Surprise, Surprise

Arsenal self-implode at home to Watford



Surprise, Surprise


I’ll start with an email received from contributor Fozzy at 11.45 last night, which will save me having to haul over the coals of last night’s home defeat too extensively…

The worst first half of football since… er… the Burnley game

I have just walked in through the front door following tonight’s dreadful performance. I am soaking wet and freezing cold, but that’s not going to stop me from putting in writing what I witnessed from half way down Block 5. I have made a point of not looking at my mobile or listening to any reports. I just want this piece to be all mine and not influenced by anybody else.

Yet again, the match started at snail’s pace. Our arrogance was there for all to see. In front of us were a bunch of journeymen and good honest pros so clearly we didn’t need to try very hard. Ramsey was having a field day with his Denilson-esque sideways and backwards passes, and then when we tried to break quickly, he was there again to halt any break by slowing down the move. Still, at least Ramsey was looking for the ball. Unlike Ozil. What is the matter with this man? He was so off the pace and disinterested throughout the whole match, he might just as well gone and sat next to Steve Bould. Here was a good chance for Bould to influence the game, but he sat on his arse throughout the first half.

Unlike Burnley, Watford had a bit of spirit about them and that made the difference. We found ourselves 2-0 down after 15 minutes as we just stood off and let them have it. Ramsey continued to be Aaron Clumsey until going off injured to be replaced by The Ox, who at least had a bit more zip about him.

The service to Giroud was appalling with nothing happening down our right flank. Gabriel had another stinker at right back and I have no idea who should have been helping him out in front. Why was Bellerin not involved?

The sight of Walcott warming up before the halftime whistle sent a shiver down my spine. Surely, Wenger isn’t going to play both of our luxury players (Ozil and Walcott) when we needed to come out of the traps a bit swiftly at the start of the second half.

But he did. To my horror, Walnutt was on for Giroud, our proven goal scorer. Surely we were never going to play as badly as we had done in the first half, so the hope was that there would be a load of balls flying into their penalty box just waiting for Giroud to latch on to. And that’s exactly what happened. The big man had been replaced and chances went a-begging.

Walnutt was the first offender when he had the whole goal to aim at, he dithered and shot tamely at their keeper. Ozil carried on from where he left off in the first half with a complete lack of energy or commitment, putting in what must go down to one of his most abject performances of his career.

Sanchez was doing his best, scurrying around and trying to make things happen. He was so incensed at not being given a penalty for being kicked up in the air in the box, next time he received the ball you could tell something was going to happen. Iwobi, who was doing some good stuff on the left wing, came to meet Sanchez’s cross to reduce the deficit. It then seemed to be a ridiculous decision to bring Perez on for The Coq and dropping Iwobi back into central midfield, where just like Walnutt and Ozil, he completely disappeared. The thing is, at Ashburton Grove on full view, there is no hiding place.

Of course, Watford loved all this, and they were helped by another incompetent display of refereeing, on this occasion it was Andre Marriner. Why is it that refs totally lose the plot when they step out on to the Ashburton Grove pitch? Petty fouls, time wasting at goal kicks and thrown ins, and ages taken with each substitution went unpunished. He never clocked that when the sub’s board went up, the Watford player in question chose to be on the far side of the pitch to allow them to slowly walk off. This behaviour so enraged Sanchez, he ended up being booked for complaining about time wasting. Work that one out.

At least we were granted five minutes to try to pull something out of the fire. Perez smashing one against the crossbar was our best chance. But the night was summed up by Ozil, yet again, with one of the last pieces of action in the match, with the ball at his feet on the edge of their box, chose to stroke an inept pass to nobody rather than just banging one into the mix.

What a shame. We could have gone to Fulham Dog Track on Saturday on a roll. Instead, we were badly let down. At the end, it appeared that the players in question did not seem to care. Which brings me to the whole point of wanting to write this piece. Because I bloody well care.

Ends….

And so to my own thoughts.

Ten changes from the FA Cup display were perhaps no great surprise, but two turned out to be simply wrong. After the Ox’s impressive display, Ramsey returned to central midfield. But far worse, Bellerin was dropped for Gabriel, which, at home to Watford, seemed like a nonsense. Yes, he was injured, but he’s been fit for selection for a while now and got through a full game on Saturday without too many problems.

