsenals hair and effectively ended the title chase that year. They sensed Arsenals arrogance that afternoon and were having none of it. A team will always reflect its boss and his 'let me win'pouting sulking whinging skulking countenance has stunk the Club out unchecked ever since. Im sure the skirting boarsd, the showers, the picture frames and the carpets all squirm and wriggle with him such is the imprint of his persona on the place! Hes had to actually 'manage' since 2005 as the top players left or got old and knackered and the shortcomings have been there for all to see.

  49. Ron

    Oct 28, 2014, 15:11 #60270

    Westie - mate. Just address me as Mr Rinus Michels in future will you. OR just 'Total'if its easier as in total football, my brainchild!!

  50. DJ

    Oct 28, 2014, 14:56 #60269

    Ron: It’s a good point you make about the French arrogance/stubbornness that has seen Wenger unwilling to change. Surely they can’t all be yes men at the club someone must have said to him ‘This pretty football is all well and good but don’t you think we need a ball winning midfielder?’ That is why it is so frustrating a little more clarity and ambition and we could still be challenging for the major honours.

  51. Westlower

    Oct 28, 2014, 14:44 #60268

    @JJ, You're right I could learn much from coach Ron about football. I've been watching top division & Euro matches for 54 years and I haven't got a clue what I'm watching. All that time & money wasted, for what? Such a shame I've wasted my life on a sport I've failed to grasp. Regardless of that, I'll be at the Armoury signing copies of my latest book at 2.00pm on Saturday, 'Dedicated To Kicking WOB's Up The ARSE.'

  52. Tony Evans

    Oct 28, 2014, 14:30 #60267

    The most annoying aspect of Wenger's post 2006 'barcalite' philosophy is that having stumbled on the magic, trophy winning formula by adding the likes of Viera, Henry and Pires to GGs formidable defence he then goes and throws it all away on some fanciful notion that he can do just as well with youthful lightweights; abandoning any semblance of grit / steel / experience / or leadership and save the club millions in the process. It makes me weep when I think back to the wonderful 1998 - 2006 squad and compare them with our current crop; and it is incredible to me that the same man is in charge. Some may argue that the move from Highbury forced his hand but not me - the change was so radical that there was more to it then lack of money, I am sure, and lack of money certainly is not the case now.

  53. maguiresbridge gooner

    Oct 28, 2014, 13:32 #60266

    jj, it's still nestled in the roof at Croke Park, Hiccup I wonder was one put in the time capsule.

  54. maguiresbridge gooner

    Oct 28, 2014, 13:13 #60265

    Gaz, I know exactly what you mean mate I've tried it myself, but they make up for it by giving us great entertainment and crack on here, Good one Exeter.

  55. Ron

    Oct 28, 2014, 13:05 #60264

    DJ - its quite sad really. i reckon he was beguiled by Barca and all things Pep in 2008. Failed to realise that the likes of Puyol, Alves and a few others were hard, snide players which propped up the edifice and did not at all really appreciate that the Barca philosophy may well have failed totally had they not had for at least 4 years, perhaps the best player on the planet to make it work.Wenger thought he would transpose it onto the PL with far lesser players. Hes still hanging onto the idea i feel like an old military general, still thinking if he sends them over the top one more time, he ll achieve the victory he aches for. Its not in his repertoire to say it was a grand idea that didn't work and as you say, his Barca blindness has meant the changing game has been lost on him. How long has it been now since physical presence and counter attacking became the vogue? I think Chelsea and Real Madrid were the instigators and Munich soon followed 5 years or so back? Guardiola himself has even departed from the style without question. Not Wenger, he knows better and will make it work for the first time on these shores and win the CL with it!. The silly old sausage. Hes like a succession of French rugby coaches who went 25 years at one time sticking to fleet footed French elan and style, won ziltch and ignored the fact of the Kiwis and Aussies running them over like squirrels on the M1. Napoleon has a lot to answer for imbuing the French nation with their 'i know best even though everybody can see i don't' mentality. They manage in their industry with the same blinkers on. When proved wrong, their way is to just throw a strop and stamp their feet and declare they arent changing anything.

  56. maguiresbridge gooner

    Oct 28, 2014, 12:46 #60263

    Smithy, injured again? really? that couldn't be could it? according to some he was going to be our saviour. A good question, but the reason for that is because we put up with the biggest joker of all, maybe that's who you mean.

  57. DJ

    Oct 28, 2014, 12:34 #60262

    I hate the way the press fawn over Mourinho like he is a cross between Eric Morecombe and Oscar Wilde when he is a sinister little ****. But there is a reason Wenger hasn’t beaten him in a competitive match, Mourinho is a better manager who knows how to win trophies. Our manager’s failed philosophy and reluctance to sign a defensive midfield player for X amount of seasons are examples of his failure to adapt to a changing footballing landscape and the reason the crowd are turning ugly!

  58. jjetplane

    Oct 28, 2014, 11:04 #60261

    Poor old WESTIE your present preoccupation with all things blue (Chelski) is a joy to behold. You will also find that messrs Oscar, Hazard, Willian work their socks off in midfield and do seem to be physically more up for the job than the Arsenal equivalents (talking about the hard men - Arteta and Flamange). You will now see Maureen revise his opinions about Mikel. As for Arsene FC - poor training practices, poor coaching and wide eyed fans do not make a good club. You could learn a lot about football from RON and you know it. Time for orbit re-entry (one football and an AKB) ...... ps whatever happened to your use of the phrases 'knee jerk' and 'moanie/bleating'? all the consistency of a Wenger team selection ...

  59. jeff wright

    Oct 28, 2014, 10:31 #60260

    Wenger used to do the shut up shop routine himself at one time years ago. This was also at a time when Wenger was at his peak . I can recall the murmur of apprehension that spread around the stadium at Highbury, when in games that we were leading in late on , by the odd goal or so, the sight of the bald eagle Cygan warming up on the touchline caused. Wenger would pull off an offensive player and send out the plodding Cygan to help protect our lead. This often backfired with the away side suddenly gaining momentum and us going from dominating the game to desperately hanging on. The situation at United on Sunday was different of course with Chelsea playing away,personally I thought that a draw was about the right result given the overall run of play. It was not a good result for us though because United and Liverpool are the two biggest threats to our 4th place finish ; and not Chelsea. Wenger can't do the old shutting up shop routine now though,because he doesn't have any defenders to send on ! A glance at the league table shows how tight things are below the top 4 . At QPR second from bottom have won 2 games and us in 5th spot have won 3 ,Liverpool below us and struggling have won 4 .You couldn't make it up.

  60. Ron

    Oct 28, 2014, 10:14 #60259

    Hi Westie - some truth there on Mourinho. Im not sure RA has insisted on him changing his modus operandi though really. I reckon RA agreed to stick with it just to get success again to be honest. I know you say hes anti football. Cant really agree. Chelsea are remorseless but is it 'anti football'really? Its just a type of football to me. If yr usage of the phrase implies Arsenal are pure football by contrast i cant go with you on that. I find our style tedious naive unproductive frustrating and weak and importantly destined never to bear fruit in the EPL. As Bard says, Mourinho s style is designed to win. Wengers is a philosophy reflection and its tantamount to a Coach who sees himself as some kind of unique pioneer aspiring to a higher plane than mortal football and mortal Coaches. The guy is a deluded haughty dreamer in my view as you know and needs a jolt to propel him back to reality, the jolt being the sack in my view sadly for him. Theres a case to say that Wengers style is anti football, but its carefully hidden and just at the other end of the spectrum to JM. They are two sides of the same coin really, but only one wins. Sadly for us, its not going to be our mad professor of football 'philosophy'. I just wish hed clear off back to Strasbourg Uni and lecture on it till his hearts content where he ll do no harm.

  61. Bard

    Oct 28, 2014, 9:27 #60258

    Westie I agree about Maureen. He tried to shut up shop with 30 mins to go and it backfired. He is basically a counterattacking coach. However what he does do is make clear what he wants and is ruthless about how to go about it, the decisions to sell Mata and Luiz were brave and decisive. Whether you agree with the plan or not at least there is one. Whats Wengers?

