Two models, one of which Arsenal could follow

Online Ed – What the Gunners could learn from Atletico Madrid



Two models, one of which Arsenal could follow

Simeone – Achieved wonders in four and half seasons at Atletico


Firstly, apologies for the lack of fresh content this week. Personally, I have been very busy with non-Gooner related matters, and have received just one submission last night for posting, which I will put up on the site after the weekend (thanks Ian Tredgett). Just to remind people that The Gooner is an open church and that contributions are welcomed, especially for the website. At the same time, I also realize that right now there isn’t a great deal new to say, and kudos to those that post daily on other sites, although at times it is obvious they are struggling for inspiration.

The most interesting thing that has happened in the football world in recent days has been the Champions League final. It’s a decade since Paris 2006, and people generally acknowledge that Arsenal seem as far away as ever from taking part in another. What are the differences between the two Madrid clubs and the Gunners that meant they could make two finals in three seasons?

Well, they both offer different models. Real’s advantage is based on finance. Certainly you can argue that they have it easy in their domestic league in terms of competition for Champions League qualification in the first instance. But are their domestic matches so easy that they have more in reserve for Europe? There could be something in this. Principally though, they can afford to buy and retain players in a quantity that Arsenal can only dream of. Mesut Ozil, one of the Gunners’ two superstars, was effectively a cast off, a financial makeweight to ensure the club could afford Gareth Bale. Going through their line-up, there are a number of high price tag purchases. James Rodriguez cost £60 million but did not get off the bench in the final.

So although Arsenal have plenty of money, they aren’t going to match Real for the wealth of talent they can afford. Yet, Atletico offer a different model, one Arsenal could imitate and actually even improve on, given they do have more financial muscle.

Let’s not mince our words here. Atletico are a selling club, much like Arsenal were in the first years after the stadium move. When big bids come in for their star players, they sell. Needs must. But the first thing that the Gunners could learn from them is that they recruit well, presumably the consequence of an excellent scouting system. Secondly, they blend youth and experience to the right degree. This is something one could argue Arsenal are already doing, but are the experienced players they utilise actually as good when it comes to motivating and educating the younger ones? I look at the body language of a Walcott or an Oxlade-Chamberlain and I’d have to say I do wonder.

Team spirit seems to be a strength of Atletico. Certainly, the manager can foster this, but out on the pitch, it is down to the players to ensure their resolve remains strong, and that they are united. This could be a cultural thing. The blend at Atletico is largely Spanish and Latin American, with the occasional exception such as Griezmann. Arsenal seem to be a far more cosmopolitan collection, and one wonders if the bonds are as strong. Organisation is an obvious facet of Diego Simeone’s approach. His team know their roles. The freedom of to express themselves is used selectively. Does this make them boring to watch? I’d venture it would if there was nothing at stake. But Atletico’s success means such matches are rare. The manager is obviously a motivator. I will never forget Thiago Mendes’ quote before the 2014 final – “We would jump off a bridge for our manager”. Wenger’s players are by and large very loyal to him, but one wonders if they would do much more than jump off a chair, such is the comfort bubble he creates for them. In a sense, he attains their loyalty in a different way, through offering them an unchallenged luxury existence in which they do not feel threatened. Does it produce winners? The evidence suggests it can only take a team so far.

Simeone has achieved wonders since becoming Atletico coach in December 2011, and on a limited budget. Lessons can only be learned from his approach, although they are not ones the current Arsenal boss is likely to take on board. At 66 years old, that particular old dog isn’t going to be interested in new tricks.

Next season’s Champions League final is in Cardiff, scene of several Wenger triumphs before the new Wembley re-opened in 2006. I’d put more money on another Real – Atletico final than Arsenal making the trip down the M4.

If all goes to plan, this year’s end of season Gooner survey should be online tomorrow, or Saturday at the worst. Bear with us.


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61
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  1. divingrooney

    Jun 06, 2016, 6:55 #90078

    Not to undermine Simeone's achievements, but Athletico have been great beneficiaries of third party ownership, which is illegal in EPL. Aguero, Falcao, Costa all came through this route. This means that benefit from the best Latin talents, without paying anything...

