Arsenal Circular 154 – A Response to Mark Halfpenny

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Arsenal Circular 154 – A Response to Mark Halfpenny

“If things go wrong this season then maybe Wenger’s time will be up”


This Arsenal Circular is a response to criticism of my comments in Arsenal Circular 153 by Mark Halfpenny.

Mark, who I do not know, does not hold back. These are some of things he said about me “his article is so full of inaccuracies, wishful thinking and blindness to the facts...thousands of long term fans have wanted Wenger out for years due to his mismanagement, end of season collapses, chronic under achievement and wasteful spending on huge wages to rubbish players...In late 2010 I gave up paying £100 a time to watch Eboue, Song, Squillaci, Denilson, Almunia, Gervinho, Walcott and others poncing about while Wenger sat on the bench fiddling with his zip...”

He goes on to say that the Glazer debt was no bar to success at United. “My dislike of Wenger is built on seeing the same mistakes, hearing the same excuses, watching the same rubbish every year since 2005”. Wenger is “so arrogant and disingenuous...Wenger’s record at producing and managing young talent is woeful” and cites the treatment of Chambers as an example of bad management. “There is nothing to suggest that Wenger will ever recreate past triumphs” and focuses on his failure to get anywhere in Europe. The problems at Arsenal “are caused by a stubborn, arrogant, out of date manager that has too much power is way behind his rivals”.

So let me respond.

1. Have thousands of fans wanted Wenger out for years? The much vaunted protest at the end of last season was a damp squib. I accept that there is frustration among some supporters and some have become vocal. But Mark should not distort reality. There is much support for Wenger as well – you can read it in social media alongside the critics. And have the critics wanted him out “for years”. Really? Looseness is no good, Mark, when you are marshalling a case against Wenger. Why not accept reality and simply admit that there are supporters who support Wenger and supporters who want him out.

2. “Mismanagement, end of season collapses, chronic under achievement and wasteful spending on huge wages to rubbish players”. I readily accept that Wenger has made management mistakes and I have said many times that last season was our season and the failure to win the title was Wenger’s fault. I do not runaway from reality. But nor do I embrace distortion. It is not chronic under-achievement to end up in the top four for 20 years. That has to be an error. You cannot have - and Mark these are your words not mine – “chronic under-achievement” and at the same time be either first or second or third or fourth. You may feel we should have won the title but not winning the title is not “chronic under-achievement”.

3. You refer to unsuccessful players and then make a gratuitous and quite dismissive comment about players “poncing” about” and Wenger fiddling with his zip. Now you are lapsing into insult and pettiness. Don’t follow the nasties and the sillies. And don’t become rude and unpleasant. Sorry to be firm on this Mark but you let yourself down with your zip and ponce comments. The question is not whether Wenger fiddles with his zip but whether a larger than acceptable number of players at AFC have fallen short of the necessary high standards - whether the squad as a whole have been less talented than you would expect of AFC. I would make two points – one is an admission that some players have not come off and you could include Jeffers, Suker, Chamakh and Bendtner in your list (but not Song). It happens at every Club and for a very good reason – no coach can ever be sure that any player will make it to the top. Some adjust to the demands and expectations of a big club and some fail. Even Ferguson failed with Veron and let Pogba go on a free and there are other players who fall short – the two Brazilian players, Anderson and one other come to mind, also keepers Bosnich and Pierre B.

This brings me to my second reason – you cut your coat according to your cloth meaning you spend what you can. Arsenal were a selling club. We sold our best to fund the stadium – Toure, Clichy, Nasri, Fabregas, Adebayor, RVP. We had to make ends meet. We sold high and bought low. The talent coming in was not of the best. The talent going out was the best. Wenger did what he could to muster enough funds to keep the football positive and the league placings high. We sacrificed the short term for the long term. We focused on a new stadium and looked to the day when we would be free of borrowing in a top stadium and with a secure bright long term future. That was the policy that was decided upon. In my view it was the right policy. We are stable, financially sound, in a top stadium and throughout this period of massive transformation Wenger had us year in year out in the top four. We were punching above our weight. But you avoid this issue.

Mark – you may say “take the risk, to hell with balanced budgets, go into debt, mortgage the future of the Club”. That is a point of view. Popular with many. At the same time there are business people who prefer to be safe and secure and stable. Some fans think one way. Some the other. That is life. United are a special Club. Their name is known throughout the world – they can afford to go for deficit financing. Arsenal FC are more cautious and Wenger also does not flash the cash. So we sold the best – bought in what we could and still challenged at the highest level – admittedly without winning but today we have a future and it is due to Wenger that we can look ahead with justified optimism.