  62. Westlower

    Oct 28, 2014, 8:38 #60257

    Now look what you've done Ron, got JJ that excited he's had an orgasm. JJ, get yourself along to M&S (you know you love a bit of M&S) & buy yourself some fresh undies. The ones with the printed rat droppings suit you best. Gary Neville very critical of Maureen losing his balls & trying to defend a 1-0 lead in the two games in Manchester. CFC sat back surrendering possession and relied on the intimidating henchmen to see the game through. That's precisely why Abramovich got rid of him in his previous tenure. Maureen has the best team & squad in the PL & the title is theirs to lose. Sadly, they'll continue to thrive as long as the refs turn a blind eye to their persistent petty fouling & cheating. Informative photo in today's papers of Ivanovic sneakily holding Mertesackers shorts with his arm hidden from view behind his back. You're an anti-football coach Maureen, not at all special. The hardest decision he has to make is when to pull Oscar off before the red card appears & then replace him with ankle tapping Mikel.

  63. Ron

    Oct 28, 2014, 8:13 #60256

    Hi jules - i cant answer for sure, particularly as far as foreign bidders apply but so far as Clubs here apply perhaps its because they were buying better players ie Costa and Fabregas and De Maria and Falcao to name but a few? The question was did AW deserve credit for signing the player? Im just saying that its not hard for anybody to see an obviously good, stand out player. The skill in these things as a coach is when a player isnt so obviously stand out but turns out to be that way via coaching or just via a coach seeing some thing that others didnt. Thats not the case with Sanchez. Not saying this just to detract from Wenger for the sake of it, but spotting a player of that value isnt hard, getting them on board can be and i doubt very much AW as a coach was instrumental in that. - G Ron - i hear you mate but Walcott has waxed on for years how he sees his future in the middle and Wenger has often paid lip service to the notion. Media cant be blamed for everything. Hes too weak for the task, in body and i would suggest, in his mind as well judging by what ive seen of him down the years.

  64. Bard

    Oct 28, 2014, 8:03 #60255

    some really good footballing posts on here yesterday. Ron you have expanded on the Ozil theme to great effect. I really like him, he sometimes reminds me of George Eastham but you are right you have to have a vision of the kind of midfield that will get the best out of him. Looking at the side at the moment you would have to say it looks massively unbalanced. Can you play Santi, Ozil, and Jack in the same midfield? Not to my mind. The feeling is that trhe midfield is a mess with too many players replicating each other and very little defensive nous. Matic looked immense on Sunday breaking up play, making tackles, getting forward. We have been crying out for such a player since Paddy left. As for credit for buying Sanchez, I would have thought it was a no brainer but yes Wenger got him to sign. Lets see whether he can keep him.

  65. julesd

    Oct 28, 2014, 5:32 #60254

    @Ron, Giroud, Koscielny, Debuchy, Ospina, Wilshere, Gnabry, injured featherweights? If any other fool could have bought Sanchez why didn't they?

  66. WENGER MUST GO ASAP(MARCUS)

    Oct 28, 2014, 3:37 #60253

    Whenever I meet an akb I always ask them one question. Do you think arsenal will ever win the premier league under Wenger again??? All never answer yes!!! They always come up with excuses to defend their messiah. It's blind loyalty that is holding this great club back. Also a friend off mine has taught me a new line. If any akb tells you folks who want Wenger gone that you are not a arsenal fan just tell them to go support Tottenham as they our happy we have now become mediocre lool. Do you see how he has reversed that "go support spuds" line onto the deluded bunch??? It's comical. They our the ones who should go support the spuds as they our content with mediocrity. I said I would never post on here again if giroud scores 30 goals in a season in the PREMIER LEAGUE or if Wenger wins the pl again.

  67. Ozzie

    Oct 28, 2014, 3:03 #60252

    The most effective way for the opinionated to draw attention to his/herself is to say nothing; but I'm not complaining, hehe :-) jjetplane, did I see the ball? It must be still in orbit - do you think Baddie has gone to fetch it?

  68. DW Thomas

    Oct 28, 2014, 1:28 #60251

    Been waiting for Walcott to Coe good, really good since 2006. He was playing well last year before another injury. Gibbs is just like him now. So many of our players get and stay injured for what seems like forever. Ozil is a very gifted player that seems to have a bloated ego just like his current manager. Though he has vision and skill aplenty, he works about 1/4 as hard as Sanchez. If he had Alexis's grit and determination, we would dominate teams a lot more. He just doesn't like to defend or tackle or take on defenders. So really, what good is he in the long term? A better coach would demand more, just like withArshavin. Remember his quadruple vs Liverpool? That was magnificent! He too could have been more. I am not saying every great player becoming a dud unde rWenger is his fault, but its his job to get the best from players. Being their best mate doesn't do it. Even Ramsey now is regressing. Again I ask what's happened to Rosicky too? Disillusionment seems to be running amok at this club. You bet the players can see what's missing too. At least those with half a brain. Once this club realizes it can be so much more than it is now, it will truly take off. That might require a new owner, board, and manager. A seismic shift is needed and way past due. Now, where is Diaby???

  69. GoonerRon

    Oct 28, 2014, 0:23 #60250

    @ Ron - but Theo is a different type of player than Hazard or Di Maria, he is undoubtedly more a number 9 than those two who are closer to 10's. In any case, his scoring record still stands up against theirs. Theo has always been a recognised wide man, it's predominately the media that harp on about him being given a go in the centre. Wenger has said he is capable of playing there but his actions of picking him out wide for 99.9% of his games for us in the last 8 years speak louder than words. I agree Theo is hit and miss, but he gets far too derided for a player who consistently delivers goals and assists which is ultimately his currency as a wide forward. As for Sanchez, of course it was a no-brainer to go for him but I'd imagine there was competition for his signature so to get him (especially considering how far in the **** we apparently are) is an achievement.

  70. Ron

    Oct 27, 2014, 22:37 #60249

    G Ron - granted he scored goals at those venues and he cant be blamed entirely for the defeats and often heavy hammerings in which he scored them. Disagree that a wide player cant impose himself on a game. De Maria has been more or less the reason Utd arent bottom 6 this season. Hazard is Chelsea s best player possibly. Even Downing has a niche that makes the Hammers tick right now. Walcott is hit and miss. Its not entirely his fault though. Wenger has allowed Wally to bask in the delusional notion that he might be a central striker for god knows how long yet deep down knows its pie in the sky yet has lacked the balls to tell Wally his role is as a wide man and as a wide man only, so i ask you when did he become a recognized wide man? Has it actually happened yet?. At another Club with a surer footed coach i think his career wouldn't have been so staccato and underwhelming. Lastly, you saw Sanchez play for Chile. Could you not have picked him out and then given the cash, go and bid for him? I wouldnt laud Wenger too highly for that and anyway, the mark up on the credit side is more than knocked down on the debit side by failing to get in players to supplement and complement Sanchez in my view.

  71. jjetplane

    Oct 27, 2014, 22:18 #60248

    Forget WESTIE you're out and RON is in. Killer posts mate! Ain't that the truth on Maureen. He would never have such a deficient squad. Imagine him rotating Flamange and Arteta. Plain silliness. He would also do good things with Ozil. Case rested. WOB landslide. Get in!

  72. GoonerRon

    Oct 27, 2014, 22:13 #60247

    @ Ron - Walcott has scored goals at OT, Stamford Bridge, The Etihad, Goodison, SHL and has scored against Liverpool at The Emirates. Theo isn't the type of player to dominate a game, take it by the scruff of the neck, primarily as he's a wide player. I agree some stats are largely irrelevant but when a wide player consistently scores a goal every two starts over a long period of time it's nothing but legitimate. And as for all those saying Alexis is our only top quality player - you may be right - but who did the player himself say was key in him signing? Perhaps a little credit for the manager in securing the signing of the aforementioned world class talent?