As it turned out, both Ramsey and Gabriel were heavily involved in Watford’s two goals. The Brazilian conceded the free kick from which Etienne Capoue scored via a deflection off Ramsey. And worse, Gabriel took a lame throw which Ramsey could not control to give possession to the visitors, allowing Capoue to waltz through Arsenal’s backline unchallenged, setting up Troy Deeney to double Watford’s lead.

Arsene Wenger said after the game that “It looked more mentally that we were not ready for the challenges”. So, that brings me to the question as to whose job it is to ensure the players are indeed mentally ready? And more to the point, why do we see this lack of mental preparation for the early stages of Arsenal games on a repeated basis? Wenger added, “We prepared well. We were warned Watford would make it very physical. I have no basic regret in the way we prepared. Did we think subconsciously we could turn up and it would be OK, I don’t know?” I wonder how the work with All Blacks psychologist Ceri Evans is going…

How is it that Antonio Conte needed less than two months of Premier League experience to work out how to convert a team that finished tenth the previous season into probably title winners, and yet Arsene Wenger has spent over 12 years trying to crack this particular nut? It’s because football has moved on and left him behind. He has good enough players to achieve the consistency of a top four finish year after year, but his management skills are no longer good enough to deliver titles, which should certainly have been achieved more than once with some of the teams he has had since the Unbeatables season. But mentally, they have never been up to it, because the manager does not prepare his team properly.

It was turned into a horrible dank pit of an evening about half an hour before kick off and remained that way until long after the supporters had departed the scene of Watford’s unlikely triumph, their first at Arsenal since the early days of George Graham’s era. This, a team that has not been able to win a Premier League game since 10th December, in theory on the edge of freefall. In that time, they have failed to beat the might of Sunderland, Palace and Middlesbrough. And lost 4-1 at home to Spurs.


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  1. jeff wright

    Feb 04, 2017, 12:30 #97746

    You have your views living in your Ivory Towers Exeter and I have mine.I stick with my ones that normal folk don't go on these lefty and lovies organized demos because they have better things to do. In the meantime self confessed Marxist and terrorist supporter M'c Donnell a pal of Corbo's admits that the Labour party has hit an all time low with thousands leaving it. I wonder why that is. You couldnt make it up.Anyway enough of this I'm off to watch the game now on TV . Will comment later on it .

  2. Exeter Gunner

    Feb 04, 2017, 11:03 #97745

    But you do make it up, Jeff. Of course that's the only thing you can add, because you can't follow what I'm saying. Keep arguing against reality if you want though: "Normal folk don't go on demos". You've been extremely well conditioned by the neoliberal media to view caring about anything beyond your own immediate concerns as 'weird' and for 'extremists'. That's how they want people to think, and that's how they've got you.

  3. jeff wright

    Feb 04, 2017, 10:57 #97744

    "What escapes you, Jeff, is I'm arguing from facts and reason, not a political position." The only thing I can add Exeter is that you couldn't make it up.

  4. Exeter Gunner

    Feb 03, 2017, 19:14 #97737

    What escapes you, Jeff, is I'm arguing from facts and reason, not a political position. You can't follow the argument sufficiently well to make that distinction, so you revert to your safe little categorisations. So all those young families, young people, old people, people of different economic classes, people from different religions and ethnicities, millions and millions of people around the world who have been standing up to Trump are all 'left wing political extremists and activists' (you don't even know what you mean by that) according to you, Jeff. And I'm the closed minded one for using my eyes and brain to see and learn otherwise. You're like Trump insisting it was the biggest inauguration ever. You believe what you want to believe, not the evidence of your own eyes. 'Normal' people do go on demos, Jeff, they really, unquestionably, unarguably do. It's only in your corporate media shrivelled brain they don't.

  5. Arseneknewbest

    Feb 03, 2017, 18:26 #97734

    Jeff extreme-right - You've gone seriously down in my estimation. A shadow of your former self. Anyone reading this exchange will be obliged to conclude that you're living in a cliche'ed, totalitarian and blinkered demi-monde under your garden shed. Try and keep it together til your other half gets back from the land of milk and honey (well at least for a chosen few). I genuinely doubt your sanity after the abject lack of metal spirit you've shown on here. Stan-K would be impressed by your stout defence of his mate Trumpo but not many on here would be I fear.