Also - is Chambers an example of bad management or an example of not knowing how a player will fare when at the very top? He started well in the centre of defence and then when played at right back had torrid games v Anderlecht and Swansea. Self doubts set in and form dropped. Not every signing at every Club comes off – look at City’s current concerns about their keeper. Sometimes you re-group and a year at Middlesbrough will be the best thing for Chambers. Going out on loan may trigger the turnaround in form. Too early to form a view on Holding but the indications are positive.

Finally Mark your pen runs away with you when you conclude that Wenger “finds a way to mess everything up”. Apart from diehard Wenger critics I think you will find very few people agreeing with you. We have stuttered so far this season. Things may come good and if they do you and I will be on the same side shouting Arsenal and Wenger from the roof tops. If things go wrong then maybe Wenger’s time will be up. But let’s avoid making every match a referendum on Wenger. But more important as between we supporters let’s be straight and objective and free of insult.

Regards

Graham

I am on twitter@arsenalcircular


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39
comments

  1. Peter

    Sep 16, 2016, 21:33 #93166

    Richard, best wishes to your daughter Leeky, I have no words for you...

  2. mbg

    Sep 16, 2016, 18:10 #93162

    jw, yes OGL is a soft touch all right, (not just for other managers on the pitch either )i'm quite sure many more other than barndoor have taken the piss out of him too and showed even less reapect (you just have to listen to Merson and Parlour tell some of their stories)could you imagine the players way back let alone the fancy boys now taking the piss out of George Graham ? or even Bruce Rioch (if he'd have got his chance)who was know as a disciplinarian. As for all these experienced players we're supposed to have I would doubt they have any respect for him either, they'd have cottoned onto him very quickly but like you say are happy to say nothing and hang around and take the big bucks as they wouldn't/won't get it anywhere else, and for all these ex players that have played for us, and he's supposed to have made (and the ones working for the club now)and supposedly have great respect for TOF and wouldn't say a bad word or have a bad word said about him ? (gladly their wakening up now with Frank Mc Clintock the latest to speak out although I think he might have done so before on other occasions)i'd love to hear or be a fly on the wall when their speaking in private in their own homes at their parties and dinner parties and private clubs/pubs, and among their own cliques, I can't wait to hear what they all really think and thought and have to say about TOF and his actions and decisions etc, etc, etc, over the years when he goes, and can speak freely in the knowledge he has no say in if they get fired, or get a job in the future the club, i'd bet it's a hell of a lot different than what they make out and say in public now. wenger out now.

  3. jeff wright

    Sep 16, 2016, 13:46 #93154

    yes mbg ,old Arsene is a well known bottler that's for sure. I see that Ian Wright reveals in his book that Wengo is seen by players as being a soft touch and that many take the piss out of him behind his back and do not take him seriously.He names a couple of these ,such as Barndoor , an easy scapegoat of course to pick on, but my guess is that in truth many more such as Sanchez and Ozil for example also don't rate Wengo and that only those who are happy to just collect their big bucks wages and finish in the top 4 every season to earn the CL cash for Syrupy Stan and co support the clown. Some supporters, such as Circular Graham ,adopt the same attitude and if Arsene knows best manages 4th place in the Prem,difficult to see him doing any better than that this term, then they will be on here hysterically warning us to be careful what you wish for and demanding that Arsene ( yawn) be given a new contract. Because disaster could befall us all, if he is replaced.We might even finish 5th! Or get knocked out of Europe before the first KO round .Other nasty scenarios to consider are us losing to sides such as Bayern Munich 7-0 instead of 5-0.What a disaster that would be! You really could not make it up.

  4. mbg

    Sep 16, 2016, 13:22 #93153

    jw, he's that artist alright, and I can think of another one in which he's the biggest artist of all. wenger out now.

  5. mbg

    Sep 16, 2016, 13:12 #93152

    If everything comes good (cough lol) no we'll certainly not be on the sane side shouting Arsenal and wenger from the rooftops, We'll be shouting Arsenal from the rooftops and wenger OUT.