  73. Ron

    Oct 27, 2014, 21:43 #60245

    Give it a rest Westie. Arsenal have nt had an injury free squad for years and the be honest enough for once to admit that the much lauded Mourinho wouldn't have a squad chock full of perma/semi crocked featherweights in the first place. The PL is a rigorous place to be. A team full of little nippy types, brainwashed into thinking the other teams are supposed to stand back, watch them play and not challenge and tackle them isnt going to achieve jack shyte. The answer to the never ending injury saga, thats lasted at least 6 years now lies in removing the architect of it.

  74. Ron

    Oct 27, 2014, 21:33 #60244

    Ozil is a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma. Bard s right. Massive mistake by Arsenal buying him and Ozil agreeing to join them. Its the memory of him in the German team in 2010 that sustains the view that hes going to suddenly become the arch creator and visionary. Fact is he probably isn't and if he does it wont be in the PL. He needs top quality footballers around him. Those who can see what he sees and who can interlock with him. Hes had that with Germany and even more so with Real M. The old adage, 'we are not worthy' fits the bill with Arsenal. The players there cant complement him. Not near good enough. The one decent player we have, Sanchez doesn't need a provider like Ozil, he needs a couple of durable and skilled grafters around him and players to take the weight off him. Hes a creator in his own right and a scorer too. Ozil is a man with no discernible role and Wenger doesn't know how to accommodate him. A traditional 'No 10'schemes and lays balls on a plate for top central strikers to feed on such as a Drogba at his peak. Sanchez isnt a conventional central striker and Arsenal have no other players who can use Ozils talents. You cant buld a team around Ozil without acquiring such players. Ozil also needs a powerhouse quality Essien / Ya Ya type to operate with him, to take the stick and be his 'insurance man'. As with Fabregas, theres only Chelsea in that PL who could operate and use Ozil to his best effect. Why do you think Mourinho wanted him and why do you think Fabregas didnt want to re join Arsenals team of inadequate lightweights? The lat think Oxil needs as a lightweight is more of and less talented lightweights around him. Its not rocket science. Wenger has done him a disservice taking him to N7 and he should either now make it up to him by getting in some decent players for once in his miserable last 9 years or offering the guy a way out and back to la liga or the Bundesliga. Ozil s morale must be shot when he sees those team sheets. The Club needs to offer him the chance to fulfil his career. If he stays at Arsenal much longer his stock will fall so low, his careers on the ropes. Arsenal wont pay what it takes to maximize his skill set so let him go. I m guessing hes on his way out in January anyway and good luck to him. Why go down with Wengers ship of misfits and aimless coaching? Its not great to be so harsh towards the Club but basically under this regime, Arsenal FC cant cope or handle players like Ozil and shouldn't be buying them.

  75. jjetplane

    Oct 27, 2014, 21:23 #60243

    Screw Clement! WESTIE you got the job and here's a DVD of when Burnley were bigger than us ...

  76. Westlower

    Oct 27, 2014, 20:55 #60242

    @Bard, I totally agree we should build a team around Ozil but first you need a settled side before you can do any building. Virtually from minute one this season we've been fire fighting covering the absence of injured players. Regardless of who the coach is you cannot go forward until the team selection is constant. CFC have used less players than any other team this season. Man City have used 8 more players than CFC and it shows in their results. Ozil has only played 6 PL games, starting upfront with 4 different combinations of strikers, Ox & Sanchez; Sanogo & Sanchez; Welbeck & Sanchez; Ox & Welbeck + Giroud, Podolski, Campbell have come on as subs. Until this ridiculous run of injuries ceases it's simply a case of patching up who's left standing & hoping the team can accumulate points until the absentee's return to the fold. Even the much lauded Maureen would struggle to cope with a long term injury list as long as ours.

  77. Bard

    Oct 27, 2014, 20:26 #60241

    Hiccup, brilliantly funny posts mate. A joy to read after a day at the coal face. I have said before that the humour on here will see us through because the football we are playing currently wont. The Wally debate is a nonsense nothing more than clutching at straws. Sanchez is the real deal, skilful, aggressive, hardworking, tough and nearly always fit. I would like his first touch to be more reliable. He makes some of the others look lightweight in comparison, Wally isnt in the same universe let alone the same class. Westie I know youre not a natural Dark Sider and I always like your positivity although we often disagree. I also agree that the future for Arsenal isnt bleak but to my mind Wenger is holding us back. You have seen enough of Arsenal to know that its not just the results that are of concern, the football is p... poor by our standards. There must be someone out there who can better organise and motivate what is a good group of players. You cant tell me that the players dont see the gaping holes in the side and the lack of tactical nous and wonder why these issues are not being sorted. I know its speculation but its my view that the reason Ozil was playing with so little conviction is that he knows hes made a major blunder signing for us. You dont buy a 42m player and then play him out of position, he did the same with Ash. You spend 42m and build the midfield around him you dont then fill it with competing talents. Whether Ozil is the real deal I dont know but the system Wenger has him playing is completely counterproductive.

  78. jjetplane

    Oct 27, 2014, 18:54 #60240

    AKBs, AZTECS & WOBS Watch this heartwarming DVD that shows the disintegration of both great and not so great nation tribes while charting the rise of the WOBS outside of Papua New Guinea and the eventual collapse of one of sport's most enduring leaders. See footage of Lord Ticki-taka sharing his knowledge with the Midfield Men (a pygmy tribe of central Africa) which led sadly to their sudden extinction at the hands of the Tall Men of Senegal. Buy this at Amazon for the special price of a 2015 match day ticket. This offer at £299 (how ****ing much!) is available only to those who have Golden Gooner Gowns (GGG not to be confused with GG or indeed Gee Gee). Thanks for your participation over the last twenty years. Your mental strength and spirit has ........

  79. Westlower

    Oct 27, 2014, 18:53 #60239

    How the make up of football has changed since our double winning season of 1970/71. That season was remarkable for the few number of players used. In the victorious FA Cup run from 8th Jan to the final on 8th May, only 12 different players started in the 9 ties (including replays) + Eddie Kelly being brought on twice as a sub. Compare that with our first 9 games in the PL where only our GK has played in all matches. What's the conclusion? Considering games were often played on paddy fields in the winter, the game was more about stamina & attrition than speed. Today pitches are pristine & the players are faster & more athletic, but seemingly more injury prone. Maybe without the prying eyes of cameras back than the players were able to take more breathers during a game. George 'Stroller' Graham didn't get his reputation because of running himself into the ground? IMO the player who would have adapted best to the speedier game today would have been Geordie Armstrong.

  80. Ron

    Oct 27, 2014, 18:48 #60238

    G Ron - hi mate. Good to see you still in the spirit of it. Stats never do sit squarely in football for me. Its the lastes trend i know what with possession, passes made, tackles made and assists given and all the BS. I prefer to ask how many big games has Walcott took by the scruff of the neck and altered their course?, how many big matches has he won for us?, how many times has be alone been the difference between a win and a loss? I think you know the answer mate.His goals have been in romps v lowly teams in the main or end of season stuff. I cant recall him pushing Utd, Chelsea City or Liverpool aside, can you? Rooney goals for England suggest a prolific game changing forward, yet hes scored 1 in 3 tourneys that mean anything. Wellbecks goals for Eng make him seem devastating. Cricket and Rugby are for stats. In football they mask reality and spin a new one to a massive degree. Thats probably why Wally is cherished by Wenger? The whole Club at Wengers bidding spins and denies reality. Wally's stats dont make him a top forward in my book. Hes a typical AW player though. Nice enough lad, lightframed and never says boo to a goose. The Club wreaks of such types and its why we are as we are in my opinion.

  81. Hiccup

    Oct 27, 2014, 18:17 #60237

    jj, that is very noble of you taking time out to spare a thought for our dear departed. Our household was going to hold a minutes silence on behalf of them tonight, but we thought it was too sombre and upgraded to a minutes applause. On further reflection, we are going to have a minutes laughter in recognition of all the good laughs they've given us. Bless their little cotton socks.

