Once more, without feeling

Online Ed – Home defeat to poor Manchester United side



Once more, without feeling


“If the manager does not have a plan, we keep quiet” – Sir Chips Keswick, Arsenal Chairman, 16th October 2014

"I know that there are players that Steve Bould has recommended to Arsenal that they have not taken" – Ian Wright, 10th November 2014

“Enough’s enough, Wenger out” – A4 flyer distributed at the E******s Stadium, 23rd November 2014

The thing is, the defeat to Manchester United yesterday did not actually bother me particularly. I gave up on Arsenal under Arsène Wenger a long time ago, in my heart of hearts. As I write for what I hope is a cross-section of Arsenal supporters, I attempt to write with reason and fairness, with an element of hope where I can find it, rather than just come out with the pessimism that has developed within me over recent seasons. So in 2013-14, I wrote positively about the team’s results and performances as they topped the table and made a genuine fist of the title challenge for the first two thirds of the season. However, inside, when the predicted collapse came due to the combination of fatigue and injuries (issues that should have been rectified in the January transfer window), I was inwardly phlegmatic. I knew Arsenal would be overhauled, they always are.

Let’s put emotion to one side and look at cold hard facts. In the first leg of a Champions League knockout match against the holders of the trophy, Arsène Wenger started the match with Yaya Sanogo. A player who had started one previous match for the club. To be in that position kind of sums things up. There is a basic lack of football strategy at the club – as indicated by Sir Chips Keswick’s words above. Where is the plan? How can a club of Arsenal’s size end the summer transfer window with six recognized defenders in the first team squad, one of them a relative rookie? And with obvious deficiencies in the centre of the park when the opposition have the ball?

The consequence is the kind of defending we have seen a little too often lately, and cost them two goals (which should have been three but for Di Maria’s late miss) against a very poor Manchester United side.

Arsenal should have undoubtedly been ahead before the visitors scored. There is absolutely no excuse for a player of Jack Wilshere’s ability to have missed his one-on-one in the first half. Danny Welbeck also had a number of chances that a better forward might have converted. Too many shots went straight at David De Gea.

United’s back line was Valencia – McNair – Blackett – Smalling – Shaw/Young. Let’s face it, they were there for the taking. They have not won an away match all season. Arsenal fathomed one gilt-edged chance for all their possession. The rest required decent finishing, which was conspicuous by its absence until Olivier Giroud’s injury time belter. Ultimately though, the Wilshere chance aside, Wenger’s team failed to outwit a very inexperienced defence. Because they played their usual possession football and were easy to defend against. There was not enough variation, in spite of the best efforts of the likes of Alexis and Oxlade-Chamberlain to make things happen.

It was pointed out to me in the build-up to the game how much more effective Arsenal’s English contingent are looking when they play under the tutelage of Roy Hodgson and get some actual coaching and tactics. Arsène Wenger just tells them to express themselves. However, football is a results game. Arsenal have beaten United once in their last 15 meetings, and won four Premier League matches this season, all against teams currently in the bottom seven. One win every calendar month.

This is a one-way street people. The FA Cup win was described to me after the game yesterday as a ‘dead cat bounce’ – a term for an illusory recovery used in the stock market. Arsène Wenger certainly seems to have a minimum of nine lives, having suffered a good number of humiliations that would have seen managers sacked at any other club. Certainly, he enjoyed incredible fortune to win his first trophy after eight barren seasons. If his intelligence outweighed his stubbornness, he should have gone out on a high last May. Instead, the old fool thinks he can prove doubters wrong, in spite of the wealth of evidence that he can no longer cut it in the game today, in terms of building a title-winning team.

My only frustration is that the club do have some very decent players, genuine winners that, harnessed by a better manager, could deliver greater success. But the longer Wenger hangs on, the less the chance they will. We have already seen enough players get fed up of waiting and move on. Will Alexis Sanchez still be at the club in August 2015 if Arsène Wenger still is? Mesut Ozil has already given up, a man that has played under coaches who have some semblance of how to deliver success. The body language of the players isn’t great these days. They know something’s missing and there is not enough experience to sort it out between themselves.

The first United goal was the consequence of a lack of basic communication between the keeper and his defender, which is the stuff of Sunday League. The second was sadly familiar, caught on the break and outnumbered as they pressed forward in gung ho Gunners style, even though there was plenty of time left due to the extended injury breaks that saw Wilshere and Szczesny removed. It was like watching a house of cards.

Giroud’s consolation goal quelled some of the resistance, but the feeling is that it is growing now. The majority of the fans – even at the stadium – want change. Witness the mass evacuation after the second United goal. People were voting with their feet rather than having any hope in a recovery for a Wenger team. Most do not want to make a negative noise inside the stadium when they want to back the team during the match. However, how many more such defeats will people take?

For me, it was over a long time ago. I am hanging on, in purgatory, until the day Wenger finally admits he is not going to prove people wrong. That a manager who can do motivation, organization and in-game tactical changes will do a better job. Until then, it’s Chinese Water Torture. In the end, you just stop feeling it. Does anyone else feel that games against Manchester United really don’t matter anymore? Because let’s face it, there’s rarely anything at stake these days, certainly for Gooners. Things sure ain’t what they used to be, which should mean it’s time to move on.

Is Arsène Wenger the man to turn this malaise around (which ultimately he has created)? Those still suffering from (as ArsenalFanTV’s wonderful Claude put it) ‘Wengeritis’, please step forward and give me some hope here.

I am now on Twitter@KevinWhitcher01.

The current issue of The Gooner can be bought online here. The issue will be on sale outside the stadium for the forthcoming Dortmund home game, and at West Brom away next weekend.

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269
comments

  1. jjetplane

    Nov 25, 2014, 23:53 #62014

    How did the Germans get on anyway JAMIE? Bloody Citeh and their Hoofball hey! See you at the next parade but let's get a proper manager first. What a diamond you are. Truly wasted.

  2. Uchives

    Nov 25, 2014, 20:34 #62001

    @ Jamie....your time is up...and goodbye. @ maguiresbridge gooner,don't listen to his interview...it will make your Arsenal Blood Boil!

  3. JAMIE

    Nov 25, 2014, 19:45 #61994

    Mathew,Did you have the balls to say something positive instead of just following the herd,that could have got you negated.Sometimes I think I'm wasted on here throwing my pearls to swine.

  4. Website Admin

    Nov 25, 2014, 19:17 #61991

    @Mathew, Post 65301 - I honestly can't remember. It has been necessary to delete quite a few in the last couple of days - mainly as a result of people over-stepping the abusiveness line, either to other posters or the manager, or people have taken to posting links to other sites which unfortunately we don't permit to avoid (a) unnecessary spam and (b) putting users computers at risk of dodgy sites.

  5. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 25, 2014, 19:12 #61989

    Unchives, haven't seen it myself but just heard on the radio on the way home that the old fraud has come out fighting at the critism, (his arrogance surprises no one (successful this season? the old fool's delusional and you can bet his flock believe him, you couldn't make it up). One thing we can console ourselves with is the fact he's had to do it (so maybe the nets closing) and his ego has taken a battering.

  6. Bard

    Nov 25, 2014, 18:52 #61984

    Jamie, Im a big fan of your posts mate, they are so surreal as to be almost genius. They remind me of the infamous argument between Ian Botham and Simon Hughes. They were arguing heatedly about who knew more about red wine. Eventually a frustrated Botham grabbed Hughes by the throat and said, how many times did you play for England then? A bewildered Hughes replied whats that got to do with anything. Your posts are a bit like that, but as I said I love them and keep them coming. By the way did you speak to the Dortmund fans in German?

  7. Clockender1

    Nov 25, 2014, 18:32 #61980

    well said Kev. the AKB's below are trying to paint all those that are sick and tired of wengers mistakes, ineptitude, wasting talent, weakness in the transfer market etc and his pitiful excuses - all on a massive salary, as glory hunters are way off the mark. most fans that are now against wenger are those like me n Kevin who were here waaay before even George took over. I'm not wanting wenger out because i want glory - i want wenger out because i want our pride back. every year we stumble 3 or 4 times against lowly opposition, and get humiliated by the top five - 6-0, 6-1, 5-3 or whatever. if you think that not wanting that is seeking glory, then you need to take a long hard look at yourself.

  8. jeff wright

    Nov 25, 2014, 18:23 #61977

    MG, there is without doubt a public and private face put on by ex-players when discussing Wenger .Deja vu the suits and others at the club, it would be interesting to be a fly on the wall at some of the get together's when the big tyrant cat is away and the little mice play.

  9. Gaz

    Nov 25, 2014, 18:18 #61976

    Got to mention that champions league semi final home game against Utd. Possibly the biggest game we've played at the Emirates and we put in such a damp squib of a performance that we were out of the game before I even managed to get into the bleedin ground!...

  10. Damo

    Nov 25, 2014, 18:06 #61975

    Jamie, it concerns me that you represent the face of Arsenal Football Club to these Dortmund fans. You seem content to criticise others without ever actually backing up your pro Wenger posts with anything other than childish retorts. At the end of the day the people on here who want Usmanov in is simply because of the state of the club now and personally i can't see it making things worse. The club is foreign owned already and owned as a majority by someone who doesn't give 2 s**ts about the club so you can forget any sympathy on how we used to be run as we're not too far from the City's and the Chel$ki's of this world, except our owner doesn't pump any money into our club. So Jamie, as other have asked, could you please provide us all with reasons to why there shouldn't be a change at AFC and why Wenger is the right man to take us forward. It might make for a good debate!

  11. Ken

    Nov 25, 2014, 18:00 #61974

    JAMIE- Of course Dortmund fans want Wenger to stay at Arsenal. All our rivals are desperate for him to stay.

  12. JAMIE

    Nov 25, 2014, 17:43 #61970

    Lots of hypocrisy going on here.People reminiscing about the good old days when you got in for a couple of quid,couple of quid everywhere else too.I'm sure the spuds and wham have more right to complain about entrance fees than we do seeing the junk they have to endure.Why are so many on here happy to see Usmanov take over,you can't moan about capitalism in one hand while taking from the ultimate manna man with the other.I was talking to a couple of Dortmund fans today and they were saying as much as they loathe Bayern,they want to see them give Citeh a spanking tonight as in Germany clubs like City,Chelsea and PSG are loathed,when I told them the glory hunting part of our fan base want Arsenal to go down the same route,they were shocked.They even said they would get some anti-wob songs going tomorrow night.

  13. Damo

    Nov 25, 2014, 17:27 #61967

    Ok in 2012, 2 bizarre own goals saw Middlesbrough beat us 3-0 at Highbury effectively handing the title to Manure. Sound familiar? Oh god just remembered relegation fodder Leeds at Highbury and a Harry Kewell wonderstrike that once again handed the title to Manure. I'm starting to question if i'm making these up....

  14. Ron

    Nov 25, 2014, 16:22 #61966

    Bolton 2 Arse 2. The day that the 'collapse baby' was born. 2-0 up and coasting. Arrogance set in. The flicks started, the defenders rocked like twigs in a hurricane. Title chase done effectively.Not a Denny, Bendy, Diaby or Aliady in sight either. The die was cast!

  15. Gaz

    Nov 25, 2014, 16:17 #61965

    Ok, here goes...Sept 2010....at home to the mighty-and of course-exceedingly wealthy...WBA! With 15 mins left we find ourselves 3-0 down! Scored a couple of late goals but by then the damage had more than been done...

  16. Damo

    Nov 25, 2014, 16:13 #61964

    Gaz - i considered suggesting that but then thought it would just be too depressing. But....if we're all in then it could be some sort of morbid Arsenal car crash to add to the fun

  17. Bard

    Nov 25, 2014, 16:05 #61963

    This Barca-lite stuff is beside the point really. What Wenger didnt get is that you could play any system you like, as long as you put Messi up top and Iniesta in midfield you're onto a winner. When Barca were creaming everyone Messi was scoring around 50 goals a season,

  18. Ron

    Nov 25, 2014, 15:54 #61962

    Gaz - Ha. Mate, the clubs abject display airbrushing policy works exceedingly well then? Seriously, its because after every lousy, insipid, toothless performance nothing is ever made of it. I well recall they kept the fans happy after the 8-2 by promising a refund. I've never been sure whether many were ever paid out though. I know of nobody who went who ever had anything. I dont agree with all this refund crap to be honest. There's no g'tee of a win on a ticket and you take yr chances watching Arsenal away to the big Clubs anyway. A thrashing has always been a risk we run and has been for years. The point is, the promise after that seems to have done the trick. Can you imagine the Liverpool or Man City fans response if they were ever caned 8-2 at Utd? The Arsenal fans were just stunned into weak kneed everlasting silence, torn between disgust and loyalty to Wenger .Interesting exercise to list the collapses and surrenders? Start the ball rolling mate. Theyre not all goal glut thrashings either don't forget.

  19. Gaz

    Nov 25, 2014, 15:34 #61961

    What I find incredible is that I'll read a post (as I've just done) and it'll remind me of a truly abject performance from years ago (this time it was Utd away in the Cup). Then I sit back and think of all the other trully abject displays we've suffered over the past 6/7 years and list is quite remarkable! Seriously if we sat here and went through them all we'd get to around 25 and we'd still be finding them!...

  20. Hi Berry

    Nov 25, 2014, 15:30 #61960

    MG - Crisis, what crisis? The only time crisis talks would be held is if Wenger crashed the accounting software.

  21. jeff wright

    Nov 25, 2014, 15:30 #61959

    The big stumbling block for Stan (there is no ' board 'as such ,more like 'the bored ' ) is the 16m left on Wenger's contract .Stan will need to see someting a lot worse than finishing 4th by Wenger before he turns morphs into Alan Sugar and points a finger at Wenger crying 'you're fired' ! It's not going to happen that way because Wenger with his alongside the truly great Chapman's is a part of the history of AFC and a mythology about Wenger has been spun by the past owners and the current one that can't easily be ignored. Personally I think that Wenger will walk if he fails to get a CL place for next season - he's hinted at doing so before when there was calls for his head back in 2012 :"At the moment I am not in the mood to think about the long-term future. We want to do well this season, that's all. I am an Arsenal man. I think I have always shown that. I have to consider if I do well or not. If I don't do well, I have to consider my future," adding, "I have been at the club long enough to have confidence in the people I work with, but I will assess my own performances and then make a decision, at the moment we are not there." Uncannily these comments can apply to right now.

  22. Highbury Boy

    Nov 25, 2014, 15:27 #61958

    In the press conference Wenger says glibly that they had to put Welbeck in the CL 25 man squad when they bought him and took Giroud out. That sounds fair if you think he's coming back in January but by my reckoning we only have 24 in the squad including Welbeck so why did they HAVE to take Giroud out? Perhaps someone can tell me who the 25 are? From the official CL site I can just see 24.

  23. Unchives

    Nov 25, 2014, 15:14 #61957

    @ maguiresbridge gooner, unfortunately I have just watched Wenger's full press conference, he was just as bullish, arrogant and dismissive of all criticisms as ever, even prepared to wager a bet with the journalist that this group of players will be successful this season......4th? he didn't say, even promising to look up the word "Crisis" in the Wenger Dictionary.He also suggested Arsenal people are either IN or OUT, regarding supporting or questioning the club.....I think he really means "THE WENGER CLUB"!

  24. Ron

    Nov 25, 2014, 14:53 #61956

    Tony - Yes mate, his theory on outfield players being interchangeable still persists doesn't it. In his mind, hes Rinus Michels revisited, but imprinting the Dutch total football concept on an unsuspecting PL. The blokes arrogance knows no bounds especially seeing as he thought he cd he cd do it with Bendy and Denny and Co! As Jeff says, you couldn't make it up. "There you go Pep, i didnt need Messi, ive got" Alliadiaire. "As for you Rinus, i didnt need Cruyff, ive got Bendy".

  25. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 25, 2014, 14:31 #61955

    So the old has been is in crisis talks with the club fighting for his job, my god that will be some blow to his ego, there's certainly something going on, could his resignation be imminent? we can only hope and pray it is.

  26. Tony Evans

    Nov 25, 2014, 14:24 #61954

    Ron - I'm with you on your thoughts re Barcelona's style of play under Guardiola influencing Wenger. The trouble is he only bought in to half of it and conveniently forgot to include the high tempo pressing game / resolute defending and top notch keeper. Also, as you say, he tried to imitate them on the cheap, expecting second rate players to emulate the likes Messi, Xavi and Busquets. Throw in to the mix Wenger's absurd notion that any outfield player can be moulded to play virtually anywhere and there you have it the mess that is Arsenal (or should that be Arsene) FC 2007 to date.

  27. Damo

    Nov 25, 2014, 14:19 #61953

    Ron - good times, love it when a trip is remembered by something so ridiculous and i really miss away games but i think it's over for me. I was at the Platt game as well and i recall a couple of 3-0's (mostly Charity Shield games i think) but that's it. i almost go numb when i think about the pantsings they've dished out on us since Lee Sharp's hat trick game in 91?? Too many.

  28. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 25, 2014, 14:13 #61952

    jw, i suppose it's no surprise some of his luvvies have come out in support of him, i'm sure uncle bob is leading the line, with wally close behind, do people like this not realise their doing more harm than good in support of the old has been? like I've already mentioned if more high profilers (especially ex players)would speak out and say what they really think of the old fraud we might not be still in this mess. Take David Seaman for example on goals on Sunday (as much as I enjoyed him) with a perfect opportunity, with his arse parked firmly astride the fence riding it like a horse, with his titting and tatting, grinning, eyes looking up as if he was thinking, and more expressions than Norman Wisdom, not wanting to say the wrong thing, rock the boat or annoy the establishment with any out spoken remarks. If ex players like him would speak out more instead of worrying about their standing maybe something would have been done by now because surely they're as fed up with the beatings and embarrassments over the years as much as the fans and can see what's going on and where the problem lies. I'd love to know what was said between them afterwards off camera, and what the Mersons, Wrights, Mc Clintocks, Adams, Georges, Henry's etc, etc, etc, think and say among themselves.