  6. jeff wright

    Sep 16, 2016, 12:07 #93151

    I can reveal the true reason why Arsene is striking that pose in the photo.He was doing his well known Leonard Rossiter - playing the flatulist ( farter) Joseph Pujol in the 1973 movie about the great fart artist - who could play the Marseilles by breaking wind . Unfortunately his career ended in farce when he was older and had an accident on stage. I suspect that old Wengo himself - who has been the butt of many a joke - will also end up with his career in the brown stuff.

  7. Red Member

    Sep 16, 2016, 10:24 #93150

    Graham you say "things may come good" but you could easily have said that for the past 5 or 6 years. I think most of know by now that things will not come good, but you go on convincing yourself that things might change, that Wenger might change. The fact is they won't, he won't. You finish by acknowledging that if things go wrong then maybe Wenger's time is up. Again for most of us there has been the realisation that things have been going wrong for long enough now to suggest that his time IS up. When will you come to this conclusion? The sooner you and several thousand others in the Emirates realise this then the quicker this club can FINALLY move forward. We are waiting for you, please give it some thought.

  8. Norman

    Sep 16, 2016, 9:47 #93149

    Great managers do not go 12 years without winning their own domestic league(one 2nd place finish in 11 years!!!),they dont go 20 years failing every year in Europe,they dont tell the supporters 4th is a trophy.That is why Wenger will never be a great like Fergis Pep Mourinho and Ancelotti

  9. Mark from Aylesbury

    Sep 16, 2016, 0:04 #93145

    Leekey - help your aim of grinding the Gooner to a halt, remove yourself with immediate effect. Further boost the bandwidth and sheer power of the all conquering Untold by contributing 50 responses a day saying Wenger must stay, or should I say Mr Wenger, Sir , lick lick Sir. Remember no one will ever ask you on Untold who you tip for the Title. Just think of the fun you could have with Brickfields Whoop whoop.

  10. JOHN F

    Sep 15, 2016, 23:58 #93144

    Richard I just want to agree with what Mark said.I know a couple of people who have recently come through chemo and are now making a good recovery.Good luck mate.

  11. mbg

    Sep 15, 2016, 23:39 #93143

    Caption Comp: wengers chief bathroom attendant, i can see the zip my lord, keep pushing.

  12. mbg

    Sep 15, 2016, 23:28 #93142

    And of course it would be the player/players who have fallen short and let TOF down, why did he fooking buy them then. wenger out now.

  13. jeff wright

    Sep 15, 2016, 23:20 #93141

    Caption: With Wenger the wind comes out both ends.

  14. Leekey

    Sep 15, 2016, 23:16 #93140

    Excellent response Graham. The fact of the matter is that online gooner is in the minority and will prove that this is the case once the fanzine has grind to a halt. It's all about opinions is a great title. In the last 20 years we have won titles, doubles, cups, we have built, moved on to make this club a bigger club than anything this country has seen in recent years. Sold overrated players at extortionate prices, brought in youth to accommodate this. Signed world class players. Kept a stable, financial business project safe and afloat throughout the transition of a stadium not only adored by its own fans but many many travelling fans alike...... And still finish above the mighty spurs year in year out. Last night proved where we have come and they still have to go. Wenger must stay.

  15. Mark from Aylesbury

    Sep 15, 2016, 22:22 #93139

    Richard - I just read your comment about your daughter so from all of us , we wish her all the very best and of course a full recovery. Keep on watching the football to take your mind off things. Best regards Mark

  16. Rob

    Sep 15, 2016, 22:05 #93138

    This pro and anti Wenger debate is unending and probably will be until he leaves. But trying ( !!!???) to look beyond that fundsamental point, surely most fans - whether Wenger 'in' or 'outers' - would agree that one of the key problems at the club is how the current squad, at all levels, are too much in their own comfort zone. Players like the Ox and Chambers - now elsewhere - and even Walcott are too easily accommodated at a level of their choosing. We desperately need someone who will shake these players out of their complacency and comfort zone. If it was Wenger - fine. But to my eyes at least, he's put them there. There's no chance he will change it. Hence the need for someone who will.

  17. LEAKY WET DREAM

    Sep 15, 2016, 21:33 #93137

    Caption comp: Hey Bouldy, wish you weren't velcroed to your seat now hey?

  18. The Kronk

    Sep 15, 2016, 21:16 #93136

    Am ready for you now, sir.

  19. JOHN F

    Sep 15, 2016, 20:57 #93135

    Caption,Wenger shows Mustafi the perfect stance for defending corners.