  82. Roy

    Oct 27, 2014, 18:09 #60236

    I know players will return from injury, and options will increase. But the way we're playing at the moment, if Alexis was to get injured, we'd be no better than mid-table. There was a time not so long ago that even if we weren't good enough to actually win something, we would still play some cracking football from time to time, now we don't even have have that. I don't contribute anywhere near as much as you more regular posters on here but I always read, and the general sense of apathy towards the team and club as a whole, while not exactly off the scale, is certainly at a frightening level. Even worse, it would seem that those at the top of our great club don't care, so there's the reason for it. Like many others, I'm simply bored watching us at the moment. One- dimensional tactics with large gaps left behind when possession is lost and certain players - dare I say it - who don't seem to want to perform to their maximum for this manager, or am I reading the body language wrong ? As far as I can see, we are at a critical crossroads now and something has to give sooner rather than later as the portents are not good.

  83. Hiccup

    Oct 27, 2014, 18:05 #60235

    Ron, sounds like you have your wits about you. Couldn't see you getting complacent and letting a 4 goal lead slip at St James Park. With Baddie, offensively they were still rudderless, but he was good at organising their retreat and covering for them as they scarpered. All they have left now is a couple of stubborn stragglers that would rather take a bullet for wenger than admit they're wrong. I feel their days are numbered though. We've tried smoking them out to no avail, but I do think they'll find solace on arseblog. Even the GCSE history syllabus for next year already has a paper on the AKB, comparing the phenomenon with the Great Plague. Future generations will look back at this period in time, and ask was the AKB real or a myth? How could such a stigma hold this great club back? All we await now, is the Treaty of Alasace to be signed, with full and unconditional surrender.

  84. jjetplane

    Oct 27, 2014, 17:46 #60234

    WESTIE you finally made it across the Moon. Give it a couple of posts and you should have adjusted to the darkness. Suggest you keep it quiet from Jules though. Saw the goals and always good to see the young uns though was struck by the Wenger is lining up Paul Clement as his successor at 'the end of this probably trophyless season article. Watch the Toffees get back in the fold and Martinez might be a board choice. Hilarious how Independent see Arsenal slipping back! into mere 4th place contention. And where may they have slipped from. ps think MIKE COLLiNS take on another Santi miss was priceless. Wonder if the ball ever came back. Have you seen it Ozzie?

  85. GoonerRon

    Oct 27, 2014, 17:34 #60233

    @ Ron - being a sniper in this 'war' would be easy - just find the dark room you lot are holed in, bring night vision goggles that will highlight the foaming around your mouths and a motion camera that will capture you all rocking back and forth. Get a bug in there to capture the Wenger is satan chants and I'm away. Good to see the Walcott arguments starting again - my personal opinion is having a player back who scored 51 goals in his last 110 starts (whilst playing 99% as a wide player) is a positive thing for the team.

  86. Ron

    Oct 27, 2014, 16:54 #60232

    For the first time since 2006 Walcott had shown a bit of mettle for the 2 months before he was injured admittedly. Never been convinced of him. Always the boy next door wannabe in my book and his habit of big talking to the press grates. It would not be half so bad if he had ever achieved anything but his big talk seems more designed to quell his own self doubts. Always thought he puts playing for Eng above Arsenal anyway.Loves to speak of how hes spoken to 'Wayne' and 'Lamps' about the 'potential' for eng. Seems odd as it always looks to me as if Wally is the last player Shrek ever wants to pass to. Ive said for years he s one we should have sold when his stock was at one of his little false highs.

  87. Westlower

    Oct 27, 2014, 16:47 #60231

    Give yourselves some relief from AFC's impending doom by watching videos of the U21's goals against Stoke on Metro.co.uk. Very talented forward line of Zelalem, Crowley, Maitland-Niles, Gnabry & Akpom. Good to see Gnabry back & he'll give Theo a scrap for a position in the first team. Agree with Ron that the fixtures are kind in the short term & should we get a hiding in the next two home games, even I will admit we're up **** creek without a paddle.

  88. Bard

    Oct 27, 2014, 16:38 #60230

    Ron you may be right but as I see it, the team are an accident waiting to happen. The joy at Wallys return is odd. He seems to have become a better player for being injured. Like you I cant quite see what the fuss is about. Im glad hes recovered but hes been out for the best part of a year and it may take as long to get back to where he was. He was a good player before his injury but he as sure as hell wasnt world class.

  89. Exeter Gunner

    Oct 27, 2014, 16:22 #60229

    Jamie fell into the trap Hiccup set for him, GoonerRon only offers very occasional misplaced indignation, so Westlower is alone really and has only a popgun shooting foam bullets at present, but I would agree with Bard and Ron. I believe Badarse is watching and waiting. He will return soon. The opening line will read "I write not in defence of myself but my big brother Westlower. You have cruelly..." and then it will go on for 2,000 tangential words. Obfuscation is his weapon, confusion will result; he attacks in that fog.

  90. Gaz

    Oct 27, 2014, 16:06 #60228

    After making a really big effort to find interest in Arsenal again I'm now firmly heading back to that bored stage again hoping Wenger leaves sooner rather than later! Of course we all know he never breaks a contract so we're stuck with him for at least another two seasons. Only saving grace for me is Alexis Sanchez. Works incredibly hard, genuinely seems to love the Club and is quite simply brilliant! He really could be Wengers last throw of the dice...

  91. Ron

    Oct 27, 2014, 16:04 #60227

    Bard - not too sure mate. The fixtures are kinder this time. i reckon the alternative to a few hidings is more likely to come this time in the form of a few embarrassing losses to mid ranking teams. Arsenal look mentally feeble and the football is circa 1982 - 85 type (save for the redeeming feature of Sanchez). They look like they fear defeat every match. Its come to some thing when Arsenal FC are bulling up and waiting for Master balsa wood himself Walcott to return like a conquering General Grant at Vicksburg. That must be why hes tried changing his appearance from being Frank Spencer in 'some Mothers do av em' to Clint Eastwood in 'Pale Rider'.Wont make a jot of difference as he ll still fall over after 5 games like Norman Wisdoms stunt man.

  92. Bard

    Oct 27, 2014, 15:39 #60226

    Really funny post Ron but also a warning. I also believe that this is only a strategic retreat for the AKBs, once we win a few games on the trot they will be back. They are feeling isolated at present and would rather withdraw than be savaged on here. Lets face it how can anyone mount much support for the team at present. They are playing the worst football I have seen from an Arsenal side for the last decade or more, so hardly much to crow about on here. Reading the other blogs its pretty clear that not reinforcing our defence is universally deemed a massive c... up. Quite whether the great one will be able to turn water into wine we will have to wait and see. But I cant believe we wont get spanked sooner rather than later.

  93. Tony Evans

    Oct 27, 2014, 15:24 #60225

    Smithy - Diaby is one of NINE injured players. Unbelievable - what the hell is going on? Every season what little chance we do have due to Wenger's insistence of going into battle with gaping holes in the squad is completely undermined by a crippling injury crisis. Groundhog day has nothing on Arsenal.

