Arsenal Circular 122 – Study the Historian before you study the History

In response to Piers Morgan’s comments on Sunday evening’s BBC Radio 5Live’s ‘606’ phone-in



Arsenal Circular 122 – Study the Historian before you study the History

Piers Morgan – Arsenal fan, yes, but one with an agenda


Ed’s Note - Before we begin, a quick mention for the recording this evening of the January edition of the Gooner podcast. Marc Ollington will be hosting a panel of myself (Kevin Whitcher), Steve Ashford (The Highbury Spy) and Mike Francis (the founder, original editor and publisher of The Gooner). Please tweet any questions / topics to @goonerpodcast or email them to [email protected].

The Editor’s piece on Saturday’s Cup win against Sunderland was excellent – comprehensive and perceptive. It also prompted many responses so no need for me to go over the same ground. Just a couple of points – still unsure why Ospina did not play – maybe it is a reported thigh strain. Ox missed when he hit the post but his pass to Bellerin which led to the third goal was top class. There is much more to come from him and Wenger is showing faith as Ox plays his way through an uncertain period. Finally Chambers – views are spilt. “He is the product - He isn’t the product”. He works hard. He takes responsibility. He wants to succeed. The problem for him is to get a run of matches. When you are in one day and out the next you snatch at chances when they come. An article on Eddie Kelly in a recent programme rings a bell here. Early on in his career at Highbury he was called in by Bertie Mee and told he was being given a run of eight matches. He knew he could make mistakes and still be selected for the next match. It worked and all of us remember Eddie for the Wembley goal but more so for the first goal against Anderlecht in April 1970. Forty five years ago it may be but clear as can be today.

Did you listen in to 606 and to Ian Wright and Piers Morgan? Let me make a comment about context. It is a word that has got me into trouble with some online gooners but when looking at anything the whole picture and not just part of the picture is essential. Echoes of “The Truth, The Whole Truth and Nothing But the Truth”. Getting the complete story. OK now back to Morgan. He loves insults. He loves being the bête-noir. He is a newspaper man. He has a reputation to maintain. He needs to be controversial. Remember he failed in USA as successor to Larry King. A big blow to his ambitions, to his self-esteem, to his reputation. So what do you do in that situation? You bounce back and fast. You build yourself up, keep yourself in the public eye and start saying and doing things that enable you to replace the failure with something new and arresting. David Mellor was the same and he re-packaged himself as an expert on classical music and columnist on politics. Morgan uses Wenger to keep his name in front of the public and to remove the smell of the Larry King failure which make no mistake was a personal setback of considerable proportions.

Morgan has always been an Arsenal man and he has always been having a pop at Wenger and putting him on 606 gave him the platform he wanted. An opportunity to repeat his highly misleading arguments and keep himself at the fore of any Arsenal discussion.

His argument is that any manager that has failed to win a title/cup from 2005 to 2014 should have been fired. And he has a point. If you manage a top team and there are inevitable aspirations to win Cups and Leagues and you don’t have any success then questions have to be asked about whether you are the right man for the job. But is that the whole story or just half the story? He focuses on the nine year period and criticises the Arsenal Board for not sacking Wenger. Echoes here of Mourinho’s smear that Wenger is a “Specialist in Failure”. The nine barren years – that is it. The man has had his chance. He has failed. He has not got it. He has to go. Let someone else try.

This is why I say this is sleight of hand. This is misleading. It is not the whole story and when that happens the argument amounts to a distortion and that is what Morgan is guilty of. The whole picture is so important but just a part of the picture is so misleading.

Many of us who support Wenger know the whole story. We faced big problems at Highbury. The size of the crowd limited the size of the finances. If Arsenal wanted to compete at the highest level they had to make a big change and that had to mean a sugar daddy or a new stadium. We went for the latter option – the best option – the soundest option. We had a financial model and we had a business plan (it may mean that season tickets are too expensive but that is for another article). We could see a future. It was in the distance but it was realisable. Wenger was wedded to change. He knew the way the football world was going. He knew Arsenal wanted to compete. He bought into the grand plan knowing for sure that it meant financial stringency. Wenger’s eyes were wide open. If Arsenal were to be a top club with a secure financial base in the long term there had to be financial restraint in the short term and the short term continued until he bought Ozil. That was the statement. That was the announcement that Arsenal had made the change – not completed it but well on the way.

But what of the intervening years. How did cope? How did he manage to keep us as a top four club and occasionally in contention for top place. There was only one way – Arsenal had to become a selling Club. We had to take one step backwards in order to take two steps forward. We sold Henry, Toure, Nasri, Adebayor, Fabregas, Clichy and Van Persie. All of these players were offered better terms elsewhere by Clubs with more money than Arsenal. They took the money. They were entitled to take the money. They were top players. Their careers are short. They want to play at the highest level. Arsenal could not offer them the prospect of top salaries and bonuses. They left and they left a hole. But not once did we flirt with relegation. Not once did we become mid-table. Despite the handcuffs on funds and some unsuccessful purchases – Senderos, Denilson, Bendtner, Almunia, Silvestre even Arshavin – he managed to compete at the highest level. It is such an achievement.

And yet to Morgan it is such a failure. And that is why I have no time for the man. He maintains a public profile by trading on half truths. But he is a newspaper man. He has a platform. He is a capable performer but he never tells the whole story. I was lined up in a queue last night to go on to 606. I wanted to confront him. He needs to be exposed. We need to write history as it is and not how some with an agenda want us to see it. A famous historian, the late Professor EH Carr wrote a famous book called What Is History? A slim volume but indispensible to anyone who wants to read History and in one of his lectures on this subject he advised his students to study the historian before you study his history. Know where the historian is coming from and know what his agendas are. Good advice for an Arsenal supporter.

On to Anfield.

