Bore Draw but Job Nearly Done

Online Ed: Shares spoiled at Old Trafford



Bore Draw but Job Nearly Done


Ed’s Note. I was unable to catch the game against Manchester United yesterday, so my thanks to Gooner contributor and podcast regular David Oudôt for stepping into the breach with the following report. Normal service will be resumed for the remaining matches this season.

The immediate reaction to the lacklustre and underwhelming performance on Monday at home to Swansea was treated by everyone as just “one of those days” and with the team having been so brilliant for the preceding 10 weeks we were justified in expecting normal service to be resumed at Old Trafford. For Wenger's team to then do a Groundhog Day effort and produce exactly the same performance at Old Trafford was very worrying, and if it weren't for the deflected own goal to give them a completely underserved 1-1 draw against a very weak and penetrable ManYoo side, the last two games would be trickier to say the least.

The game kicked off with Arsenal travelling at a snail's pace and was sadly reminiscent of their games against United, Chelsea, and Citeh prior to the Etihad Stadium visit earlier this year as the Gunners had a “right, just don't f*** it up” sense of nervousness and simply didn't get going. Passes going astray, no movement off the ball by the other players, and this served only to encourage a United side who are weak and there for the taking without Rooney. After being so good since the turn of the year, Cazorla and Coquelin in particular were poor yesterday, failing to get the ball to any of the four attacking players and giving possession away in their own half.

However, with Arsenal being so poor, the home side stepped up and looked to get the first goal which didn't seem a surprise when it went in. The goal was similar to that conceded against Swansea as what is becoming clear is that if you stick a cross over in the air it will scare the defensive unit as a whole, and will leave a player open, who then has a simple chance. Herrera finished well, but questions must be raised as to how and why he was left in so much space as United's only form of attack from kick off was to send crosses into the far post in and around Fellaini.

After that very little happened for the remainder of the first half and as with the Swansea encounter Arsenal failed to register a shot on target until after the interval, when Giroud was thwarted by having to use his right foot and De Gea further proved that he is the best goalkeeper in the League. Whilst Wenger’s side obviously have room for improvement in the squad even though they have had a slight improvement on last season, van Gaal will have to rebuild his entire squad for the second summer in a row and replacing his goalkeeper with one of a similar quality will be impossible.

Arsenal did not change until substitutions were made which brought the best out of the side. In his worst game of the season so far, Cazorla was rightly replaced by Wilshere with Bellerin going off for Walcott. This saw Ramsey being moved from the right hand side into the middle and to give him credit it helped prove the point he wanted to make to Wenger, in that he is a far better player in the middle of the park. For the first hour he, like Ozil, was completely redundant as his team could not get the ball out of their own half towards him, but by putting the Welshman in there to do it himself, he showed what an engine and all-round, Gerrard-esque game he has. He went to seize the ball himself and look to move forward at pace and create a chance for the attackers, and his perfect 40 yard cross-field ball to Walcott led to the equaliser. After that both teams had gentle prods at each other but as per a lot of cricket Test Matches in the final session on the fifth day, if one captain offered the other a draw they would have taken it.

Despite it being a point the visitors didn't necessarily deserve after their woeful opening 60 minutes, the fact is that they got the point needed, and if Arsenal are to get one win from either of the Sunderland or WBA games then the job is done and they will have qualified for the Champions League without having to negotiate an August qualifier. It's still a massive shame that by dropping three points at home on Monday the Gunners will almost certainly have to settle for third place rather than second, although it's probably more appropriate for them to finish there as that is what they are at most. The third best team in the country. And hopefully that will make Wenger and the Board realise there is still a lot for them to do this summer and look to improve in every area that the side need to.

Twitter@DavidOudot.

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  1. maguiresbridge gooner

    May 20, 2015, 13:14 #71273

    Tony Evans, and they probably will, and then do the right thing and not allow him on the open top bus.

  2. maguiresbridge gooner

    May 20, 2015, 12:44 #71271

    DWT, not posted in a while but still as relevant as ever.

  3. Tony Evans

    May 20, 2015, 9:20 #71261

    DW Thomas - Agree with all you are saying. I am trying to remain positive but it is very difficult when I can't even trust the manager not to screw things up against Villa. The Pole in goal, Ramsey (clearly out of position) out wide and more than likely no homework done on the opposition - just an arrogant assumption that he doesn't need to. I just hope the team wins in spite of him, and comes out of the blocks raring to go - and not with the tortoise like casual stroll they started with against Hull.

  4. DW Thomas

    May 20, 2015, 3:41 #71259

    Haven't posted in awhile as this is all so boring now. We don't compete and never complete the team. Wenger is so past it you can't take him seriously anymore. We got completely luck with Walcott's goal. For over 10 years now he has failed at winning the two big trophies. 10 YEARS!!! The club is a poser, a wannabe champion. Same goes for the players. How many clubs have sold their captains only for them to come back and win the title for a rival?? Maybe it's more than you think. Still, the club and team reek of failure. Only losers can make this many excuses about losing for this long. Nothing will change until a whole overhaul is done. Board, manager, and many players.

  5. Ho Hum

    May 19, 2015, 16:48 #71252

    Neither of the record signings mentioned were bought from a position of strength. We had a shocking first half of 71/72 and were mid-table by the time Bally arrived at Christmas, and 91/92 also started badly before we decided to splash the cash on Wrighty.

  6. Westlower

    May 19, 2015, 16:06 #71249

    @Ron, My point is that Arsenal did attempt to stay at the top after winning the league titles in 71 & 91 by breaking the clubs transfer record to strengthen a championship winning team but results show it didn't have the desired effect either occasion. Every big transfer is a gamble of sorts.