  94. Ron

    Oct 27, 2014, 15:19 #60224

    In fairness to Badarse and knowing the old veteran from previous head to head skirmishes from way back i think he might yet be planning a major assault and counter offensive. Hes tactically astute and has been known before to withdraw, re align his troops and then attack with speed from the flanks before launching a major offensive centrally. He ll wait until hes on harder dryer ground before he strikes but until then will just observe and plan meticulously. A couple of narrow home wins against average teams will see him minded for a buoyant battle cry to whats left of his forces. Dont ever underestimate the old campaigner. He might be crotchety but can strike like a cobra once the batteries are recharged.You can bank on high level talks going on with Westie as we type. Mustn't rest on yr laurels. I dont know what's gone on. Your artillery might have winged or bruised him but he ll be back with some strategic distance shelling soon enough before he mobilises properly. Know him as i do and be on your guard. Ignore the old fox at your peril.He isn't known as Field Marshall Erwin Rommel at AKB Central Command for nothing. Best tactic for now is to target Westie, a formidable durable campaigner himself, aptly nicknamed 'Vic Groves' at AKB CC and never one to cut and run. Outflank Westie and morale at AKB CC could be shattered irreparably. Im guessing high level talks to bring Amos back into the fold are hurriedly taking place. Amos took some batterings a while back though and might not fancy the heavy fire of the fray again. He was deft and slick but would often fade away and hence cruelly earned his nickname according to some as 'Antonio Reyes'at AKB CC. They have never replaced him though and thats why Amos is nick named by better informed opponents as 'Paddy V' at central command. If Amos comes back you might need to allow Jeff as sabbatical for a while. He once fought a gallant battle for 4 days, left alone and isolated under AKB heavy fire. Seriously wounded, cut and bruised Jeff battled on gamely but needed bed rest for quite a while afterwards. Has he properly recovered? There is grudging respect for Jeff at AKB CC though as a result. They have long nicknamed him 'Eddie Kellys minder in the corridors of power. The quiet at AKB CC is an old ruse that they have tried before. Keep your watch as Gooner Ron is lurking some where with his sniper rifle you can bet on it. Rightly known as 'super mac' at AKB CC Gooner Ron will shoot on sight, get a rebound in off A N Other and still claim the goal as his own. One big win v a poor team and Gooner Ron will be out in the open firing like Jesse James on speed. Ive warned you young bucks now. Take heed.

  95. Mike

    Oct 27, 2014, 15:10 #60223

    The truth of the matter is that despite everything there is only one team playing decently in the EPL at the moment and that is Chelsea - Southampton are surprisingly consistant - The rest are very erratic -

  96. Smithy

    Oct 27, 2014, 14:54 #60222

    I see Diaby is injured again- that's him done till 2015-2016 season. Why do we put up with this joker?

  97. jjetplane

    Oct 27, 2014, 14:19 #60221

    Can we just make a moment to think of our beloved, departed Gooners who have gone to the Arseblog in the sky. Right, dusted. Radford/Kennedy - funny stuff mate! Lovely day out there MG.

  98. maguiresbridge gooner

    Oct 27, 2014, 13:37 #60220

    Correction apparently it's been flying for four days now.

  99. maguiresbridge gooner

    Oct 27, 2014, 13:26 #60219

    Reports coming in of a barrage balloon over Margate.

  100. jjetplane

    Oct 27, 2014, 13:20 #60218

    Interesting watching Birmingham's implosion against Bournemouth and pundits talking of 'lack of leadership from the top to the bottom.' Any club that takes serious beatings is a club with serious issues but there are beatings and le accidente/s (sic) and it seems to me Birmingham 'lack the mental strength and spirit' whereas we learn quickly and that is why 'we have leaders throughout the club with the mental strength and spirit .....' CRASH. Quite what the Brummies have to do with our great club is another matter. MOVE ON!

  101. radfordkennedy

    Oct 27, 2014, 13:05 #60217

    There's already two new statues at the club,trouble is they're in the heart of the effing defence!

  102. Hiccup

    Oct 27, 2014, 12:40 #60216

    Seems we are responsible for driving every great player we ever had away. Also responsible for driving away every crap player we ever had. Now we're responsible for driving Jamie away from this site. The only people left are wenger and Stan, the guys who we actually want to f#ck off...

  103. maguiresbridge gooner

    Oct 27, 2014, 12:38 #60215

    Hiccup 63527, you were right, and it didn't take long. You couldn't make it up.

  104. maguiresbridge gooner

    Oct 27, 2014, 12:27 #60214

    jj, you can just imagine OGL telling all his followers, yes the statue is there even though you can't see it, it really is believe me, it took great spirit and mental strength to come up with something like this, even though we've been winning virtual trophies for years and years it's a first for the club to have a virtual statue, and all the wengerites lapping it up and believing him, and off to celebrate and stand around it in a circle with all the tourists taking photos of it.

  105. jjetplane

    Oct 27, 2014, 12:02 #60213

    Oh WSESTIE now making abstract comparisons with Chelski while forgetting they appear to have a coach who does his homework on opponents and who also has the respect of his players. Even his frail flowers go the extra mile while at Arsene fC the 'really hard Peter Storey' types like Flamange go around tearing their shirt sleeves off in a match. Is that passion or an absence of drug testing? ha ha keep scratching away there - that's entertainment (The Jam) Just off down the Kings Rd .... Hello JAMIE!

  106. Bard

    Oct 27, 2014, 11:49 #60212

    Tony Evans, sensible post, thats my view. The trouble is this current set up have long since departed from what you would call reality.

  107. Tony Evans

    Oct 27, 2014, 11:24 #60211

    Most supporters of my vintage are well used to Arsenal performing poorly, as any analysis of the last 40 or 50 years or so will confirm. We have had some wonderful highs to enjoy along the way though and I wouldn't have had it any other way. You need the lows to fully appreciate the highs. My beef with the present set up is the fact that the team is consistently sold short. If Wenger had brought in the decent holding player and top class centre half so desperately needed I would be disappointed at the slow start to the campaign but accepting of it as just one of those things; but of course he didn't and that is where the anger and frustrations lie with those of us that can't wait to see the back of him. I just want the club to use all the resources at its disposal in order to compete effectively and surely that is what every supporter should be demanding?

  108. Ron

    Oct 27, 2014, 10:58 #60210

    Westie - Sadly i couldn't see that team of ex,s pulling up any trees. I could see it giving the present Arsenal team a run for its money though.

  109. WeAreBuildingATeamToDominate

    Oct 27, 2014, 10:57 #60209

    Can anyone tell me how we're doing on the Calender Year League Table? We won that last year you recall. And hey, Saturday was an improvement on the 3-1 win at Sunderland last year.....this time we kept a clean sheet. Things just keep getting better and better.

  110. Exeter Gunner

    Oct 27, 2014, 10:08 #60208

    Jamie decides to sign off with a bit of self-parody. Jamie - your carefully reasoned posts will be missed, but try and take this distinction with you: Yes, no player is too good for Arsenal, but Sanchez is playing with players who aren't good enough for Arsenal - and a manager who is no longer good enough for Arsenal. That's why there are concerns he'll go.

  111. Bard

    Oct 27, 2014, 10:08 #60207

    Jamie, you are getting a touch paranoid mate. I havent read a single post thats anti Sanchez, on the contrary most think he is carrying the team. As for going to games, its the perpetual rubbish about who is a real fan. I didnt go to Sunderland but others did so what, I go to home games and the other London ones if I can get a ticket. But is Ozzie not a fan because he lives in Australia ???? Good luck looking for Baddie. Im afraid it seems like he has jumped ship along with bring it on alias GBH.

  112. JAMIE

    Oct 27, 2014, 9:45 #60206

    The wobs are already trying to drive out Sanchez like they did Vieira,Henry and Van Persestrings.In Vieira's case they moaned about him being not as committed as before.Henry they kept telling him he was past it while Van Persestrings the ultimate betrayel they told him he was too good for Arsenal the same line now being spun to Sanchez.NO ONE PLAYER'S TOO GOOD FOR ARSENAL.I'm taking a rain check with BADARSE,This sites been taken over by the anti Arsenal and fans from other clubs plus most don't even attend the games anymore.

  113. Ozzie

    Oct 27, 2014, 9:17 #60205

    Who has the best hoof - Cazorla or Muffin the mule?

  114. GoonerRon

    Oct 27, 2014, 9:06 #60204

    @ Mike Collins - on your point re: Ozil, wasn't it the German federation who announced his injury whilst he was on international duty? Obviously, I'm sure they'd have no problem fabricating an injury and lying to the football world about it, just for thrill of being involved in Arsenal's clandestine transfer operation. Seriously, get a grip.

  115. Westlower

    Oct 27, 2014, 8:42 #60203

    Chelsea have been able to start every PL game with the same 7 players + Oscar has only missed one. Szczesny is the only AFC player to have started every PL game + BFG has missed one. Obviously being able to field a settled team is a big factor in producing consistent team performances. My other observation after watching highlights from the weekend games is that refs continue to have a major influence on the outcome of games. Please retire Mike Riley, your time is up! Where do you WOB pessimists get these Ozil leaving stories? After seeing photos of Ozil in the gym with a heavily strapped up knee, do you not believe he's injured? I'm all for conspiracy theories but let's have something a bit more believable please. I'll leave with some words from one of my favourite songs, "Fool if you think it's over, tell you why..."