  20. jjetplane

    Sep 15, 2016, 20:47 #93134

    Caption: Wenger ****s Evian bottles for fun .....

  21. Cyril

    Sep 15, 2016, 20:15 #93133

    CB - on the defensive line up - ' holding le coq, bellerin, well are you yet '

  22. RedPig

    Sep 15, 2016, 20:13 #93132

    zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz!

  23. JOHN F

    Sep 15, 2016, 20:04 #93131

    Re Caption comp.Wenger attempts bottles up bottom world record ,only four to go.

  24. CB

    Sep 15, 2016, 19:39 #93130

    Can we have a caption competition for this photo

  25. Richard

    Sep 15, 2016, 19:22 #93129

    Mark I see just as much support for Wenger as against him. Now the question shouldn't be about when is Wenger leaving but what happens when Wenger leaves and this is where I believe that a huge misconception is seen. The club will be in a great financial state and will be stable but what of Wengers replacement now of course not many incoming managers are successes there is evidence to contrary that changing the manager has little or no effect on the team. I do feel that once Wenger goes the board will replace him with a similar style manager one that is prudent and that will bring on youth talent alongside established stars whilst giving a continuity of champions league football . We won't see a mourhino who spends money as if it is going out of fashion and personally his morality and image is one I wouldn't want associated with the club. For me I support this club not for the trophies it will win I have supported it since 1978 and have seen ups and downs I support it for the style and type of football played its image and family connections the past trophies and recent ones are a bonus but I spend my money because I choose to the club doesn't hold a gun to my head or tell me that I will see trophies in fact all I get is the chance to see a football match that lasts 90 minutes as long as outside factors dictate like freak weather traffic problems etc. In those 90 plus minutes I get to forget about whether I can afford next months mortgage or how I'm going to afford to get the car repaired or how many more times I have to watch my daughter suffer after her latest chemo treatment. For me that's all that matters that for ninety minutes I get to see a game of football and that I can actually forget the real world and the problems associated with that. For that reason I will continue to support the club and the team which in my opinion is the coaches manager kit men physio backroad staff coach drivers etc that make the match day possible.

  26. Arnie Asano

    Sep 15, 2016, 19:14 #93128

    Just pass the ****ing thing you ponce!

  27. Alfie G.

    Sep 15, 2016, 18:57 #93127

    Who the hell is Richard you silly Cow! It's Graham ain't it! Stop poncing about and make us a cuppa. Nuvver Rich Tea Mr Perry! Here! Gimme that bleedin' coat!

  28. Richard

    Sep 15, 2016, 18:57 #93126

    Graham I like your responses to me halfpenny. I am of the opinion if we take at the whole rather than the micro we will see what Wenger has achieved like the stadium and state of the art training facilities at hales end and Colney. Now yes he has made mistakes but what manager hasn't they are human after all, I also believe Wenger is a victim of his early successes we learnt and got accustomed to having entertaining and winning football and once the winning stopped some fans became disgruntled. Now the big question is Wenger still able to and still have the desire to win major trophies at Arsenal. I believe so for two reasons the first our two recent cup wins show the ability is still there to win trophies. Now for desire I was at the Bradford league cup debacle and of course was frustrated but I went home and watched the match as I had recorded it to rewatch and it was an eye opener at one stage Wenger on the touch line and it was quite audible to hear said just pass the ****ing ball now this for me show the mentality and desire to win things. this season may have been a bit slow but this squad has shown it will fight to the last minute to get a result, now unlucky in the Liverpool match not to get a draw in the next few games there has been improvement now take our last two games we played slightly weakened teams now in the past those game against Southampton and psg would have been lost but not this season a respectable draw and a win against tough opposition. Of course Wenger and the team now have to follow that by going to hull and getting a result. For me the first test is against Chelsea this Wenger and team need to get a result because for many seasons they have been a stumbling block. I am going for a win against hull this weekend 0-3 to the Arsenal.

  29. mbg

    Sep 15, 2016, 18:42 #93125

    Cyril, don't encourage for fooks sake mate.

  30. Dick Emery's mum

    Sep 15, 2016, 18:38 #93124

    Insults and pettiness have no room in football. More tea Richard? That would be lovely Mr Wenger. Seem to be having a bit of a problem with this zip ..... Ooh Richard you are awful ... but I think I like you .... Slap!