  7. Ron

    May 19, 2015, 15:40 #71246

    Oddly enough Westie im aware of those purchases too, but what pray tell is yr point? What do transactions 44 and 24 yrs ago have to do with todays game? Your comments talk of 'big names'. By far the large majority of transfers dont involve stellar names and i dont see people shouting for us to buy your Bales and Ronaldos et al. The stark truth is that AFC often go into extended periods of relying on inadequate players. We did it under Wright, under Mee, Under Neill, under Howe and under GG. We re doing it under Wenger now in my view. We re also a Cup team now. Our history shows we buy when its often too late or we panic buy. Indeed Ball had an element of a panic gamble in it as he was bought during a time when he was starting his decline and wasn't wanted in the dressing room. My point is that buying quality performers when a team is at the top is the time to do it. Its doesn't follow that transfer records have to be broken to do it. AW is far to prone to apply cheap sticking plaster. Its imprinted on his record. Hes likely to do it again too. I wont mention the names of the players who represent the sticking plaster as there are far too many and we all know who they are.

  8. Westlower

    May 19, 2015, 14:55 #71245

    @Ron, After we won Div.1 in 71 we bought Alan Ball for a national record fee of £220,000. In 91 we bought Ian Wright for a club record fee of £2.5m. The common denominator is that on both occasions we morphed into a cup team & with the exception of 72/73 (runners up to Liverpool) we never challenged for the title again under the existing management. Bringing in a big name can often backfire, as it can disrupt a harmonious dressing room. George Graham letting Martin Keown leave for Aston Villa for £200k because he asked for a £50 a week pay rise is probably the best example of Arsenal being skinflints. It cost them £2m to buy him back from Everton 7 years later.

  9. Lord Froth

    May 19, 2015, 12:04 #71238

    I think it was just one of those days to be honest, it's just that it happened against Man U. There are several times that we've been all over them and lost so it was good to nick a point considering that's all we really needed. Wilshere looked fresh and if him and Oxlade can ever be fit for an extended period then we have two very capable players that like to drive at the opposition defenders and cause problems. Even Welbeck's work rate can be useful when he's available even though he's goal shy. What did disappoint me though was Ozil being shot shy. He really needs to have more confidence in front of goal but chooses to pass when a half chance has opened up and could force the rebound or deflected goal.

  10. Bard

    May 19, 2015, 10:48 #71234

    Good post Ron; Arsenal have always been tight, thats why they have the moniker the Bank of England. FFP was never going to work, that was a delusion. We have Usmanov so we can compete if we want to. I wont rehash all the old arguments about why that wont happen, thats been done to death.

  11. Ron

    May 19, 2015, 10:27 #71231

    Hi Westie - money always did rule football. How else did Utd and Liverpool largely dominate the post war years? Only Wolves in the 50s and to a lesser degree Everton and Arsenal made imprints on those Clubs and the latter 3 Clubs were minted at the time. Be honest, Arsenals frugality isnt a feature of the post RA and Mansour yrs, they've always been skinflints and never bought well whilst at the top. Thats why we always deflate like a party balloon once we ve win a title. Wengers a godsend to this Board and keeps our much vaunted prudence intact and to hell with football achievement. Theyre loaded and mugging off the fans and many are still falling for it. The Chelsea and City thing is over rated. FFP was a UEFA inspired mish mash designed to look after the top European Clubs like Barca and Munich. In any event, the cash comparisons isnt the sole reason for the Club drifting in its own sea of mediocrity, thats just spin. Poor quality players and tactics are as much to blame and its obvious to those of us who wish to see and recognise it. Wenger and Arsenal have proclaimed the merits of FFP as its been their default position for a while now feeding their spin to blame the other Clubs for keeping Arsenal in the shade. FFP was never going to work. Why shdt a rich guy buy a small football Club and spend his cash on it? They dont have unlimited resources and still need a top Coach. Chelsea have done well because theyve had better Coaches than Wenger and have an owner who doesnt tolerate being an also ran, thats the bottom line. Same at City. AFC have the capacity to be the equal of any Club domestically. That they arent is their choice. They sold us a pup with that stadium shift.

  12. Ho Hum

    May 19, 2015, 10:26 #71230

    Make that ancestors.

  13. Ho Hum

    May 19, 2015, 10:23 #71229

    Westlower- I think we can be certain that none of your descendants were standing alongside Wellington at Waterloo. We'd have all been speaking French by teatime.

  14. Westlower

    May 19, 2015, 8:33 #71218

    @Ron, The 'penny pinching' criteria could be about to get a whole lot worse with the news that FFP is about to be modified. Any massive investment from the owner now will be classed as a 'gift' rather than a loan. As long as the owner(s) are happy with this amendment then spending will be limitless. The Mail sum it up thus: Arsenal, Bad news as they are a well run & rules protected them: Chelsea, Free to spend Abramovich's billions: Man City, No more restrictions and, in theory, unlimited spending. Football as we once knew it, is dead and buried. Money totally rules, OK! It'll be almost incidental who the coach is as Chelsea have already demonstrated, winning silverware with at least 8 different coaches since Abramovich's arrival & Man City 2 PL wins came under different coaches. Money will decide who wins, not the coaches.

  15. Tony Evans

    May 19, 2015, 8:09 #71215

    Westie - certainly agree with you on the injury front - which at the moment seems to be getting much better. It's a massive bonus when you have a full squad at your disposal but Wenger must have the courage to use it and if that means dropping under-performing favourites then so be it.

  16. AJAAFC

    May 19, 2015, 8:07 #71214

    Reasonable summing up of the game. But there really aren't many things worse than a grown man using slang names for other teams.

  17. Joe S.

    May 19, 2015, 5:50 #71213

    Dear old Westie must have special access to the Great Wegner's strategical thinking to be able to elaborate the game plan in so much detail. From where I sit this is a very privileged position indeed for a mere fan who to my no knowledge has never worked in professional football.