  29. Ron

    Nov 25, 2014, 14:03 #61951

    Damo - I can recall a 3-0 win one Boxing Day in the late 60s that my Dad took me too v Utd and then the 3-2 at Highbury in 1997 happened i when Platt scored i think and that wan--r Sherringham scored 2 for them and did his tease at the North Bank. We never never pasted Man U in my lifetime mate in a match that meant anything unless theres one ive forgotten? Any offers guys?

  30. Unchives

    Nov 25, 2014, 13:54 #61950

    @ Jamie - I'm one of those die-hard arsenal fans that go back to when it cost a few quid to get in....not £62!So whether the team played well or ****e, it wasnt an issue as it cost nothing compared to now. I have looked at the blogs, videos, listened to the pundits and they all think like the 90% on here (WOB if you like), please enlighten us with all the links you have of all the AKB fan-bases, be it blogs, videos, pundits, or shut-up, get off here and let the real Arsenal Men & Women get on with the job of kick-starting this club again,go help Badarse stroke his cat.

  31. Ron

    Nov 25, 2014, 13:53 #61949

    Damo - i always recall that 4-0 drubbing, not for the game (it was abject surrender wasnt it - they had some half arsed CL to follow on the Wed after as i recall so we knew what would happen really) but as we went in a hired Renault mini bus - 12 seater thing and the large back door window fell out. It was January time, Maybe 4th Round tie? . Bloody freezing. All of us bar the Chewbacca (the driver!) were hypothermic!! About 3 of those guys still do games now and not often either.

  32. Ron

    Nov 25, 2014, 13:40 #61948

    Could be right Bard. 4th? I reckon that PL is so damn poor that they could get 4th without buying anybody at all. To be honest i doubt they will buy. Wenger then has his credibility back with him then in the eyes of his disciples at least, of having stuck to his his principles and doing it despite all of the injuries. And on it goes and on and on and on ......

  33. John F

    Nov 25, 2014, 13:40 #61947

    Comparing the comments of Rodgers and Wenger today.One of them admits mistakes and does not believe his job is safe,the other does not take any blame and claims to have 100% board backing with promises of a strong season ahead.The man is not for turning.

  34. Damo

    Nov 25, 2014, 13:37 #61946

    Ron - yeh that was the one, it was just the most woeful performance and Manure were there for the taking and we bottled it. You've nailed it though Ron, just have a think back to how many there have been at OT (and dare i say E******s) against Utd and that tells you enough. I'm struggling to think of a time when we've given Manure an absolute pantsing at home, even when they've been s***e.

  35. Ron

    Nov 25, 2014, 13:28 #61945

    DAMO - Was that the 4-0 FAC thumping at OT? I went to that. The trouble i have now is there have been so many thumpings up there that theyve all merged into like one bad dream. The loss to Moyes Utd last Season, the body language they showed was telling before they even kicked off. Like they were overawed? Hesitant and scared touches as soon as it kicked off. 5 mins in we just knew it was a bad OT day again!The finger has to be pointed at the Coach as much as the players for being feeble minded surely.

  36. Bard

    Nov 25, 2014, 13:27 #61944

    Ron I would love to believe that there really is a sea change imminent but I don't see it myself. Yes there is a blip ( from the Boards point of view) but I don't see anything happening for a good while yet. The club couldn't care less about what the fans think. If they buy a CB and or a DM they can still make 4th and thats job done. The other relevant question is who might take over and are they available? I see more of the same this season and next. Lets face it bar Chelsea every other top club is rubbish at the moment so the crisis is less critical points wise than it appears.

  37. Jumpers for Goalposts

    Nov 25, 2014, 13:26 #61943

    EXETER - Don't waste any time on JAMIE. I've politely asked him/her several times for his/her reasons for wanting Wenger to stay, and why he/she thinks that Wenger will bring success back to Arsenal. JAMIE has never once answered, but continues to throw childish abuse at anybody he/she doesn't agree with. And don't forget that JAMIE has been caught out before posting wind-up comments under various different user names. Sadly fans like JAMIE are the ones that keep an arrogant, useless manager in his £8million a year job!

  38. JAMIE

    Nov 25, 2014, 13:19 #61942

    If you want Arsenal to become some cheesy Chav/Citeh team then yes get Usmanov in but when Arsenal have completely lost their soul and the ground is full of gits and glory hunters barely selling out like the chavs and city don't start dripping.jjetplane I think you'll find most of the guys on untold have been Arsenal fans for donkeys years and defend and support the team through good and bad,not just the open top bus parades as you and your mates do.

  39. jjetplane

    Nov 25, 2014, 13:18 #61941

    KEN your post should be required reading. Love the working class bit 'cause I am hearing a lot of fake street voices in cyber land. There's always a career in other people's misery.

  40. Ron

    Nov 25, 2014, 13:18 #61940

    JJ - Dare i say it but haven't Westie and Badarse done what's expected of any AW team member? They've both done a runner when under pressure to defend haven't they? Tony - The problems really started once Wenger went public with his 'philosophy' of the way to play about 8 years back. Didn't we just know we were going to get po faced stubbornness from that point?The reality as ive always seen it is that he became beguiled by Barcelona like a kid in toyshop and decided to use Arsenal as his vehicle to emulate it in the PL on the cheap, thus going one better than them and at the same time cocking a snoop at Mourinho and Chelsea whos emergence and game style hes never been able to stomach. In essence his economics of football philosophy was his impetus to forge a playing style, the tactics and expenditure of which it calls for that he s never really understood.

  41. Damo

    Nov 25, 2014, 13:14 #61939

    Avid reader and rarely post but i am one of the many Gooners who no longer goes to games(despite keeping my silver). My last game was spuds at home 09 when Fab scored from halfway line. Final straw was getting told to "sit down and shutup because they were trying to watch the football" when i was trying to get an atmosphere in upper tier. Anyway my point is that one of my last away games was an FA cup game at OT probably back in 08/09 and Manure put a shockingingly bad team out which i believe had O'Shea in midfield and we put in a truly abject display, worse than Saturday's debacle. Wenger has never been able to truly galvanise and motivate a team and that's still true to this day. It's clear the team have no belief so where does that leave us. Problem is i feel as though 4th place will be ours this year and groundhog season once...

  42. Ken

    Nov 25, 2014, 13:11 #61938

    Very disappointing back-tracking this morning by Ian Wright after Sunday's comments, but he's not the only one. Alan Davies spends his entire podcast slagging Wenger's decisions but won't call for a change of manager, ditto one anti-Wenger bloke on the Footballtastically Arsenal podcast who didn't think booing was appropriate behaviour and mocked fans who daubed messages on bedsheets (ironically he also asked where have all the working class fans gone- well they've probably made way for you mate). Months ago John Cross was telling us that the time had come that Wenger couldn't take us any further, yet yesterday he was ridiculing fans calling for Klopp to take over. The hold that Wenger still has over many fans, ex-players and certain media is quite incredible, and we only have Usmanov with his personal agenda to tell it like it is. A couple wins against a Reus-less Dortmund and a gone-off-the-boil West Brom and we'll soon be a minority again.

  43. Tony Evans

    Nov 25, 2014, 13:01 #61937

    Usmanov hits the nail on the head when he says Wenger is letting his principles stand in the way of the club's success. Absolutely spot on - nothing else can explain this never ending cycle of failure in the PL and CL. If Wenger can't win matches his way (sideways tippy tappy, coupled with gung ho defending seems to cover it), instead of adapting and learning, he just continues blindly on, lurching from one disaster to the next. 'We are a little bit naive defensively at the moment' to quote him directly - AT THE MOMENT, my God what about the last 8 or 9 years or so? No wonder most of us have no faith in him whatsoever, but due to the mediocrity of the PL he could well achieve 4th place again and the nightmare continues!

  44. jjetplane

    Nov 25, 2014, 12:52 #61936

    Who seem to forget that many woman (young and old) are gooners as are many kids (even babies!) as we were all once junior gunners of some sort. Maybe Jamie jumped on the bandwagon when Wenger arrived and is now wondering how to get off without too much disgrace. Just follow WESTIE and BADDIE for now and await further instructions. Notice you have stopped mentioning Hoofball all the last few postings ....

  45. Gaz

    Nov 25, 2014, 12:03 #61935

    @maguiresbridge gooner/Ron: Unfortunately there'll be a lot of new fans being born into families led by the likes of Jamie and those other loons over at Untold Arsenal! What a scary thought...

  46. Exeter Gunner

    Nov 25, 2014, 12:01 #61934

    JAMIE - I'll ask again. What are your thoughts on what's going on at the club - Wenger's in game management, his transfer policy, his tactics and so on?. All you're giving us is your opinion on other people's opinions. Surely that can't be all you've got by way of a defence of the status quo? Or is it?

  47. jjetplane

    Nov 25, 2014, 11:58 #61933

    Boring boring Arsenal is now the default. Everything about the club sounds tired and well, overfed. We have it's defenders who presently cannot string one argumentative paragraph together and it is no wonder that the real Arsenal fan (as witnessed on this site) have left the club in droves. I feel a great sympathy for those who have kept going up til now but who now are thinking of throwing it in. I imagine there must be a case for the 'customer' to enforce some grievance procedure against the club. If Tesco can be taken down a peg or two - why can't Arsenal? Just started reading (for my sins) a 900 page tome on the battle of Stalingrad in my 'spare time' so anything Russian will do for me and send the American and his spineless french friend on their way. Looking forward to a mid-table 9th tier game on Saturday and it should be a good one with both teams looking to get up with the 'top four.' At this grade of football there is no question of disputing the commitment on offer. They all do what they can. Would like to reiterate that Wenger (a non-football man) has done more damage to Arsenal than anyone in it's history. The greatest smokescreen was moving to that multiplex of a stadium which looks like a progressive out of town shopping centre. The thing is that is all it is and most of the punters are being watched as many of the punters also collaborate in policing and weeding out the dissenters. A post modern nightmare bang smack in the middle of social deprivation that results in red wine being chucked in Mc-Coliseums. Like the Romans never went away. Baggies - they are a down to earth mob. Watch out! Here's hoping for the Klopp banners on Wednesday. A very unhappy situation and I would be lost without football. Thank **** I found a local club to support again.

  48. David

    Nov 25, 2014, 11:57 #61932

    @Jamie - you can't tar everyone with the same brush - most Arsenal fans probably want Wenger to go, but aren't irrational about it, and don't do the moronic stuff you describe. Wenger lost his mojo years ago. What he's achieved isn't bad since the glory days, but it falls a long way short of expectations. But now it looks like AW can no longer inspire his players to achieve the bare minimum. It might get a lot worse this season. So how do you explain your contempt for fans who think it's best for AW to go? And how does your contempt make you any different from the morons you describe?

  49. Ron

    Nov 25, 2014, 11:41 #61931

    There are the odd grains of sense and truth in what Ian Wright says at times but by and large he imagines himself to be the appointee and voice of the common man fan. Talk a load of boll---s 90% of the time and wearing glasses hasn't created a more cerebral impression either. Theres always an element in what he says that betrays him feeling slighted by Wenger way back, same as with Mr Merson. Neither were, but they're never going to accept that.

  50. JAMIE

    Nov 25, 2014, 11:33 #61930

    What a big bunch of girls the wob's are, crying like babies because they're not getting their own way,boo hoo hoo.Listening to Talksport yesterday one Wenger hater was seen in tears because he was told by a nasty akb where to put his Wenger out flag.He'd probably got his mum to make it for him and the precious little soul just couldn't take a first home defeat for over a year.Another precious little wob darling was seen crying and ripping up his season ticket,oh my heart really bleeds for these poor little glory hunters.

  51. Mathew

    Nov 25, 2014, 11:25 #61929

    Admin, why did you delete my previous post ? I didnt abuse anyone and always complied with the general rules ?

  52. jeff wright

    Nov 25, 2014, 11:06 #61928

    Rumpole ,I was commenting on his article in today's Sun in which he blames the players for Wenger's embarrassing sorry defeats ,such as the 6-0 to Mourinho who had called him a specialist in failure prior to that game. Not that Wright was claiming that Wenger should stay. Wright blames the players for bottling games,I think they are just being out played by better organized sides ,despite what the possession stats say. Possession without goals is meaningless. It's like sex without a climax, I rest my case.

  53. Ron

    Nov 25, 2014, 10:48 #61927

    As much as Usmanov isnt on the Board, his words amount to an enormous change in the temperature for AW now. His words are ominous even though hes trying to score points and sound like the 'fans man'. For the first time now it really does look like the nets closing on Arsene W. Its cheap tabloid talk too in that there's supposedly meetings between the Club and Wenger at London Colney. As with Usmanov, the fact of the press now speculating on this and throwing names into the hat are as ominous.The issue is whether the Club and Wenger come out and say that hes leaving in May 'by mutual consent' which is likely or whether Wenger just walks now, which is very unlikely, though i wouldn't say its impossible.

  54. Rumpole

    Nov 25, 2014, 10:27 #61926

    As a matter of fact Ian Wright said on Talksport on Sunday night that it's time for Wenger to go.

  55. jeff wright

    Nov 25, 2014, 10:23 #61925

    After Usmanov's blast at Wenger for his inept management that he is not happy with the Wenger supporters are predictably rushing to defend him. First out of the traps is Ian Wright, who claims that it is all the fault of the players that Wenger has signed. He goes to say that Vieria and Henry , etc, would never have bottled it like the current cowardly lot did when they were thrahed 6-0 at the bridge of sighs. , Me and the other lads would have rammed Mourinho's taunts abourt Arsene being a specialist in failue back down his throat roars Wrighty ! I believe him, but there is a big flaw in all of this ,apart from Sanchez there is not one player in the current squad that would have got into any of the sides that Wenger won titles and doubles with. Another factor is that the football that Wenger employed back then was more pragmatic than the tipy - tappy Barca Lite fluff of today. These garden gnome midfield players that tip tap in the footprints of the past giants are not built for attrition and our defenders are left exposed like frightened rabbits caught in the headlights of on coming traffic by the lack of cover provided by the midfield . Wenger is to blame for his own current predicament and not the players who are being asked to play a type of football in the Prem that they are not capable of doing . A new manager ,new players and different tactics are required to get the club performing where its status and finances deserve . Wenger is past it , he looks as Usmanov said old and tired he should have done the decent thing and retired in good grace and goodwill after wining his last trophy, the FAC that is, not the sham one. Instead though due to a combination of a chronic lack of self awareness ,greed and arrogance, he stayed on for another unlikely tilt at his holy grail . It's a shame that it has all come to this but not really so surprising because the signs that it would all end in tears for Arsene have been there for donkeys years.

  56. JollyJumper

    Nov 25, 2014, 3:09 #61924

    Kevin and others, Good reading. I did not post for a long time as the ONLY news I am looking for since 2008 is ... "Wenger was sacked". Wishful thinkings! So in order not to sound like the general after the battle, feel free to read my post No. 1096 from 2011 in extenso (with minor editing). Valid in 2008, 2011 and 2014/15. In the meantime, Kevin was writing the same things even before. Have a good time if you have a stomach to remind yourself that Wenger should have been sacked in 2007/2008, i.e. 6-7 years ago. Poor Arsenal FC! Quote: Post No. 1096, 13.01.2011, 10:17am (Suffering in Suffolk by Kevin Whitcher) Excellent editorial Kevin, as usual. ARSENAL vs Leeds = 22 places below, vs Ipswich = 36 places below, NO Kidding !! I have been an Arsenal fan since 1971 and FA Cup Final (remember Charlie George's Wembley winner?) and I wish our Club only the best. I shall support the Club but not the individuals who are harming its reputation and its future – owners, manager, players. 1. The Board and the owners are concerned only by the financial results, leaving the results on the pitch as secondary. After five years without trophy, in any other club with a real owner, the real boss, the Manager would be out long time ago. The football activity is there to provide the cash for the owners and the real estate became very important. Naively, I thought that the owners and the Board members were there to set the strategies, bring in fresh investments and disagree with the Manager when the trophies are lacking. 2. Arsène Wenger in the past did great things for our Club – trophies, financial stability, E***ates, Training Centre – but now it's over! Academy = No end product, exception being young lad Jack Wilshere. Our youngsters go to other clubs in England and Europe. Too much investment for a poor result while A.Wenger is buying second or third rated players in France and Europe!? The outcome must improve dramatically. For many years A.Wenger's buying policy was a disaster. He is reluctant to buy when needed, he is stubborn and often miss the opportunities (long list). A.Wenger is keeping loony and inadequate players and give them new, improved contracts. Then he makes them play out of their best-suited positions. His substitutions tactics are difficult to understand and the mechanical pattern of substitutions around 70min is appalling. On these last topics, all have been already said and written repeatedly by many not so blind Gooners. Our captain Cesc Fabregas stated openly for the media that the team has been sometimes scarred psychologically!? What, an ARSENAL captain? Yes, just like Tony Adams when he was the Captain. NO kidding!! But who is responsible for the mental fitness of the team? Well, the manager is at the helm of the team. Finally, the mismanagement i.e. finishing second in the Champions League easy group is a professional mistake. A.Wenger must be mad to prefer Real and Barcelona instead of some Italian or French team. 3. Since David Dein's departure, ARSENAL FC has no real influence, no clout at FA, Premiership, with referees, compared to MU and Chelsea. Alex Ferguson has 24 years of lobbing experience and probably has a half of the referees in his pocket if not on his payroll. He is continuously bulling FA, referees and media when needed. Chelsea owner Roman Abramovich has billions and probably uses them … when needed. Watch out on M.City when their owner Sheikh Mansour picks up the rules quickly. Just screen penalties/red cards outcomes MU/ Chelsea get vs ARSENAL. Gary Neville = no penalty, no red card. Dimitar Berbatov = dive, no yellow card + penalty given. At the same time, referees denied ARSENAL three clear penalties vs Wigan, Birmingham and M.City. What a difference in the long run over the Premiership seasons. B.Cullen is right: the titles are so often decided on very small margins. In England and especially in Europe, we are not any more the big, top team with a clout. 4. In the meantime, ARSENAL fans are paying the most expensive tickets in the Premiership, may be in the world (any clues?), while being patient, knowledgeable, passionate and loyal. I am asking myself, why on earth I have to be so frustrated during every match watching the set pieces against our team? 5. Proposals - Make the owners and the Board get going for the better football future of our Club. - Ship out these lazy, idle, overpaid, indolent players out of the Club. Who? Already written repeatedly. - Improve the integration of the young players from the Academy. Buy top players only. - Watch/monitor FA, Premiership and referees decisions concerning ARSENAL, MU, Chelsea and in the future M.City. - To demonstrate the above, post tables, photos, videos on Internet, blogs, YouTube, etc. Keep the pressure in order to get the fair and equal treatment for ARSENAL and combat the favouritism of other teams. - Time is out for Monsieur Arsène Wenger, so called 'the best manager of the last decade' who manages "…the best team ever…", according to his own words. Wenger OUT!! - Bring in Mr ... insert any name. Come on ARSENAL !! Come on Gooner and Online Gooner!! Unquote.