  6. jeff wright

    Feb 03, 2017, 18:20 #97733

    Exeter, the majority of those on these protest demo's about this or that are left wing activists who organize them no doubt some others who find Trumps travel ban objectionable also took part but they would be in the minority. If Corbyn had opposed Article 50 then the Momentum activists would have been out supporting him and protesting like crazy but them supporting Corbyn on Article 50 doesn't fit into their agendas so they stay quiet .Hypocrites . Exeter like all politically motivated people you believe that only your view is right just as say Jehovah's Witnesses do with their firmly fanatically held beliefs and they like you do believe that everyone else is wrong. You are the one with the closed mind not me. I don't support Trump or right-wing politics as you and the deranged AKB claim .If wanting us to leave the corrupt falling apart European Union makes me a racist then there are 17.5m ,probably more, folk in the UK who are as well. As I said normal folk don't go on these politically organized demos and your claim that some ordinary people do is ludicrous.

  7. Exeter Gunner

    Feb 03, 2017, 18:01 #97732

    "...hi-jacked by left-wing extremists like AKB .These are the ones out protesting about Muslims being banned by Trump. Normal folk have better things to do." This is manifestly, demonstrably not the case, as has already been pointed out to you. Look and listen to the range of people that were protesting Trump. But why let facts and actual events get in the way of your lazy, half-baked, wilfully ignorant categorising into stereotypes that mean you don't have to bother doing any thinking? Still, we live in a post-truth, alternatives facts world now, so maybe your time has come. It's not the truth that counts is it, it's what you 'reckon'. You really should take your own advice and stick to the Wengo bashing. No point debating with someone with such an incurious, closed mind. Your worldview was set long across by right wing media. You don't know any better, and you don't want to know.

  8. jeff wright

    Feb 03, 2017, 17:48 #97730

    Exeter ,the reason that the labour party is now powerless is because it has been hi-jacked by left-wing extremists like AKB .These are the ones out protesting about Muslims being banned by Trump. Normal folk have better things to do. Mark I understand your point about Stalin - in politics the extreme right and left have a meeting point where they become indistinguishable and as I said yesterday Trump and Corbyn share some similarities they both attract extremists to their causes the difference being that Trump has won power whereas Corbyn is leading , if that is the right description for his shambolic leadership, his party into the political wilderness.

  9. markymark

    Feb 03, 2017, 16:30 #97728

    Jeff - I'm not really sure where the argument over Stalin is going? Both Communists and Fascists are parties of control. Hitler obviously operated murderous anti Semitsm, however Franco protected Jews, Mussolini weakly acquiesced to Hitler but had a Jewish mistress and the Japanese protected their small Jewish communities. Stalin as a brutal dictator and Hitler have very similar relationships to their respective political parties. The arguament against Trump is broad and deep. Do you want to know who sponsored the report linking Trump with Jamee style pissing competitions? None other than Jeb Bush. So when I was reading looney Americans blaming liberal Pinkos I did have to laugh. Not such a laughing matter though is the Russian instigator of the report has been found dead in his car. So when the online Mail was causing the MI6 chap a coward! One has to question the mindset of that paper. Support of Trump is a case of holding your nose and ignoring the thugs. Sadly something that many members of the middle classes did with their leader in the 30's Germany

  10. Arseneknewbest

    Feb 03, 2017, 14:33 #97722

    Jeff - You're so relentlessly stupid and politically constipated, you're not really worth the bother. An armchair fascist, moving seamlessly once a week to become a golf club-n*zi boring everyone at the 19th hole. You crap on about Corbyn and spew out so many lies in a way that suggests you genuinely fear him. Your writing generally gives off an odour of someone who does a lot of worrying about things. And your reading range is evidently so narrow: it's either conservative party speaking notes, daily heil or bust - there's no other world for you, other than giving your racist sympathies a break by talking about asano. That attemtped pen picture you essayed by the way is just like your politics - wrong and egg bound. Types like you are ten a penny - unable to listen, imagine, or think that there's an alternative beyond the stereotypes that prejudiced people like to peddle about others. But hey, power to the people Jeff. And tell me: I'd love to her your treatise on what's weird and sexually abusive about what I used to send to your fellow racist jamee son...