  18. Flozzie

    May 19, 2015, 5:38 #71212

    Melbourne Victory wins the double! (And an Aussie to coach the pom cricket team) - oh my, what next?

  19. maguiresbridge gooner

    May 18, 2015, 23:10 #71211

    John F, not a chance, he's an arse licker too.

  20. Ho Hum

    May 18, 2015, 23:03 #71210

    Westlower- Since we last won the PL in 2003-04, Liverpool have twice mounted proper title challenges that have lasted to the final 2 weeks of the season despite not having the financial resources of a Chelsea or a Man City. Please could you tell me why we have not been able to manage that? Genuine question, thank you. The Arsenal fans who champion mediocrity and stagnation make me want to weep.

  21. maguiresbridge gooner

    May 18, 2015, 22:57 #71209

    Bard, are you sure your not reading a back issue from eight years ago.

  22. John F

    May 18, 2015, 22:55 #71208

    I think the announcer can play a role in getting the message to Wenger about playing Ramsey out wide as nothing else will work.He can play songs with slight changes to the title such as out wide and legless,I want to be stuck in the middle with you,The B Gees I'm on the wing and I need a prayer and the last one that always enters my mind is The Killers For reasons unknown.

  23. Bard

    May 18, 2015, 21:43 #71207

    Read Wally in the London Evening Standard saying that there are no excuses for failure next season. He obviously hasnt seen the AKB manifesto. Under the section 'in the event of failure' the following are always relevant. We dont have enough money. We have bad luck with injuries. The referees are against us. The media are against us. The weather is too cold or too warm. The Wobs are responsible. Perm any one for the above and away we go for seasons 2015, 16 ,17.

  24. Hiccup

    May 18, 2015, 21:01 #71206

    Can we have some confirmation on who wrote this piece please? I actually thought it was a Simon Rose article? Bring back Polly!

  25. Ron

    May 18, 2015, 20:41 #71205

    Carry on being blinkered Westie. Most proper fans want us to COMPETE not clean up and run off with all the silver each season. Those Clubs do compete. Arsenal dont. They instead choose have a self imposed bar based on penny pinching criteria. Yr selective and deliberately limited comprehension of opposing views to yours has long since become too tiresome to be taken seriously to be quite honest.

  26. Westlower

    May 18, 2015, 19:44 #71204

    Since we last won the PL in 03/04, it has been won exclusively by the 3 richest clubs. Man U x 5; Chelsea x 4 & Man City x 2. No Dortmund's or Atletico's in there chaps?

  27. maguiresbridge gooner

    May 18, 2015, 19:30 #71203

    jw, yes and after the way it was going to make us great again, and put manners on the big boys, and create a level playing field, and as usual it was lapped up and believed, you couldn't make it up, Quack Quack.

  28. Stan

    May 18, 2015, 19:12 #71202

    Westlower fan - Where does the "Website Editor" complain about getting a draw? Clue: Perhaps you might want to re-read the whole article with particular attention to the opening paragraph in italics.

  29. maguiresbridge gooner

    May 18, 2015, 19:09 #71201

    Tony Evans, 75103, great post, and it's not a theory it's fact. Post of the day so far.

  30. Westlower fan

    May 18, 2015, 19:04 #71200

    Quote from last week: "If you gave me a draw there now I’d bite your hand off." Unbelievable inconsistency by Website Editor to have mixed feeling about the draw. I for one am decidedly elated.

  31. Hiccup

    May 18, 2015, 18:55 #71199

    Disagree with the 'job nearly done' headline. The job was done a month ago when 4th was secured. The fact that the annual mission was completed ahead of schedule, ie the last game of the season, I think it's unfair to start moving the goalposts of the company's kpi and creating further goals? Since 13 teams are apparently in a relegation battle from the start of the season, which truly shows the state of the PL, finishing 3rd or 4th out of the remaining 7 teams is truly exceptional. Until the Racing Post tells us different, let's keep our feet firmly on the ground with our fixation with 4th place.

  32. Alsace

    May 18, 2015, 17:40 #71198

    Have Villa fans been disrespectful to Jamerson? He seems very animated by them. Perhaps he is just psyching himself up. Just as well that he is because trust me, Wenger hasn't noticed their improvement. We will have to work very hard in the final to avoid a banana skin. How I would love to see Arsenal come out of the traps very rapidly indeed and put the game to bed in the first 20 minutes. Back in the real world however, we support Arsenal not Man United, so it will be gut-wrench city - as is usual.

  33. maguiresbridge gooner

    May 18, 2015, 17:38 #71197

    TJ, and that's a stat you'll not hear on here to often in defence of OGL.

  34. Bard

    May 18, 2015, 17:33 #71196

    I'm sightly surprised by the posts. What was so shocking about yesterday ? We were bullied for an hour as we usually are against the better teams and could have been out of the game before half time. We were overrun in midfield. We werent at it mentally. We had 3 or 4 great chances to win the game and Giroud missed the lot. Surely none of that is a surprise if youve been paying attention this season. Having said all that we put in a good shift for the last half and hour and got a draw. Of course we're several players short as we have been for the last 10 years. Westie is still banging on about the financial differences. Nothing changes

  35. maguiresbridge gooner

    May 18, 2015, 17:28 #71195

    David, i can't believe your one of these fans who actually think or keep thinking that OGL is going to change and is eventually going to do what needs to be done after all this time, but i suppose we all need something to cling on to.

  36. jeff wright

    May 18, 2015, 17:06 #71194

    Uefa have announced that the so called 'fair-play' rules are to be 'relaxed' in time for the next transfer window. This nonsense was always a dead duck in the water and doomed to fail.