* You can follow my tweets @arsenalcircular


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95
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  1. Hiccup

    Jan 14, 2016, 6:34 #81779

    Didn't catch the game last night. Was out wining and dining the missus and generally having a good time. Don't think the same can be said for this B52 chappie? Seems a bit bitter and twisted? Sounds the type to sit watching the match on the telly with his scarf and bobble hat on. Meanwhile the rest of the household hide away praying for an Arsenal win otherwise there'll be plates thrown at the walls and a two day sulk to follow. Anyway, thanks for taking time out from your fantastic playboy lifestyle with the girls, to come on here and have a good moan and groan. Much appreciated.

  2. B52's

    Jan 13, 2016, 22:45 #81777

    Ah how the love shack will be full of moaning punters, got nothing and no one in their lives other than boorish boring ill informed idiots. All singing and dancing when Arsenal lose, know alls about everything, transfers, roof repairs, what players to buy, how can anyone be tired nowadays, didn't happen in their day, etc etc. I have agreed for their Lord and master GG to be displayed at the entrance and attach a couple of brown envelopes to his picture for a whip round. Excellent game of football tonight in tough conditions, Giroud excellent and a battling performance. Can't wait for mbg to get the beers in, the local Indian beers Cobra and Tiger have obviously changed nationality overnight. As for the girls, you lot wouldn't know what to do with them. Tin roof, rusted.

  3. Jamerson

    Jan 13, 2016, 18:43 #81772

    God exists to his elect and reveals himself to them as a graceful merciful god yet only after they are regenerated.To the reprobate he is looked on as a hard pleasure spoiler,so they either invent their own God or worship their fellow man..

  4. mbg

    Jan 13, 2016, 18:40 #81771

    Tony Evans, why don't you come along and accompany me you sound very level headed for a run like this, and you can question them on their favourite positions when i'm driving and get back to OGL so he can choose his line up before he arrives. John F, lets hope he does, i'm sure Ozil and the cart horse would be up well up for it, anyway IWOBI is going to be there to open proceedings him being one of our own and our president.

  5. Badarse

    Jan 13, 2016, 18:22 #81770

    Lots of arm waving going on this evening.

  6. mbg

    Jan 13, 2016, 18:17 #81769

    JOB_ AFC, but you see it would have, according to AKB's and wengerites anyway and those who thought, and still do think 3rd 4th place was and is an achievement and a trophy, they would have told you (and maybe still would) we don't want to end up doing a leeds or a Portsmouth by spending money. You couldn't make it up.

  7. Alsace

    Jan 13, 2016, 18:15 #81768

    Why do the AKB's think that the AMG's do not give credit for Wenger's successes and achievements? We do. In full. What we want is the application of good sense to things which have NOTHING to do with money. That sense is sadly lacking in important areas which mean the difference between success and failure.

  8. jjetplane

    Jan 13, 2016, 18:01 #81767

    Right RON it's a Spud double then and should be a good game Westie now the Mancs have sorted the attack. LVG may well be the new Fergie. 1-1 tonight but 5-0 to Stoke and then Webster's men to thrash Barca & & & win the ....... But I just said the Spuds - getting the hang of this now. Betting for Dummies by A Webster - just ordered online .... Anybody see the news on Stan - franchise - LA which is another reason not to buy until Cheerleader salaries have been negotiated. What Jamerson's Butler saw upon nearing The Love Shack - a cartoon book by The Reverend G Perry - buy one get one thrown at ya!

  9. Ron

    Jan 13, 2016, 17:44 #81764

    You should bet JJ. Dont miss out and stand on yer pride! Just bet and then loads of cover bets, change yr bet half way thro the event, then cash out. Its easy. Theres no rich bookies anymore, too much to pay out. Im so pleased i found betting before it got too late. I ll retire in a few weeks, having only found betting only last October and then its just bet, bet, bet for me from here on in as alas, i reflect on a life wasted working for a living. Watch -in, liss - nin and bet - in risponsiblee mind you!!

  10. Westlower

    Jan 13, 2016, 17:20 #81762

    Shock horror news: It's just been announced that Man U will be televised live for the 49th time in succession when they play Derby in the FA Cup 4th round. Doesn't it just warm the cockles of your heart?

  11. jjetplane

    Jan 13, 2016, 17:08 #81761

    Ha Ha WEsTIe supports anyone he's betting on and as he thinks the Spuds are up for the league he's wondering 'can they do the double' - and the odds are ......? I generally support whoever is up against the Wombats .... Bit like Westie but I don't bet ...

  12. Arseneknewbest

    Jan 13, 2016, 16:26 #81759

    My second favourite team on my mothers side is Tottenham,always had a soft spot for them.

  13. John F

    Jan 13, 2016, 15:27 #81757

    It would be handy if mr Wenger brings along some of the first team with him to the love shack do,because if he starts doing the tiger feet and the birdy song i am hoping a delegation of players will step up and advise him to change his style before he does himself a mischief.

  14. Bard

    Jan 13, 2016, 14:45 #81756

    Tony E; you raise some interesting points about the bash this weekend. I totally agree they must be able to adapt to a variety of positions not necessarily the ones they are most comfortable in. I think the word I am looking for is flexibility. I've had an email from Jamerson begging to be allowed to attend along with his various alter egos. He says he could probably pass the IQ test provided he doesnt get asked his name. Colseyboysetc says he doesnt want to attend but has asked if he can wait outside and try and get a selfie with the Great one when he arrives.

  15. Tony Evans

    Jan 13, 2016, 14:29 #81755

    mbg - make sure you keep both hands on the wheel, we don't want any nasty accidents!

  16. mbg

    Jan 13, 2016, 13:57 #81754

    Bard, cheers that's a big weight of my shoulders, security can be a bit dicey at these doo's at the best of times, but especially now OGL is talking about making an appearance, we're going to have wengerites and AKB's coming from all over trying to gate crash and becoming WOB's for the night(if their not already), but we have the right person on the door in big Helen as we know she takes no crap although we will need out side security too, these AKB's can be very cunning and rude and will make anything up when it comes to their messiah but your IQ tests will sort that. The caterer arrives at nine with all the grub, jw, has the bar sorted with plenty of San Miguel and assorted Spanish beer from his contact over there, and of course some irish stuff like cobra and tiger, I doubt OGL drinks lager so he'll have to source some French wine. The girls are flying in from Asia at 8pm and I have took it upon myself to pick them up at the airport i'll probably need someone to accompany me in the mini bus but that shouldn't be a problem. Will be in touch.