  11. Exeter Gunner

    Feb 03, 2017, 14:29 #97721

    What are you talking about, Jeff? Those protesting against Trump aren't all Corbynites or from the 'hard left' or even 'soft left'. There's moderate Tories and Republicans in there too. And many people are very unhappy about the Labour Party's stance on the EU. You expect them to take to the streets to protest the theoretical position of a powerless party, as they do actual policies being enacted in the real world by those in actual power? What an absolutely ludicrous statement.

  12. jeff wright

    Feb 03, 2017, 13:32 #97715

    Exeter, I don't buy your view on the protestors motives either these protestors are very selective in what they protest about . They need to get a reality check many of them look like over aged undergraduates in the way they dress and act they have just never grown up and remain in a constant state of agitated protest just like AKB on here .All rather dated really in the 21st century all of this Momentum Corbo sound of the farties nonsense. Gordon Brown started all of this anyone who opposes uncontrolled immigration must be a racist. I guess then that Corbo must be one because he just supported Article 50 that is designed to take us out of Europe and to stop the uncontrolled immigration from there.So how come the left and liberal protestors are not protesting about that then >?

  13. Exeter Gunner

    Feb 03, 2017, 12:33 #97714

    Not buying it, Jeff, very transparent stuff. I think your problem is you don't like anyone shaking your complacent worldview (hence the belief that protestors are 'angry for no reason' and so on) and you think that if Corbyn or someone like him came into power you fear you personally would be affected by your taxes going up or the price of petrol going up, cos that's the sort of thing you've read would happen in the papers you read. Sod the bigger picture. That's what's behind it, I reckon.

  14. jeff wright

    Feb 03, 2017, 12:24 #97713

    akb ,the only one posting nonsense on here is you how can any reasonable person not want to see a credible opposition party I have no desire to live in a party state if I did I would go to Scotland. Stick to the Wenger bashing you are on safer ground there because when it comes to politics you obviously do not have a clue.I'm still waiting on you replying to my question regarding who you think was or is a real communist. Stalin by the way was the general secretary of the Communist Party so in my book that makes him a communist the fact that he was a murderous tyrant as well is irrelevant.I note that you have done rather a lot of weird sexul abuse postings on here ,all rather childish really, so grow up and act your age is my advice to you chum .I think that you are missing Jamie everyone else is glad to see the back of him. I have no intention though of replacing him for you to aim your arrows of hate at. You really do come over as being very angry and agitated AKB. Were you bullied at school or your mum did not love you ore something>?

  15. Arseneknewbest

    Feb 03, 2017, 11:03 #97711

    You don't half talk some bollox jeff. Your latest nugget implies you'd somehow welcome a stronger, more electable labour party. Really? - how does that fit in with your islamophobic right-wing world view? FFS please at least try and be honest. That's the problem with people like you - no personal integrity and you run a mile when challenged. I'm obviously going to have to sit behind you again with that "he's lying to you" sign. I hope Mrs W is back soon to moderate some of your thinking. Maybe you need to bash one off?

  16. jeff wright

    Feb 03, 2017, 10:29 #97710

    Exeter ,my problem with Corbyn and co is that they are not providing a credible opposition to the Tories and in a democracy this is not ideal. Corbo is basically just a protest group type politician and it is in that role that he and his extreme left wing cronies should have stayed in.

  17. Exeter Gunner

    Feb 03, 2017, 9:55 #97709

    jeff, your obsession with 'Corbo' is really weird. He has no power, no chance of power. Trump and his dangerous cronies have a lot of power and have already demonstrated their willingness to abuse it. So why are you 'more worried' about Corbyn? It's very strange how threatened you feel by him. Must be something in some of what he says that strikes a chord with you, something you're furiously trying to deny to yourself, with these constant denigrations of him. If you accept Trump is getting things wrong, why aren't you more worried about a UK politician who is backing him and normalising him who has some actual power - Prime Minister May?

  18. jeff wright

    Feb 03, 2017, 9:31 #97705

    Interesting points Mark we will have to see how things transpire in America. Trump soon backtracked on his total ban on Muslims so he may well have to compromise on his Mexican wall and other populist vote winning policies. At the end of the day this is what politicians do. Even Corbyn who supported mass free movement immigration from the EU during the referendum now tries to cash in on the populist vote among the electorate who oppose it by supporting article 50 on Brexit. It must have been a shock to AKB that with himself having only recently discovered that Father Christmas doesn't exist now learns that Corbo is just another political idol with feet of clay.The forthcoming by election in which Labour have gone in the polls from first to 4th no doubt played a part in Corbo's sudden support for Brexit .Public opinion in the USA and world wide will also impact on Trumps tenure he has to stand for reelection in 4 years and in America the process starts after about two years.