  37. Ho Hum

    May 18, 2015, 17:02 #71193

    Westlower- Yep the richest clubs win most of the time, never heard anyone dispute that rule. But it's those inconveniently frequent exceptions that reveal exceptional managers who merit exceptional wages. We haven't got one of those.

  38. Know Man

    May 18, 2015, 16:52 #71192

    @westlower, Wenger doesn't have a clue. Have you watched our recent decent run, we've beaten teams we should be beating and just about got over the line in games versus Reading, QPR, Southampton to name a few! He's tactically inept, brings on Wally when a defence is sitting deep and will not make a change until the 70th minute?! He has stumbled upon a winning formula and named an unchanged team, then says they're tired after the Swansea game, then plays the same team against Utd! He's running Alexis into the ground, he's now running on vapours. Yes Wenger clearly knows what he's doing. Let's buy Gabriel who needs bedding in and not ready for EPL. He has ruined Chambers too who at the start of the season was a revelation.

  39. Ron

    May 18, 2015, 16:22 #71191

    Inter AC Marseille Apoel Benfica Dortmund Roma Fenerbahce et al. All cash rich giants, paying lusty wages i suppose eh Westie and yet all at least Qtr Finalists in the CL over the last 7 years while Wenger has been ......... well, we ll say no more, but Keep trying by all means! Seems to be loads of 'exceptions' though? You must be tired?

  40. Westlower

    May 18, 2015, 16:20 #71190

    @Tony Evans, It's too simplistic to say Wenger only plays his pets. Too often it's been a case of who's fit and able to play. Our consistent winning period has coincided with a settled team because of players returning from long term injuries. What a strong bench we have now. The right back position in particular has been a season long problem, with Debuchy only able to play 8 PL games in that position. Ramsey is a strong box to box player but he's infinitely better running forwards than tracking backwards. The balance of the team has been affected by injuries for large chunks of the season. Chelsea by comparison have been virtually injury free, maybe they wouldn't be so lucky next season. Oh, for an Arsenal season with just a 'normal' injury rate. I'm sure Man U would concur. Being able to miss the ECL qualifiers gives me belief that we can get off to a flyer next season.

  41. jeff wright

    May 18, 2015, 16:12 #71189

    Westie,this we are below Chelsea and City in wages (so were United with the jock in charge but he still won titles) Leaving all that aside ( yawn) though it still doesn't explain Wenger's bizarre policies and decisions. Obviously 5 years of Almunia is enough to give anyone an headache on its own before we even get down to other issues. Also a club that can't set out it's stall to compete properly for the league title should not be in a 65k seater stadium charging the highest prices in world football for tickets and paying the manager 8m a year plus big bucks bonuses to the likes of Ivan for just doing his job, that he already gets well paid for doing, and giving hand-outs to Stan for the 'advice ' that he provided. More like to help pay off the interest on the loot that he borrowed to pay the former shareholders with for their shares that he now holds.The first big offer he gets for them will see him gone faster than you can say Howdy ! You couldn't make it up.

  42. Tony Evans

    May 18, 2015, 15:57 #71188

    Ron - Yes Wenger is only now grudgingly accepting that you need to have more than tikki takki to your game to succeed. He's not happy about it though is he and will never go far enough for us to compete with the physicality of teams like Chelsea. Now I will have Jamerson after me saying all I want is 'hoof ball' which is not true at all. I just want Arsenal to able to compete with each and every team they come up against, and to be able match teams both with skill and physical strength. Now there used to be a team like that I remember from years gone by that played at Highbury!

  43. Westlower

    May 18, 2015, 15:34 #71187

    @Ho Hum No surprise that A.Madrid's wage bill is lower than QPR as there's usually a trail of devastation left behind by wide boy 'Arry. Atletico are currently in their natural financial position of 3rd, 16 points off the top & 12 behind the 2nd. Liverpool nearly pulled it off last year. It's the exceptions that prove the rule. Whether we like it or not we are still not at the financial level of both Manchester clubs & Chelsea.

  44. Ron

    May 18, 2015, 15:27 #71186

    Augustus - True. Utd were allowed to play yesterday for an hour or so as our dainty flowers scratched about gingerly hoping they wouldnt get an OT mullering again, but that aside they were stacks better than last November when they won at the bowl. They passed it to each other with purpose and their physicality was there for all to see. AFC on the other hand have the physicality of a boys club team. Van Gaal seems to stamped his mark on the Club now. Tony - i think this array of under performing wingers/come midfield men who Wenger has repeatedly bought for so long are a testimony to his deep seated desire (he still has it i think) to play like Barcelona. In his florid mind, these players are all mini Xavi's and Iniesta's, all able to interchange and play Ajax 'total football'. Emporer Wenger (in his mind) is Rinus Michels/Pep Guardiola personified! His heads been in the clouds for years.

  45. Ho Hum

    May 18, 2015, 15:18 #71185

    Westlower- Any idea what Atletico Madrid's wage bill was last year? I'm sure I read somewhere it was below QPR's. Or Juventus this year? Doubt if it's much more than Tottenham's. If the majority of Arsenal fans are happy to continue with a manager who perenially achieves the bare minimum then so be it, but he shouldn't be paid an overachievers salary.

  46. Tony Evans

    May 18, 2015, 14:51 #71184

    Know Man - Although I don't think Sterling is the answer I would still swap him for Wally any day. Sterling for me is another enigma, a sort of Merse type of player with bags of skill but no natural position - not really a striker and not really a winger. Maybe in the hole between a front two but that is not really the way Wenger ever plays.