  2. mbg

    Jun 05, 2016, 21:19 #90073

    Hiccup, yes the untold goonies have been caught out on this one, just like a swerve ball they never seen coming, you can just imagine the tizzy they were in when this news broke, (routers would certainly have been going down) caught between a rock and a hard place you have to laugh, crying out for guidance from AKB central (good one) while they await guidance from they're messiah. It's not right laughing.

  3. Time for change

    Jun 05, 2016, 10:09 #90054

    Don't forget keV that Arsenal cannot financially compete with Real to win the European Cup but Liverpool, Porto and Chelsea can. Dubai Emery in.

  4. Ozzie

    Jun 05, 2016, 9:36 #90053

    News report: 'Jamie Vardy's wife responds to Arsenal transfer.' Oops! I mean 'Jamie Vardy's wife responds to 20 million pounds'

  5. Arseneknewbest

    Jun 05, 2016, 8:55 #90052

    With his ridiculous new quiff, am I the only person who thinks Ramsey looks like an hubristic bell-end? You'd think the geezer would have a bit more humility after the underwhelming season he's just partaken in. Maybe he's looking for some new product endorsements (Mr Whippy perchance?) or perhaps he's planning to enter a Colonel Sanders lookalike competition while in France. In any case, I simply cannot wait to see all the selfies and cod LA-gang finger signals (yes Ozy, I mean you) from our boys as they help their respective countries to fizzle out of the euros...not gonna bother watching it - this is one area where I'm definately a euro sceptic. Still not sure about the referendum though.

  6. Edmund

    Jun 05, 2016, 3:10 #90051

    My theory is that they got the wrong guy in Wrigglesworth instead of Paul Walsh. All we are getting now is a case of buy what Walsh bought - Vardy, Mahrez and Kante. Meanwhile Grimaldi's eyesight is none too good so he cant spot talent on the cheap anymore. Hence Wrigglesworth. By the way, those who bought the new home kits, there goes a meaningful protest against Arsenal business corp. May as well join the AKB crowd and quit griping. I'm saving my money the following season if there is a change.

  7. Hiccup

    Jun 04, 2016, 20:00 #90050

    The Emergency Hotline set up for AKB's suffering with pre-Vardy trauma has been inundated with callers and the lines have jammed. Untold have asked for calm, and to only call if your distress level is very high. Counselling is being provided, with firm assurances that Wenger will beat the diving out of him, and mould him in to a typical Arsenal player that stays on his feet, in the style of Monreal, Welbeck, or the legend Eboue. In the event that the deal falls through, this will have just been a bad dream, with Wenger never having no intention of buying Vardy, and it was just a wind up, as like the Suarez bid. Whatever happens, if we all pull together, we can get through these troubled waters.

  8. jjetplane

    Jun 04, 2016, 19:25 #90049

    Lawd knows what Walter must be thinking and the latest is that it is a Vardy double who is coming to the Emirates and not the real one. There are pictures online of the two of them and the double managed to dupe Clouseau & Ivan (Int. comedy act) and so the ball rolls into the Untold net where all posters are now on open docket with all leave cancelled for the forseeable future. Watch for articles of Ranieri walking out of pasta houses with Dons and bent refs .... Remember V for Vendetta .... Latest news has hard core AKBs outside the Emirates with No to Divers placards along with the usual anti-abortion chants (?) ....

  9. Bard

    Jun 04, 2016, 18:36 #90048

    What japes aboard the Arsenal fun bus. Knickers being twisted everywhere. Has the Weng lost his mind or even his soul. According to vol 3 subsection 4 on 'Vardiniho dives for victory' how a cheat won the title, the equivalent of a footballing pariah is now to join the unsullied at the Grove. Have the club lost their moral compass? Do they know how long it takes to analysis every Leicester game. Will he soon be diving for victory in the red and white? Will all the bent referees now change sides? Can we penaltise ( I made that up) our way to glorious victory. Oh Vardiiniho what angst you have bought to the disciples of Untold. As he crumples in a heap in the box for yet another pen and another victory the Untold banner is taken down, the chanting starts, and there is mass exodus from the ground.