  19. markymark

    Feb 03, 2017, 7:17 #97701

    Jeff - that argument used as a comfort blanket no doubt by many who are worried about Trump is already proving wrong . Previous presidents whether good or bad have worked to the constitutional protocol or established practice . An example is George Bush who blocked Karl Rove from the security committee as he wanted to keep its security and military independence. What does Trump do? Well he dis-invites the security elements from their own council and invites yes you've guessed it old Steve Bannon anti-Semite, wife beater, probable KKK groupie to sit on it permanently. He want to bring in an act what does he do? Bypasses Homeland Security. So when you totally disregard existing structures you can do pretty much what you want. I've got a feeling in my water that at some point there will be a big stand off and then Trump will appeal directly to his angry supporters. This could start getting very unhinged with pro and anti Trumpists in the military. So I think Israel will find Trump more of a problem than a low polling Corbyn.

  20. mbg

    Feb 02, 2017, 19:17 #97698

    Alsace, good post, and good shout on DOL, I didn't recognise him with dark hair he must be on the Grecian 2000, yes proper gooners with the club at heart, I bet they were having a great laugh as TOF rocked back and forth talking fluent Martian into his hands down to their old mucker Bouldy with his earpiece stuck in his lug, i'd have loved to see the expression on their faces if their eyes would have met I bet they'd have burst out laughing, equally i'd have loved to be a fly on the wall when the three of them got together later.

  21. Arseneknewbest

    Feb 02, 2017, 18:43 #97697

    Jeff - While you were typing all that pish, I was sitting behind you holding up a card saying "He's lying to you."

  22. jeff wright

    Feb 02, 2017, 18:22 #97695

    Mark,tbh if I was an Israeli I would be more worried about Corbo and his pro-terrorist pals that he has in his team rather than Trump and some of his odd-balls .In American politics due to the governmental system it's not easy for anyone to actually do what they may want to do anyway .As Obama found out and Nixon of course.

  23. Alsace

    Feb 02, 2017, 18:10 #97693

    In fact, Brady, O'Leary and Rice are there and you can see by the look on their faces that proper Arsenal people are disgusted by what they see from Wenger's team on Tuesday. Only TOF is quietly amused, but then again it's not surprising as he in fact has nothing to do with Arsenal Football Club. He didn't play for the team, he doesn't support the team and has little or no idea of our true values.

  24. markymark

    Feb 02, 2017, 16:43 #97691

    Jeff I don't usually get involved in politics but as you have Jewish relatives perhaps it's wise to take note of Trumps sidekick Steve Bannon. Already known for allowing fascistic articles on his Breitbart site labelling one fellow conservative a "renegade Jew" and promoting Alt Right messages (KKK approve this) Steve's ex wife alleges, as well as clumping her he screamed he didn't want to send his children to school with Jewish children. Steve's team have now got further form as on holocaust Memorial Day the Whitehouse for the first time did not specifically mention Jewish suffering. There comment about the Holocaust being "sad" and they wanted to be "inclusive" Hummm. Stories have circulated that the CIA have warned U.K. And Israeli Secret services not to share information with Trumps inner circle as they fear it could leak to Putin and seemingly unbeilievably Iran via Putin. Take a look at Steve's face he has the nose of a hardened drinker. Not someone I'd trust or want the world to rely on. Particularly as he is pulling Trumps strings. Based on this alone I would say it is very much worth us all rigorously examining every step they take and put on as much pressure as possible. Believe me some notable anti Trump figures range from Bernie Sanders on the left to McCain and Jeb Bush on the right.