  31. Danny

    Sep 15, 2016, 18:38 #93123

    Dear Mr Perry 12 years without a league title.20 years of being f**king useless in Europe.6 seasons in a row couldnt even get past the last 16 of the CL.That is failure in anyone's language.But we finished 2nd last season you and your AKB mates tell us.Yes SECOND 10 POINTS BEHIND LEICESTER CITY YES LEICESTER CITY.The man was finished in 2008 when the title was handed on a plate to him.Wenger lovers keep saying look at 2002 and 2004.That is history.When Wenger does go his Arsenal career will be judged in two parts 1997-05 and 06 to 2016.The first part very good the second part poor.

  32. Mark from Aylesbury

    Sep 15, 2016, 18:28 #93122

    Graham - over the last 5 years we have seen every Arsenal website bar Untold remove their support. If you really want to see aggression go onto Le Grove which can make this site look like a Vicars Tea Party. Virtually every time a poll is conducted reviewing Wenger it goes 80/20 wanting him out. Please don't deny the synergy between social media and real public opinion as well as you wouldn't be on here otherwise. The conditions remain broadly similar as per last year which suggests simmering discontent will boil over as soon as there is a run of poor performances. If this is not so why have the Aways now started protesting as well. The residual of patience has run out hence the rapid build up of discontent when things go wrong . You'd be far better internally processing your stress over his imminent departure rather than continually trying to convert a crowd who have made their decision. Ultimately Wenger is greedy but thin skinned and ultimately not stupid. He'll go at the end of the season probably sadly he will still be meddling at board level.

  33. Carlos

    Sep 15, 2016, 18:17 #93121

    Fabregas, Van Persie and Nasri left the club to play in better teams, earn more money and to win meaningful titles, not as part of any book balancing exercise.The manager and the club offered eye watering amounts for them to stay, so to imply that their leaving was somhow against their wishes is delusional. Another thing, these supposed times of austerity in the early Ashburton Grove years are further examples of the garbage that the manager's acolytes peddle. The club was skint in the lead up to the move but pretty much as soon as it received the shiny new keys the £££'s were rollling in. Finally, there is a middle ground between doing a Leeds and not spending anything. I have yet to see, hear or read anyone saying the only way of challenging for the title is to bankrupt the club, merely that we should do more to try and win.

  34. Cyril

    Sep 15, 2016, 18:05 #93120

    Graham- to be fair you have used the protest as your evidence to counter the 'thousands want him out ' remark. That would be disingenuous in truth too. I go to the games and there are plenty plenty people who want Wenger to go but would not protest about it. I live in north London and believe me there are plenty plenty arsenal fans who don't go but want him gone. In truth there are thousands who want him out but thousands who are happy with him. In my opinion,most fans who are going inside will likely be more pro Wenger as they are shelling out cash and enjoying the day out. But I can assure you Graham there are so many fans who don't go who are livid that he remains. Im sure Graham you wouldn't take the bold step to say that fans/supporters who do not attend are not real fans. For the record, I hope he can go out in a high as I gave up a long while ago opining how he should have gone upstairs many years ago. Would be interested in a response Graham, but well done for writing.

  35. mbg

    Sep 15, 2016, 18:04 #93119

    Oh dear TOF's chief bathroom attendant is back, he didn't like what someone said to/about him and his messiah in an article (boo hoo) and just had to respond, he'll be responding to the responses next such is his self importance, I doubt very much if any one cares what you have to say let alone your silly responses, how long has it taken to make this one up, is that your messiah I hear coming up the stairs ? you'd better run. wenger out now.

  36. Seven Kings Gooner

    Sep 15, 2016, 17:59 #93118

    Graham, it is simple, Stan Kronke wants to buy all of Texas and Arsene is helping him - end of story!

  37. jeff wright

    Sep 15, 2016, 17:49 #93116

    These 'Circulars'must be a wind-up ! No one can be this silly . All of those empty seats at games and people leaving early suggests that a fair few supporters have decided that Wenger's time is up and that they don't need to read the book to know how the story ends.They have read it before - season ( yawn) after season. So then Graham what's new then >?

  38. CB

    Sep 15, 2016, 17:48 #93115

    Yawn

  39. Paul Bagshaw

    Sep 15, 2016, 16:23 #93113

    Totally agree with your thoughts,if this is to be Arsen's last season let's keep behind our manager and players.