  10. Hiccup

    Jun 04, 2016, 17:58 #90047

    Oh the meltdown re Vardy on Untold is is hilarious. The poor souls just don't know what to make of it all, and are crying out for guidance from AKB Central. Having initially batted the bid away as lazy journalism on par with the Suarez bid (that they still don't accept as ever happening), the type of player they detest for diving could be on his way here. However, Untold should be pleased about Vardy joining us, as their correspondent who spends all week watching reruns of the Leicester games to report solely on Vardy can be freed up for better things now. This special agent could now waste most of his life reporting on the corruption that goes on within the technical areas, as managers and back room staff try to bribe the 4th officials. Or better still, spending their exciting lives comparing how the Italian leagues have two more ball boys per game than the Premier League, which in itself proves everyone has it in for Arsenal. Whatever happens, the cabinet reshuffle over on Untold is going to be interesting. Well, as interesting as reading one of their Referee Reviews.

  11. John F

    Jun 04, 2016, 17:08 #90046

    Apparently our Jack has been the one who has been trying to persuade Vardy to join I wonder what he said.'Vardy my boy what do you think of Tottenham sorry I can't get that song out of my mind.You will love playing for Wenger he lets us do what we want including team tactics.Quite often he turns up not knowing what to do so we send him out to do car park duty. If you feel a bit tired before the match don't worry you can do what (he plays when he wants)Ozil does and take the match off,you still have to turn up on the pitch though.Trainings a doddle a Lot of sideway passing and we don't have to do boring things like study the opposition.One last thing we have a lovely lovely treatment room i spend most of the season in there and all for 150g a week lovely jubbly' .

  12. jjetplane

    Jun 04, 2016, 16:46 #90045

    After Untold have run untold articles about how Vardy and Co stole the PL from the lovely Arsene FC folk through their diving, paying refs off and dodgy finances run from fronthouses, you can feel the hatred if Vardy were to wash up which would be a massive betrayal by their leader Lord Wenga and a nod towards a tough, diving, cheating regime at the Emirates. Sounds good to me but with Wenger in charge I think a time out from CL monies is fast looming. Predictor says Koeman to lead Toffees to PL glory and boy does he not like Wenger. Read Untold comments for squirm value - pure gold. Vardy though would be great and even better if he arrived and told Wenger 'a few truths' because he can .... Ozil would love it I am sure. Other news is Jack being very tetchy with media in the style of his master and he really looks like the boy looking in from the outside in the England set-up.

  13. Mark from Aylesbury

    Jun 04, 2016, 16:29 #90044

    Worth reading the mail online today it's got a good analysis of how Vardy could fit with options of 4-3-2-1, 4-4-2, 4-3-3 with the various player combos. A 4-4-2 Sanchez and Vardy looks vicious ! Probably the most frightening combo I could imagine since the invisibles. Either we change formation or Vardy gets lost in the formation. Looks very interesting!

  14. Mark from Aylesbury

    Jun 04, 2016, 16:19 #90043

    Bard and also MBG - good point well made I think we should carry out a hypocrisy watch on Untold as they suddenly become Vardy acolytes whilst probably blaming us if he loses form. Two things spring to mind: 1: if we fail to win the title next year with Vardy leading the line it will further reflect on Wengers inability to manage success. 2: looks like tippy tappy is dead, I suspect a return to press and speed. Poor old Jamerson will be gutted. Then again hasn't he retired from Arsenal (the plastic )

  15. Peter

    Jun 04, 2016, 15:58 #90042

    Can someone tell me how we have bought Grant Xhaka when I thought the transfer window opens on 1st August?

  16. mbg

    Jun 04, 2016, 15:56 #90041

    Why in heavens name would vardy want to come to us ? wenger would ruin him.

  17. CT Gooner

    Jun 04, 2016, 15:04 #90040

    I like Vardy, but I think he'd be stupid to come to Arsenal. We rarely play counter attacking football, though when we do we actually look very good at it ( man city games come to mind). I'd say theo's lack of success is further sign of this. No, get yourself 100k a week at LCFC and enjoy being their star. I believe we have great squad players in Giroud and Welbeck, we need to invest in super star quality, but I think that would be a number that Wenger couldn't swallow. Again, why build an über club if you can't stomach the prices of the talent you need

  18. mbg

    Jun 04, 2016, 11:53 #90039

    SKG, good post, and there would be less complaining about cost and price/prices too i'd bet, and the atmosphere and noise in the ground would improve tenfold over night. Yes the heart has been ripped out of the club there's no doubt about that, and that's just what TOF wenger likes, and wanted.