  25. jeff wright

    Feb 02, 2017, 12:31 #97684

    Exeter it is not my view that only 'lefties' are bad people.Tbh I don't really like any politicians and struggle to understand why anyone would like them. As for Corbo having principles you're having a laugh surely ! Trump and Corbyn should get together. They have both seriously destabilised their parties due to their own capricious ambitions to hold power and they have more in common than either would care to admit. Corbo is trying to appeal to the populist vote in the same way that Trumpo did in the good old U.S of A. Many Labour voters voted for Brexit due to the problems they have had with uncontrolled mass immigration into areas where they live that Blair and Brown allowed to happen .Corbo knows this and that is why he supported the government last night on the Brexit vote Trump supports Brexit unlike his predecessor the smooth talking nice smile Obama.Corby supported remaining in the referendum so if he had any principles he would resign rather than supporting something that he doesent ,or claimed not to do, believe in. This was nothing to do with any principles but is on his part purely down to not wanting to upset Labour voters who want out of Europe and voted overwhelmingly in many Labour seats to do so in the referendum.

  26. Yes its Ron

    Feb 02, 2017, 11:39 #97678

    Hi lads. Ive finally got back on, despite the need for a slight name change, but hey, i found the mental strength, the required focus and i gave absolutely everything to fight for permission to log on. Overall, its good to be back. Im now looking at the next post!!. Hi Kev, was it really a surprise the other night? I dont think so mate. Its been coming hasnt it?

  27. Exeter Gunner

    Feb 02, 2017, 11:23 #97677

    Another reading suggestion for you, Jeff: Nietzsche, specifically his ideas on the 'will to power'. Those who lust for power use whatever convenient ideology is to hand to advance themselves. They believe in nothing but their own advancement. We see it now with Trump in America, and in a smaller, ****ter way, Boris Johnson pretending he wanted to leave the EU because he saw a path to becoming PM that way. Now, if you wanted to make the case that socialist/communist organising principles for society cannot work because of human nature inevitably leading always to hierarchical systems and exploitation, that would be a different argument. But you're not saying that, are you? You're saying that Stalin, Putin etc are 'bad people' BECAUSE they are 'lefties'. Ironically, the modern leader who is the greatest target of your opprobrium, 'Corbo' as you childishly call him, could never achieve real power because his principles do come first. You may disagree with those principles, but you should be able to admire that at least. But no, you think he's the worst of the worst whilst a vacuous, morally void, dangerous narcissist like Trump has just made a 'silly mistake' with his border policies, in your eyes. It's unfortunate that someone should labour for so many years under such a fundamental misapprehension.

  28. jeff wright

    Feb 02, 2017, 11:19 #97676

    Thanks AKB for that I'm just off to casualty to get the hatchet out of my back! It's not looking good for the away at the bridge Rambo has already ducked out and Keystone Kos will klimp off if it all goes the shape of a Rugby Ball and we can't even be sure that our players will be motivated for the fracas.Wengo claimed that they were on Monday before the Tuesday night fiasco v Watford but then said that they were not motivated after they lost the game so if he doesn't know then who does. Of course he gets 8+m a year to motivate them ,but hey..this is Wengo.... The great thing for Wengo is that he is allowed by the media to say what he wants without anyone seriously pulling him apart over his often inane comments. If we lose he will blame the players but should we win ( unlikely ) then he will claim the credit for it . Good old Arsene.

  29. Arseneknewbest

    Feb 02, 2017, 9:53 #97672

    Jeff - still suffering from delusions I see. Seeing as you appear averse to reading anything that does not have the word "daily" on the front, I prescribe (either definition will do) 2 x tabloids per hour, ideally the ones that fill a patient's head with ideas that prejudice and greed are good human qualities and that the buses will finally run on time with a good jackbooted leader in charge. Moreover, identify a good person or set of ideals to mock and trivialise for fear that people actually start believing them. Ingerland is the still point in the turning world, except for the carribbean island where the tax-evading tabloid owner lives. Stay in your homes and be good little foreigner-hating citizens. Up the dose as far as you need. Now Jeff, seeing as you had the first word, there's mine. Only in your have you cake and eat it world do you get the first and last word. Balance may not exist in the fetid, moribund Daily Mail world but it ought to. There, I've buried the hatchet. By the way, we're going down like clowns against Chelsea - they'll be wanting to put the record straight after that 3-0.

  30. markymark

    Feb 02, 2017, 7:27 #97664

    Oh the memory of the potato juice maniac Mr Arsenalknewbest. And also where is Squeak? Anyway perhaps I shouldn't ask as it will only encourage them. Now where was I? Oh yes Wengo is total crap.