  47. AugustusCaesar

    May 18, 2015, 14:49 #71183

    "Spot on Kev." Following a lengthy introduction on why "Kev" didn't write this report tells you all you need to know about the predisposed comments of the majority of users on this site. It was a shame we didn't perform especially well for a decent chunk of the game yesterday but we got a result (albeit fortuously) whereas in the past we would have probably have come away with nothing. I think it's a decent indicator of a generally more resilient Arsenal. Don't agree about the point about Man Utd having to do a wholesale rebuilding of the squad. They've improved steadily under Van Gaal. They were so much better yesterday than when they beat us at the Emirates ironically enough.

  48. Tony Evans

    May 18, 2015, 14:39 #71182

    Ron too true mate. My theory has been that Wenger always wants a 'jack of all trades, master of none' type of player that fits into his anyone can play anywhere philosophy. Doesn't work and never will - you may get the odd one or two with the sufficient skill / discipline to play well in two different positions but at the level Wenger usually buys at we are lucky if they can actually play at the very top level at all in any position.

  49. Know Man

    May 18, 2015, 14:36 #71181

    Tony Evans, agree with your points. Although I disagree with your Sterling observation. If available, I'd swap him in a heartbeat with Wally. Sterling is still young but is already the goto man for club and country. Not sure how we'll fit him in but he would be an excellent addition & improvement on Wally. The Ox and Jack are the future of our club, if we can keep them injury free. My concern is they will leave if they do not get game time.

  50. Ron

    May 18, 2015, 14:25 #71180

    CT - Hes been buying wide men for 10 years though. The only trouble is, nobody has known inc Wenger whether they're are wide men or midfielders. Most end up being a hybrid master of neither. Nasri, Arshavin, Rosicky, Hleb, Cazorla, The Wally etc . The Oz flirts with showing great potential but he seems like another on the Clubs perma crocks conveyor belt. Truth is hes never bought a genuine wide man up to even Stewart Downing s capabilities, never mind one that can play like Ashley Young does, but then its all about the lack of resources isnt it yawn.

  51. Tony Evans

    May 18, 2015, 14:22 #71179

    Know Man - Yes Wally has always flattered to deceive although I did think he started to come good just before his injury in the FA Cup defeat of the Spuds last season. Both Wally and Jack are so injury prone they are never fit for long enough to get the decent run in the side required to maybe show their true worth. Although Wally is not the answer (and neither would Sterling be) I still think we are much better balanced with a proper wide player like him. The Ox is the better bet but he seems as injury prone as Wally. Westie - I like your theory that Ramsey is being played wide to help protect the inexperienced Bellerin but I just don't buy that. Obviously I can't second guess Wenger (who could) but for me he has continually shied away from playing his best balanced 11 because he refuses to drop his favourite 'pet' players, and that is still the situation now.

  52. CT Gooner

    May 18, 2015, 14:12 #71178

    Man of the match was Ashley Young, made Bellerin look terrible, not that Ramsey helped out. I remember similar things happening to Chambers earlier this season. Strengthen the core and bring in some excellent wide men and we'll be in with a shout next season, but we all know it won't happen....

  53. Red Member

    May 18, 2015, 13:55 #71177

    @Nick you havent been paying attention. Arsenal FC do not do title challenges anymore. Not worth the bother or cost involved. 60,000 sheep will be sitting there all content though again next season.

  54. Know Man

    May 18, 2015, 13:50 #71176

    @Tony Evans, it's frustrating. However Wenger is not the only person who is blinkered. Most fans think the sun shines out of Ozil's backside. It's narrow minded and laughable. When I see people say he's better than Hazard or Cesc it tells you all you need to know about someone's football knowledge. Ramsey is paying the price to accommodate Ozil. In fact, so is Jack, Santi, the Ix when he returns and Welbeck too. Too many players are paying the price. As for Wally, yes he has pace, but that's it. He's still not capable of beating his full back.

  55. Westlower

    May 18, 2015, 13:50 #71175

    Ramsey is played wide right in part to help give the inexperienced Bellerin support. When Debuchy plays, so does Wally, with Ramsey moved inside. Interesting article in the Racing Post re the richest clubs. It states that only two, perhaps three teams have a realistic chance of winning the PL. Up to thirteen teams could go down. Three clubs have wage bills around £200m, Chelsea, Man City & Man U. One of them should win the title. Two clubs have payrolls around £150m, Arsenal a bit above & Liverpool a bit below. One should qualify for the CL & the other should fall into the Europa League. Tottenham's wage bill is around £100m. They should qualify for the Europa League. Ten clubs have wage bills bteween £45m & £70m. £70m should buy more than £45m, but not a lot. By my reckoning 13 clubs are playing for 46 points or less. Any of those clubs having a bad season could be relegated. On the above analysis Arsenal have done well to finish 3rd.

  56. WeAreBuildingATeamToDominate

    May 18, 2015, 13:49 #71174

    Maguiresbridge; Napoleon once said "don't find me a good general, find me a lucky one." Yes we were somewhat fortunate yesterday, the Mancs have also had fortune on their side this season - specially the first half of it. We are the 3rd best side in the league - it's as obvious as that. Also obvious that the other 3 sides will strengthen - will our Beloved Leader?

  57. Nick

    May 18, 2015, 13:38 #71173

    Awful first half, Wenger said we were slow and not sharp enough and lacked width, so in that case why not at half time make the changes to remedy that instead of waiting till the obligatory 75th minute ? And why unless he was injured did he take Hector off to accommodate Ramsey in the middle and move Le Coq to right back ? Why not just take Coqulien off ,Bellerien was not our worst player on the day by any means, the game was crying out for the tempo to be raised , yet Rossicky remained on the bench throughout, overall poor from the players, poorer still from our managers who simply refuses to change his game plan untill its either forced on him through injury or were in need of a rescue act, Sanchez apparently was playing when not at a hundred per cent and it showed , although his work rate as ever cannot be faulted, but why did Wenger not rest him or sub him earlier as it was apparent he was out of sorts? I have lost count of the times we have got results in SPITE of our manager not BECAUSE of him, he is stubborn to a fault , and despite this latest performance in willing to bet that we see Ramsey yet again out wide and little or no change to personnel against Sunderland , who will park the bus from the outset, another frustrating evening awaits i fear, i only hope we rediscover some form before the cup final or this will be a very disappointing season , surely Wenger must strengthen in attack , defence and in goal to ensure a genuine title tilt next term if not then he really is a bloody fool !!