  57. Ozzie

    Nov 25, 2014, 2:21 #61923

    Hi Ron, thanks for that. I still sit up all hours watching but have lost that childlike glee that I used to have, not necessarily in anticipation of a win but of being aligned to a grass roots club, a real football team - not an aloof business. What the club now has become is an insult to it's very soul - it's story - much of which consists of it's old bands of followers. We don't need people preaching to us about a changing world - we know all that already and that doesn't take away our dismay of what we are witnessing as a slow demise to a historic, proud institution and our feeling of impotence in the face of this. Presently it seems a waste of mental energy dissecting every game when we know already what the problem is. Cheers Bob, the one post mortem that is needed is not about the game but the departure of a certain parasite(s)

  58. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 24, 2014, 23:43 #61922

    The AKB's must be really pissed with their messiah these days/weeks giving them nothing to crow about and try and defend him with, and giving the WOB's even more ammunition to use (not that they need it) they must really feel let down by him after all this devotion and support, it must be like a wake at Central command all sitting around staring at each other in silence, with the odd sniffle into a hankie now and again, waiting and waiting for him to give them another opportunity no matter how small to think everything's rosy in the garden again so they can pop their head back above the parapet (or pulpit if you like) and start spreading the scripture again. But no need to worry we have the mighty brom on Saturday which should give them the opportunity although i doubt it will be for long.

  59. jeff wright

    Nov 24, 2014, 22:37 #61921

    Hey let's face it lee KFC ,you just believe that whatever Arsene says must be true . Anyway here are a few things that he did say,I have added my own tonque in cheek comments to the messiahs Monty Python type views on all and sundry... ................. On José Mourinho, (November 2005 "When you give success to stupid people, it makes them more stupid sometimes and not more intelligent." Hmm,just as well you are a clever man then Arsene. (On sleeping in beds.)No matter how much money you earn, you can only eat three meals a day and sleep in one bed. ( 1989) Hmm, . It depends though on whose bed it is non >? On Paul Scholes, (August 2010) "We were considering him (Ruud van Nistelrooy) and Francis Jeffers and, in the end, we went for Jeffers" Hmm,an inspired choice old jug ears ,well done Arsene ! "We do not buy superstars. We make them." (2007) Hmm , where the **** are they all then ? Detailing his philosophy, (2007) "When you're dealing with someone who only has a pair of underpants on, if you take his underpants off, he has nothing left - he's naked. " Hmm, no comment. "On suffering ( 20011) In my job, you expect to suffer. That's why when I go to hell one day, it will be less painful for me than you, because I'm used to suffering." Hmm, believe it or not Arsene but there are many of others suffering watching your teams performances . Does anyone have a spare handcart ? (6 February 2004) "My job is to give people who work hard all week something to enjoy on Saturdays and Wednesdays." Hmm, well it didn't quite work out on Saturday this,but there is still Wednesday to come. Good old Arsene.

  60. Bard

    Nov 24, 2014, 21:48 #61920

    Have enjoyed some of the posts but some have been watching too much X factor. If you've followed Arsenal pre Wenger as I have you will have been through all kinds of crap. This is football. Reading some of these posts, Brixham in Devon comes to mind, you would think it was the end of civilisation. Get a grip. Whats different from last year or the year before or the year before that, nothing but confirmation that Wenger is not up to the job. Why is it now such a shock. I've posted before nothing will change in the short term and maybe not in the long run. This is where we are unless we have a change of owner. Losing to Untd is neither here nor there in the grand scheme of things.

  61. Dartford gooner

    Nov 24, 2014, 21:44 #61919

    I don't hate Wenger or wish him any harm, I think some of the comments have gone to far, but he must go and must go soon. He takes no blame for anything, he can't see that its his fault for the mess we are in.How can a man that clever be so blinkered. What worries me is that he will have a massive say who takes his place and I shudder to think who we will end up with. Its got to be a clean break and he must not go upstairs. Stan must be laughing his head off, he can't lose , no matter how bad it gets he knows he can sell at a massive profit when ever he wants. How did it all come to this?

  62. Rob from Brixham, Devon

    Nov 24, 2014, 21:10 #61918

    I find it incredible that I am even writing this. I have been emotionally raped by proceedings at Arsenal these last years. Not a sudden rape, more of a slow, deep, loving rape. I have had my inner soul interfered with and now it lies broken and cast aside, unwanted. I need to be loved again, not treating as a customer of a business, a cash cow. I used to take pride in spending shed loads of my hard earned money on all manner of club merchandise, even memberships that I know will never make available a decent seat at a decent match or even one for a sensible price to take my lad. How things have fallen for us Arsenal faithful. Priced out of our own club by American money men milking our loyalty and bleeding us dry. I paid up for years following blindly like hundreds of thousands believing things would return to a former glory where innovation and guile would be decisive. Like playing Wiltord as a lone left winger in a bizarre strikerless formation away to Allardyces Bolton on the 29th April 2002 on our way to the title. I remember that game for the unique tactical approach taken by our Manager that evening. "He is a great Manager", I thought, he has out thought his opponent and HE made the difference. HE made it happen and HIM alone. Oh how I lament for those lost days and now we live in a wilderness. We have been spoiled and wont forget it for we have been loyal, patient, waited at the table for our just desserts to be served up. And now we have it. We waited so long the chef forgot the recipe. He cannot produce like he used to. There have been so many mistakes, so many resounding gaffs that we now tuck in each week hoping the chef will remember next time what it was that made it mouth-watering. We now have commentators everywhere in our ranks who all think they know better, they could do better with the resources. I used to think that Arsene was special, really special and that we were so lucky to have him. We have had some great times. But then I had some great times with my ex-wife. I cannot impact change for who the hell am I? I am the bloke who pays for 8 Red Memberships per year so that my gang can enjoy the 500 mile round trip because to me it is my simple pleasure. Well not any more. I will give nothing else, its the only thing I can do. To do nothing. I feel very sorry for you ST holders who will never get a ST again if you let it go. But I just cant take it any more. It feels like we don't have a Manager when you see what that lot down the road are doing. The thing I don't understand is hes done it all before. There must be something going on that I don't know about or understand. He is a very intelligent man. But he is now increasingly perceived as stubborn, rigid, blinkered. How do you reach the top then become like that? Someone please tell me. I can no longer care about the results of AFC. See what you've done to me?

  63. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 24, 2014, 21:00 #61917

    Gaz, i know exactly where your coming from mate, i have a fifteen year old son who obviously like your lass has been a gooner since birth and still as keen as ever and wanted a new shirt every season, and yes right or wrong I've always bought him one purely because you don't want your son or daughter to be the only one at football or at school without one. Now just like your girl it's waning and waning big time as this season he didn't want one, when asked why? he said i couldn't be bothered. So there you are then as Ron says that's the future Arsenal fans, and that's what they're thinking and feeling (and do Arsenal give a fook?) And that's sad, and sad for parents like ourselves, who've been life long supporters ourselves to have our sons and daughters thinking that. And there's one person who i blame for that arsene wenger, and that's another thing that he'll be remembered for and never ever be forgiven for.

  64. Lee afc

    Nov 24, 2014, 20:56 #61916

    Hey "always" I predict that if we win the manager wont get any recognition. If we lose it's his fault, if it rains it's his fault, if the tube is late it's his fault, if the beer is warm it's his fault, if the linesman gives offside it's his fault and if we qualify from the group stage, we must be lucky.

  65. walkinginawengerwilderness

    Nov 24, 2014, 20:55 #61915

    Still, at least good ole Arseblog generally remains positive. I read his words the other day that when he says "we" he means wenger. Bonus. What is the point of retaining critical faculties, though, when there are vast amounts of dosh to be made via AFC. Bit like wenger really. I will continue to prefer Online Gooner for my take on things.

  66. Kube

    Nov 24, 2014, 20:43 #61914

    Anyone seen Westlower? Hope he/she hasn't hurt themself after coming to terms with reality. Fans going to Wednesday's game should sing/cheer/put up SOS banners telling Klopp he's NEEDED at the Emirates next summer!!

  67. jeff wright

    Nov 24, 2014, 20:17 #61913

    1st 2.71%, this is the percentage of posters on here who think we will finish 1st in the Prem. lee KFC is one of them. Chelsea are 1-6 to win it. We are 66-1 . United are 33-1 and Southampton 50-1. So the bookies even think Southampton have more chance than we do. Other predictions we have had on here from AKB's ,such as Pete,Mike and whatever are Costa will flop and Chelsea shortly implode. Against such predictions as these I can live with my odd wrong ones about the now long gone and who gives a toss anyway world cup - and I never did say that Wenger would never win another trophy,in fact I suggested that he had a chance of winning the FAC last season. I did say though that he would never win the Prem again, or the European Cup , a trophy that has proven to be beyond his abilities to win . I stick with those views. So , er, lee KFC (?),what is your prediction for the Dortmund game then> ?

  68. Nick Gooner

    Nov 24, 2014, 20:16 #61912

    I have never really been one for posting on sites but I must admit I have been impressed, heartened, and saddened by the quality of contributions, in particular respect to Rocky RIP, Ron, and Maguire's bridge Goober. When I used to bunk school to get into Highbury ( always excited and far too early - best memory was Sammy nelson doing a moonie to the North bank I think against Coventry in the cup ), the focus was the Arsenal and all that entailed. It was never about winning titles, the standard of half time cuisine (pjgged out on toffee apples and peanuts before the match), or a pig arrogant manager. Although I did once write to George Graham about our **** midfield. That grew over the years to include a dodgy Turkish cafe on the Black stock road where you ran the diarrhoea gauntlet, the Arsenal Tavern, The Twelve Pins, stealing food on cross channel ferries and visiting police stations to locate missing mates. It was all Arsenal and I loved it! This no longer exists and the destructive reign of a totalitarian dictator has managed to infiltrate all these memories and eventually replace them with immense resentment at paying a grand a year to be more pissed off with the ****e stadium, prima Donna players, ****ing expensive food and drink, money grabbing board, and the most arrogant manager in football than the liberties taken by opposing players and supporters. My Arsenal has been stolen and hijacked. There was never the amount of aggression showed between gooners because of their support or criticism of the manager as there is now. Maybe the conflict surrounding Wenger is indicative of a greater conflict regarding the nature of the current fan base of Arsenal. The soul of the club and the works ng class history of the fan base has been systematically eradicated. There was a time when disagreements were rapidly resolved with a bark, an occasional slap and a pint to make up afterwards. This is not fluffy nostalgia, there were rules of engagement that people from a similiar social grouping understood. Unfortunately the gentrification and globalisation of AFC has ****ed that up and thus provided a platform for the like of Jamie and Peter Pan to remain in the debate. You are an irritation but I respect your right to air your view. Please respect my right to retort 'you sound like a mug' shut up and go home to bed. Apologies for spelling mistakes. Fat fingers and small screen.

  69. jeff wright

    Nov 24, 2014, 19:26 #61911

    Trust me MG on panto Peter he is a fanatical AKB who no way wants Wenger out ,he worships him! Apart from every other manager and his dog Usmanov also has Wenger sussed out. He made a telling comment about Wenger getting older and not being as sharp as he once was. He also rubbished the current side that Wenger has cobbled together on coat buttons,never mind the Ozil and Sanchez fees ,these were paid for by selling players and not replacing them for years, the fact is as Usmanov says the side needs a massive investment in it to allow us to compete at top level. That means doing better than 4th in the Prem and always going home early in the first KO round of the CL. This season we are struggling to get out of the group despite us having been seeded under the old gerrymandered system in an easy group. Usmanov was having a laugh though telling Wenger to admit he has made mistakes,there is more chance of the Pope becoming a Mmuslim convert than that ever happening!

  70. Ron

    Nov 24, 2014, 19:18 #61910

    Good stuff Jason. Gold menberships are a chain around the neck in my view. Make you feel obliged to go when you dont want to. Silver is by far is the better status. The added extras such as they are off the Gold are no great loss in the greater scheme of things.

  71. Lee afc

    Nov 24, 2014, 19:09 #61909

    "pellegrini is Spanish" .........."badarse is a liar"........."Germany wont win the world cup"......"arsene wenger will never win another trophy (2011)......ignorance is bliss eh Jeff "always" right....

  72. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 24, 2014, 18:58 #61908

    jw, (oh no he's not he's over there) LVG knows what wengers all about alright (just like all the other managers in the prem and futhur afield) it didn't take him long did it, he's only been in the job for five minutes but that's all it takes to work this tactic less old has been out.

  73. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 24, 2014, 18:14 #61907

    Exeter Gooner, i read those Arteta comments earlier, we now know why he's such a wenger favourite, boy the old fraud has him well trained.

  74. Hiccup

    Nov 24, 2014, 18:05 #61906

    Arsenal v United, always been a massive game that got the fans up for it with nervous excitement. Now just a run of the mill game up there with Saturday's game at West Brom. No one too bothered about it all pre game, and everyone numb to that gutted feeling of defeat one would have felt in the past. And even fans are getting bored of hoping Liverpool or spurs get beat so we can seal 4th. Who really gives a sh!t anymore? I don't know whether to laugh or cry for those that now see going to watch arsenal as just being an expensive chore. At least on the box you can switch to a different comedy channel to watch Dads Army when the keystone cop antics at the back starts to get a bit too repetitive. So on to Wednesday, and my prediction is the place will be like a morgue bar the Germans partying, freezing temperatures, so a good tippy tappy performance to warm the cockles. And if we don't lose, more drivel from wenger. Oh the excitement of it all.

  75. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 24, 2014, 17:58 #61905

    Bob, good shout, and there won't be one from me either, he doesn't deserve any, he's had more than 60,000,000 tributes and that's way way to many for an old past manager. I'll save what I have to say until the day comes but a party will be the order of the day.

  76. jjetplane

    Nov 24, 2014, 17:57 #61904

    Wrighty laughing his balls off as the news came on late so Morgan could finish his slag-off of Wenger. They then got 100s of tweets saying 'Piers is a right .... but I agree with everything he just said.' Amazing that it is Rodgers getting all the flack and though I could not give a toss, at least the bloke owns up to the shortcomings. Klopp is having a hell of a time in the league and now would be the perfect moment to sign him up on wednesday night after the 'game.' He still has a record over the last 5 years that pisses all over the aging economist. WEsTIE come on back mate. It's alight - you're a WOB now ...

  77. jeff wright

    Nov 24, 2014, 17:13 #61903

    Hi Ron, my prediction is just based on optimism!I have little interest in the so called Champions league so I might as well go for a win as a defeat.I'm on a bad losing streak though tipping Wenger to win games . Regarding the CL blame this Wenger obsession with the gerrymandered midweek TV show for most of the problems that we have suffered down to it. I have long believed that Wenger builds his squads to try and win the European Cup because he himself has said on more than one occasion that winning the cup is his main aim , the small physically tippy- tappy sides that he fields in the Prem always come up short though and in Europe as well due to Wenger's brain-dead lack of tactical nous . However,with his considerable advantage financially ,our wage bill is Chelsea size, over most of the other sides in the Prem he takes qualification for a shoo-in and looking at the league again this season he will more than likely get 4th spot .Liverpool are going backwards without Suarez and Rodger's, like Wenger himself is struggling big time. I can only see Liverpool being a threat to the Wenger 4th trophy , but as was the case with United last term Liverpool are imploding and helping Wenger out. Had they won yesterday the pressure on Wenger for Saturday's game would be even worse,but again Wenger appears to have a charmed life regarding the 4th place finish. I make United favs for third spot . Tbh, I would take not finishing 4th if it meant getting shut of Wenger and the horrible Silent Stan regime. In fact with a manager in place with ambitions other than making money and an owner backing him to try and compete for trophies my interest in going to games would return ,as it is my money is staying in my pocket,I prefer it there to being in Stan and Wenger's rather deep ones.

  78. Jason

    Nov 24, 2014, 17:13 #61902

    Ron, I agree with you with regards some fans wanting to keep Wenger as manager due to sentiment, but not the board, ie Kroenke. You don't get as rich as him by showing sentiment. Kroenke keeps Wenger for one reason alone, money. He has no interest whatsoever in success on the pitch as long as the money keeps rolling in. The only way he would get rid of Wenger is if he suffered financially. I am not a season ticket holder but have 2 silver memberships, but I do have a question for any of you season ticket holders out there. Would you re-new if you could fall back as a silver member?? This is the reason I believe so many continue to re-new.