  19. Bard

    Jun 04, 2016, 11:50 #90038

    Vardy ! surely not. Over on the other site they have done a statistical analysis of all the penalties he gets that are effectively dives. We dont want that sort of player at Arsenal do we ?????

  20. goonersol

    Jun 04, 2016, 11:39 #90037

    Just heard Koeman going to Everton, so another potential manager goes elsewhere, while we Rust in Wenger....Vardy, really?? Would not fit into Wenger's tippy tappy style, where was his real bid for Suarez, who would have suited us, I don't think Vardy does, but might please the KB's with our penalty ratio ...The agony continues...

  21. Seven Kings Gooner

    Jun 04, 2016, 10:24 #90036

    If Simeone became our manager I would put my name down on any waiting list to get a season ticket. I have been reading Ray Parlour's book "Romford Pele" and it is great reading about Pat Rice working with the youngsters, in one training session Ray put in a couple of hard tackles on our England youth captain, the miffed player told him "you can't tackle me like that I'm the England captain" Pat hearing this stopped the session and told Ray to hit him harder next time and told the other lad "you may be England captain but you are f*ck all here!" Reading that makes you realize that as these great old pros of Arsenal leave the club, so leaves the heart of Highbury with it. As for Vardy he would go potty making run after run without a hope in hell of a ball over the top. Vardy is not a fit for us while we play this slow approach possession game, under George Graham or Simeone - 1-0 to Arsenal most definitely.

  22. mbg

    Jun 04, 2016, 10:19 #90035

    Ozzie, didn't you know TOF has been watching him for the last two three seasons, and tried to sign him three years ago.

  23. John F

    Jun 04, 2016, 7:59 #90034

    Ozzie that is why I would be surprised if it happened and maybe a distraction as the Express are reporting that we have agreed terms with Antonio Cloak from Hoffenheim a 2nd tier German side ,which is more like a Wenger signing although the clubs have not agreed a fee.Whatever happens Vardy is about to get richer.Another more like Wenger story that we have again insulted Bolton by bidding 750g for their defender Holding and have now improved it to 1.2mil.The Cahill saga comes to mind when we would not pay the 7mil that he went to Chelsea for.

  24. Ozzie

    Jun 04, 2016, 6:34 #90033

    Vardy? Why would Wenger want to sign a 29 year old one year wonder? We have had enough of those a la Van Persie, Ramsey, etc. To think we could have had Suarez and been celebrating being certain champions.

  25. mbg

    Jun 03, 2016, 21:52 #90032

    John F, no worries mate, you have to give it to the spin department season tickets and all that, i don't watch much weather forecasts, i have friends abroad and although it's warm it hasn't stopped raining for days, and the heat and sun here has been magic i cant wait for them to get home in their shorts as white as when they left lol.

  26. mbg

    Jun 03, 2016, 21:32 #90031

    I wonder what the Ian tanners and all the other AKB excuse makers think of this latest piece of spin ? would he suddenly become a hero ? LOL, you couldn't make it up.

  27. John F

    Jun 03, 2016, 21:27 #90030

    I know Mgb I have not even got the heat as an excuse we haven't seen the sun for days up here .

  28. mbg

    Jun 03, 2016, 21:15 #90029

    John F, get a grip mate, i know the suns shining and it's hot but don't let this heat go to your head and fall for it, there's enough who believe the spin, and will do again.

  29. John F

    Jun 03, 2016, 21:13 #90028

    Funny how Gary lineker defended Wenger last season and has now just tweeted'Vardy stay with the champions don't go to the perennial also-rans.

  30. mbg

    Jun 03, 2016, 20:56 #90027

    Mark, sad state of affairs isn't it.

  31. John F

    Jun 03, 2016, 20:39 #90026

    Jamie it is all over the Arsenalnewsnow site.At first I thought no way will he sign for us but I forgot he is 29 and maybe trying to get one more big contract either from us or Leicester.Liverpool are also trying. Not sure if he would suit tippy happy football he is more effective in fast counter attacking football.If he does sign let's hope he is not played on the wing .