  58. Gazza

    May 18, 2015, 13:22 #71172

    Ramsey is not a right wide player the last 3 performances have been poor because Wenger plays there how the AKB'S cannot see that i do not understand

  59. maguiresbridge gooner

    May 18, 2015, 13:12 #71171

    Yes only for the OG from wallys cross it would have left the last two games very tricky indeed, as we know what OGL and his team are like under pressure, and it wouldn't do to have made this so called progress only to regress back to fourth again so soon, but no matter what happens TOF always comes up smelling of roses especially as far as top four is concerned, as some team, some player, some circumstance, luck, always helps him out in the end.

  60. radfordkennedy

    May 18, 2015, 12:58 #71170

    TJ...and there lies the problem mate,if your going to play counter attacking football you have to have pace by the bucket load,when your main striker is beaten to the ball by a centre half on his hands and knees who himself appears no stranger to a fish supper,it says it all really,Giroud yesterday looked like a man running up the down escalator.

  61. Ron

    May 18, 2015, 12:49 #71169

    Quite right Villa had an eye on the FAC. They're entitled too aren't they? Playing up front alone is always 'thankless'. Giroud just isnt very good at it. Fluffing decent chances isnt a symptom of the job description, its a symptom of not being a clinical finisher. 'Shots on target' wasn't the issue. No shots at all was the issue.

  62. Tony Evans

    May 18, 2015, 12:47 #71168

    Know Man - totally agree, but Wenger knows best doesn't he - Ramsey out wide and Ozil untouchable however little he contributes! I have never understood Wenger's obsession with trying to fit square pegs in to round holes and Ramsey out wide is the latest in a very long line of Wenger flying in the face of common sense. Ron - agree with your cup final fears. It'll be cigars and slippers time even before a ball is kicked, and if we start as slowly as we did against Hull then God help us. Villa will be totally 'up for it' and with Wenger doing his damnedest to screw things up anything could happen! Oh for a manager you could trust to make the right calls that you could put your utmost faith in - I have forgotten what that feels like!

  63. Westlower

    May 18, 2015, 12:39 #71167

    Ron, I think even you will agree Villa's performance 1-6 to Southampton was with both eyes firmly fixed on the FA Cup final. It is generally overlooked that Man U's goal was the first we've conceded in the first half this year in the PL. This fact alone shows how the team have evolved into a more patient approach, starting cautiously before finishing the game strongly. Previously Arseanl were slaughtered for playing gung-ho & now more criticism for playing conservatively in the first half of games. Maureen is hailed as a tactical genius for adopting a similar approach. No shots on target in the first half is not unknown to the Chavs. Ozil must remain the link between the striker (whoever it is) and the midfield. Ozil is at his best when Arsenal break quickly, a static game makes him almost redundant. Yesterday for an hour our midfield did not perform, Cazorla didn't play a worthwhile pass & Sanchez loses possession too often. His saving grace is that he works his socks off to get the ball back but with more intelligent use of the ball in the first place he wouldn't have to keep chasing back to atone for his flagrancy. How often did a move break down because of Cazorla & Sanchez? The much criticised Giroud has a thankless task up front on his own.

  64. Gaz

    May 18, 2015, 12:33 #71166

    Theres no denying we've improved on last season. Sadly we seem hell-bent on making sure those improvements are as small as possible. After all we might finish third rather than fourth but the fact is we should be finnishing second! I'm still trying to view things through positive eyes but if I've learned nothing else over the years its that Wenger has this knack of draining away any positivity I might have with one or two crap performances. And lets be blunt-these last two games have been pretty dire. That said I am cofortable-for now-with the fact Wenger's going nowhere for another two years and I am surprisingly optimistic he's going to buy well this summer. But after these two years-and on the basis I doubt we'll remotely get close to the CL-he just has to go...

  65. maguiresbridge gooner

    May 18, 2015, 12:30 #71165

    Bore draw, aren't they always, the perfect word to be associated with wenger and Arsenal these days and has been for awhile now. But wait as sure s night follows day up popped wally to tell us how good he is and how it felt like a win ( and to advertise his green drinks bottle) is that what these players are al about? is that the height of their ambition? to go to OT and play a bore draw and get a point they need to secure third or fourth place and treat it like a win? Theres a lot of green bottles that need knocking off the wall on this Arsenal team and wally's one of them along with the biggest green bottle of them all.

  66. Know Man

    May 18, 2015, 12:12 #71164

    Santi was poor but I would prefer him to Ozil any day of the week. Despite giving the ball away he never hid, Ozil hides. Is lightweight, contributes little. Yes I have an agenda. He's our most expensive signing, yet is afforded to play poorly and every other player receives the flack. He should be dropped, Utd drop DiMaria & Falcao. Ozil needs a rocket up his arse.

  67. Where's Wally is a Gooner

    May 18, 2015, 12:10 #71163

    @divingrooney It was perfectly obvious from the first ten minutes that Utd's strategy was for Young to cross to the far post and then to get a two on one overload on Nacho at the far post. It happened at least three times before the goal. The point is either Wenger doesn't see it or doesn't want to scream at Sanchez to protect his full- back. The buck always stops with the man at the top. Always.