  79. Ron

    Nov 24, 2014, 16:57 #61901

    Hi Gaz. Its the future personified in your young lass who the Club are fools to alienate, yet they do and dont seems to care. Im no loss to them really as id been winding down for a few years before i jacked in going (and the ST) regularly back in 09/10.The feeling of non enjoyment had been with me and a few others of the old crew ive always gone with from about 2008. My long standing friends who went for years to Highbury with me packed it in in the 2nd season after the move. One or two still renew and just give the seat to their Sons/Daughters or sell the seat to various supporters Clubs who are always on the cadge for spare seats, plus they do a few away games here and there. Its via them how i get to the odd away game that i do. The renewals are dwindling badly now though. What state for a Club to get into, though that membership system they run is so corrupted. Really is. I still get offered a ST, albeit one up near the back rows of the very top tiers that i wouldn't give them a tenner for and ive only held a red for 4 years? Hows that happening? Others i know have accumulated numerous ST s, 3 or 4 of them yet have hardly held Silvers for a few years? Its the renewals though that keeps things as they are at the Club isnt it. Another old pal of mine put a bet on (after a few drinks admittedly) with another guy that was waged in 2006 that we d never win the title under Wenger again. Its a £300 quid bet and most of us sniggered at him for doing it back then, but alls fair to him as hes never rated Arsene W. Hes laughing now and never ceases to keep reminding everybody! All good friendly stuff though. Youre right though when you say its ominous when people like yr mate turn how they have. Its not just being mardy arsed either why he or any of us have gone that way. Its just the utter feeling of futility, waste of money for what you see and disillusionment. Not just with AFC but the game in general in fairness to AFC. They're not entirely to blame it has to be said. Ive often recounted as a kid how i was close to being an Orient fan but followed my Dad to be a Gunner. Im not sure id be so inclined now if i was the same 6/7 year old kid facing the same choice, seeing what the Arsenal have become today.

  80. Danny

    Nov 24, 2014, 16:55 #61900

    Guys something tells me Arsenal will beat Dortmund and all will be well again in Arsenal land! the FANS should be shouting for his head and see the bigger picture as Wenger is clueless.

  81. Gaz

    Nov 24, 2014, 16:25 #61899

    @Ron: In all honesty I gave up 18 months ago and have had to almost force myself to show any real interest in games since then. Saturday was the final nail for me though as I simply didn't enjoy any part of the day whatsoever. Decided there and then that I won't go to another game until Wenger is gone. What makes it kind of complicated though is the fact my 16y/o daughter is a big fan and I've tried to involve myself in games to keep her happy. Sadly even she's losing interest now and apparently after the second goal went in on saturday she simply turned off of the TV and trudged upstairs in a right old mood! I'll tell you somethimng else too. I've a mate who's a real 100% fan-ST holder for years and all that-and he's as optimistic as they come. He's now turned against Wenger and if he has the end game is just around the corner...

  82. Ron

    Nov 24, 2014, 16:12 #61898

    HI Jeff - I wdt be so sure of that Dortmund prediction if i was you mate. Even if youre right, its a sobering and chilling thought to even start to think what some of those teams waiting (and no doubt wanting to play Arsenal) will do to them in the next stage. Like you, ive little interest in it (CL) either though.

  83. Kerryman Gooner

    Nov 24, 2014, 16:08 #61897

    A lot of unhappy people on here. Wenger has ruined a great reputation by overstaying his welcome. Still, the board do not care once the cash comes in. Wenger will stay, invoking how he must honour his contract. Reality seems he likes the huge money. Surely he must doubt himself now. I predict the board will do nothing. Atmosphere in the ground must be awful.

  84. Charlie George Orwell

    Nov 24, 2014, 16:05 #61896

    I wonder what are Arteta's thoughts of the Anderlecht away match?

  85. Ron

    Nov 24, 2014, 15:46 #61895

    Highbury Boy - Yes, the irony of all that you say. The runt Wilshere sould go to bed and kneel at its foot tonight and all week thanking whoever is above us all that hes still in one piece. He did his short arsed, hard guy, little man syndrome ridden gob shi-te act to a decent and genial player in Fellaini. I wonder if he realises how absolutely stupid he looked standing on his toes to try and fail and get the top of his thick head as far as Fellainis chin? I doubt it even registers with him how daft he looked. Its a pity Fellaini didnt just punch his mouth in, head butt him and then knock him out in my view. What a total t--t he is.

  86. kilkenny cat

    Nov 24, 2014, 15:23 #61894

    Arteta has said the manure result was 'not fair' well for once against this mob it was. No bullying,no intimidation,no diving by their number 10. It was down to poor finishing and lack of ideas. Simple as that.

  87. Ken

    Nov 24, 2014, 15:22 #61893

    Highbury Boy- Nail on head mate. Don't know who I hate more now, Wenger or the many thousands of Tarquins at the soulless bowl who keep him in his £8m a year job. Fans will continue to argue and fall out over him for decades, that will be his most lasting legacy.

  88. jeff wright

    Nov 24, 2014, 15:21 #61892

    There are a few supporters still living in Wenger Dreamland and like Peter pan, the forum pantomime clown, they give themselves away when pretending to 'being reasonable'. Peter pan says that I am anti-Wenger, now who would have thought that!*! you couldn't make it up.Yes Peter,aka lee KFC ,TH14, well spotted ,I will have to plead guilty to that charge . This does though show where these deluded AKB's are coming from ,they think that it is WRONG to be anti-Wenger and they can get very angry and nasty when confronted with anyone who dares not to share their own subservient views on Arsene .... Arteta says the sort of things that they want to hear, wallowing in self pity , he talks of it not being 'fair' to the players losing to United,as though by them having lots of possession and failing to make it tell,plus making expensive defensive errors, is something new. Arteta is 'shocked and disappointed' by the undeserved result. Now come on please,this is football , these things happen all the time . Sometimes we have been the side that ' nicked it' as RVP once put it after somehow we beat a team that had outplayed us. Now if our performance were, as some are trying to claim , a one off, then we could just move on and forget it,but unfortunately the missing chances and crappy defending is endemic in the current side due to Wenger's coaching and lack of any tactical nous. LVG knew what Wenger was going to do and set out to try and defend against the tippy- tappy gung-ho attacks and hit us on the break. It was not rocket science but it was good enough to win the 3 points. You make your own luck in football and there was nothing unlucky about Wilshere and Welbeck's misses in front of goal .You can argue that the first goal was unlucky,although it came about due to our usual Keystone Cops defending, but even allowing for that,it is only ONE goal . Then it TWO after more tippy tappy gungho went pearshaped leaing our defence with just on player in our half as De Maria sprinted forward to pass the ball across field to Rooney who said than's very much, De Maria and Rooney were both in their own half when they started the move that led to the 2nd goal. This was just yet more Keystone Cops defending that again had nothing to do with luck at all. In fact United then got in on the missing chances act with De Maria missing a sitter that was easier than the one that Jack missed. So according to the luck theory United were unlucky not to be 3-0 up. Of course though in Arteta dreamland it's only bad luck when these things happen to us. The good news is he is tipping us to beat Dortmund to start us of on a good run,so I will trust him and back him to do this ,which is more than some of the AKB will do. I'm going for 2-1 to us Dortmund are no world beaters and it's time to stop the rot by beating them. them. Of course I could be wrong,but we can only live in hope . I must add though that I'm no big fan of the Champions League and am not really that fussed about it as we have no hope on winning the thing. Saturday's high-noon showdown at West Brum is of more interest to me .As I predicted a couple of weeks back the games that looked easy earlier in the season now all look a little tougher. C' est la vie!

  89. johnnyhawleyloveinggooner

    Nov 24, 2014, 14:50 #61891

    Someone told me it is our worst start at homer since1983-wonder what the board did about that way back when eh? So boldy's mates are now starting to let it be known he is not been listened to.all we need now is some player power and the senior pros start picking the team and tactics.if it goes badly midweek it could be the end.I think the board give terryneil the fa cup to turn things round then changed their mind on the way home.the problem iswhat role for the manager if moved upstairs as he can't be sacked.how about the Kolman at south Hampton as someone ruthless and ambitious enough to take a risk on? '

  90. Highbury Boy

    Nov 24, 2014, 14:40 #61890

    It's said that 'people get the government they deserve" and we Arsenal supporters get the manager we deserve. At the Manu game the fans sang out loud for Jack after he missed that great chance and sang out even louder for him when he stuck his head into Fellaini. When their 2nd goal went in hundreds immediately left and at the final whistle when the players went to the crowd they were clapped by the remaining Arsenal fans. There was no booing,just a mixture of bemusement at losing a game we dominated and disappointment at losing to a very poor Manu side. Past managers like Billy Wright,Terry Neill, Bertie Mee and George Graham never enjoyed the luxury of such an apathetic crowd.

  91. chris dee

    Nov 24, 2014, 14:27 #61889

    Have a look at the Guardian and read what Usimov says. He reafirms what most people in these postings are saying. So you see we are not all stupid whingers who should be happy with our lot.

  92. Ron

    Nov 24, 2014, 14:06 #61888

    Staplehurst - there are indeed those who shout fool and fraud yet ive never seen an expression of 'hate' on here and wouldn't expect to. The point you mention re appointment capacity has been made and its a good one. In practice they only need to 'approve'. They wont do the finding. Others do that.

  93. Red Member

    Nov 24, 2014, 13:59 #61887

    @staplegurst gooner - why did he sign a new contract then? he deserves all the criticism coming to him. I want to see the abuse stepped up further until he resigns. Hound him out to save the club!

  94. Bob

    Nov 24, 2014, 13:54 #61886

    Exactly, Ron - and in terms of marking his contribution to the club, while I have no problem with the bust of him which already sits in the Diamond Club entrance remaining there, I would certainly oppose any move to commission anything further on his departure. Enough is enough.

  95. Ron

    Nov 24, 2014, 13:49 #61885

    Bob - Good point and well made. A thank you and have a happy life and continued good health is merited and justified. Please, lets hope there's no weeks on end tribute fest that followed Fergusons departure. It was if he d died! There only football coaches when alls said and done despite the elevation to nigh on sainthood status thats been afforded to AW.

  96. ATID

    Nov 24, 2014, 13:45 #61884

    Judging by the near fight at the back of Block 1 towards the end of the game (AMG v someone whose insight was limited to shouting "shut up") there are still a fair few of our fans living in Arsene Wenger Cloud Cuckoo land. The heated debate where I sit was who was to blame for the poor performance we had just witnessed? The manager or the team on the pitch? For me that misses the point. Once a manager has gone past the point of no return his continued presence will always prevent the team from performing. Has AW gone past that point? I would say yes.

  97. Bob

    Nov 24, 2014, 13:37 #61883

    When the day comes, there will be countless tributes to him on this and many other sites. You won't see one from me. For all his achievements in the early years, he has taken hugh amounts of money in wages which he has not earned since 2008 or 2009, when he should have gone. Some will claim, no doubt, that he kept us "competitive" during the years following the stadium move in circumstances when other managers could not have done. I never really bought that, and I certainly don't now that we have the money, financial fair play is around and not only is he still Mourinho's bitch, but we still can't beat a mediocre Man United team. No hypocracy or tribute from me when he is gone, and I hope all of you who are now calling for him to go will be genuine enough to say "close the door on your way out" and leave it at that.

  98. Exeter Gunner

    Nov 24, 2014, 13:35 #61882

    @ Staplehurst Gooner, right now an empty chair would be better. I actually think results would improve; Bould and the players would have to stand up and manage themselves, as the great players in the first half of Wenger's reign did.

  99. Staplehurst Gooner

    Nov 24, 2014, 13:29 #61881

    Fraud? Fool? I'm not enjoying watching one of our club's legends fading away like this, it's cruel all round. Maybe some of you could stop with the hating - Weger didn't appoint himself and it's not him to balme for his not being sacked. I agree though, it's time for him to stand down now and enough really is enough. One point that seems to have escaped most people is this: our board has no experience of appointing a coach (Wenger was in place when the current board was formed)so do any of you have any faith in their ability to get the right person? I'm not even sure they'd get someone from the right sport............

  100. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 24, 2014, 13:26 #61880

    Hi Berry, obviously Sue's prognosis is quite correct.

  101. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 24, 2014, 13:06 #61879

    Martyn, good post, yes he had some good tweets also, people say this and that about Piers Morgan but as high profile as he is at least he has the balls to speak out and say it as it is, and what he thinks, and what the majority of fans think and want and maybe if more like him done it instead of been afraid to and always kissing wengers arse that transition would have happened already and we still wouldn't be in the mess we're in today.

  102. jeff wright

    Nov 24, 2014, 12:51 #61878

    So Peter pan,aka lee KFC,TH14 no predictions then for the Dortmund game , where is the loyalty and fighting spirit! you couldn't make it up. But , lee KFC , seeing as you are still celebrating Germany winning the world cup you probably want Dortmund to win.

  103. chris dee

    Nov 24, 2014, 12:16 #61877

    Arsene has done too much for the club for all the crowd on Saturday to protest angrily,but believe me,according my season ticket holding brother,all they crowd were seething. How many seasons,how many matches are gonna be subjected to play ground defending,how many years are we gonna miss chances (Jack, who thinks he's the lad,missed a chance that beggared belief). We are a professional sporting club,we have some of the best attendances in Europe,we are in the top ten of the richest sporting 'brands' in the world. We should be frigging doing better,we should be challenging for every frigging trophy on offer.How have the people who run the club allowed a collective stupor to come over the whole club,why is it now in our D N A that we collapse under any sort of pressure,how come we can't beat any of the 'top' teams ,why have won only 1 game in 16 against United. It's simply s**t. How have we allowed Chelsea, despite Abramovic's 'business' deals in Russia supplying them with unlimited dosh,to look down at us and almost pity us.I can guarantee that if Ferguson,Mourinho or George Graham had the players Arsene has had over the eight years we would have been more succesful because they would not have insisted on playing the same way,the 'Arsenal' way ,which many gullible fans have swallowed,with no succcess to show for it.

  104. Ron

    Nov 24, 2014, 12:04 #61876

    Rocky - hi mate. Good sense there. True enough. I differ on the quality point though. Im pretty sure that the quality of defending in football generally yesteryear that i first saw in the mid 60s even (when we were poor at it) was at a far higher level than now.It was certainly better in the 70s. The rule changes to football in the last 20 years have all been to the detriment of defensive football and defenders as theyre made to suit the TV paymasters of the game today. Im convinced that if they could devise a rule to end the offside rule, to create more goals, they wouldnt hesitate. It was once tried in a pre season tournament called 'The Watney Cup' in or about 1970. It was a joke, there were goals galore but if nothing else it proved that the offside rule is the foundation of competitive proper football. Im not sure that the TV companies or the movers and shakers in football today quite now realise it though.If they do, they would ignore it anyway, im sure. Yr right though, football today is passionless and so are the majority of fans who can still afford to go regularly. I think there's more passion in a fan taking a decision to give up PL football, than there ever is in going to matches now. At least its decisive and gives a message to Clubs like Arsenal who in my regretful view are the undisputed market leaders in sanitizing football to the levels that you mention under Wenger.

  105. Johnny White

    Nov 24, 2014, 12:02 #61875

    It guts me to say but I have so much apathy towards the results now. I hate the fact that they have us over a barrel with our season tickets, I want to support my club as I have for 40 plus years but I sdon't recognise it anymore, the fans are behind the players but can't relate to the board - it's more about share price than winning !

  106. Seven Kings Gooner

    Nov 24, 2014, 11:54 #61874

    Ron : how about the board bringing back "Gunflash" their own fanzine with notes for supporters on how to behave! it would of course be red.

  107. Rocky RIP

    Nov 24, 2014, 11:48 #61873

    @ Sue - I agree. Going to football used to be such a laugh. After my first game ever on the North Bank I was hooked. Not by the quality of football, which by today's standards was seriously poor, but by the atmosphere and buzz. We moan about today's team, but compared to the one I started watching we are brilliant and electric now. The technique and fitness and athleticism today is on a different level. Unfortunately in terms of passion and desire both on and off the field, it's tame today. Sorry to repeat myself, but the 'match day experience' is so lame. It's joyless, overpriced, sterile and sanitised and can leave you exhausted and frustrated at how it's all come to this. You can see through some wider marketing strategy to make you cough up as much as possible. People blame Wenger for 'killing our club', but really is it not endemic of modern football as a whole? Diehard fans have been replaced by 'half and half scarfers' and clueless day trippers and people who choose to sit in total silence all match or people throwing their vin rouge in outrage. There's people filming di Maria as he homes in on goal. Who the hell does that? I once saw Cesc take a penalty for us and a guy behind the goal in an Arsenal scarf was waving his arms to put him off. (He'd seen it done elsewhere and didn't realise when it was appropriate.) Irrespective of the right manager or the wrong manager, this is something that concerns me as much as anything. I'm sure with a return of that sorely missed feel good factor, the atmosphere will improve big time, but at the moment, it's all wrong.

  108. Charlie George Orwell

    Nov 24, 2014, 11:42 #61872

    We live in a world hungry for news. 24 hour sports news channels need constant filling, with presumably high profile items occupying the top slots. What higher football–related interest will be generated at the moment (domestically at least) with visible anti-Wenger protests? I don’t think these events to begin with would need a cast of thousands – just groups acting in high profile ways like big banners outside the training ground or picking a pre-planned minute in a match to hold up printed signs at matches (with Sky Sports, BBC, etc being tipped off beforehand). Such publicity would also create a momentum – I’m sure the silent majority believe we are lost and just need a beacon.