  32. Jamie

    Jun 03, 2016, 19:52 #90025

    Arsenal have supposedly triggered the release clause for Jamie Vardy. How many pound coins over?

  33. Mark

    Jun 03, 2016, 18:50 #90024

    Pep Carlo Jurgen Jose now Ronald all available in the last 6 months but Gazidis wants to stick with our Specialist In Failure.Lets face it when Clueless finally does go Bould will get the Arsenal job.A club that totally lacks ambition thats Arsenal

  34. Mark from Aylesbury

    Jun 03, 2016, 17:52 #90023

    On a happier note the AST survey has arrived like s big dollop of poop on Gazidis bald head. Want Wenger to stay beyond current contract? Your part of a whopping 8% , like Kronkes way of business? 1.5% on the response. Wenger right man to manage? 49% ( remember AST tends to be a little conservative in its thinking, other groups would probably go 25%). Suck it up Ivan looks like it's not just social media thinks the Board, stewardship and general management is dire!

  35. mbg

    Jun 03, 2016, 15:05 #90022

    AMG, your dead right, we were lucky to get second (regardless of what others think, and regard it as some kind of an achievement and progress)as usual we needed help from others the spuds collapsing, and all the other big clubs in transition and playing shyte, yes we were lucky we didn't finish fifth or sixth, it's about where we belong now thanks to this old past it manager. But as we all know there would have been an excuse/excuses for that too.

  36. Ron

    Jun 03, 2016, 12:34 #90021

    Mark - there you have it re Gazadis latest utterings. Its nothing we didnt know though is it. 'He can go when he wants' - f--k me! What outfit would ever say that? The Clubs truly pathetic. Deserves to fail.

  37. AMG

    Jun 03, 2016, 12:29 #90020

    I agree Mark. The insinuation from Gazidis seems to be that Wenger has a job for as long as he wants one. That's a message unheard of in top level football, but of course we aint really top level any more, just alsorans lucky to get 2nd behind Leicester. Pathetic stuff from a club once so proud.

  38. Mark T

    Jun 03, 2016, 11:57 #90019

    At last - an article worth reading! Welcome back.

  39. Mark from Aylesbury

    Jun 03, 2016, 11:08 #90018

    Very worrying comments from Gazidis in the Telegraph saying that we are making real progress under Wenger. He does acknowledge social media but dismisses it as people caught up in different realities. Ultimately you ignore social media at your peril but looks like it will take yet another collapse by a factor of 10 for the reality to sink in

  40. Radfordkennedy

    Jun 03, 2016, 10:21 #90017

    Arseneknew......agree mate,the trouble with a self sustaining business model is that it has to be administered correctly and by people with drive and ambition. The most important part of such a plan is to spend big money to get real quality,because you shouldn't really have anymore than an emergency pot of 50mil say,you must invest every year so you arrive at a point where you just need that one player,maybe two,if you take your eye of the target and allow yourself to succumb to the temptation to stockpile cash you will in any business arrive at a situation where your product or in our case playing staff will have dipped below an acceptable level, then all that happens then is that market prices now dictate that all that pile of cash isn't enough to get you back to the top , which is where I believe Arsenal are now

  41. Nick

    Jun 03, 2016, 9:58 #90016

    Fairly pointless exercise that, Wenger is NOT Simeone,and Wenger is who were stuck with, he will never base our play on defense unless forced into it by circumstances but then only temporarily. Whether he will utilize club money and buy the requisite players in the right positions is still up for debate with only the one early signing, I suppose the Euros will be used as the excuse for parsimony this time out, I hope not but I wouldn't be surprised, Gazidis is having a q and a session tonight with " invited" supporters who will no doubt be staunch Arsenites who will give the snake oil salesman an easy ride with predisclosed questions, as frustrating as all this is we can do nothing else but wait to see how this summer turns out !

  42. Redshirtswhitesleeves

    Jun 03, 2016, 9:48 #90015

    Arseneknewbest- 'Naked greed' - in two words you have nailed the parasites running our club

  43. WeAreBuildingATeamToDominate

    Jun 03, 2016, 7:35 #90014

    Whilst I normally like Kevin's articles, this one seems a bit lacking. Talk of following a particular business model, but not how that might be acheived. Easy; clear out the current regime.