  17. Tony Evans

    Jan 13, 2016, 13:46 #81752

    Ron - I don't see us winning tonight either and would take a draw. Not that Liverpool are anything special but I just don't trust our lot to put in a performance. I don't think my deep mistrust of Wenger's latter day Arsenal teams will ever leave me entirely - even though we have seen gradual improvements recently, with more focus and less gung-ho.

  18. Exeter Gunner

    Jan 13, 2016, 13:44 #81751

    That's funny mgb I was a Man U fan in my youth.

  19. mgb

    Jan 13, 2016, 13:26 #81750

    I was a Liverpool fan up to the age of 16.

  20. Ron

    Jan 13, 2016, 13:21 #81749

    Good old Westie. been on the 11 v 11 web site again. Its good tho! Sounds like yr getting the excuses in early again for the Anfield visit, yet no fatigue? Agree tho, AFC likely to show us a bottle job there tonight, theyre always like cats on a hot tin roof when playing there. Draw or a loss coming up. We need to Liverpool to put in one of their habitual horror jobs to win it. I ll bet for the draw but also cover it with a bet on the likelihood of ice and frost over night and cover that with a bet on the 3.15 at Kempton today. Im watchin, listenin and gonna bet respon - sib -lee. Cant wait to cash aaaght.

  21. mbg

    Jan 13, 2016, 13:20 #81748

    ArseneKnewBest, there's nothing like getting the excuses in early, it/they must actually help soothe the AKB's in their own wee way. You couldn't make it up. One minute we're been told all about them, and the're been used as a tool to defend their messiah and his injury record, then we're been told not to be fooled by them. You really couldn't make it up, it's not right laughing really.

  22. Ron

    Jan 13, 2016, 13:04 #81747

    Utd will stick by Van Gaal in my view. Good teams are built from the back, not the front. Always have been and always will be. Getting this very basic p[principle back to front for so many yrs is the reason AFC have won no titles. Utd are very transitional. Have some excellent players. Im going for them for the FAC this yr and top 4. The media are loving the silly LVG witch hunt theyve embarked upon for the moment and loving sucking passive punters/ anti Man Utd armchair fans into it, but one things for sure, Man Utd will be winning more titles than we do over the next 5 yrs.

  23. jjetplane

    Jan 13, 2016, 12:20 #81745

    Enjoy yourself at Anfield WEstIE - You are going I take it? lol!

  24. Westlower

    Jan 13, 2016, 12:01 #81744

    @Ron I backed the Mancs at 16/5 to win when score was 2-2. Ten seconds after making my bet they went 3-2 up but proceeded to f**k it all up in minute 90. They really should be more pragmatic when leading so close to the end, this gung-ho stuff gets you nowhere, expect it's good entertainment. Mike Jones from Cheshire is the ref at Anfield tonight, so don't expect too many favours!

  25. Tony Evans

    Jan 13, 2016, 11:26 #81743

    Bard - just spoken to Arsene; he's still not sure about the party and wanted to know more about the women. I told him they were all happy to perform in any position and I could sense the gallic smirk emerging when he said in that case he was definitely up for it!

  26. Ron

    Jan 13, 2016, 11:07 #81742

    Lovin these 'won' medical arguments and how its the reason Eng havent won a WC for 50 yrs! You cdt make it up. No rant about Utd 'boring' today Westie? Another media bandwagon you've jumped on after swallowing the message wholesale. Stop embarrassing yourself old boy! Where's 'Maureen' these days. Hes been off the radar for a bit now?

  27. Leggsy

    Jan 13, 2016, 10:48 #81741

    Loathe is the nicest thing I can think of for this man , most other thoughts of him would involve torture !

  28. Amos

    Jan 13, 2016, 10:34 #81740

    "And yet to Morgan it is such a failure. And that is why I have no time for the man." Ironic that you should spend so much time writing about a man you have no time for. Morgan is a fair weather celebrity fan - he uses the club to promote himself. You have just bought into it.

  29. Bard

    Jan 13, 2016, 10:34 #81739

    Some brilliant posts last night. mbg; the party preparations are in full swing. i have taken it upon myself to deal with security. Helen has enthusiastically agreed to body search everyone before entering, which will put a smile on our faces. My word she is thorough. As an extra precaution I have hired a psychologist. Everyone will have to do an IQ test. Anyone with an IQ of less than 50 wont be allowed in. That will stop any AKBs trying to gate crash the love shack. I also took the liberty of inviting the Great one who sent me a very nice email. He asked if the women were top quality and cheap. I replied of course and several of them are injured. He was delighted and may pitch up later on. Meanwhile I dont see a result against Liverpool. The ref is dodgy, its a long way to Liverpool and we are bound to be denied several penalties. Does that cover it Westie ?

  30. JOB_AFC

    Jan 13, 2016, 9:37 #81738

    Im sure that buying a decent holding midfielder for 20 million or a decent goalkeeper 5 years ago would not have bankrupt the club. I dont buy the whole argument of financial restraint to much. We offered players like bendnter, denilson and almunia 60k a week. We would of easily bought a couple of decent players in positions we desperately needed over the years. That is just bad management.

  31. Westlower

    Jan 13, 2016, 9:28 #81737

    @AKB Your memory fails you. In 71, we drew at WBA & lost at Leeds in 2 of the 3 games before the final game at the Lane. In 89, we lost to Derby & drew with Wimbledon in the two home games before Anfield. It wasn't always sweetness & light. My feeling about tonight is that this is the game that Klopp wants to announce his arrival in England. He knows more about Arsenal than any other foreign coach.