  116. radfordkennedy

    Oct 27, 2014, 7:40 #60202

    Bletchley Park...that sounds like badarse in his alter ego of prof Stanley unwin

  117. Bard

    Oct 27, 2014, 7:25 #60201

    Bletchley park. come on mate its obvious. it means we are just off the shoulder of the top teams. We could ve, we should ve but we didnt, is that clear ? we need the delightful Ms Oakley to deconstruct that little gem. incidentally all the AKBs seem to have gone awol, do you think the have f..... off down the lane ?

  118. Bletchley Park

    Oct 27, 2014, 6:55 #60200

    Has any one got a spare enigma machine laying around? Because I'd like to decode this quote from OGL “We are six points off where we should have been,” Wenger, Arsenal’s manager, said. “Let’s say four because we lost only one game since the start of the season, but we have only won three, so I think we’ve dropped too many points.

  119. Hiccup

    Oct 26, 2014, 21:33 #60199

    The wob's will be blamed for a) driving Ozil out, and b) telling him it's alright for him to go so we can blame wenger. Think we've heard that one recycled from time to time and it needs to make a chart re-entry. JJ, I would like the club to throw a virtual testimonial for the retired AKB's. Without them, this virtual circus wouldn't have been possible. Looking forward to the Ozil proceeds going in to our winter war chest, but on 1st February when untouched will be transferred to the cashbuilder as we get closer to that £1 billion target. Agree totally. It's a scream watching this comedy called Arsenal these days.

  120. jjetplane

    Oct 26, 2014, 21:18 #60198

    Ha ha HICCUP talking of statues a virtual one for Abou like the Invisible Man would be really cooool with the tourists. This new Arsenal is kinda fun right!

  121. maguiresbridge gooners

    Oct 26, 2014, 21:17 #60197

    Hiccup, yes we'll be ready, they don't like it up em you know, and the back turning brigade more commonly known as AKB's can start planning for the Ozil transfer and accusing him of letting OGL down and jumping ship (lets hope they plan it better than the counter attack)the days of legends at this great club to follow all the others is sadly long gone mate, and not expected to return for quite a while.

  122. kilkenny cat

    Oct 26, 2014, 21:09 #60196

    Love to see this lot play gaelic. Wouldn,t last 5 minutes. In the hurling they wouldn,t even make the throw in.

  123. maguiresbridge gooner

    Oct 26, 2014, 20:44 #60195

    Mike Collins, look on the positive side if had been Gaelic football it would have been a point.

  124. jeff wright

    Oct 26, 2014, 20:25 #60194

    I couldn't agree more Mike the chicanery and sleight of hand that goes on at the club these days is a disgrace to the proud history of AFC . I blame Diamond Danny for this situation,now dead and resting in his cold grave in eternal tax-exile in Swissland he ,due to his personal feud with David Dein , left us with his legacy of the Kroenke regime. A man with a record of running his sports clubs for profits while producing mediocre mid-table results in the American 'soccer' league.

  125. Hiccup

    Oct 26, 2014, 20:25 #60193

    mg, maybe they've had the weekend off, but we'll be ready for them whenever they arrive! Happy for Ozil to go to City. At least we won't be selling him to a rival this time around and Big Sam won't get him. Just another ex arsenal player for everyone to hate. Will we ever have another legend that sticks it out at this circus? Bendtner and Djourou are the only ones with long service awards that fit the bill that spring to mind. Good on 'em. I await their statues.

  126. jjetplane

    Oct 26, 2014, 20:18 #60192

    Well said Mike Collins The club has just gone plain ugly and looks like a Wal Mart sports division. Hope Ramsay has not 'lost it' like some others but watch that space. Things are getting bad when Santi cannot even be bothered to smile. Think the look he gets from Alexis speaks volumes of a preoccupied club that seems to be floating away on some half baked idea about 'doing it right.'

  127. maguiresbridge gooners

    Oct 26, 2014, 20:17 #60191

    Why I man, yes indeed well done the toon, i'll buy me new trainers in sports direct after all.

  128. Mike Collins

    Oct 26, 2014, 19:40 #60190

    Sorry, I forgot to mention my wager of a paid night out on the town (preferably Islington) that Ozil won't play for us again. The "knee injury" lie is as low as the club has gone in my 50+ years of supporting Arsenal and, though I was slated by some for these comments a few weeks ago, now the Man City transfer talk is surfacing on this site. Whether it's them or not, the German has effectively gone after a disastrous spell with us. Does anyone recall when a decent football club called Arsenal FC used to reside in London N5? No? Not surprising, as it's getting to be a long time ago now.

  129. Mike Collins

    Oct 26, 2014, 19:16 #60189

    Is it me or is Santi Cazorla rubbish these days? One of his shots during this match - shown on Match of the Day, much to everyone's embarrassment - took off in the direction of Geosat VI orbiting 25 miles above Earth. We even missed out on the trademark grin this time, the one that always accompanies his mishaps these days. He's finished, Arsene, just like the hugely talented Sanchez will be after a few more months of your coaching. And where's Ramsey this season? As an Arsenal fan I need to know as much as all the Fantasy League whingers on my back at the moment. C'mon you Gunners!

  130. jjetplane

    Oct 26, 2014, 19:05 #60188

    Ozil to Citeh 32m That's 10m he owes Stan. 3 years will just have to be 3 years. Who would go for the most? JW, Ramsay, Santi, Sanogo, wally, Chambers 9too early), Diaby (staying) think think sell sell! ......

  131. DW Thomas

    Oct 26, 2014, 18:56 #60187

    Hazard, Cahill, and Fabregas. All could have been signed by OGL but no, we were good! The whole Chelsea team played with balls and desire. Drogba scored another good goal off Cesc's corner. How I wish Arsenal had that desire. Mo doesn't put up with slackers. Wenger coddles his boys. You see the huge difference in these big games with the big boys. Can anyone explain what happened to Rosicky? Interesting watching Matic and Fellaini battle each other. We have no one like those two. I agree re Pogba. Don't pay or give him that much, but this club needs to send a message that we want to compete. If you don't do it with signings then make it happen on the pitch. When is the last time Arsene laid down a marker? All he seems to lay these days is eggs!

  132. Bard

    Oct 26, 2014, 18:46 #60186

    Terry; what team are you watching mate ? Its not the one Im watching. Head and shoulders about the rest, you must be kidding.

  133. Ron

    Oct 26, 2014, 18:43 #60185

    Kev - I think that the way too look at that game and make make sense of it is to accept that we played a team weak on will, talent and confidence and made up of average players and journey men yet we never once looked like a team who had the self belief to go there and beat them quite easily. A player like Sanchez can sometimes drag a team as ordinary as Arsenal to win these type of games and it happened. A win is a win though, but we never look like a team who has such belief as we have a head Coach who looks totally shot of any belief himself. I honestly think that any points the team garners occur due to players carry thing the Coach and not the other way around. The man seems to make little imprint on any game that we play. Such as Sanchez cant do it every week though.

  134. jjetplane

    Oct 26, 2014, 18:41 #60184

    Scratching around in the cupboard again WESTIE watch out for the traps!

  135. Westlower

    Oct 26, 2014, 18:33 #60183

    PL team made up of ex Arsenal players. Fabianski (Swansea); Sagna (Man C); Toure (Liverpool); Senderos (Villa); Clichy (Man C); Fabregas (CFC); Song (W Ham); Larsson (Sunderland); Adebayor (TH); RVP (Man U); Nasri (Man C). How would this team fare?

  136. maguiresbridge gooner

    Oct 26, 2014, 18:23 #60182

    It's 1830 hours and the big counter attack hasn't materialised, I guess manoeuvres at margate didn't go well with a lot of the home guard deserting central command, now maybe if it had been 8-0, that bloody referee.