  44. Edmund

    Jun 03, 2016, 2:03 #90013

    DD was with AW at Wembley? Dare we hope that AW has enough humility to get some advice from him to bring back the glory days?

  45. mbg

    Jun 03, 2016, 0:39 #90012

    ArseneKnewBest, good post, I couldn't agree more, it was all spin way back then too, and we all fell for it hook line and sinker (and can you believe some still do/are)I'll never be convinced that if OGL wanted one, two, even three certain players way back then (just like now) money wouldn't have been found/made available for wenger, TOF just hadn't the balls instead indulged himself in (at the fans and clubs expense) his pet project youth where he knew he's be safe using lack of money as an excuse, and like I said we all fell for it/spin, especially the AKB wengerites who have done so, up to, and for the last four seasons with they're crying and scare mongering with, we don't want to do a Portsmouth we don't want to do a Leeds bla bla bla in defence of their messiah's failings and failures.

  46. Arseneknewbest

    Jun 02, 2016, 23:01 #90011

    I keep coming back to this refusal to accept that AFC were somehow obliged to tighten their belts during and after the stadium move. A more adventurous and ambitious leadership would have borrowed if necessary to deliver success (nb: money has been unprecedentedly cheap for ages) right from the off in order to justify the move. But oh no, not us: bungling Hill-Wood and more latterly the merkined midwest moneygrubber have chosen to suck cash out of our club instead of really pushing Arsenal onto a higher level. Ably abetted by a vastly overpaid former manager who sacrificed success to become a gold-plated whipping boy. Over-cautiousness? Yes, but naked greed is/was the main motivator and the chance to leech money out of Arsenal while at the same time forsaking success. The previous and current board have f&cked the Arsenal for their own personal greed. They're enemies within. Imagine Simeone being interviwed by SK for the job in future - nah, it's impossible isn't it.

  47. Goonersol

    Jun 02, 2016, 22:24 #90010

    Nightmare scenario looms, Wenger will coast along for another season achieve the minimum required , then land himself a job upstairs thanks too gazidis & Kroenke, especially if the AKB,s stand behind their man and think he can do no wrong, the Arsenal we loved has been lost years ago and it looks like it won't be coming back any day soon.... As for Simeone no chance will clueless regime remains .

  48. Smithy

    Jun 02, 2016, 21:47 #90009

    Did anyone see David Dein at Wembley with Arsene tonight. Wishful thinking- I would love to see him back instead of that plank Ivan. Speaking of Berks - Kane and Ali were really poor for England tonight. But credit where credits due the Spurs full backs were good. Jack looked ok when came on. As for simeone- yes please a winning mentality versus Arsenes beauty of the game mentality.

  49. Big Andy

    Jun 02, 2016, 21:42 #90008

    The "cultural mix" didn't stop City from winning two titles, didn't it? No, the real problem at Arsenal is the lack of ambition to do anything other than make money. When the manager say that he'd be happy to finish second for the next 20 years then you know exactly where the club's priorities lay. The loser mentality starts with Kroenke and runs right throughout every layer of this club. That's why mediocrity is so blithely accepted. Simeone would never come to Arsenal: he actually cares about winning.

  50. CORNISH GOONER

    Jun 02, 2016, 19:46 #90007

    A Corporation & not a football club anymore - & to make things even worse a Corporation totally lacking in ambition. 5th or 6th place next year is my prediction which, unless the Sponsors kick up a fuss, will probably be enough for Stanley to continue with The Greedy, Egotistical, Delusional One for another 3 years. Still, if the nutters have their way on the 23rd couldn't we apply to join the MLS? We might have a chance of winning that.

  51. mbg

    Jun 02, 2016, 19:07 #90006

    Arsenal under TOF making it to a CL in Cardiff ? (splutter) now we know what you were doing/indulging in when you say you were busy with non gooner matters to even think about it Kevin.