  32. Arseneknewbest

    Jan 13, 2016, 9:18 #81736

    Westie - classic apologism. You're so far up the manager's fundament, you're already making excuses for him and the players. 4 points from three important games right now ain't gonna be seen as championship form. You AKBs are soooo pessimistic. When we used to win titles (remember that?), we'd come out of the next three games bruised and battered but with 7 or maybe the full 9 points, and with a sh*tload of confidence (and therefore no fatigue) to boot. Bookies can be ignored, esp by people who know that gambling is a mug's game which spreads misery. I know OGL is a lugubrious man with a loser's attitude but surely you can raise the bar a little? Otherwise, it sounds like you're preparing everyone for failure (on behalf of the club's specialist).

  33. Westlower

    Jan 13, 2016, 8:56 #81735

    Don't be fooled by the reports of Liverpool's injury woes as their quantity of long term absentees are similar to Arsenal's. None of the home team have played since the victory at Stoke on Jan 5th & will be refreshed for tonight's encounter. Liverpool's predicted team in the Racing Post is a very strong one indeed, particularly in midfield & are tipped to beat AFC. The expected return of Sanchez has not materialised. All the overnight 2/1 about a L'pool win has gone with 15/8 the best odds available. Arsenal will do well to come away with a draw. The next 3 PL games are pivotal for AFC & I reckon 5 points from L'pool, Stoke & Chelsea will be a good return. Nothing less than 4 points will do.

  34. Arseneknewbest

    Jan 12, 2016, 21:39 #81734

    Jamee's "love shack" is a euphemism for his vie d'amour solitaire, and involves the sticky business of bashing one out in front of a stained full-length mirror in the shed at the bottom of his garden (while listening to the dulcet tones of his special friend Jose Mourinho berating the hapless chelsea staff). Branleur.

  35. Westlower

    Jan 12, 2016, 19:37 #81733

    Simple solution in the Telegraph to solve the current fixture congestion while at the same time creating a winter break. 1. No FA Cup replays. 2. One off COC semi-final on neutral ground. 3. No midweek PL games after FA Cup third round. 4. No games for two weeks after FA Cup 3rd round. 'The medical argument over cumulative player fatigue, injury & overload has long been won. The evidence is indisputable from the sports medical science community (hope you're reading this Ron), especially when it comes to how England fare in international tournaments.'

  36. Badarse

    Jan 12, 2016, 19:10 #81732

    Bit of arm waving there?

  37. mbg

    Jan 12, 2016, 18:52 #81731

    Ron, i'm surprised OGL hasn't been up on the roof himself sorting it out we know how he like to take control of everything and after all he built it, but i'm sure we'll soon hear one of Stans company's have the roofing problem all sorted for the cost off £3,000,000.

  38. mbg

    Jan 12, 2016, 18:37 #81730

    Sorry just getting hear late just of the phone chatting to (no not Piers Morgan)but one of those Asian beauties that are advertised up top real nice girls, there's a crowd of them coming to the love shack party at the weekend, sorry AKB's it's WOB's only.

  39. Badarse

    Jan 12, 2016, 18:00 #81729

    B52's I think the roof repairs is all to do with overheads.

  40. B52's

    Jan 12, 2016, 17:49 #81728

    Season ticket prices are frozen for next season, that put paid to that joke. Nice to know everything about the roofing business. Tin roof....rusted.... Maybe the club should hire Peter Wain as transfer coordinator, get him to dot the i's and cross the t's. Bard can always lend a hand, it surely can't be that difficult with these two in control of negotiations. Old JK has signed himself a right Caulker, must have Germanic parents or perhaps he wasn't watching that night when Liverpool put six past the saints with Caulker at centre half.

  41. Badarse

    Jan 12, 2016, 16:27 #81727

    You know, one point worth considering in the Mo/committee transfer saga-have a good holiday rate for OAPs and one leg travels free-is that scientists believe they may have detected gravity waves, this will be of interest to any space cadets like jeff. For those unfamiliar with the term it is the final piece in Einstein's general theory of relativity-like could uncle Albert really have done that with all four bridesmaids? To be more specific the gravitational wave is that one where your arm is so fatigued from all that waving, but the status quo dictates that WORs still have to offer salutations to any poster that is regarded as superior-be it ever so slightly. It is hailed as the likely answer to all questions we may have about the Cosmos-dearer travel prices than saga, but for younger and more shapely legs-so in time all committees may be understood, still a hope for Esperanto then-arrikanedercci.

  42. Bard

    Jan 12, 2016, 16:02 #81726

    Westie; thanks for that. But I would have thought that its surely possible to get Egypt to play a few matches in quick succession ( providing they are not too tired) against international rubbish so that their ranking goes up to 50. We could then get the deal sown up around next August. Maybe thats why he's so cheap.

  43. Croker

    Jan 12, 2016, 15:54 #81725

    That's very well written Graham, thank you. You are not alone in seeing through Mr Morgan. My gripe is with some of the shambolic defending and lack of tactical nous which has cost Arsenal cup finals and greater Champions League progress. Did the George Graham back 5, Paddy Vieira and Sol Campbell mask over that? Even with being limited to buying mediocre talent, players can still be coached to tighten up at the back and to hold the midfield. The lack of dependable talent coming through the feeder sides to the first team is also a long term concern. I'm with you Graham on saluting Wenger for maintaining Arsenal at or about the top level and getting us to where we are but his reign has produced so many unanswered questions. I hope he will hold court one day and give his side to it all.

  44. Westlower

    Jan 12, 2016, 15:37 #81724

    The only obstacle that I'm aware of in the Elneny transfer is that Egypt are 57th in the world ratings. The FA tightened up the criteria for the player's national team being in the top 50, before a PL club can sign them. Bizarre that Greg Dyke gets to play God who can and can't be signed. What would have happened if Messi was Egyptian and Man U wanted to sign him? Bureaucracy involving the appeal procedure for a work permit has held up the transfer. It was known in advance that the proposed transfer would have to go through the appeal procedure. Anything involving a committee(s) slows down any decision making, e.g a committee designing a racehorse usually end up with a camel. As Elneny has 39 full International caps, every other aspect seems to be in order.