  137. jjetplane

    Oct 26, 2014, 17:09 #60181

    Too right. If we see as OGL does then we are 2nd with just the Hammers above us. Little chance of the Mancs going top but who knows. Those teams above the Hammers Does noy make any sense. Burnley - you're for it!

  138. maguiresbridge gooner

    Oct 26, 2014, 15:56 #60180

    DWT, I can't believe and even more surprised it's not been spun as some kind of masterstroke. Well you know how it is, whatever a player/players have or had it is eventually squeezed or coached out of them in line with the old frauds philosophies.

  139. maguiresbridge

    Oct 26, 2014, 15:31 #60179

    I wonder was it just coincidence that OGL was interviewed by a woman post match yesterday, if it wasn't for his ex keeper getting him out of jail again there might have been no smiles just his grumpy arrogant self, or maybe she was a brunette.

  140. Why I man

    Oct 26, 2014, 15:25 #60178

    Toon Armeee!

  141. Torbay gooner

    Oct 26, 2014, 14:27 #60177

    Whoops, 63500 was mine!!

  142. maguiresbridge gooner

    Oct 26, 2014, 14:22 #60176

    I always knew Mannone wanted to play and do well for Arsenal.

  143. HgW7fL

    Oct 26, 2014, 14:05 #60175

    Two consecutive fluky wins against 2 poor sides. Have to agree with Frank, most of our football(Sanchez apart) has been mind numbingly dull. The Ox and cazorla were poor yet again, why does n't Rosicky start any more? We are as convincing as Allardyce's face after being ambushed by that publicity shy dandy, but insisting that he 'loved it'.

  144. We need to replace Vieira

    Oct 26, 2014, 13:34 #60174

    by signing Paul Pogba. Pay his 70m euro release clause and pay him 300k/w If its too much for some of you ask yourself this. Would you rather Arteta 80k Rosicky 80k Diaby 66k Flamini 60k Wilshere 80k or pay pogba 300k aweek?

  145. John Abrehart

    Oct 26, 2014, 13:29 #60173

    Regarding the defensive midfield position, a chap called Song was MOM for the Hammers yesterday.

  146. jjetplane

    Oct 26, 2014, 13:27 #60172

    The way it is on this site now (WESTIE back these figs up) is 95% want Wenger to really live in a castle in another country while one and two bits on here want him to live in an air castle above Holloway until he cannot take the sheer boredom of it anymore. People in smaller clubs say how can these so-called gooners be so ungrateful they should see what we put up with blah di blah. Believe me if you had supported the sports package Arsene corp have delivered for a decade you would be comatose too. NFL home games in London are the present pursued narrative (Atlanta v Detroit) and there will be many more and an Arsene ruined Arsenal will be playing half their 'home' games abroad in a decade. In Arsene time 'that is a leetle time and we have the mental strenght to play in the Bronx ....' Sounds like a good idea and then a new Arsenal (totally) could come out of all and have some lower league fun before finally 'coming home' to kick 'yankie gooner as' You can try and make this up. Already calling Fabregas 'player of the year' in pundit world (WeSTIE again!) but looks like that rude young gentleman who posted earlier (Hazard non-waste) looks the doggies blahs. Got that Ronaldo thing about him. Sanchez would be like that if he was in a good team. Strange that I am enjoying going to football games now as much as I did as a kid. Maybe even more. Might do a big one soon. Bournemouth .....

  147. N4

    Oct 26, 2014, 13:24 #60171

    DW Thomas you're spot mate...but why is AW waiting to give a new contract to Diaby?!

  148. DW Thomas

    Oct 26, 2014, 12:57 #60170

    Can't believe people aren't talking more about his now 85th minute substitutions. Rosicky and Ramsey for a few minutes? What's the point? Diabolical decision making all the time, every week. We lucked wins twice this week and Sanchez is the only reason we didn't drop points again. He is head and tails above any other player right now. The curse of Arshavin is now haunting the rest of the team. Arteta has one good game in 5 now. Such a pivotal position given to a slow, whiny, sideways passer. And I used to like him a lot at Everton! Even his first couple season were decent. Again, though, we replace players like Cesc with what? Second besters. If Cesc wins the title it will be the second time our captain has left this club and won the title with another. That must be a record or something. At the least it is a dire indictment of this failed coach and board. I guess we at least knew when it was time to let Mannone go, poor fella. So why did we let Almunia stay so long? Also, did anyone see Ramsey bombing forward to get another goal at the end? Do we not have any team discipline at all anymore?

  149. Bard

    Oct 26, 2014, 12:45 #60169

    I thought the game was a crushing bore although Im obviously pleased we won. Hiccup you make a really good point this is the poorest PL Ive seen in a while. With the exception of Chelsea and Southampton and the odd performance from Man C everyone else is garbage. Liverpool are worse than us and Man U don't look remotely top 4 unless they spend big in Jan. The fact that RM thrashed Liverpool without even getting out of first gear should be a worry for all the so called top teams. All in all dire stuff. Kev it hardly need reiterating that we won't win the the league because we never had any intention of trying to win it in the first place. The current defensive situation is evidence of the shambles that passes for Arsenal these days. Although we never really competed in the past at least we played cracking football from time to time.

  150. jjetplane

    Oct 26, 2014, 12:28 #60168

    Good one RG on the Wright/Sanchez comparison. Soon as he starts writing for The Sun he will be off. WESTIE would probably hope he writes for the Telegraph. Bang on also with Hillier/Jensen compare. Still trying to judge who are the most stultifying pair of the two? Arteta is afew years too late to Arsenal and then should have only been a fixture on the for the last two. That he occupies such a pedestal (perfect yes man) tells us about the line of ambition with Wenger and where it drawn. Enough to keep the tourists going and too little to keep the critical fans away. Science of bull**** really.

  151. Realistic Gooner

    Oct 26, 2014, 12:15 #60167

    You used to be the voice of reason Kev but reading your report you now sound like the rest of the AKBs.Totally ignoring the BIGGER picture.The football this season has been dire.Its like the end of Graham's reign with Sanchez playing the Ian Wright role.Its ironic to hear the AKB's praise the recent wins at Anderlecht and Sunderland when Grahams teams used to do the same and they hated George.Sanchez is outstanding but who else is?Be honest is Sanchez going to stay long with a team whose only ambition is 4th.He is better than that.He is carrying us at the moment.Arteta and Flamini (the new Jensen and Hillier) shouldnt be nowhere near an Arsenal starting 11 and Cazorla is living off his first season.His form for the last 18 months has been average.Will we get 4th? i really dont care this season has been just painful to watch

  152. maguiresbridge gooner

    Oct 26, 2014, 12:14 #60166

    Hiccup, you forgot diaby.

  153. maguiresbridge gooner

    Oct 26, 2014, 12:01 #60165

    Of course it's a concern Kev but others will not see it that way, they'll be to busy lapping up and believing the old fraud's bullshyte about water boils at 100 degrees and we're at 99 and after yesterday with two goals gifted to use from absolute howlers from a goalkeeper that was coached under him by his coaching team (and who he bigged up before the game) we're now 99 and three quarters. You really couldn't make it up. Would somebody please put this old man (and us)out of his misery.

  154. Wenger Out

    Oct 26, 2014, 11:55 #60164

    I hate Wenger he has to go. So sick of Wenger and same failure every season. I will wish for us to lose every game until Wenger gets sacked. Come on Burnley destroy Wenger. Love the fact we play United and Dortmund. Can't wait to see Wenger get trashed and humiliated like he does against any top team.