  52. Ron

    Jun 02, 2016, 16:37 #90005

    Hi Bard - im not leader type characters exist in football anymore. Most seem to be prissy little prima donnas who couldn't lead their dogs up the garden path as i see them. Theyre also just wrapped up in themselves. Good leaders need to hard but unselfish. Certainly, those that dont fit this description arent employed by Wenger as im pretty sure hes threatened by them as football has changed. I never thought PV 4 to be a great leader to be honest. Hes a quiet distinguished chap. Arsenl ahave nt had real leadership since TA5 in my view. Had to laugh at Henry dissing Tottenhams youngsters as lacking mental strength. Good grief, him, one of the worst Captains we ever had dishing the dirt upon youngsters of the ages that he used to sulk at and abuse. Theres one prissy egotistical pr--k if you want one. Im sure the ballet dancing deters many Bard! The Clubs a social Club not a footie Club.

  53. Andrew

    Jun 02, 2016, 16:31 #90004

    If our players jumped off a chair for their manager, they'd be out injured for a year...

  54. Bard

    Jun 02, 2016, 15:43 #90003

    I agree the Atletico model is the route we should be going down and their success surely debunks the notion that you cant compete without big bucks. Ron its an interesting issue this leadership problem. He knows what it is because he's had Adams and Paddy for starters but he cant seem to find players who have that quality now. I wonder whether its a result of the style of play. We have so many ballet dancers and no powerful players. Maybe this new kid is one who knows. I also dont think Simeone would come to Arsenal in a month of Sundays

  55. Redshirtswhitesleeves

    Jun 02, 2016, 15:28 #90002

    Atletico are a team with REAL mental strength, led by a manager that is second to none in motivating and getting the maximum from his players. Watching them reminds me of Arsenal under George Graham, and what I'd give to have an Arsenal side again that played as if they actually gave a toss. I'd love Simeone as our next manager but I have no confidence in the board appointing anyone that would challenge the cosy, smug little set up that kroenke and gazidis have cultivated there so we can rule Simeone and anyone of his character out

  56. Ron

    Jun 02, 2016, 15:18 #90001

    Atletico and Real WANT to compete in Finals Simon. AFC dont really. Those 2 Clubs also have belief that they can achieve. Arsenals was drained from them yrs ago. Yr right too, the cultural and nationality mix seems to be poor at Arsenal. It always comes down ot the leadership on and off the pitch too doesn't it. Do AFC have any? I dont think so. Wengers going to no CL Finals for sure as i see it. I dread to think what would have happened to Arsenal under the RM onslaught in the 1st half or the AM onslaught in the 2nd half. Perhaps its as well that Arsenal dont compete in these things and you know what ....i think the Club know it too.

  57. mbg

    Jun 02, 2016, 13:56 #90000

    I don't think/believe their domestic matches are so easy at all, it's just that they have proper/genuine top top qualitee players having spent their money and spent it wisely (unlike us)and most importantly have a proper coach/manager (unlike us) who knows what he's doing.

  58. mbg

    Jun 02, 2016, 13:45 #89999

    There's a hell of a lot of fans who have been struggling for inspiration now for years Kevin thanks to an old out of touch past it manager, Simeone is just the man (or type)to bring it all back along with others, young ambitious managers who know what they're doing.

  59. Torbay gooner

    Jun 02, 2016, 13:40 #89998

    Simeone's European record already towers over Wenger, in the mere four and a half years he has been in charge at Atletico. A Europa league win and two CL finals in three years, with a club that had only previously enjoyed modest European success, similar to Arsenal's record, marks him out as an outstanding talent. Shame that we are very unlikely to see him at Arsenal, as after Wenger does finally step down, who at the club is likely to have the enterprise and ambition to seek him out?

  60. CT Gooner

    Jun 02, 2016, 13:21 #89997

    It's the likes of Simone & Athletico that show Wenger is wrong for Arsenal. We have tread water through our self imposed tough financial period, while Athletico have prospered. Untold will tell me I'm a glory hunter, I'd argue I'm an Arsenal supporter, and very much not an Arsene supporter.

  61. CB

    Jun 02, 2016, 13:02 #89996

    Simeone is number 1 choice for me. He would be a great fit. He instills fight in his players, more like the old Arsenal many of us remember. And just think what he could do with the extra funds available. Lets hope he stays at AM for another year and that Wenger does not get another contract. Even Ivan should be able to figure out that Simeone should be one of the main targets