  68. Ron

    May 18, 2015, 12:06 #71162

    Wheres Wally ... thats precise;y the issue at the Club. As much as us so called Wobs have had the view for quite some yrs that AFC need to shuffle Wenger off, the Club wont change. A new Coach would have the same canvas to work off. Like it or not, for Arsenal to 'progress' beyond their present creditable level (make no mistake it is creditable as they are consistently top 4 and their are 16 Clubs every season who would kill for that status), they need a new Owner of the ilk of RA or the Sheik et all. Kroenke isnt going to change. The pattern hes set for Arsenal mirrors all of his US franchises. Wenger is nothing more than his more than willing 8 Million quid pa mule. 4th place does them and theyre not interested in progression. PS Westie - Arsenal couldnt really care less if they win or lose the FAC Final if push comes to shove, so to suggest they're playing with 'an eye on it' is just you doing yr usual job of trying to mask the mediocrity churned out yesterday that staring you in the face. Nobody's buying it. Villa s 6-1 humbling is the worry now. Wenger will be having AFC turning up in their flip flops with their buckets and spades on hand, hand brakes firmly on, 'speeerit', 'focuuus' and 'mentaaal streength' lecture all at the ready. He ll maybe even try out a couple of the under 18s too. Nothing would shock me about what he ll try.

  69. chris dee

    May 18, 2015, 12:01 #71161

    Nothing wrong with a bore draw,but there were a few insipid performances from a few players. One worrying point,Swansea beat us after their winger went pass Bellarin and crossed the ball and they scored ,yesterday Young did the same and United scored.It also happened with Chambers playing at right back at Swansea's place.Is there no one in this multi million pound,seventh richest club in the world who can teach defenders to frigging defend?Any Sunday Morning League team manager worth his salt tells his full back not to allow crosses into the box so why not Arsenal's coaching staff?

  70. divingrooney

    May 18, 2015, 11:52 #71160

    Boohoo, boohoo. Arsenal did not lose... Boohoo, boohoo. This forum is just for Wenger haters, who have lost all love for Arsenal. We got a great draw, after going a goal down. The goal was from lack of tracking by Sanchez, and Ozpina once again failing to guard his near post. The bad performance was also due to Sanchez. He was put through twice in first half, only for sliding Smalling to put an end to the break. Hazard would have at least gotten, by hook or crook, Smalling yellow carded, so that he cannot make these tackles again. We needed only a draw, and we got it. This Arsenal team is thrid in the league for a reason. If you are looking for that reason in each game, and hope that it disappears, then its ridiculous. Ox is the most important player for this team. He defends and attacks. Welbeck might have improvement on Giroud, and Debuchy would have fared better against Young...

  71. Smithy

    May 18, 2015, 11:40 #71159

    Unfortunately the spine is where we need to improve but he is too stubborn to do it. New replacement ct back, destroyer midfielder- tall and strong and a world class forward- benzema or cavanni type. Giroud is not a no 1 striker.

  72. Darync

    May 18, 2015, 10:56 #71158

    Two games in a row kos get caught under the ball and mon doe.nt attack it no wonder we can't win the league and playing players out of position same time subs should change it earlier ozil must have if fit I play every min even if I don't put a shift in for the team

  73. Where's Wally is a Gooner

    May 18, 2015, 10:49 #71157

    Wenger said after the game that he would have taken third in October. That sums this club up. Where could we be if we had a board and manager who wanted to get to the top. Arsenal is basically a first class pension plan for its employees. Paid for by us, the mug punters.

  74. jeff wright

    May 18, 2015, 10:39 #71156

    Even though Wenger the accountant is now trying to pass himself off as a horse loving 'Farmer from Alsace' ( you couldn't make it up) this fools no one he is still the boy who grew up counting the till takings in the pub for his mother every night and every sou had to be accounted for. This obsession of his with profit and cash appealed to the diamond geezer Danny and also now to his replacement Silent Stan. So anyone expecting a title challenging spending spree by Wenger in the summer will again be disappointed. Apart from Sanchez, who Wenger signed while in well paid for TV work holiday World Cup mood in Brazil last summer, virtually all of the past signings such as Mertesacker and Ozil have been panic buys after a bad opening day show . The 8-2 massacre at OT as Wenger himself candidly admitted last week led to the late trolley dash to bring in players. Wenger tried to claim yet again the other day that players don't want to join us unless we are playing in the Champions League and that having to contest a qualifier tie is a put off for them when they can't be sure of what the outcome will be. Other clubs not in the midweek TV cash-cow fun-fest have managed to sign top players though . So to me it looks like Wenger is using this to try and put a bit of gloss on us avoiding this scenario that he claims by having finished 3rd this term, instead of in the usual 4th place. The problem is that there is too much of this spin on everything going on at AFC these days with everything being done to try and make it appear , despite all the evidence to the contrary, that winning the Premier League is the ambition rather than just finishing in a minor position to get into the Champions League. The once despised FAC now also yet again offers a chance to divert attention away from the usual abysmal Euro Cup failure and non-existent league title challenge and that when it was there for the taking that Wenger couldn't even get second spot in the league . Even worse regarding all the OTT hype a few weeks back about our run of wins City showed that a run of wins at some point in a season doesn't equate to a title challenge.

  75. Jumpers for goalposts

    May 18, 2015, 10:35 #71155

    3rd or 4th - who cares??? It's still not 1st is it?

  76. Bard

    May 18, 2015, 9:58 #71154

    Grossly underpowered in midfield, too lightweight and too similar. All of them plus Sanchez want too many touches on the ball. It allowed Utd to press us easily. I thought we missed Danny's pace up front Giroud was hopelessly slow for this level. Wally looked like he always does a headless chicken. Interesting thoughts about Santi. I have always maintained that you play either Ramsey or Santi not both.