  31. mbg

    Feb 02, 2017, 0:39 #97663

    John F, your right, cech is finished too, long past it, he was before he even landed in wengers lap (we'd still be suffering chezney)as another stop gap cheapie, (as a lot of us said at the time) and here we are again, back already, or more like still, at square one, the keeper situation has never been addressed since Lehman some would say Seaman, how many years is that now ? thirteen, fourteen, ? scandalous, disgraceful, a sackable offence on it's own, and why ? because this old fraud of a manager never thought it or them important, helped of course that he hadn't and still hasn't a f*****g clue how to, he'll persevere with the idiot in a hat too (we all know how TOF won't be told what to do or take advice especially on who to buy) and if by some miracle he were to spend money on one it'll just be another quick fix stop gap cheapie, or another like himself who's well past his sell by date, who will of course be top top qualittee and we'll still be at square one no further on with the keeper situation like we were thirteen odd years ago, and also with the team as a whole for the same length of time no further on with this old fraud of a manager. wenger out now.

  32. John F

    Feb 01, 2017, 21:56 #97662

    JJ it is a little known fact that due to the absence of any instruction from Wenger, Wally and Ozil consulted David Icke pre match who told them to wear purple.He has also taken over the goalkeeping coaching at Arsenal so expect Cech to have a big purple helmet for the next game.Cech needs to look in the mirror before he moans about his team mates I thought he could of done better with both goals.Like Wenger he is only kept on due to his past glories,both are well past their best before dates.

  33. jeff wright

    Feb 01, 2017, 21:04 #97661

    The POINT I was making AKB, that appears to have sailed over your angry head, was that the reds or so called communists in this country never spoke out against Stalin's purges whether or not he was a real commie is irrelevant .How are you on Mao Tse Tung was he a commie >? Castro >? Who actually in your learned view was a communist,Lenin ,Khrushchev ... Corbo... that landslide victory voted through tonight in parliament supported by Corbo is the only vote that he ever win... anyway enough is enough of this and let's get back to the serious issue of Wenger and his magic roundabout .

  34. jjetplane

    Feb 01, 2017, 20:25 #97660

    Thing is with all these double barrel names at Arsenal I reckon Arsene Wenger Trump makes a lot of sense. I mean, you have a ferret on the one hand/wing/claw and then an ostrich, both who seem to not have any consistency in their chosen fields. I will/won't am prepared/unready and have been well paid for it applying in both cases. Couple of wankers and I am past the point talking about either. What I do want to talk about is Theo's purple boots which complement Mesut's purple and white ones. Seems also that the Ox is the new Santi as I recall Santi had one good game (against City) in his Arsenal career and the Ox (anything Ashley can do ...) has equalled the record against the Saints C side. Anyway - **** Trump, Brexit, Le Pen, Wenger and the rest. Always liked a bit of anarchy meself and was most happy to see Wenger coming a cropper against Watford. Loved it and don't mind saying it and as I post old Pep is running riot lol!

  35. nozzer

    Feb 01, 2017, 20:22 #97659

    A spot on analysis of last nights debacle. Lets be fair its a cut and paste of the last 11 years of failure. The team was not mentally ready according to the manager, that is unacceptable and the players were a disgrace but he is in charge and it has happened far too often. When you see that Jenkinson and Debuchy are still at the club on big money and HMS Belfast (Mertesacker because he turns slower than it) gets another year. That is a fair chunk of cash that could be used to keep Alexis at the club. Its poor management. I wish Wenger would announce that this is his last season, the toxic atmosphere I think would lift.

  36. CORNISH GOONER

    Feb 01, 2017, 19:48 #97658

    With you on this Exeter - very hypocritical of anyone in the UK to pretend we have some sort of moral superiority over our latest"enemies" (Putin, Assad etc.) - our newest "best friends" are always those to whom we wish to sell stuff, a few warplanes, missiles perhaps. But enough of political cynicism, let's concentate on the cynicism of Arsene FC. Same old boring excuses being played out for the customers - "unprepared", "couldn't play our (my) game which we love to play". As the Club's "commercials" are looking less & less impressive & as the wastage increases (the Jenko fiasco - a 3rd reserve player rejects move because the silly old sod thought it clever to pay him £40k per week) is it possible that the fossilised BoD might wake from their 12 year slumber? Maybe there is some credence to the Italian rumours? Not holding my breath though - I have moved on, from a WOB to a ABW (anyone but...).