  155. jeff wright

    Oct 26, 2014, 11:53 #60163

    Westie, we will just beat the riff-raff in Europe and in the Prem . It's ALL just deja vu the last 9 seasons with the same old excuses being put forward to justify Wenger's inept delusional management . When we play the first top team outside of the group stage in Europe we will get knocked out .The top teams do not make the sort of mistakes in defence that allowed us to beat Anderlecht after being outplayed by them . Same scenario in the Prem, where top sides will not gift us goals like Sunderland did yesterday,but for that the game would have ended 0-0 . We struggle to beat top 4 sides at home even when a goal ahead - think City recently,even Fat Sam's Hammers managed to defend their lead at home against City . Wenger's record over the past 5 seasons against top 4 opponents is shocking and he still has yet to win a game against Mourinho. That is not going to change whatever players Wenger has available , because his tactics, team selections , and pre-planned substitutions will still be an handicap when we play top sides who have players of equal - or better abilities - and who use more pragmatic tactics than Wenger does. Wenger never plays for a draw away intentionally , it's always the same high-line tactics that leave us open to counter-attacks and cause nervousness not least to Wenger himself sitting pale faced wringing his hands in fear every time we lose possession going forward and panic Keystone Kops type defending results from it when our slow defenders are left exposed and the jittery Chesnay dashes out to try and help them ,not always successfully so it must be said. Also the comments by Mertesacker who has played in successful sides at other clubs under other managers in the Bundesliga and with Germany ,that our players don't train hard enough, echoes those of others who have said this . Wenger of course denies it,but then again he would do , wouldn't he ? It looks unlikely from what we have seen so far and on Wenger's past record that there will be any FAC win this season to dress things up before he departs to a World Cup ,so what are the odds on Wenger still being manager after another duff season ends ?

  156. jjetplane

    Oct 26, 2014, 11:34 #60162

    Sanchez 2 Sick Cats 0. Alexis will be wanting a move sooner than later if he has to share many more games with Santi. Why are so many of Birthday boy's players so ultimately inconsistent? Wenger has described Wally as a nice young man. No wonder we have won nothing for aeons, of note for just about the best team in North London though I would rather watch Borehamwood for the money. Arsenal have become a softly boring team under le Prof. Even WEStIE is doing his best just to convince himself. I am sure you want him away as much as we do but your pride won't allow you to say it. KEVIN know you gave credit to le boss there but if you read BARD's authoritative post of yesterday you will see how 'the team picks itself.' Watching Arsenal in Rome has a perverse irony methinks .....

  157. AA

    Oct 26, 2014, 11:34 #60161

    Weakness in the club need to be adressed. Arteta and Flamini should be replaced by Schnierderlin and Pogba. Garay needs to be brought in. Draxler to replace Cazorla. Wee will have a top team again. Just a few players away from being a top team. would cost about 100m.

  158. Frank

    Oct 26, 2014, 11:22 #60160

    I am now bored watching Arsenal.We play like a team that has already throw in the towel that is excusing the brilliant Sanchez of course.There is no zip in our game its just ponderous tippy tappy.It was a poor game between a very poor team and an average team and but for the two diabolical mistakes we would never have scored.Am i the only one who thinks the Ox is on borrowed time.Its games like this against weak opposition he has to take his chance.But once again he blew it.Cazorla has been crap all season and is only starting because of injuries and suspensions.Wenger has lived off the Invincible season for 10 years its time to say enough is enough

  159. Mathew

    Oct 26, 2014, 10:49 #60159

    I agree to you KC, mediocre players like Arteta and Flamini should've been replaced in the summer. It's so funny when Arteta tries to poke his nose as a captain to the referee, that's all he does during the match. Brave decisions needs to be taken by Arsene, for what is best for the team. We continue paying 50K a year for 6 seasons on Diaby who has played like 3 games in that span. Arsene seems to be loyal, but the club is suffering in the long run. Campbell, Poldi and Rosicky should've got their chances yesterday. Somehow Arsene delays substitutions too for no reason, we should've killed the game early. Well, we scored on their errors eventually but I feel Sanchez is carrying this team on his shoulders and he should be rested sometime. Win was scrappy but 3 points by the end of the day, will take that.

  160. Hazard

    Oct 26, 2014, 10:39 #60158

    This club is nowhere near Chelsea. On the level of Tottenham. What a pathetic club this is. No quality anywhere. Average players everywhere. Play the worst football in the league. Arsenal fans are idiots paying the highest ticket prices for this rubbish. No wonder Wenger and his mates get way with it with idiots like you around. No wonder Arsenal is such a rubbish club today.

  161. AMG1

    Oct 26, 2014, 10:37 #60157

    Alexis is superb in all positions. He has all of the attributes to play anywhere across the front, he is a born winner, which makes it all the more strange that he chose to join this club with zero ambition. Watching El Classico last night and I could not fathom why Barca would be willing to let Alexis and Cesc depart, it was like watching Arsenal against any of the top 4 - Outclassed and outmuscled. Alexis and Welbeck are the 2 shining lights this season, I can't see Welbeck going anywhere as he is a guaranteed starter, but how long will Alexis put up with this small time s***?

  162. Westlower

    Oct 26, 2014, 10:20 #60156

    I'll take 2-0 wins all day long. Considering we finished the game with only one first choice defender in the back 4 & it was Sunderland's first home defeat in the PL (Man U & Sours didn't win there) we did enough. Also an impressive stat that AFC have won the last 31 games when leading at half-time. As for the missed opportunities, surely Cazorla will never again have as many bad misses. The return of Walcott in tandem with Sanchez & Welbeck will give us another dimension. Maybe injuries to Gibbs, Debuchy & Koscielny will give Chambers a prolonged run in his preferred position at CB. We ought to win our next two home games against Burnley (2-9) & Anderlecht (1/3). It's a great opportunity to build up confidence & momentum before upcoming Man U & B Dortmund home games & away game at Anfield.

  163. Hiccup

    Oct 26, 2014, 10:03 #60155

    Very negative Kevin. You have to start taking it for what it is. We don't have the manager or tactical nous to swat these teams away with ease. And I think there's enough cr@p in this league that we can probably rely on free hand outs like yesterday. And when they come, if we take them we can't complain. I don't know what you want or expect? A crack at challenging for the title? That just ain't on wenger's kpi. I think we can also rely on our main rival for 4th in Liverpool faltering this season. They have fallen to our level if not below. And because the league is so poor this year, our form of win, draw, draw should be enough to secure 4th. If the teams around us ain't good enough to challenge us, that's not out problem. And now I can see wenger not bolstering in January. Kos will be back, and we'll be back to our full complement of defenders. If 6 defenders is fine to start the season, why shouldn't it be enough to finish the season? Now can you imagine what an achievement finishing 4th with only 6 defenders will be hailed as. It will surpass Chelsea actually winning the thing. And then we will go through another summer of saying if wenger can strengthen the defence we will challenge for the title. And then we all know what follows, just more groundhog dithering.

  164. Website Editor

    Oct 26, 2014, 9:54 #60154

    @mcdowell42 - ahh, sorry. am in rome and watched the game on a stream with a non-english commentary. did not pick that up. think i missed jack's stream of yellows through being diverted by calum chambers picking up his!

  165. KC

    Oct 26, 2014, 9:53 #60153

    We must take positives, so after an away Champions league game on a Wednesday straight into a Saturday a win is good, the opposition came off the back of a drubbing so you know their effort will be at maximum and our squad is threadbare. What frustrates me so much is that if we had two top quality players to replace Flamini and Arteta this formation could be utilised at tough away games thus protecting our back four and providing a base for the offensive players. We can play better as team here's hoping a few wins will provide confidence to do so, at least that's what I'm hoping. Sanchez should demand the others follow his ethic of working off the ball it does create errors and helps break sides down, Barca did it fantastically at their prime.

  166. exiled&dangerous

    Oct 26, 2014, 9:51 #60152

    One more defensive injury and I'll have to dig out my old boots and offer my services....... I'll play for a pie and a pint.

  167. Smithy

    Oct 26, 2014, 9:18 #60151

    I agree with everything so far but would like to add a positive- it seems players were willing to shoot outside the box , long May it continue!

  168. Paddy

    Oct 26, 2014, 8:24 #60150

    Glad you made the point about the missed chances towards the end. Having seen it happen so often in the past I was convinced we were going to be made to pay. Thankfully it wasn't to be, but we have really ridden our luck with results this week. Hopefully we won't need any good fortune next weekend.

  169. mcdowell42

    Oct 26, 2014, 8:09 #60149

    Kevin ,wilshere was suspended yesterday , he got his 5th yellow against hull last weekend.