  109. HEADLESS CHICKENS

    Nov 24, 2014, 11:31 #61871

    SOME GOOD PLAYERS WHO RECEIVE NO PROPER COACHING, NO TACTICS, NO WINNING STRATEGIES. I NOW FEEL SORRY FOR THE PLAYERS AS IT IS NOT ENTIRELY THEIR FAULT AT ALL. ITS VERY SAD HOW THIS DECLINE HAS BEEN COMING AND COMING AND MOST OF US FELT IT. THE BOARD TAKE THE BLAME FOR ALLOWING AN EMPEROR TO FEEL UNTOUCHABLE BY THE REALITY OF RESULTS. LIVING OFF OF THE PAST FOR SO SO LONG IS REALLY NOT ACCEPTABLE. CAN WE NOT PLEASE MOVE ON ??

  110. Peter pan

    Nov 24, 2014, 11:30 #61870

    I suppose, in a way, if the manager did leave. It would give Jeff nothing more to comment on because it appears that each and every post arks back to anti wenger. Also Jeff, I'll leave the predictions to your good old self. Germany and world cup spring to mind.

  111. jeff wright

    Nov 24, 2014, 10:40 #61869

    Oh ,it'S Chris the calendar year champions man! How are we doing at the moment ?

  112. Ron

    Nov 24, 2014, 10:35 #61868

    Ozzie - its pure sentiment on the part of the Board and the fans keeping AW in place. Nothing else. Note as well that the fan with the demo banner had it confiscated! The whole Club is institutionally geared to never questioning his tenure. Wengers like a footballing Chairman Mao. Im just surprised they dont sell little red books in the Armoury or more likely make them a compulsory extra purchase as a condition of season ticket renewal. Out of the players too, there's barely ever a whimper or a questioning comment save for Podolski whos probably only a little more free with the truth as hes off soon. This tells a story in itself. The media totally accept that its Wengers choice as to whether he stays or goes. Andy Dunn in the Sunday Mirror has said as much again only yesterday.The Club is in a prison of its own making and is structurally unable to work out how to break the mould. The fans who go still quite regularly go from habit. Many admit this. They still think things will change for the better and are as equally as much prisoners of their own wishes as the Club is of its own inertia. Deep down they know the writings on the wall. The Membership system that the Club has carefully weaved though in itself keeps them in denial via its oppressive structure that means that once a fan stops paying up, he/she is likely to never get back on the ladder that it took maybe 20 years to climb. The whole place is rotten with its own mould and decaying timbers. Fans have to react and react strongly. Wengers likely to nick a place in the infernal top 4 still. They've got to disregard it. Faling out of that worthless quartet is in my view an essential prerequisite for the Club to move forward. Sounds perverse i know, but its a step back to step forward that Arsenal need as i see it.Top 4 is the sanctuary for Wenger. From there he can smug leathery grin his way to contract after contract

  113. jeff wright

    Nov 24, 2014, 10:30 #61867

    MG, Peter pan ( watch out he is behind you!) is clearly an attention seeker making up arguments for the sake of it. With all of the porkies that he tells he should call himself Tom Pepper. Tom will now no doubt pop up later . The pantomime character Peter pan names 3 posters that he claims have been 'driven off here' by anti- Arsene posters - although as you pointed out theses have all posted on here recently . So that is just made up nonsense . He also claims that I want us to lose games when in fact I have said the opposite,I actually thought that we would get at least a draw on Saturday and tipped us to beat Anderlecht ; Swansea and Hull .Obviously though it is my fault that Wenger who is the manager failed to do so. You couldn't make it up. My posts are in response to results and Wenger's inept and arrogant management . Wenger demanded more money to stay with us if he had not received that cash on top of his already massive wages then he would have flounced off .So I don't need any lectures from Peter pan in Neverland, or Dreamland in Margate more likely, about showing loyalty to AFC .There is only one thing that Wenger is loyal too and that is himself .This malaise of Arsene knows best is also shared by his followers and devoted disciples. By the way Peter pan,why don't you tell us what you think that the result will be against Dortmund ..?

  114. Exeter Gunner

    Nov 24, 2014, 10:23 #61866

    @ Hi Berry, yes Wenger talks like a detached observer. Couple that with Arteta's comments... "it's not fair..." "we get punished for every single little mistake...". These comments illustrate why there is no hope of change. It's a victim mentality. No recognition what's happening is due to systemic issues; they're as blind as a Westlower (sorry couldn't resist).

  115. Hi Berry

    Nov 24, 2014, 10:07 #61865

    From official website: "I have to see it again because I was surprised there wasn’t anyone there [in defence]. It was a moment where - especially with such a long injury time - if the game stays 1-0, it gave [United] some confidence because they just defended after. "I have a lot of respect for this group because of their great attitude, spirit and energy levels. Maybe the disappointment of being 1-0 down meant everybody wanted to go forward too much. "[Individually they have been] really good. At the moment it’s very difficult because we lack a bit of experience in some positions." Surprised there wasn't anyone there in defence??? Maybe being 1-0 down meant everyone wanted to go forward too much??? We lack a bit of experience in some positions??? Does Wenger really not see how ridiculous these comments are? Does he not see that it is his job to make sure players don't lose their heads and bomb forward? Does he not see it is his job to have the right blend of youth and experience on the pitch? Christ Almighty, my daughter plays football at U 11 level (great to see her score against Arsenal the other week) and if she wanders out of position too much or the player she is marking has too much space she gets told from the touchline to look over her shoulder. It looks increasingly like Wenger gets a complimentary seat to go and watch Arsenal as a spectator every week with impunity and get paid £8m to do so.

  116. AMG

    Nov 24, 2014, 9:11 #61864

    As if any proof were needed that Arsenal has lost any working class roots it had, someone threw red wine at the united bench - Red wine FFS!

  117. fredm

    Nov 24, 2014, 9:09 #61863

    I like many others thought that when steve bould came onto the coaching staff we would have some defensive intelligent input bearing in mind what type of player he was, does he actually have any say in the training sessions it seems not. I wonder how much of a clue wenger has to defense as he took over the best back 4 in the country when he came in which served him well for a fews years extende I think with veira and pettit in midfield, and he had a knack of finding players and making them great like henry but its seems he has lost the plot and although I am not one to shout sack the manager at the first sign of trouble but his time is up. However with the american holding the reins arsenal is now just a successful business not so much a football club who care not a thing for its fan base, its a shame david dein left and the russian did not get control we may have ended up a couple of million in debt but we might have spent more and won a lot more, at least bruce rioch had the good grace to admit the job was to big for him although we did sign bergamp in his time, will see how wednesday goes if I stay till the end as saturday saw the biggest walk out I can remember after rooneys goal, as for chatching chelsea they are light years away from us , might have to start going to local football at least there will be passion, fredm

  118. declan burke

    Nov 24, 2014, 9:00 #61862

    I just do not believe what is being tolerated at my club. ENOUGH ENOUGH ENOUGH.

  119. Sue

    Nov 24, 2014, 8:57 #61861

    Football is about having fun. I'm not having fun. I accept we win, draw or lose, that's how it is but to go each week knowing it will be dire regardless of the result is soul destroying. I've been going since 1973 and even in those terrible days of mediocrity I enjoyed going because I had passion and the team had passion. Now I suffer from numbed apathy. Not to give a **** is terrible. But I dont. I don't sit there with the heart thumping, knees knocking anticipation. I sit there KNOWING What will unfold. And now I don't care, when is it time to cut my losses? Wenger doesn't need the salary so why is he staying? Does he love the club and believe he can rescue it or has he just gone insane and is oblivious to its predicament? I wish I knew what was going on.

  120. King Jeremy

    Nov 24, 2014, 8:52 #61860

    The most sickening thing is that this league is (in general) so poor this year, we will probably still get 4th on around 67/68 points, and the old fool in charge will regard that as another successful season. I'm not saying we sould have challenged Chelsea who are on another level, but for taking off of his blinkers it could have all been very different. 2.5 years left on his contract, a board who loves him, and an owner who loves him - unfurl all the banners you like chaps - he's going nowhere any time soon. Just sit tight, grin and bear it and hope he's had enough come May 2017.

  121. Tony Evans

    Nov 24, 2014, 8:46 #61859

    It was all there wasn't it. Loads of possession - tick, miss a sitter - tick, concede a goal due to school boy defending - tick. Purgatory is the word - and I fear A and F is right in that 4th place could still easily be achieved due the mediocrity of the teams around us, and so it goes on.

  122. Goodar*e

    Nov 24, 2014, 8:37 #61858

    Blo’&ddy inte(n*t – on th” bl!n_k ag^in.......

  123. Red Member

    Nov 24, 2014, 8:34 #61857

    Hound him out! If enough pressure is put on him then he WILL crack

  124. 71guns

    Nov 24, 2014, 8:28 #61856

    Much the same as prime ministers question time when the line "I refer my right honourable friend to the answer I gave some moments ago" that is what this blog had become, all of the above comments could be used in response to anyone of the last 10 defeats (specifics aside). I am a firm believer in getting things off your chest but we're all going round in circles here. Our ranting is as broken a record as Wenger's management, I am fed up watching us and fed up reading about it. I'm f*cking fed up!

  125. Martyn

    Nov 24, 2014, 8:18 #61855

    I don't normally take much notice of Piers Morgan's opinions but on 606 last night he hit the nail on the head. Arsene had 8 brilliant years which has allowed him to get away with mediocrity ever since. His legacy is being tarnished with every passing season and I, for one, take no pleasure in calling for his departure. Klopp brings his Dortmund side to the Emirates on Wednesday and I would like to think that someone at the club will take him aside for a beer and a question. Klopp may not be the answer but we have to accept as fans that AFC will have to eventually go through a very long and messy transition at all levels before we can rediscover the joy and anticipation that once characterised supporting our great club. Remember the 'feel good' factor?

  126. Ali

    Nov 24, 2014, 5:37 #61854

    When Wilshere missed that "Goal", I somehow knew we will lose

  127. Edmund

    Nov 24, 2014, 4:57 #61853

    Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. I think Wenger was probably a much better coach in his early years when he had to worry about the fans. Now who cares about people who "don't have 30 years experience in managing football teams". If he had just done the popular move and signed back Fabregas and pushed the boat out for Khedira, it would have been a very different outcome.

  128. jleau

    Nov 24, 2014, 4:13 #61852

    The second goal for clearly shows that Wenger's got no hope of turning this around. At the moment the ball turns over Chambers and Ramsey can easily see that possession is lost and they absolutely need to drop at a sprint to keep defensive shape. Both players barely jog. No effort to defend and no idea why Chambers isn't more aware that he should not have been that high. It will get worse. These players are too talented for this type of performance.

  129. Ozzie

    Nov 24, 2014, 3:22 #61851

    The saddest thing is that the REAL fans are even wrestling with this farce still, when it was so obvious years earlier and looks like continuing undisturbed. One of our major league coaches has just been fired after losing 5 of six games despite winning the premiership 6 months ago and being named coach of the year, yet Wenger continues on with his perennial mediocrity. Much of our Aussie media are just as stunned, believe me.

  130. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 24, 2014, 1:44 #61850

    Peter Pan 65216, I didn't get to read that post before I penned my reply otherwise i would have worded it differently, maybe you do think along the same lines as most of us after all, but i can tell you now i support the team always (yes not wenger and there is a difference) and i always want them to win. As for jeff I've had no indication he thinks any different but can understand why some others do if it means getting rid of this past it manager, because that's what he's drove us to.

  131. DW Thomas

    Nov 24, 2014, 1:41 #61849

    Peter Pan, you must of taken too many blows to the noggin fighting Captain Hook. You and the bloated lost boys like Jamie know the mudslinging has been going on for ages on here. All in good fun mate! But, we do strongly believe Arsene must be moved on and any sane fan knows we are not being overly critical, just fed up with what we see is all the bs! The poster I miss most is Joe Fitzpatrick I think he was called. He and others had very astute reasoned arguments. Many of us supported Wenger somewhat until recently. For years now the club have sold snake oil at exhorbitant prices ripping the fans off and basically saying if you don't like it piss off! If Wenger showed real change many of us would probably give him some time. But that's just it, he never changes. In fact things just get worse. He dangles carrots with Samchez and Ozil, but not completing the team AND passing on Cesc is just too much. Thanks, but times up!

  132. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 24, 2014, 1:12 #61848

    Peter Pan, verbal attack belittlement? if you think that's a verbal attack or belittlement you've clearly never had them before, but that doesn't surprise me as im sure it's non existent or not allowed on the site you frequent. The only person good at that is your messiah the old man who lives in a shoe and doesn't know what to do, who verbally attacks and try's to belittle third officials in an attempt to disguise his own short comings off which there is many, and which a lot of us have seen through a long time ago and even I suspect yourself. As for the three posters you mentioned one has been posting quite regularly the other has just penned an article (maybe you could pen one telling us why you think we shouldn't be so negative about your beloved arsene)the third has made a couple of brief appearances over the last month or so, and as far as I can gather they think along the same lines as I do and indeed the majority of posters on here, maybe not as extreme as views as myself but certainly want the same thing, if you think their not posting regularly is because their fed up with posters like me and others you'd have to ask them because i'm sure they haven't told you so, but i'm quite sure that's not the case and their just as fed up as the rest as us with what's happening to our club and did it ever occur to you they just chose not to be as vocal and outspoken as others, i guess not.

  133. JackL

    Nov 24, 2014, 0:42 #61847

    The thing that did it for me was when , on deadline day, AW was abroad refereeing a game-total arrogance and a complete disregard for the fans. He may have been in contact with Mr Law over the day but he needed to be SEEN to be at the club working on transfers that day-just total indulgence that only AW can get away with. I've barely missed a game since 1963 but I am now just at my wits end, sadly his time is up and he must do the noble thing.

  134. Peter pan

    Nov 24, 2014, 0:05 #61846

    Maguire. I wouldn't shed too many tears if the manager left tomorrow but blind inability to support the team is outrageous and the willingness for us to get beat is bordering on lunacy, which Jeff and his chums are famous for.

  135. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 23:57 #61845

    jw, a good description, and it sounds familiar i wonder who it could be? maybe one of those fans deserting the site.

  136. Peter pan

    Nov 23, 2014, 23:49 #61844

    Maguire. You've answered it in a nutshell. Because my views don't correspond with yours, a verbal attack is your answer. Pathetic, belittlement is the key from many on here. Rocky rip, gare kekeke, Canada gooner etc stopped posting because the negatives know only one way to criticise. There used to be an online gooner over there.......no wonder sales are on their arse.

  137. jeff wright

    Nov 23, 2014, 23:42 #61843

    MG,Peter pan ,who claims that he is not sure that Wenger is the man to take the club forward, me think he protests too much though, and is really a die hard AKB trying to appear reasonable . Peter pan only sees those who agree with his views as being Arsenal supporters, those who don't must be Chelsea or United, although he fails to explain why any of those ones would want Wenger to leave. This is like David Cameron going loco and wanting Ed Milliband to be replaced by someone with some idea of what they are doing. If I were a Chelsea supporter I would want Wenger at AFC for ever and a day. You couldn't make it up.

  138. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 23:18 #61842

    Peter Pan, honest gooners deserting this website? where did you get that from? wengers never never land? all I can see (and i'm quite sure everybody else can if their not as short sighted as you)is more honest fans on here than ever before thinking, saying and wanting the same thing.

  139. jeff wright

    Nov 23, 2014, 23:17 #61841

    Peter pan I know it's the panto season but stop being such a drama queen.Those deserting the site, as you ,ludicrously put it , are just hiding behind the sofa and reading the articles and posts, this is because results are not going the way they would like. They had no problem pouring scorn on me and others when we suggested that their belief that Wenger was the only man who could take us forward was delusional and that Wenger should have left after he won the FAC. Which some of these die-hards had suggested he should give a swerve to early last season ,when they were convinced that the Prem title was on it's way. Now they have scuttled off ,or like you squire, change their names from one to another while still posting the same old discredited tripe. I myself attended games regularly for years home and away and never complained about others not doing so when they offered their views at work or in pubs etc. It's a matter of choice if people go to games these days anyway with so many on TV - the Emirates Experience is not that great anyway is it ? The gaff is full of tourists that Ivan has flogged tickets to through their travel agents and day trippers who leave early after spending most of the time on the concourses at the bars . I already pay enough for SKY and BT along with others ,and everyone in the UK has to have a TV licence and some of this money also goes to the football clubs ,so virtually everyone is contributing something financially to football. It's the TV money anyway that is providing the clubs owners with the big cash . As I said before if someone wants to pay Wenger and Stan money by going to the Emirates then that is their choice,a lot who do are not happy about it though ,if you are then in my view you are either a mug or lying. No sane person could be happy about the situation with ticket prices hoarded cash,Stan being paid 3m while Wenger can't cobble together a propeer defence.You even hint yourself that you think that Wenger is not the man to take the club forward , he however demanded a big pay rise to stay,so where the **** then is HIS loyalty >?! The answer is it is in his bank account all 60 million of it. Now I suggest that you give your sanctimonious preaching a rest, it's all really just another clumsy attempt to try and shut up Wenger's critics who have been proven RIGHT while the AKB have been proven WRONG. C'est la vie.

  140. Th14afc

    Nov 23, 2014, 23:04 #61840

    The game ruined my weekend,I'm still angry now...worst iv reacted in a while cos utd were there for the taking and the best team definitely lost....so frustrating,season is already a write off

  141. JAMIE

    Nov 23, 2014, 23:04 #61839

    I love a bit of banter,but please no name calling.

  142. David

    Nov 23, 2014, 22:53 #61838

    Badarse? Westlower? Surely you can see it now?

  143. Hi Berry

    Nov 23, 2014, 22:42 #61837

    Nick Gooner - don't be so hard on little Jamie....he may bang on about Wobs but it won't be long before he joins the ranks after his announcement a month or two ago that if Arsenal dropped out of the top four, didn't fare well in either of the domestic cups and didn't make any progress past the last 16 in the CL he would start supporting a call for change. As things stand he's just a tough away draw in the FA Cup from chanting 'Wenger Out'.