  45. Tony Evans

    Jan 12, 2016, 15:34 #81723

    Badarse - thanks for clearing that one up for us!

  46. Badarse

    Jan 12, 2016, 15:08 #81722

    Tony Evans and Bard. Sorry guys but you seem to be missing the obvious in this particular transfer. Mo is a complicated lad-he has been ever since he broke up with Curly and Larry. He is struggling to find a suitcase big enough to pack all his Toblerone bars in-as an Egyptian he has been advised not to carry a backpack in London as he could be shot-and believes chocs in this country are rubbish and therefore a swizz, if this alps, (last bit was for mbg-he hasn't been out for a walk yet). He knows our medical department is top, top quality and is trying to injure himself little bit. He has lacerations on his palms and both knees as he has spent the last two weeks crawling over broken glass to become an Arsenal player-he hopes this is sufficient. He has put his bad back behind him-so no worries there-though in doing so has twisted his neck. The free Oyster Card is a sticking point, but the club are confident we should get our man before the window is closed, so shut that door! or, je t'adore as we say at the Groove.

  47. Bard

    Jan 12, 2016, 14:38 #81721

    Tony Evans; I agree mate. I dont understand why Arsenal's transfers are always so protracted. I mean its not as if this current squeeze at £7m is a world class capture. Everyone else seems to get them done and dusted in double quick time. I understand there may be work permit issues but surely they knew about this beforehand unless its another 'Kallstrom' type situation

  48. Ron

    Jan 12, 2016, 14:34 #81720

    Wearebuilding - Good points. I recall Blair becoming an avid Toon fan! On Collymore, i wonder if when he got caught d o g g i n g he was thinking over a move to Doggenham and Redbridge?

  49. Badarse

    Jan 12, 2016, 14:16 #81719

    WeAreBuilding-you are so right. In times of emphasis-the PL emergence was a 'biggy'-the self-promoting individuals clamour for a slice of the cake and Mister Kipling was probably the worst offender, though I did like 'If'. Association! It's associated with all things and especially football and the kangaroo court of the Football Association. It happens on this site-those who want to trade off and hang onto the shirt-tails of a perceived stronger personality-ah the bathing in reflected glory, an end to BO with Lifebuoy. Arsene Wenger was a David Bowie fan. He was also a fan of Jim Bowie, mainly because he was a rarity in that he never wanted to stab him in the back. The Jim I am talking about was the kernel who had that fight at the Alamo Car Rental with his buddy Davy Crotchet. Davy leaped to fame-he could jump very high-as the musical brother of Tiny Tim, 'Atishoo! Bless us, everyone!

  50. Peter Wain

    Jan 12, 2016, 13:29 #81718

    same old same old we do act decisively in the transfer window and it takes at least 4 weeks to sign a player once the fee is agreed. What a shambles sack WENGER now and get some one who knows how to play the market. Until we do we will not win the pl or cl.

  51. Tony Evans

    Jan 12, 2016, 12:35 #81716

    Off topic but wanted to express frustration at Arsenal's transfer deal for Elneny being so protracted, though I suppose I should be thankful we are, at last, bringing in a defensive midfielder. Also the Gods seem to be smiling on us with another, eminently winnable, home cup draw. It's all going amazingly well (Southampton apart), especially when you factor in the injuries so let's hope the wheels stay firmly on in what looks, on paper, to be a testing January.

  52. Mark from Aylesbury

    Jan 12, 2016, 11:55 #81715

    But what does Kate Hopkins got to say? She is the voice of the nation!

  53. Ron

    Jan 12, 2016, 11:42 #81714

    Off topic - 'the Club awaits its specialists report on the leaking roof' as reported by AISA. Good grief! Whatever happened to getting on the roof and sorting the problem with fibre glass and resin re a roof of that type? Days work tops by a few decent fabricator roofers. Never mind though, the season ticket hike will cover the 'experts' report. What a joke.I d love to see the quote the Club gets and inevitably accepts.

  54. WeAreBuildingATeamToDominate

    Jan 12, 2016, 10:11 #81713

    Badarse; when football became hip, note, hip not popular, around the turn of the 1990's, every band, film star, politicians even, let it be known who they supported. Football became a vehicle to sell not just hot dogs and burgers but also someone's latest album or film. Can't say I ever remember knowing who Mick Jagger or David Bowie (RIP) supported though. My own favourite, this was obviously coming from his agent, was Stan Collymore. Stan moved from Forest to Liverpool - "he's a Liverpool fan". Stan moved from Liverpool to Villa "he's a Villa fan, used to stand on the Holte End". Stan moved from Villa to Leicester "used to watch them play at Filbert St". An so on and so forth. Although by the time of the move to Bradford that one didn't wash anymore.

  55. Arseneknewbest

    Jan 12, 2016, 10:05 #81712

    ....he's also a phone-hacker and a proven liar. Yuck.

  56. Bard

    Jan 12, 2016, 9:49 #81711

    Fans and disciples alike you need to read these blasphemous words from the Independent's Mark Ogden under the heading are 'Arsenal the great pretenders AGAIN or the real deal ? Are they the real deal or 'another reincarnation of the flaky invincibles teams that have repeatedly failed to deliver the PL trophy to the Em'. Hasnt he heard of fatigue or injuries or bent refs or building for the future. Please join me in organising an online petition. Incidentally apparently he lives quite near Manchester in Barnstaple.

  57. Badarse

    Jan 12, 2016, 9:29 #81710

    With a nod to Robert's point, for those around at the time, and switched on enough to that particular environment, in the tsunami that surged after The Beatles rise to prominence, most 'celebrity' entities declared themselves 'friends' of the group and Liverpool FC 'fans'. We've touched on this subject before, 'When is a fan a fan and not a fanny?'. People of opposite poles, with perhaps little or no interest in football declaring themselves and squeezing into the spotlight. It was an elevation of their renown and fame by association. It was often tripped out and name dropped-it is still prevalent, there are just more powerful-and perhaps more gullible people(?)-nowadays. Incidentally, discussing this particular topic has nothing to do with homage or regard for Morgan-this phenomenon shows itself readily with 'old fans', 'true football lovers' and many other questionable vocations, it is a theme which occurs at every level, even at the 9th tier.