  77. TJ

    May 18, 2015, 9:23 #71153

    It's funny, we seem to have taken a new approach to games away at other top clubs. We used to just turn up and play all out attack, now we just turn up! The plan is just to sit back and counter which is a much better strategy, but this was like the Spurs away game in terms of merely handing the initiative over- if they had had Rooney I bet it would have been 3/4-0 to United... As MOTD analysis showed, the wingers and Ozil didn't track back properly (Alexis could have been closer to Herrera for the goal) which seriously undermined the defensive approach. Something I thought they missed was how poor we were at counterattacking. We barely completed 3 passes against Spurs, but yesterday we were not set up properly for counterattacking- a fatigued and semi-injured Sanchez, an out of position and slow Ramsey and the sloth Giroud for a counterattacking side? No wonder we didn't register a shot in the first half (first time for 10 years!). We desperately need a GK, DM, Striker and natural wide player- until the spine is strengthened properly we will continue to see inconsistency of this sort.

  78. Westlower

    May 18, 2015, 9:12 #71152

    We only have 3 players who can drive the team on from a central midfield position, Ramsey, Wilshere & the Ox. Cazorla should be the player sacrificed and would probably be best used as an impact player coming off the bench midway through the second half when there's some space to play in. It's time to restore Theo to the wing to give us some variety & pace going forward. Bellerin is still learning his trade and Debuchy would be a better fit in the short term, when fit. Alexis Sanchez has temporarily lost his mojo and looks like he's hit the wall, mentally & physically. His passing remains moderate at best & he remains a maverick. I'd replace him with Welbeck for the remainder of the season, once again if fit? We're playing like a side that has one eye on the Cup Final at present. Anyone who believes we are capable of losing our last two PL games can get 150/1 with the bookies. On the flip side we are 8/13 to win them both.

  79. Mike Collins

    May 18, 2015, 9:00 #71151

    Cazorla has been far from impressive lately and this was a truly shocking performance that should have resulted in a half-time substitution. When Wenger did shake it up we improved but overall this was a poor showing against a team that's a shadow of its former self (and that's true from whichever angle you look at it).

  80. goonercolesyboy

    May 18, 2015, 8:59 #71150

    We were awful for an hour and then when we decided to play and the subs were made we probably should have taken all three points, but at least this time we found a way not to lose. Think we might see some changes for the final two games as one or two are looking a little tired, in preparation for the cup final. Onwards and upwards.

  81. Mathew

    May 18, 2015, 8:45 #71149

    We respected the opposition a bit too much yesterday, we allowed them to have possession and they retained the ball easily too. Arsenal's improvement after 70 minutes had much more to do with the switch in formation that had Ramsey playing back in the middle. He is wasted on the wing, and Wenger seems don’t have the courage to sub Santi or Özil when they are not playing well. Giroud is quite a skilful player, but doesn't have the balance, agility and pace required for mobile centre forward, playing two ahead might be the best option, Wenger wouldn’t loath to alter his 4-3-3 system. Looking forward to those days when Gabriel will be a regular in our team sheets.

  82. Wear Your Colours

    May 18, 2015, 8:41 #71148

    We were awful in the first sixty-minutes but credit has to go to United for their tactical approach. They pressed very well, Cazorla and Coquelin were always being harried and we had no out ball; Giroud was marked by two defenders (one in front) and Alexis, Ozil and Ramsey simply ran into outnumbered blind alleys. However, despite the fact we had no fluency we fought well; we dug-in at the back with Koscielny and Mertesacker both playing quite well. As expected United tired visibly after the hour-mark and when Jack and Theo came on we had a lot more space and time to express ourselves. We got a goal back after a sumptuous pass by Ramsey and could have scored the winner if Giroud had hit the target with either of his golden chances. Overall I thought it was well-earned away point. COYG!

  83. Paulo75

    May 18, 2015, 8:37 #71147

    Fair result, cant complain too much with a point at Old Trafford despite their recent fall from grace. There are obvious areas to be improved within the squad so hopefully this is being worked on as we speak. About time the likes of Szczesny, Flamini, Sanogo, Campbell, Diaby, Podolski to name but a few were shipped out aswell.

  84. Tony Evans

    May 18, 2015, 8:25 #71146

    I only listened to the match on the radio and almost didn't bother for the second half as we hardly got out of our own half during the first 45 minutes - and that against one of the weakest Man U teams for quite a while. One thing was obvious to all (apart from Wenger presumably) and that is that Ramsey has to play in the middle and not out wide. Not a big Walcott fan but his pace alone can unsettle teams and we looked much better when he came on with Wilshire who also helped up the tempo - not that that was very difficult to achieve!

  85. WeAreBuildingATeamToDominate

    May 18, 2015, 8:13 #71145

    Utd have several times blagged a result when they didn't deserve it so I ain't complaining. There does seem be a worrying repeat cycle of going to OT and playing like a bunch of pussies though. The side does seem to have switched off in the last two weeks.....hhmmm wonder why.

  86. Ron

    May 18, 2015, 8:10 #71144

    Spot on Kev. More so than the poor standard of football, two things were clear 1.That team has no belief that it can win at venues like Old Trafford even v the weakest Utd team for many years. So much for Wengers 'we have mental strength'. They clearly have little. 2. It was plain to see that we need a quality striker to replace Giroud. He could have stolen that game. As many of us have said so often, hes a back up striker at best. Without the own goal it was hard to see Arsenal scoring had they still have been playing now!

  87. Peter Wain

    May 18, 2015, 8:06 #71143

    the nw thing about this transfer window is that we will not buy any one of note. OGL will say that this proves he is right we have a strong squad ect ect. I am afraid that a title push is still a long way off without a goal keeper holding midfield player and a quick striker. I have given up on a top quality centre half after OGL's comments.