  144. JAMIE

    Nov 23, 2014, 22:30 #61836

    You tell them Peter Pan.jeff's a sad laughable figure,along with his rottweiler pet son MARCUS,the ginger midget DW Thomas,old baby face BARD,the lunatic maguirebridge,Peter Weena and old tiny todger wetplane.

  145. Stanmore Gooner is Temporarily Unavailable

    Nov 23, 2014, 22:27 #61835

    I wonder if anybody else has thought about supporting their local non-league football team for the next two and a half years. It's cheap, fans' expectations aren't high, you occasionally see a half decent game and you don't have to listen to Robbie Savage talking ****e about your team.Oh and the club probably won't be controlled by a disinterested American billionaire nor will it pay its chief executive £2+m p.a.to sit in a plush office and dispense platitudes to the fans. Think about it - it must be better for your health, your wallet and you'll have lots more time on your hands now you won't have to debate Arsene's latest disaster.I'm off to the Hive. See you in August 2017.

  146. DW Thomas

    Nov 23, 2014, 22:25 #61834

    Wenger is comfortable in the knowledge that as long as PROFITS rule over TROPHIES he will never be canned. 2 points off fourth aint that bad yet. But finish outside the top 4 and maybe he will be removed. A young manager like Martinez who is hungry and has some good ideas would be new wind in our sails. Imagine him leading the team? Or Klopp? Pep? The players could have a choice. Stay and build something with real effort and commitment, or get lost. It actually sounds grand thinking about it. My biggest hope is the new man would complete the squad, no weak links, no missing pieces. Still, it might take 3-4 years to come out of our mire. But one can hope!

  147. Peter pan

    Nov 23, 2014, 22:15 #61833

    So Jeff. You watch the game on the TV, and I'm guessing that is all you are capable of doing. Just please answer me this. If a diehard fan who believes that Arsene Wenger is still the man to take this club forward, which I sometimes wonder, why do you have the necessity to pour scorn on the person. It's a genuine question and why I believe most honest gooners are deserting this website.

  148. DJ

    Nov 23, 2014, 22:04 #61832

    That should be the final nail in the Wenger coffin all of our so called rivals want him to stay! It is sad to see but he has become a laughing stock and the stubborn old fool and money obsessed board refuse to acknowledge it!

  149. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 21:54 #61831

    Some great examples of tweets on yahoo sport from Arsenal fans, one photo from a man yoo fan standing outside the Emirates with a banner wenger in, another we have 100 problems but beating Arsenal isn't one of them.

  150. DJ

    Nov 23, 2014, 21:24 #61830

    The sad thing is this league is so bad we could still and probably will finish fourth. Wenger supporters will point to our record in qualifying for the champions league and it will continue ad nauseam for the next two seasons. For the first time on Saturday I heard Wenger out chants but I fear our leaders holds us supporters with such contempt that he couldn't care less and like all dictators will carry on regardless!

  151. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 21:22 #61829

    We could have signed Ronaldo, yes indeed, and it works, with his followers anyway they believe him.

  152. Wenger Terminator Aka Unchives

    Nov 23, 2014, 21:09 #61828

    What makes you think Arsene Wenger is a Failure?.....I HAVE EXTENSIVE FILES SINCE 2005....Why do you think Arsene Wenger makes the same mistakes again & again?.....I ONLY OPERATE ON LOGIC! YOUR QUESTION DOES NOT COMPUTE!What do you think the long term outcome will be? THE END IS INEVITABLE.....NO ACTION LEADS TO TERMINATION.Will success ever follow? I WAS SENT FROM THE PAST TO ATTEMPT TO CHANGE THE FUTURE OF ARSENAL , BUT THE TIME IS NOT SET.What message do you send Arsene Wenger? COME WITH ME IF YOU WANT ARSENAL TO LIVE!...DA.DA..DA..DA..DA!

  153. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 21:00 #61827

    Nick Gooner, well said, post of the day.

  154. We could have signed Ronaldo

    Nov 23, 2014, 20:22 #61826

    @we could have signed Messi. In the last 3 months Wenger has talked about how we nearly signed Messi, C. Ronaldo, Paul Pogba and Gerard Pique. It's a Tottenham tactic, look who we tried to sign and a distraction from the current malaise and ultimately an admission of failure anyhow

  155. Bard

    Nov 23, 2014, 20:01 #61825

    Some really good posts, but barring a complete collapse and in this league at present how bad does that have to be, nothing is going to change and I can see why. As long as Wenger delivers on the balance sheet everything remains the same. All of us understand that but somehow think that dear old Stan gives a flying f*** about our performances or the opinion of fans. He doesn't watch Arsenal and I suspect cares even less. Im with you AlextheGooner, my vote would be that Usmanov smells blood and makes Stan an offer he can't refuse. Here's a thought , depressing but possible, Wenger gets a couple more 4-6th places finishes, the stadium remains full ( theoretically ) and he signs for another 3 years. From a business point of view whats not to like about that.

  156. Gerry

    Nov 23, 2014, 19:43 #61824

    Pretty much agree Kevin, if I was into online betting I could make a fortune on these guys and the now familiar bottle job. Gibbs like the TV replay used to judge a run out in cricket was not even in the picture when they broke for the second. Szcsesny was asked to do one thing in the game and proved once again that he is not up to the job. I'm growing numb to it now and fed up moaning about the same basic errors occurring every week. Why persist with monreal at centre back, surely we must have someone resembling a central defender in the stiffs. The miss management continues. This man has lost the plot and is going to a cloughie on us GET RID NOW for everyone's sake

  157. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 19:39 #61823

    Gaz, you couldn't make it up, another one of these wengerites who are standing outside their messiah's bathroom everyday with the andrex at the ready as soon as they hear the flush, thankfully their getting scarcer by the day and letting him do his own dirty work. But it didn't take some of them long did it, they really must be worried, and expect more of it as they try in vain to protect and hold on to their beloved messiah. It will be very interesting in deed to see how long AKB's like him and others give the new manager when he DOES arrive (without undermining them even before they do) because they will have no room or excuse to bleat about anything having given the old fool their lord and master ten years.

  158. jjetplane

    Nov 23, 2014, 19:30 #61822

    Just heard an old Eagle fan remind us that Wenger is on 20 thou a day (how ****ing much!) and then some AKB saying 'it is too early to get Wenger out.' You could not make that up but you escort him to a suitable rest home.

  159. Nick Gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 19:15 #61821

    What is a Wob ? **** spelling in last post. Fat fingers and small screen. Heartened to see I am not the only one to have stopped going but saddened to see that so many of us have been done . I used to rant about the re marketing of the club and how the working class were being priced out of Highbury. Perhaps there is a plan to piss if all the old dinasors so the tarquins and tourists can enjoy their sanitised football experience and maximise revenue by enhancing the global brand. It is all ****ed up..

  160. jjetplane

    Nov 23, 2014, 19:09 #61820

    Bang on the head NICK GOOnER - did 40 yrs at highbury too and now watch footer outside the PL and loving it. 9th tier with a bit of championship. Spent some years watching div 2 and loved that. People do not what they are missing and if 30 thou did not turn up for the next home game there would be a steward's intervention.

  161. jeff wright

    Nov 23, 2014, 19:04 #61819

    Of course Peter pan "passion, support and belief." All the things that the AKB and Wenger have . If only. You couldn't make it up.

  162. Nick Gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 18:59 #61818

    Jamie ???? I despair reading your list what the **** is a Wob ? I am an old clockend Goober with nearly 40 years of watching Arsenal home and away who has given up a season ticket because an arrogant old man followed by fools has stolen my club and instilled passionless mediocrity where there was once class. I don't mind losing but I do mind ineptitude and arrogance. Someone posted that the legacy is diehard support turning away from the club. This old ****er has done me. Now on the terrace of an on league club after 40 years !!!wake up you tit. Your being mugged off. AFC died in 2006 RIP.

  163. Torbay gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 18:24 #61817

    Good report Kevin, I watched Torquay play just prior to this match and they defended more intelligently than our lot! I can't listen to our manager's interviews/excuses any longer, it really is a very depressing time to be a supporter of AFC.

  164. Unchives

    Nov 23, 2014, 18:23 #61816

    Times up Arsene......Your words........." I Always say that a manager has a love story with the club, and he has to behave like it will be a love story forever,but not stupid enough to think it will never end" Thanks Arsene........the Love story is over!

  165. jjetplane

    Nov 23, 2014, 18:22 #61815

    Spuds won if that's any help. As I gave up going in 2004 a decade later there is a little numbness but generally because of the Wenger and Stan show this is a giggle. I watch my football elsewhere but do notice Arsenal are 7 points off a relegation battle and the fanbase are still taking their smiling selfies though look at some of those Wenger Out shots and methinks the stockbrokers are most bemused. Must have busy with the Headlocks yesterday PETE. You could not make it up. Everyone is bigging up Dein on 5 live - turn in for the great slagathon.

  166. Peter Wain

    Nov 23, 2014, 18:19 #61814

    For Arsenal sake Wenger please resign now and take Gazidis and that old board with you. Let the yank go back home you are just killing our club. We need 4 or 5 new players, new tactics and new training methods. What will we get in January some loan sign who is injured what a terrible way to runa football club. Wenger out now.

  167. Ron

    Nov 23, 2014, 18:19 #61813

    I always enjoy yr [posts Kev and im glad youve nailed your colours firmly to the mast as ive never quite worked out where you are with things mate. I can see now. Gaz - Youve my admiration for toughing it out until now. I got to where you are at the end of 2009/10 Season. My Dad would who took me all over the Country to see the Arsenal from the age of 9-15 and then left me to it to go and see them as i saw fit would turn in his grave now if he knew that i no loner cared for the club deep down. The consolation is that if he was still with us to see this, i know he d probably understand (he died the day we beat Utd at OT on the 15th Feb 2003 in the FAC and he stayed with us long enough that day to have been told the score)R.I.P Dad. As for yesterday, was it not expected really? The Club truly has disappeared into its own delusional dreamland, led there by a tyrannical con man who i suspect deep down no longer cares that much himself. His continuance is an end in itself to him. Hes pathetic, the owners are the players are sub standard men who also know deep down that theyre rudderless and powerless. Nobodys going to sack Wenger so please, Mr Wenger, whatever mess we re in, whatever travails yr departure brings, for the first time for many, many years do some thing decisive, positive and genuine. Please just go and go now taking your staff with you.

  168. Peter pan

    Nov 23, 2014, 18:12 #61812

    Jeff. It's called passion, support and belief. Something you know nothing about.

  169. KC

    Nov 23, 2014, 18:02 #61810

    Nas problem is if you give your seat up it gets sold quickly. Big decision to give up ST as may have long wait to get it back. It's tough to turn your back on a club you love even if you despise the owners etc. would certainly be up for an organised protest against Wenger. I do disagree about whining though surely the people who pay the entrance fee have the biggest right to complain either on a site or at the ground after all losing tastes worse when you have paid to watch it.

  170. jeff wright

    Nov 23, 2014, 18:02 #61811

    What is the meaning of this then ,Lewis Hamilton flying the Union flag on his car after winning the world championship ,this must make him a FI car man!

  171. Gaz

    Nov 23, 2014, 17:54 #61809

    @maguiresbridge Gooner: That point I made RE the fans earlier? Check out the tweets of that chief AKB GeoffArsenal. We haven't even replaced Wenger with Klopp and he's finding every whic way to criticise him!!!...

  172. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 17:54 #61808

    A&F, it certainly did mate, remember when asked who do you support? and you proudly said Arsenal or i'm a gooner, now? thanks to this old fool we have as a manager you just keep your mouth shut.

  173. DW Thomas

    Nov 23, 2014, 17:49 #61807

    Exactly the problem KC! He never plays his best uninjured 11! Ramsey has been poor all season. Rosicky and Pod rot on the bench. But, Giroud is played for sure! Wenger's decisions are bizarre. He cannot seem to see anything we see. Or any pundits! It is all just so deflating and unenjoyable. And football should be fun.

  174. Unchives

    Nov 23, 2014, 17:41 #61806

    @ Nas, your right I doubt if Silent Stan reads the Blogs, however his CEO Gazidis does read them, he admitted this in the AST QA annual meetings. I gave up my Gold season tickets 4 seasons ago.....you are correct, complainers should stop going or at least protest at the game if your not happy.

  175. KC

    Nov 23, 2014, 17:29 #61805

    Re taking over from Wenger. I would love Simeone but no doubt Arsenal will not want a manager like him. He would put the edge back into us and make us competive. If not Klopp would be a sound choice. @Bard re your earlier post agree we played well offensively in the first 30 but they were shocking defensively. What does bother me is Wengers failure to see right now both Ramsey and Carzola are not playing well enough to be considered for for a starting position appreciate he did bench Carzola yesterday but both players are totally out of form.

  176. Nas

    Nov 23, 2014, 17:28 #61804

    How many of you complaining here still have season tickets and go to watch the games? If you meet these criteria then you are a part of the problem. If you whinge and complain but still plan to renew your season ticket next summer and buy the new jerseys then stop whining and go watch your team. Arsenal is a business not a club. As long as you keep filling their coppers then you are signaling your support for the business. Silent Stan doesn't give a damn about your dissent. He doesn't read online gooner or any other arsenal blogs. Either stop going to games and buying merchandise, or go to games and make your protests heard. As for the accusation of kev enjoying the defeats, I must confess that I do take a perverse pleasure in our defeats. I'm sick and tired of forced average. It's time we get exposed as a mediocre team. When this happens either wenger leaves and there's new hope, or we are so far from the real title contenders that expectations drop and we stop being aghast at our performances. Win-win as far as I'm concerned.

  177. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 17:25 #61803

    foxinthebox, he's an expert at blaming others (just like his followers) he didn't mention why they're always steaming forward in the first place allowing it to happen i'm sure it's not of their own bat, it wouldn't be because of his philosophy and instructions, there's obstacles alright and their all coming from him, and he's also the biggest one.

  178. KC

    Nov 23, 2014, 17:05 #61802

    Hornsby Bill great post in total agreement. Jamie do you enjoy failure? No one judges any team based on one game as sometimes the best team loses. It's the repetition of the same weaknesses that we are upset with. I can not believe you really care about Arsenal because if you did you would look at the facts, get angry and expect better, unless struggling for fourth each season is your target for our club. AAA is probably a term invented by those cult deluded muppets Untold Arsenal where the main contributor couldn't see the second half yesterday as he was going to see a comedian, he should have turned up like a real fan and watched our comedian on the sideline you should take a look your find a few friends on there but be careful they blame the ref even when they have not seen the game!!!!!!!

  179. Angry & Frustrated

    Nov 23, 2014, 17:03 #61801

    Supporting Arsenal use to mean everything to me, now it's just utter purgatory. What have we all done to deserve this never ending nightmare to which no end seems in sight? Nothing new about yesterday as I expected it, just as I expect us to ultimately finish fourth and our collective punishment will continue.

  180. Unchives

    Nov 23, 2014, 16:56 #61800

    @ Danny, unfortunately we lost out on Pep Guardiola because the board wanted to stick with Wenger. Even Roberto Martinez would be a great choice....Kloop comes across as a bit of a loose cannon.

  181. jeff wright

    Nov 23, 2014, 16:53 #61799

    jjetplane,their goalie was MOTM is an old Wenger excuse he would have trotted out we lacked sharpness due to our players having to play midweek .The only problem was that Rooney and co also played midweek. Gaal gambled on us struggling to score if he defended in depth and had players to cut out the last pass ,the one that follows on the previous sideways 20 or so .This forces our players to have to shoot from long range or in a hurry and De Gea was easily able to cope with this . On the occasions when we did break through the United rearguard poor finishing let us down .Welbeck's finishing on two good chances that he squandered was typical of him and the reason why he has only scored 2 goals in the Prem this season ,.He is not a natural goal scorer - but can flatter to deceive in this respect on odd occasions.The real top strikers do it regularly though and Danny Boy for all of his effort and pace fails to do this.He is better out wide where he can use his pace to help out by dashing about making a pest of himself than he is making a mug of himself around the goal area up front - Hodgson and Ferguson sussed this out and I suspect so has Wenger also . So it looks like being between Danny and Wally for that wide spot with Oliver back in harness now.

  182. Danny

    Nov 23, 2014, 16:36 #61798

    We all know Wenger is clueless, but the problem is the board which looks at the Financial rather then the football side. we need to protest at the stadium and give Wenger abuse. The idiot thinks we were shouting at teh players . Someone should tell him, it was him. Also now that Liverpool lost to Palace, i am afraid they may go to KLOPP !

  183. Jess Cooper wants AW out

    Nov 23, 2014, 16:24 #61797

    Ive been going for 30 years but this is the last season for me. Wenger and Kroenke are a cancer that has been destroying my club for too long now. I actually hope we lose and keep losing so as to speed up Wengers departure, I would sooner lose the next 20 on the trot than suffer another 3years of this idiot. He should have gone in 2007. A word of warning, does anyone think there is anyone at the club with the brains or ambition to make the right choice when that day finally comes?

  184. Unchives

    Nov 23, 2014, 16:23 #61796

    @ Jamie, believe me and all the others here, we have given Wenger our Time & Money, im giving him my time here and now. I have been prepared to eat Humble pie on many occasions as it tastes just as delicious as normal pie, however we are still waiting. He goes on about an Arsenal Brand of football that is revered all around the world......there is only one brand....and that's a winning brand! the rest is just football.

  185. Exeter Gunner

    Nov 23, 2014, 16:14 #61795

    JAMIE, as Wenger's in game management seems to have become one of the major points of discussion, perhaps you, as a supporter of his, could offer your insights and explain to the rest of us what he's up to?