  58. mbg

    Jan 12, 2016, 0:03 #81707

    Carlos, I rest my case.

  59. mbg

    Jan 11, 2016, 23:53 #81706

    CORNISH GOONER, great post, if the author of this article wouldn't have bit (like all wengerites do) and penned it we would probably not even be having this full blown discussion, it would most likely have been mentioned in some other thread and the subject and programme quickly forgotten. But no the square man in his great wisdom decided to do for Morgan exactly what HE accuses Morgan of doing for himself in the first place. Piers I doff my cap to you, you've played a blinder, you've no need to worry about building yourself up and keeping yourself in the public eye when you have AKB wallys who type before they think like we have.

  60. Robert Exley

    Jan 11, 2016, 23:43 #81705

    Disregard anything Piers Morgan has to say on Football. When he interviewed Gazza he asked him why he chose Spurs over Man Utd - the best team in the country (what in 1988?). Did anyone encounter anyone called Piers at a Football match in the 1980s? He's Roger the Nouvaux Football fan personified

  61. B52's

    Jan 11, 2016, 21:52 #81701

    Ah, more to add to the love shack, CORNISH GOONER, theopants superstar and Win the league. RIP David Bowie, an absolute legend who was truly innovative.

  62. Carlos

    Jan 11, 2016, 21:02 #81700

    Re the former editor of the Daily Mirror, this quote from Oscar Wilde is apposite: "There's only one thing worse than being talked about; not being talked about" Ignore

  63. Rex P. Skeeter

    Jan 11, 2016, 21:00 #81699

    Perry has it right. Morgan's off base Wenger perspective raises the question of balance in other matters he covers. Are they all self-serving stunts as well?

  64. mbg

    Jan 11, 2016, 19:55 #81698

    Mark from Aylesbury, yes and he's not afraid to give his opinion. Unlike all the wenger luvvies and celebs who stay schtum ( who probably have a different opinion of wenger in private and would probably agree with Morgan) and that's why wengerites are up in arms with him and his opinions. But of course if he was one of these types who think OGL can do nothing wrong and every time the sun comes out their messiah has just farted he'd be a great man, a top celebrity and Arsenal fan who sees the whole picture, has the complete story, sees everything in context and always tells the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth (just like wenger) and a great success at his job and has taken the USA by storm.

  65. CORNISH GOONER

    Jan 11, 2016, 19:04 #81697

    Why on earth manufacture such a "story" out of b****r all? If anyone needs "to be exposed" it is Monsieur Webster - just the summer purchase of a Glove Butler together with the usual, ongoing January transfer farce is inexcusable for a filthy rich club in one of the world's richest cities. If Arsenal seriously wanted to win things the man would be long gone. Groundhog days as per usual.

  66. Mandrake

    Jan 11, 2016, 18:51 #81696

    I met a strange WOB fellow He looked weird With his long beard Seems unshaven for many years Walked like a turtle With a shiny armor like metal Hung around his neck were cups and kettle Swagging with baby like steps I heard Tip-a-tip-tap With his walking stick and a Man U cap I watched him from far Away from my car Hip-a-didal-do why you stare like am at a zoo He mumbled loudly like a roar From a lions cage somewhere at the core I kept my pace to see him more A man they says from Mongolia. A small man perhaps a dwarf Making his way towards a dark lane I decided to head off As I turned to go He startled from behind Saying Sip-aa-say-so Leaving me speechless With no clue Of how he got me I'd say he's a blue He tapped his stick And sat on a brick He totally looked sick I said "hello" He replied "ello" "I am a weird fellow" He looked away Far to the other way Got up and started his weird song Tip-a-tip-tap Tip-a-tip-tap With a say of little Here I stand a moaning in the middle Whose with me...Whose with me With cups and kettle I'm a standing fellow. Sip-aa-say-so Sip-aa-say-so With nowhere to go Emirates a no go Hip-a-didal-do Hip-a-didal-do those akb's just don't ave a clue have no clue

  67. Win the league

    Jan 11, 2016, 18:40 #81695

    Sorry Mr Perry but at the end of the 2012/11 season after Arsenal exited the domestic cups to Championship Blackburn and League One Bradford and finished with no silverware for the eighth year in a row did you not want Wenger sacked? Even Wigan and Portsmouth had won a trophy in that period and how were their transfer budgets?

  68. Mark from Aylesbury

    Jan 11, 2016, 18:29 #81694

    The thing that always amuses me about Piers is that ever site or platform he is on there always seems to be the same comment along the lines of "I can't stand the Bloke, but got to say on this point I agree with!" Honestly take a peek at the reactions on forums. At least one thing agree with him or don't agree with him but at least he has an opinion. Seems that we have lost our opinionists . With only far right columnists getting a look in so in some ways he is out there on his own. Good on in I say. Badarse I was amused by your point just before the election some foolish young tories printed a pamphlet arguing we needed to work longer and take less holidays . This of course from privileged young politicos who might not have done a days work in their life. I noticed it quickly got buried!

  69. mbg

    Jan 11, 2016, 17:57 #81693

    CT Gooner, and good opinions they are, all the more reason that there should have been a new lead for the dog years ago.

  70. jeff wright

    Jan 11, 2016, 17:57 #81692

    theopants , apart form it being hard to make a case out for Aresene ludicrously and stubbornly sticking with Almunia for 5 years as his number one GK or the waste of cash for donkey's years on Diaby... the failed silly never going to work youth project... playing the kids against Chelsea in a cup final.. never winning a competitive game against Mourinho... 4th place is the first trophy won every season.. hows that for taking pressure of our players ... ...even Morgan, who I am far from being a fan of , could see this... in fact you need a visit to SpecSavers if you can't !