  186. JAMIE

    Nov 23, 2014, 16:07 #61794

    I did notice the Wenger out boys have their own mention on the wikipedia Arsenal supporters section.Apparently they are called the Anti-Arsenal Arsenal and have been around since 2010.

  187. foxinthebox2001

    Nov 23, 2014, 16:07 #61793

    Wenger's post match interview gave an insight into one of the countless obstacles we face. He moaned the players were naïve/reckless in steaming forward in numbers leaving us vulnerable to the counter attack. Yet as United broke, there was Wenger on the edge of pitch quiet as a mouse. If he saw the problem then why not actually get a message to the players to hold back? I have just watched Neil Warnock cajole his team to a 3-1 win over Liverpool. He was like a 12th man, I don't mean inane rants to 'up your game' but you could see he was getting across tactical instructions on who was out of position, and how he wanted them set up. I understand Wenger's argument that he trusts his players to solve problems themselves but this is the 3rd time in as many weeks when he has just stood and silently watched as we have self destructed.

  188. jjetplane

    Nov 23, 2014, 16:02 #61792

    JW according to Prof De Gea was the best player on the field which tells us that in Wenger's world not only is the money offshore, so is the football. Little Jack needs some posture (potty) training as he appears to be using his ankles as feet. Why try to be smaller than you are.

  189. DW Thomas

    Nov 23, 2014, 16:00 #61791

    Can't speak for everyone on hereJamie, but would bet most find your comments as delusional as OGL. But then you always were his most outspoken follower. We lost, played poorly, and had no plan B. Same s..t, different day. Terrible results, worst in 32 years, yet the AKB muppet squad defend their leader. Wow!

  190. Unchives

    Nov 23, 2014, 15:58 #61790

    @ Jamie - virtually all the posts im reading here, are talking the same language,since you are the only one that is bored, I suggest you leave the site and go back and watch your Arsenal DVDs up to 2005. I'm am pretty sure that any manager in the premiership, given 9 years, would have won an FA Cup. I have already mentioned, we can have an exceptional team, however Mr Wenger cannot finish the job off.....and guess what, I don't care why.....he must go. Dont attempt to tell us Black is White!

  191. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 15:57 #61789

    jj, he's behind you, but not until tomorrow or the next day.

  192. Abou Diaby

    Nov 23, 2014, 15:40 #61788

    Everything will be good when I return. It will be like signing a new player. Have mental strength people!

  193. Mike Collins

    Nov 23, 2014, 15:35 #61787

    I've just watched Crystal Palace beat Liverpool and it was a thrilling game of soccer. However, everything was spoilt by a loud minority of presumably white-van men, who probably put flags outside their houses, shouting and singing for the entire 90 minutes and creating what I believe is called an ionosphere (or something like that). I will tweet evidence of this in due course but in the meantime thank goodness we don't have any oiks like that at the Emirates. Anyway, Tarquin and Arabella, I'll be over at Barnsbury Squah as arranged for 7 tonight. I've also managed to bag a bottle of that divine Petrus 89. Ah, thank goodness for true north London tradition! Oh yah!

  194. jeff wright

    Nov 23, 2014, 15:30 #61786

    Spoken like a true AKB dear Jamie,what's all this about fight ? Surely you are confusing possession and passing with fight,there was no confidence in our players this stems from Wenger who is a busted flush and a fretting bag of nerves -that's why they lost and why he never beats top opposition . The first United goal came about due to the usual slapstick Keystone Cops type defending that we see every week ,why did Gibbs sit on his arse after the clown had knocked him over in his panicky running out to punch the ball aimlessly away,why didn't Gibbs, instead of sitting there looking annoyed, jump up and help to defend ,instead he stuck out his foot while sitting on the ground and deflected the cross into our goal . He spent the rest of the game sulking and feeling sorry for himself. TBH, we got off light losing 2-1 it could have easily have been 3-0 .We never had apart from Giroud's late consolation goal in the added 8 minutes, a really decent shot on target everything went straight at the United GK -he would have ben disappointed not t have saved those shots.The best team is always the one that wins the game only losers believe in heroic defeats .United scored 2 goals we scored one ,and that is a fact and is the only thing that the history books will record. Arsenal 1 - 2 Manchester United 2. Hard luck stories will not be of any interest to posterity.

  195. jjetplane

    Nov 23, 2014, 15:27 #61785

    Arsenal 'fight hard' against the worst Mank team for ages and lose. ummmmmm something desperate about these barrel scraping AKBs. JAMIE where is BADDIE with that Panto script? It will be January soon and the 'sales' will be on us, or not. Time the crowd started singing 'you could not make it up' ....

  196. DW Thomas

    Nov 23, 2014, 15:11 #61784

    I chives, spot on man! We have very good, potentially great players. This coach has had his chances and then some, and some more, after failing again and again. Time to find someone with new ideas. New tactics, better coaching. This clib and team are a sleeping giant. We can and should be so much more!

  197. JAMIE

    Nov 23, 2014, 15:07 #61783

    The wob's are always telling us they don't care yet love to bore us with all this boring diatribe after every game.Fact is United were very fortunate and played their accustomed anti-football, which if we had played that way the wob's would be calling us lucky.Surely after that performance Arsenal can't be attacked for their lack of fight which is what these people are always saying is the most important,or have they shifted the goalposts again and gone back to results..mmmm very fishy these wob's.

  198. jeff wright

    Nov 23, 2014, 14:57 #61782

    Even the United supporters who are having ,by their Ferguson halcyon days a nightmare at present , are now laughing at us . The notion that Chelsea supporters come on here to post anti-Wenger rants to try and get him fired is even funnier,why the heck would they want Wenger fired >? Wenger is the best thing going for Mourinho ,he has him in his pocket, he doesn't want Wenger out nor do any of the other top managers . The last thing they want is a new manager at AFC who uses the considerable resources at his disposal to do a better job than what Wenger does. Both LVG and Rodgers will believe that they can get 3rd or 4th place ,so far in the battle for the top 4 spots Wenger has only won one point off his rival managers,that was against City in the 2-2 draw at home,he lost to Mourinho away and he along with City are now over the hill and gone .This leaves just 3rd or 4th place and United with an easier fixture list having no Euro games will now fancy their chances of third spot with us having to play both them and City away plus Liverpool also . So I'm now making it 4th spot at best for Wenger again ,and Liverpool being the main threat to him achieving that . I have no idea what the betting odds on us getting 4th are,but I won't be taking then anyway there looks to be a touch of the Weimar's about AFC these days the shadows of doom are lengthening and casting despondency upon everyone. Wenger looks frail and fraught lacking in self belief ,talking gibberish ,he thinks the boos at the end of the game were just aimed at the players and showed a lack of respect,someone needs to point out that they were for him .

  199. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 14:52 #61781

    KC, good post, and MARCUS there's no need to write anything else that says it all.

  200. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 14:33 #61780

    More fans are waking up to the old fraud alright as the amount of new posters on here today tells us, all saying and wanting the same thing, welcome to the club.

  201. Unchives

    Nov 23, 2014, 14:31 #61779

    We have the makings of a fantastic team. Wengers deadwood out, quality in, tactical manager in and we can have it all. The tide has turned, I have an inner excitement, despite the loss, that change is imminent, im sure I'm not alone. Arsene must bow down now, so we can prepare for next season. I don't want him spending anymore money in January, the season is already over.....perhaps now is a good time to boycott the games in order to expedite the changes needed.

  202. jjetplane

    Nov 23, 2014, 14:27 #61777

    Cazorla and Mata on a 5 min love-in before the match. Comparing wages and laughing at the fans no doubt. Imagine that happening in Adam's day. Wonder if Wenger knows where he is at times. Methinks he is still on a beach somewhere and the irritation he feels is having to attend games which seems bad for the joints. He could always warm up with Pod.

  203. Nozzer

    Nov 23, 2014, 14:21 #61776

    Groundhog day again, yet there are several people who defend Wenger. Everyone has their opinion but you cant not change the manager because he was great years ago or you are worried that the replacement may be worse. The fact of the matter is that we are not going forward under his stewardship. I cannot see him resigning, he has the boards full support and we are only two points off fourth spot which is the boards minimum requirement. His gamble in not signing defensive cover has blown up in his face. I hope the next two and a half years goes quickly because I cant see him going.

  204. DW Thomas

    Nov 23, 2014, 14:19 #61775

    Watched the Chelsea game before ours and am in awe of that team. All work,hard and know their job, even Hazard has matured and learned to defend under Mo. Plus they have Fabregas, one of my favorites and one of the best in his position. With Matic, Cahill, and Costa they have a great spine. Ours is Ramsey, Welbeck, and Per. Nice guys. But they don't and haven't gotten consistent results in ages. Arseblog blasted Wilshere but I like him and he of all plays better under Hodgson. He was his best when Cesc was here, before he was overplayed through his injury. Yet he like many is played with Ramsey and is regressing. Ramsey has been woeful, terrible. Why? Rosicky, a great player and tireless worker is in the shadows, thrown to the bench like an old towel. This clueless manager has no answers as he doesn't think there are any questions! I am beyond angry. I am disinterested now, at least compared to my usual enthusiasm. Losing just doesnt hurt as much as it used to. That is the biggest problem with us fans. Wenger has eroded our love for this game. He is a thief of our joy. And on $8 million a year, he should be replaced. Failure for 10 years in the PL is the only evidence needed for his removal. I agree with many, get in a hungry young coach. I prefer Pep or Martinez. But give them power, not unlimited, but cash to rebuild and retool. Then we could really fly. With Wenger, we have no wings anymore.

  205. Th14afc

    Nov 23, 2014, 14:15 #61774

    Depressing...very depressing,the best team lost tho but it's all so predictable

  206. c. duff

    Nov 23, 2014, 14:09 #61773

    Kroenke needs to share his vision for the club if he has one because business as usual aint working

  207. Hornsey Bill

    Nov 23, 2014, 14:05 #61772

    I'm generally a rational and fair minded bloke and despite the mediocrity we have endured since the move to the Emirates I continue to go to as many games as I can and support the team. I have grown increasingly frustrated with Wenger and his eccentric ways but this season I feel really ANGRY! I probably shouldn't feel real anger (Westie and Badarse would no doubt offer such counsel) but there are two things above all that have maddened me. 1) Failure to resign Fabregas 2) Total neglect of our defence The latter was blindingly obvious to the world and his wife and the arrogance of Wenger when trying to excuse himself from any sort of blame or responsibility makes my blood boil! We will never be serious contenders without a strong defence. A reliable defence spreads confidence throughout the team as everyone knows. And yet the highest paid manager in the league does nothing about it. Shameful! As for Szczesny 2nd rate Chamionship level player, I'm afraid. He never keeps us in a game unlike his counterpart de Gea yesterday. It would be nice to have someone between the sticks who had the ability to pull off something brilliant - we've had GKs like that in the past but these days it seems we have to settle for mediocrity. I don't blame him he's an average goalkeeper but that's it. - average! A club with our resources should have and can afford top class GK but Wenger sits on his hands. We are going nowhere until this defence is sorted out, but it's not on Wengers radar. My mood is not helped every time I hear another commentator / pundit laxing lyrical about the flair and influence the magnificent Cesc Fabregas ........ At Chelsea! ......Arrrrrrggh! Meanwhile Wenger draws a cool £8m a year. You say the fans are voting with their feet Kevin, I agree the "tourists and corporate clients" drift out before the end once the "show" is over, but the Southampton and Newcastle games sold out in minutes and whilst Kronke continues to harvest the money with full attendances he is happy. Cash is king and Lord Wenger can do what he wants, which these days is pretty much nothing!

  208. au revoir wenger

    Nov 23, 2014, 13:54 #61771

    good to see the wenger out flag hopefully we will see a lot more at future games.

  209. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 13:52 #61770

    Gaz, good point and one that has been touched on before, a case of the rolls been reversed if you like, but the AKB's can't say much (if anything)and any undermining they do try they will just have to be reminded (and they will too) they gave their messiah ten years.

  210. Alexthegooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 13:38 #61769

    I posted here 2 seasons ago and haven't been back since. The reason being my post warned of the real malaise at our club. It isn't Wenger. He has been finished as a top manager for some time and the inevitable fall from grace is being prolonged by the guilty parties involved, namely Kroenke and the board. I asked the question 2 seasons ago what happens when wenger goes. Nobody seemed interested then. The ineptitude of our manager will be short term; only as long as he remains at the club. The decisions of the board when he's gone will be far reaching and profound. A clueless board have the capability to send a club into freefall. This is such a board. They have allowed their employee to take the reins because they have no clue. Chips Keswick admitted so himself. We have to hope Kroenke will take the money and run when wenger goes. The man in waiting is Usmanov. Regardless of his pariah status as Russian oligarch he will have a plan and do his utmost to make it work. Like him or loathe him he is the future of this club so better get used to it. Blood may be shed but at least we will have awoken from our groundhog nightmare. Personally I say bring him on. A lot of sanctomonious crap has been flung at Abramovich but chelski are strolling to another prem trophy and 1 or 2 cups may be added. It is modern day football. Money talks. If people really find it so distasteful they should follow the romance and honesty of a local team. The prem league is for villains!

  211. KC

    Nov 23, 2014, 13:37 #61768

    Cheers Spike, being a supporter is a difficult thing to shake off. So after our dismal record against top sides for 5 years, after watching teams break on us game after game, after watching a squad being left with gapping holes, after watching Wenger buy cheap on defensive type players, after watching Wenger leave us short up front season after season, and now watching us slip further behind even though he nows has the money there are still people supporting him how the fu££ is this. These people in my opinion are not supporters or fans of our club their deluded Wenger fans REAL fans will be depressed by this shambolic season and wanting the best for the club. No top team ever wins major trophies when you pay no attention to defending and being aware when the opposition have the ball. We defend like a Sunday team it's been like this for years yet no change.

  212. WENGER MUST GO ASAP(MARCUS)

    Nov 23, 2014, 13:34 #61767

    If you can't beat a team with McNair, Blackett and smalling in Cb than you need to go. That's all I'm going to write

  213. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 13:24 #61766

    Mike Collins, there's a hell of a lot of us in the same position, and also a hell of a lot he's done that to, and as I've already said he'll never ever be forgiven for it.

  214. Bard

    Nov 23, 2014, 13:19 #61765

    Anti-Wenger; terrific post mate. you are absolutely right. You could put Wenger in charge of Bayern or Madrid and they would look as clueless as Arsenal these days.

  215. jjetplane

    Nov 23, 2014, 13:17 #61764

    Most yellow cards in the PL. Mainly awarded for attributes of cowardice in the line of duty. Have always said Wenger is no football man but just a diet, bum philosophy spouter and DVD voyeur so can we skip the accolades. A very long time ago he was just stealing the thunder of some very good players. Under a proper coach they may have been truly great. If mid week sees another humilation and then tits up at West Brom - I do believe the box of DVDs and diet sheets will have to be shipped out to Colorado as they plan his new career in American Soccer. Maybe his disciple Henry will play for him. You could not make it up.

  216. Spurrina

    Nov 23, 2014, 13:11 #61763

    February will be the time.

  217. anti-Wenger

    Nov 23, 2014, 13:06 #61762

    If LVG were to choose the best 11 from both teams yesterday, only Da Gea, shrek and Di-maria will make it into that list. The rest of the players including the bench would have been filled with Arsenal players. I tell you guys, it's not about which players we have or don't have. We may not have the best squad, but I believe it's only Chelsea and ManC that are better than us. If Mourinho had this same Arsenal squad, he'll win the League with it. Because he'll get them to fight, work harder, stay organised and do some tactics as well. The talent is there in abundance, it's just the leadership right from the bench that is lacking. As perfect as Chelsea squad is looking, if AW were to be their coach,the best they'll achieve is 3rd or 4th.

  218. Sarf Lunden

    Nov 23, 2014, 12:58 #61761

    Its the apathy I can't stand. The players just don't seem to care and the manager and Bould just sit down when things go wrong. Wenger then blames his players for been naive. Well those are his players and his tactic's. He just has no ideas. He is stuck in the past. The board made a massive mistake (albeit no one could have predicted Abramovich's arrival) in building the Emirates. That allowed Wenger to indulge in his project youth and playing tiki taka with "Barca lite" players. All I think now after every game is another 90 minutes closer to getting a new manager.

  219. Wenger Out

    Nov 23, 2014, 12:55 #61760

    Another shambles. A club falling apart. Die-hard fans leaving in droves. Shakespeare couldn't have written a more poignant tragedy. I've experienced it so many times now that it no longer hurts. But there's no fun either. Just numbness left. If Wenger had an ounce of dignity and integrity he'd be long-since gone.

  220. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 12:55 #61759

    I wonder who they have wheeled out today or will tomorrow to talk a good game and tell us where we went wrong and we'll learn from this and move on, or need I ask

  221. Jaffna Boy

    Nov 23, 2014, 12:52 #61758

    Kev, well said and about time everyone realise that we are going nowhere fast. A colleague at work gave up his Arsenal season ticket 4 years ago and we both agreed that we won't win a thing under Arsene's management.IMHO we were lucky to win the FA cup last year.The semi final was awful to watch. First time ever I left the game early yesterday, straight after Rooney scored. Kev I used to work for Deloittes and don't believe the lack of cash and Kronke management charges as disclosed in the accounts. I fairly certain you this already! Bad times ahead for the fans

  222. jjetplane

    Nov 23, 2014, 12:26 #61756

    Brave article KEVIN and in your position I understand how hard it must be that you/we are degraded to saying things like 'the old fool.' It would be cruel if he was on less reward 'for his (subtractive) efforts' than the whopping millions he has creamed off particularly over the past decade. He should have gone in 2004 and we would now be a team in satisfactory contention, week in, week out. It would not have been inconceivable that we would now have a squad to give Chelski the main thing to worry about. Listening to Mourinho speak yesterday about his team and the oppnents efforts was like the Dalai Lama in comparison to OGL. A myth has been built that Wenger is a lovely guy and knows his football. The reality is of an overpaid servant to the whims of disinterested billionaires and the only way out - Don't ****ing go! Believe me - it will be worth. Remember, we are Arsenal, not he chancers who saw an opportunity to do a sublime demolition job on a formerly great club. Look at Chelski too and see what a good coach can do with good players. Must be a few Arsenal players who wish they could **** off to West London if they were good enough. They are not and the fingers are solidly trained.

  223. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 12:21 #61755

    Kev no games are important anymore with this old fool in charge and we all know why, and lot of us have given up and wenger will never ever be forgiven for causing that, any legacy this old man had is ruined (and it has been for a long time and he has only himself to blame) we all know what he will be remembered for. Thankfully more and more fans are waking up at last (a lot have a long time ago)and now see what a lot already did, a useless, past it, has been, who should have walked or made walk a long time ago, instead of hanging around like a bad smell and nothing has changed, time to go old man

  224. Matt North Bank Lower

    Nov 23, 2014, 12:07 #61754

    Wenger quotes in programme notes. " I think we have learned to be patient and to wait for our chances. That will be vital again tonight " "We can score goals but we're maybe conceding too many at the moment". Clearly not!! Still perplexed how we did not take the worst United team in PL history, cannot fault the effort however the application at times goes beyond belief. As the old adage is you must score when on top. Wilshere, why not stick it away with his right foot as against Citeh (Rooney finished with his left) or square to Sanchez as TH or DB would have done 10 years ago. Less said about the 119 formation at 1-0 down with 15 minutes to go plus 8 mins of injury time. Simply not good enough, Klopp or Guardiola anyone?

  225. Gaz

    Nov 23, 2014, 11:51 #61753

    Good grief. I can't believe there are fans who still want Wenger to change! He won't change-ever-and the choice is a simple one. You want change? You want a new manager. You want Wenger to stay? Expect more of this **** and repeat every twelve months...

  226. John Abrehart

    Nov 23, 2014, 11:46 #61752

    To me the Editor's summary was factual and honest. In my opinion we need a football man on the board of directors, even if non-executive in order to properly advise them of the real situation. I imagine Sir Chips' game is rugger and as for the Americans……..don't even go there. It appears that the only feedback the board get of how the football is going is from the manager himself. That's like asking Billy Bunter if he is happy with cream cakes. I don't mean a 'Director of Football' to whom the manager is responsible; I agree with Wenger there, if you are in control it should be total control of all things football. However, a board of directors without a member having specific knowledge of the company's product seems rather strange. To me, a stand out choice would be Frank Mc Lintock and if Wenger was to oppose such a selection it would tell us all we need to know.

  227. maguiresbridge gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 11:38 #61751

    Another nail hammered into the old frauds coffin i'm surprised there's any room left even so i suppose news of his resignation this morning or even it been offered was to much to ask for, I doubt he even considered it such is his ego, but it's early yet we can still hope and pray. I thought the old fraud would have came up smelling of roses last night(he always does when need be)but not this time his luck had to run out sometime and no get out of jail card to play he only keeps them for small teams wait man yoo aren't exactly a big team these days the worst for a very long time and he still can't beat them and he never will again he just doesn't know how or ant team for that matter. Yes enough is enough, time to get this old has been out of our club before it's to late and he destroys it completely that's if it isn't already, and he already has.

  228. Wenger fan

    Nov 23, 2014, 11:30 #61750

    The first goal is unlucky and I hope the defense will improve after Debuchy comes back. I still prefer the manager to change rather than changing the manager.

  229. Mathew

    Nov 23, 2014, 11:20 #61749

    The mood has been dampened and yesterday was our chance to beat them to the bushes. I thought our defense was the poorest in the league but United's were worst. I wish we could've gone for Wiliams and Schnederlin to strengthen our defense. No hopes for a 4th spot now and BVB will tear us apart midweek.

  230. Jumpers for Goalposts

    Nov 23, 2014, 11:02 #61748

    I've wanted Wenger to go since May 2009. It's taken a while but the vast majority of us also want him to go now. This awful tortuous decline will continue until he and Kroenke are gone - SO WHY AREN'T WE DOING ANYTHING ABOUT IT???? We need to stop whingeing and organise some proper protests.

  231. Ian Ure's Son

    Nov 23, 2014, 11:01 #61747

    Anyone want my tickets for West Brom away next week?! I can't stand the pain or embarrassment anymore. Wenger is not up to it, but strangely he was when Dein was around, or was that just a coincidence? As the Chips Keswick quote at the start of the article shows, the real problem is Kroenke and Gazadis not being able or willing to handle him. With Kroenke in control, The risk is nothing will improve even if Wenger is replaced. But let's test that with Jurgen Klopp or Pep Guardiola.

  232. Shu

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:57 #61746

    Unless the crowd turn nothing at all will change

  233. Gaz

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:57 #61745

    Worst thing about this is that Wenger has managed to dived the fans to such an extent that thet there'll always be 'fighting' amongst the two rival groups now. I mean when Wenger hopefully goes and a new man comes in its pretty obvious that the WOBs will be giving him every chance to succeed whilst the AKBs will be undermining him at every opportunity and reminding us that 'we've' go what we deserve. Its inevitable...

  234. mark h

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:52 #61744

    If Wenger goes and I hope soon does anyone have any confidence in this board to chose the right successor? The torture may not stop when you expect it to.

  235. Aylesbury Gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:43 #61743

    Totally agree with what you say Kev.But can someone please tell me what Steve Bould is actually there for as he you never see him utter a word or move from his comfortable seat. Do we have any player with the backbone to stand up to that 'specialist in failure!' and tell this is how things should be done,don't think we do.

  236. Wibblefish

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:38 #61742

    There's no point talking about the football anymore. Did anybody see Pixie Lott's Charlseton on strictly last night? Just watched it on the I player. Surely that should have been 4 tens!

  237. Spike

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:35 #61741

    KC, your loyalty is commendable and fans like you deserve much better. My last game was a 3-0 v Spuds, cannot even remember the year but as I handed over 60 quid for my seat in the upper tier, I just decided there and then it was too expensive and have not been back since. I now feel the same as many posters on here, each game, win or lose, just washes over me. My AFC has been replaced with Kroenke Sports Enterprises London, England franchise and it's not for me. For what it's worth, my choice would be Carlo Ancelloti and we should have grabbed him when Chelski let him go. A good organiser who runs a professional back room staff, coaches well and knows how to win in the PL. He would keep the club top four and give something to build on. Trouble is, he may be tough to get now and the board probably don't even know who he is.

  238. Exeter Gunner

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:30 #61739

    The paradox of Wenger: A man who demands absolute control at the club... except when the matches are underway. Then he just sits there.

  239. Bard

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:29 #61738

    Arsenal have become a self fulfilling prophecy. I hardly bothered when Jack missed that sitter and we didnt score because you knew we are an accident waiting to happen. defensively. Good post Kev and agree wholeheartedly with the sentiments. In mitigation I did think the first 20 mins were the best of the season so far. I don't think we can blame the players, there is a good squad there, they just don't have a coherent tactical plan. They look like a Sunday side frankly. I agree with Rob. There will only be change when the fans turn on the manager. My sense of yesterday around 10 mins to go is that they have given up but are too loyal to shout abuse. Maybe they feel sorry Wenger. He is clearly a dead man walking. What happens in the next fews weeks or months will not be pretty. Something needs to change but as a famous old woman once said 'this lady aint for turning'. Wenger cannot change even if he wanted to. Like many on here I don't feel angry but indifferent its like watching a car crash on repeat.

  240. HowardL

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:26 #61737

    Spot on Kev - I was pretty down after the Swansea defeat but this one seemed so inevitable after those first half misses. Martyn is right - despite the lowest points in 32 years at this stage we are only two points off 4th place - and that is EXACTLY the problem.

  241. Gooner67

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:22 #61736

    I stopped going after March 2012 as every season it would be the same laborious ****e every season under Wenger I thought at the time. Surprise surprise absolutely nothing has changed apart from winning the FA Cup with great difficulty against Hull City. We can look forward to 3 more years of this predictable passing football from Wenger unless he start losing the club revenue not qualifying for the CL or the Emirates is half full.

  242. Bob

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:22 #61735

    You reckon a club hierarchy that has been willing to hang onto Wenger this long will necessarily be able to deliver a better manager who is likely to bring success? Be grateful Malky MacKay just got a job as he's probably at the right pay grade for the board's liking.

  243. Trev

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:18 #61734

    @Trevisamook I think he does enjoy it. That's nothing to do with IQ. I read his posts and the worse we are the more joy there is in his writing. After we won the FA Cup he sounded desolate. I like your name BTW @Goongoonergone we are clearly very poor at the moment. I don't deny that. I'd like us to start winning though.

  244. Mark

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:18 #61733

    Both goals show how bad things are. The keeper has never been good enough and created panic and Gibbs lost his head; the second goal was like an under 9s game. So embarrassing when a professional team all go forward at the same time and none of them have the intelligence to drop back and cover. Utterly pathetic.

  245. Hiccup

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:11 #61732

    Truly hilarious! 4-2 up against spurs with a minute left, the tactics are go gung-ho. One down with half hour left, the tactics are go gung-ho. The silver lining behind yesterday is the official disbandment of the AKB movement. Their last line of defence of who can you replace wenger with truly up in smoke. Pick any Sunday pub manager and I'm sure they can maintain these basketball tactics that wenger has installed. Roll on Wednesday for more fun and frolics.

  246. AMG

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:11 #61731

    The best article I've read in a long time Kevin. After the Wilshere miss I think we all knew what was coming and ultimately found it hard to get upset about it. Just a sad situation, where 75% of the fan base are completely apathetic towards the results of the team. It says a lot that for years my old man would call me after or during every game so that we could carry out a post-mortem of the performance, or wax lyrical about some budding superstar - It's not happened once this season and when we do talk of Arsenal, it's 'what will make the old fraud leave?' Sad sad times at Arsenal, get on yer bike Wenger, please! Finally, is it true that some fans had 'Wenger Out' banners confiscated at the ground?

  247. Trevisamook

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:09 #61730

    TREV - I don't think the Editor enjoys it. He is resigned to it. Now please try and up your IQ you numpty...

  248. Nick

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:05 #61729

    Great article . so glad I sub let my season ticket. I realised two years ago that the frustration at lack of tactics and Wenger's arrogance woud exacerbate my emotional distress to a point where for my own sanity I could not attend the corporate toilet we call a stadium as I would end up being violent. We have had Arsenal fans fighting each other and I predict this will occur again. It is like a civil war .the board are satisfied with financial gain and football mediocrity. There are fans who cannot envisage life without Wenger and the likes of myself with memories of Highbury and a once dignified if sometimes **** football team. But we had class. Now we are a joke. The only way to be herd is to stop going. Support your non league team they deserve passionate loyal support and grieve the once great AFC who passed away in 2006.

  249. KC

    Nov 23, 2014, 10:02 #61728

    Kevin - great article, the frustration of this slow death watching the same mistakes and weaknesses week in week out. The results record against the top sides again and again. I would just add the complete lack of man management and zero discipline that comes from wengers trust of players. Sadly I'm in two minds about renewing my St next season as this torture is very expensive. The club requires a complete new start our manager is a lost deluded arrogant very rich man that will only listen once the Emirates crowd turn but they seem to have amazing patience.

  250. Gaz

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:58 #61727

    Summed up the whole sorry situation pretty well there Kev. Was at the game and quite frankly in all my 40 years of going over to 'the Arsenal' I've never felt so flat. Theres no way I'm going back until he's gone because its just not enjoyable or worth it any more. I'm sure you all know this anyway but in 33 games over 5 years against the big 3 (Utd, City and Chelsea)we've won just 5. Now some fans will try and convince you that we simply can't compete with these sides because they have so much more cash than us. Ok, how about the fact that in that same 5 year period we've either lost or failed to win on 40 occasions against sides who aren't anywhere near us in terms of size, history or wealth! I'm talking about sides such as Hull, Wigan, Norwich, QPR, Sunderland, Stoke....the list goes on and on and on. Wenger has sucked all the life out of me as far as supporting Arsenal goes and it realy is purgatory supporting us right now...

  251. Simon

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:56 #61726

    Leicester i repeat Leicester put 5 passed Man Utd.I used to hurt when Arsenal lost.I dont care anymore.We could lose the next 20 games and it wouldnt bother me.Thats what Wenger has turned me into.I am only looking forward to one thing the day Wenger goes.Remind me why we moved from Highbury?

  252. Mike Collins

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:52 #61725

    I agree with Kev about feeling numb. I watched on TV and, in the old days, cats, dogs, spouse and relatives had to wear tin hats as I tended to get "animated", like being back on the old North Bank. I did rise from the sofa when Wilshere was put through but after that truly shocking miss I knew United would win... and for the first time ever I simply did not care. AW has destroyed my faith in - and passion for - Arsenal now, and I wait for the new blood who I hope will restore both. We need the future now!

  253. Goongoonergone

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:51 #61724

    @ Trev: "This is an odd situation. The editor of an Arsenal fanzine appears to enjoy defeats more than wins. - Post No. 65080" Respectfully, Trev, remind me when last we have won, and when last did we defeat the big boys. Must we also applaud possession and while we watch mind-numbing losses to Swansea, et al for the same reasons that has now been going on for ten seasons?

  254. Chris Nottingham

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:48 #61723

    Newcastle 's resurgence is based on not conceding, Chelsea 2-0 up against 10 men at half time just shut the second half down, Wenger would have chased more & drawn 4-4 like at Newcastle years ago. Taxi for Wenger

  255. We could have signed Messi

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:42 #61722

    Welbeck has the same amount of league goals as Giroud.Wait a minute Giroud has been out for 3 months!!! I said the only way Wenger will leave Arsenal is in a box.The board will never sack him he wont resign and the sheep will still turn up at the Emirates.We will not finish top 4 this year,But Wenger will still be our manager.Sadly Wenger still has his supporters.

  256. Gggggoner

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:41 #61721

    Bang on the money. I would rather we got hammered by a better team than endure the frustration of watching super talented players being wasted. When will the blinkered board realise that the emperor is naked?

  257. Peter Wain

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:40 #61720

    another poor performance from a porr squad. Quite what our transfer policy is I am not sure anybody knows. The need for two defenders and two 6 foot plus central midfield players has been obvious for four or five years. Why we did not buy Fabregas and sell Cazorla in the summer is unbelievable. We are mid table nediocrity going no down fast.

  258. vinnie

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:35 #61719

    Yes I agree with this article. Also we are very predictable against the top teams not just that we usually get a bad result but the manner in which it happens. There's no doubt arsene can create good teams that play good football but his tactical ability is not very good. The United team we saw yesterday were probably the worst since about 1991 and we still cannot beat them

  259. Rob

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:33 #61718

    He won't quit - unless the Fans turn en mass. I don't think they will. Kronke won't sack him because he doesn't care and seldom attends. The rest of the Board - Chips and co - might as well not be there for the difference they make. The only conclusion is a minimum of 2.1/2 more years of this. That's an awful lot of 'torture' to endure. Sanchez certainly won't. He'll be gone. And I suspect others. Having correctly damned Wenger, even Paul Merson turned round and said he wants him to stay !! What will it take for someone in a real position of authority in Arsenal's history to stand up and tell Wenger - he has to go. My money's on Frank Mclintock. It's about the last hope I've got.

  260. Martyn

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:32 #61717

    Only two points off fourth place!

  261. Trev

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:23 #61716

    This is an odd situation. The editor of an Arsenal fanzine appears to enjoy defeats more than wins.

  262. John F

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:22 #61715

    Arsenal remind me of Forest under Clough when the directors were too slow to take action due to his personality and past successes.Arsenal looked disorganized and an average side .These were quotes from my friend a Forest fan who I watched the match with.Its hard to disagree when you see BFG upfront with the ball on the left wing with 20 mins still to go.Surely when you are only one goal down you do not allow your defenders to leave us exposed like they did.I did feel that we were very unlucky with the first goal as Gibbs was fouled but the away team scoring on one of there few attacks is sadly not too unexpected.That was the worst Utd team I have seen in a long time and we still lost.

  263. Alsace Lorraine de Totteridge

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:22 #61714

    The Champions League place is the crucial thing. If we go into freefall, money will talk. Let's hope.

  264. tippytappynevershooty

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:15 #61713

    Agree with every word, this blinkered, stubborn arrogant man has managed to extinguish any semblance of passion in this club, and made it impossible for us to believe in any of his teams. Arsenal is not our club - it is a vehicle for his ego unfortunately, I predict this will unravel quite quickly this season, he has been getting away with murder ever since he sold Edu, stripped Gilberto of the captaincy and put Almunia in goal, no point listing all his failings as a coach, everyone can see them - the man is spent

  265. Where's Wally is a Gooner

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:14 #61712

    Could someone please give me the phone number of the genius who gave Wenger a new three year deal. I've got some investment ideas for him.

  266. Mark from aylesbury

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:04 #61711

    Been ages since I commented but one statement summed it up from Kevin. Why is it our English lads look so much better in the England line up! Bloody obvious isn't it!

  267. GoonGer

    Nov 23, 2014, 9:03 #61710

    Great article Kevin, as ever.. No Hope!! I sit watching in a trance waiting for the inevitable!! We are "HOPE"-LESS!! He won't go, but he must, it is just dreadful

  268. B Fawlty

    Nov 23, 2014, 8:56 #61709

    Well said and summed up the feeling of numbness after the game. Does anyone have any actual belief that OGL will be removed?

  269. ALAN WHIFFIN

    Nov 23, 2014, 8:53 #61708

    Spot on at £8 million a year as well.Nearly 3 more years please no.