  71. mbg

    Jan 11, 2016, 17:32 #81690

    What has Morgan failing in the USA as a chat show host got to do with it, or anything ? and has your messiah never failed in anything ? (no of course he hasn't) has he not got an ego, has he never had a pop at anyone ? you and the rest of the wengerites are just doing to Morgan what your accusing him of doing to your Lord and master. You couldn't make it up.

  72. Ron

    Jan 11, 2016, 17:27 #81689

    MBG - ....but, the thought of PM having been the catalyst for the anti Wenger arguments and having been endorsed....ooh, awful feeling. PM would dine out on it for 10 yrs if AW was ousted claiming he alone was right and the carrier of the message etc etc. The way PL delivers his views is just odious, maxing his profile to propel his view.

  73. Badarse

    Jan 11, 2016, 17:24 #81688

    That response roughly encapsulates the divide between men-a woman's divide is something quite different. Those who support Arsenal and those who would prop up Morgan. You take your piece, and forever hold it...well until the bucket is kicked. Is it true, or just subjective, that if the four horsemen of the apocalypse appeared westlower would be trying to place a bet?

  74. theopants superstar

    Jan 11, 2016, 17:22 #81687

    "We sold Henry, Toure, Nasri, Adebayor, Fabregas, Clichy and Van Persie. All of these players were offered better terms elsewhere by Clubs with more money than Arsenal. They took the money. They were entitled to take the money. They were top players. Their careers are short. They want to play at the highest level. Arsenal could not offer them the prospect of top salaries and bonuses." Curiously (or was it deliberately?), you did not mention that at least some of those players might have left because they wanted to win some silverware and didn't see the prospect of that happening under Wenger.

  75. mbg

    Jan 11, 2016, 17:08 #81686

    Yes Piers was quite right to refer to and use the last nine years of failure, and there's no sleight of hand there or nothing misleading about that (no matter how you and the other wengerites try)after all that's what it's all about that IS the whole story no matter what spin, if's, and but's is put on it, remember what we were told (spun) when we were moving into the new stadium ? Now that's what you call a real sleight of hand and misleading, I suppose Piers Morgan is to blame for that to. Yes TOF should have been fired years ago for all the embarrassments and humiliations alone before we even take into account the nine barren years of failure, and he would have been at any other club with ambition or not, as far as ambition goes obviously we have/had none over the years (and your as good as questioning that yourself) now there's another real sleight of hand and misleading with the spin maintaining we are, but of course again as far as the wengerites are concerned in the defence of their messiah that's alright. I've no doubt if TOF had been put out to grass years ago and someone else given a go we'd have had at least two prem titles in the last nine barren years, and there's nothing misleading about that, the truth hurts.

  76. Badarse

    Jan 11, 2016, 16:59 #81685

    Mark of Nark, you draw me from my slumber. Only a knave would suggest we should work longer hours and for more years. This fragment of time is all we have, why waste it in an all, but slightly, xenophobic post? Well it drew jeff from beneath the eiderdown, so I suppose you might count that as a success.

  77. jeff wright

    Jan 11, 2016, 16:51 #81684

    Hi Mark,agree with you,whatever one may think about Morgan's views on other matters it's difficult to make a case for him not being right about Wenger. If anything,compared with others, his views are rather moderate !

  78. Mark from Aylesbury

    Jan 11, 2016, 16:36 #81683

    Piers Morgan is an easy person to pick on as he appears to irritate people. Strangely I've not found that myself. A few facts : he actually did 3 seasons of the Dave Letterman show so not a total disaster. Also he was very openly anti guns which in the states is not going to go down well so quite brace really as I expect he may have had a few threats. His message was as welcome as an American commentator on French TV telling them to work more than 35hrs a week and retire later. It would go down like a lead balloon but would not necessarily be incorrect. Think he made the right call on Wenger as well

  79. Badarse

    Jan 11, 2016, 16:29 #81682

    The past has flown, as have the doves of peace, and the last BEA and BOAC plane. Gather around for a circular discus-sion. Generally all posts are delivered as statements of fact, including the factual ones. Yes we beat this team on this occasion by this score-but how we played, the way we scored, the justice of the result are all subjective-though subjects can share, we can even share objects, but please return undamaged. 'You are blind! You should wake up and say, "You for coffee?" Get out of the house and see real life, you will change your view!' So not an arbitrary dialogue, but a diatribe directed with a venomous and aggressive attitude-and who's hat it chewed is anyone's guess. Personal views, but many shared makes a cook spoil the brothel. Majority may rule but has no litigation or claim to what is, or isn't correct. Axioms go a long way-and at a good rate,20m/p/h, even faster in metric-in making some semblance of understanding life, but who is to say this music is the best, this genre of film-making was superior, and Colgate really did have a Ring of Confidence? We are who we are, though thankfully MARCUS is someone else, isn't that enough?

  80. Ron

    Jan 11, 2016, 16:23 #81680

    I reckon Morgan is one of those whos known for what he is and treated and listened accordingly ...a total prat. Im not an Arsene to stay forever man, far from it, but i ll defend Wenger vis the likes of that overbearing oaf all day long. You d never tire of slapping him would you yet, he knows this and makes a mint from it. More fool the barmy viewers and listeners who keep his profile raised. I wouldn't employ him to run a sweet stall and might reverse over him if i ran over him to make sure the deed was done. He typifies modern TV and its dumbed down content. I'm surprised SKY haven't signed him up yet.

  81. deansway

    Jan 11, 2016, 16:03 #81679

    he did not play ospina i would guess because it backfired in the champions league. see leicester and others if they play a weakened team they do well if they keep their goalkeeper and they are the only position where tiredness eg hamstings problems is rare.

  82. In The Luton End When Caesar Fell

    Jan 11, 2016, 15:40 #81678

    @jjetplane....dude, were you like, totally lit when you typed your piece? Psychedelic man, wowee zowee....as for dream sequences, mine involve Axel Witsel and Romelu Lukaku. And occasionally Troy Deeney.

  83. CT Gooner

    Jan 11, 2016, 15:34 #81677

    Really Gents, we want to pull the plaster off again? No one (outside the board room) has all the facts on our barren years, so suggesting anyone's argument is stronger than the opposite one is flawed. You can disagree with Morgan, or any other pundit, all you want, but what's true is only Arsenal have allowed a manager to keep his job when achieving so little (champions league clubs). I view Arsenal as that dog you don't want to put down. You love what he's been, but you know things are going downhill. You over emphasize every positive hoping things are turned around, but deep down you know times up....All only my opinions.

  84. mbg

    Jan 11, 2016, 15:20 #81676

    Yea just the same way your using Morgan to defend your messiah. OGL is very good at bouncing back himself after embarrassments and humiliations in his nine barren years, but of course that's alright and allowed. A lot of fans happen to think Piers is spot on and agree with him, but of course anybody that speaks out (especially Arsenal fans)and says it as it is, and/or tells the truth about or against Lord wenger is not a true fan, just the same way other managers who do the same become hate figures, I suppose when your devoted to a messiah, or an old past it out of date manager who should have been put out to grass years ago, as some are the truth hurts.

  85. jjetplane

    Jan 11, 2016, 14:59 #81675

    Carr's book is great as is H G Wells and Hobsbawn but we/I/they digress and I am really warming to Piers as he is correct in all he says regarding Webster's (aged 78 - look it up!) yawningly overlong tenure (zzz what's that muffins you say!) at The cor blimey bleeding Arsenal JOHN. Always remember Webster's Waffles being digested in full by an aging Barca team at Wembley (lovely storm that night!) and thinking this club will never get to the top - these waffles simply don't and never will have the fight. Watching Ox and his rueful smile as he hits the post tells you all you need to know. There's more fight in a Private (?) Perry circular than there is in this er low sugar, lacking flavour Arsenal. To say the great change was heralded (sic) by the arrival of Das playboy who now has less chance of playing in Spain as Ramsey is really quite funny. Let's be honest - Wrighty is far more ridiculous than Morgan a she strives to advocate with just one brain cell. How did cope (pen para 1st line) indeed .....

  86. Jamerson

    Jan 11, 2016, 14:48 #81672

    Here's a Question:What happens to babies and imbeciles who know nothing about sin if they die?Arsenal to beat Liverpool 2-1.

  87. Bard

    Jan 11, 2016, 14:29 #81670

    Who cares what Morgan has to say, he hasnt worked a day in football. Graham everyone has an agenda, everyone has an opinion, whats new ? Incidentally, the EH Carr book is fantastic.

  88. jeff wright

    Jan 11, 2016, 14:25 #81668

    Morgan is not someone whom in matters other than AFC that I agree with. However , leaving that aside , his arguments regarding old Arsene are spot on -that's why they touch a raw nerve with AKB's. By the way Graham once again you are stating your own views (on Morgan's ones this time) as his views being 'misleading'as being a fact,when in 'fact' your own views are just a matter of opinion and not a fact . Although the real facts are that all of the evidence available - regarding such matters as the alleged stadium debt anchoring Wenger down - and other excuses dreamed up by Ivan and co - that are lapped up by AKB's as thirsty dogs do with bowls of water - simply just not true!

  89. WeAreBuildingATeamToDominate

    Jan 11, 2016, 14:21 #81667

    Who cares what 606 have to say. Their agenda is to get people to phone in. Why bother wasting 10 minutes of your life you won't get back on trying to call them. 606 has been s h i t e ever since Mellor took the reins.

  90. Westlower

    Jan 11, 2016, 13:58 #81664

    For Piers Morgan read Adrian Durham & Jeff Wright!

  91. Badarse

    Jan 11, 2016, 13:54 #81663

    Graham, your comments display a wisdom and understanding which are vital for anyone occupying a platform which may influence some. Morgan, with such a position of influence has an agenda, and therefore fails in the guidance of others. I find him an odious character and have a recurring dream of both he and Simon Cowell, being trapped between floors for six hours, in a lift. Can but hope, I suppose. That Eddie Kelly goal against Anderlecht, like the Liverpool Cup Final goal happened at the other end to where I was standing. The difference in the two was that I watched that Anderlecht goal fly high and true into the net, knowing it was goal bound when it left his boot. Magnificent, and yes still there in vivid Technicolor in my mind. 'OO, OO! Eddie Kelly!'

  92. David

    Jan 11, 2016, 13:46 #81662

    Nah - the selling club thing goes back further than financial constraints, new stadium etc. He couldn't hold on to Overmars, Petit, and Anelka. Overmars and Petit left because of the greater challenge at a bigger club, but Anelka was all about the cash...and the bigger club. The football under Wenger was like nothing seen at Highbury, but it was all a bit powder puff in the Champions League. And the failures in the CL still weigh heavily on AWs shoulders - it's his greatest ambition. In line with Churchill - If Hitler invaded Hell, I would make a favourable reference to the devil in the House of Commons - it is the civilized thing to do to vomit on Piers Morgan's words. AWs ambition has been to take a big English club and make them a big European club. Even if he hasn't done this, 3 titles and a top 4 finish every year has meant Arsenal are still in with a chance. And the 'expert in failure' comment doesn't stack up with the trophies won in the past two years. Those successes surprised many fans - as the old man looked past it, and success has made this season quite exciting. What he has achieved is impressive for all the reasons stated in this article. Good old Arsene.

  93. Jamerson

    Jan 11, 2016, 13:44 #81661

    Piers Morgan just regurgitates the same nonsense we have been hearing from our WOB friends on here over the lat ten years.He like them is an attention seeker and glory hunter..

  94. Peter Wain

    Jan 11, 2016, 13:25 #81660

    no change in transfer tactics we talk big and buy no one. I think Morgan just likes to be talked about so he comes out with a load of piffle which gets him noticed. I doubt he even likes football just another johnny come lately out for publicity.

  95. South African Gooner

    Jan 11, 2016, 13:15 #81659

    Great comments...think you it the nail on the head..