  37. Arseneknewbest

    Feb 01, 2017, 19:46 #97657

    Jeff - and there you go, crying into your consomme like you are an innocent bystander who was picked on by some nasty lefties. Revenge is a dish best served cold eh Jeff? I like the sinister warning at the end (evocative of jamee son's threats to me, mbg and bonzo in the recent past). If ever you were el presidente, senor Jeff, then I would indeed crap myself but not for the reason you hint at. But as you're not, I'll continue to maintain my image of you as a pernicious, misanthropic little man surrounded by daily mails and expresses. Exeter and I have both drawn attention to your apparent lack of meaningful reading - put down the tabloids for social climbers -see above - and get down to your library - before your right wing mates decide to close it or burn the books!

  38. Arseneknewbest

    Feb 01, 2017, 19:33 #97656

    Jeff, Jeff, Jeff, You know as much about world history and politics as wengo knows about how to motivate players. You risibly suggest that is Stalin a dangerous leftie - puhleeese. I'll happily concede that he called himself a communist but do you think he was honest enough to have acted like one? Those millions of murders in Russia and the east were committed by a totalitarian fascistic maniac. Russia and the Soviet union were state capitalist, i.e. one big murderous enterprise calling the shots instead of what we have here and in the US which is the semblance of many big enterprises calling the shots and controlling life for the rest of us. He used and distorted the russian revolution for his own murderous fascistic aims. For Stalin, read Mussolini and his German friend. In more recent times, Trump's rise, along with his other extreme right wing mate Putin will see Farage, Le Pen and Wilders etc. try to hitch onto their coat tails. The point is Jeff - they're ALL right wing fascists and to that extent you ought really to be a fan of them all given your politics. I can't believe you're so naive about stuff like this. Read some history books while your missus is in the levant.

  39. jeff wright

    Feb 01, 2017, 19:26 #97655

    AKB, th only one being offensive on here is you .Remember though that just because you are paranoid it doesn't mean that they are not watching you.

  40. Exeter Gunner

    Feb 01, 2017, 19:24 #97654

    So those families and people from all walks of life we saw protesting against Trump were mob handed commie reds then, jeff? You call Trump's policy stupid and counterproductive yet have a real problem with people protesting against him. At least try to make your own thought processes have some coherence. Your should read up on conservative thought - it does indeed put the individual above the collective, and proudly so. Maybe then you won't misunderstand what I said as meaning 'right wing extremists are to blame for everything'.

  41. mbg

    Feb 01, 2017, 19:23 #97653

    wenger you've given us a Lorra Lorra laughs (unfortunately the rest of the world too) time to go, resign now your an embarrassment.

  42. Arseneknewbest

    Feb 01, 2017, 19:22 #97652

    Jeff - you sound like a cross between Piers Morgan and Nigel Farage. To that extent it's no wonder you struggle with the truth. You play the "my wife is jewish" card as if that is a licence to be offensive yourself. Where does that come from? You right wing loons want to be able to offend with impunity yet cry like babies the second you're called out for it. Chickenhawks! Your idols Trump and Farage are exactly the same. Please ask your wife if she'd do me a favour and tell Netanyahu to f*ck off while she's there! Oh, and a travel tip...don't let her take your daily mail on the plane with her. Israel is still a little bit, shall we say, irked by that so-called newspaper's firm support for German and British Fascists in the 1930s.

  43. jeff wright

    Feb 01, 2017, 19:08 #97651

    Exeter, my experience of these protesters who go out mob handed is that they will protest about anything that doesn't fit in with their views. I didn't see Corbo and co protesting about Putin's murderous bombing campaign on innocent Syrians .As History also shows the reds did not protest about Stalin's genocidal and other mass killings and only supported the war against Hitler's Nazis after Hitler and Stalin fell out .So please spare me the lectures about right wing extremists being to blame for everything.You couldn't make it up.

  44. Exeter Gunner

    Feb 01, 2017, 18:52 #97650

    jeff, there's a difference between being aware of gutter press and lifting opinions from it, and your use of language like 'rent-a-crowd', 'lefties' and 'remoaners', along with your remarks about Muslim men and women, is very telling. As for the protestors, it suggests they have some awareness of 20th century history and where discriminatory policies based on nationality and religion can lead to, so are trying to stand up to that now. Your airy dismissal of them suggests a profound ignorance - as does your belief that it's those on the left who are self-interested, when self-interest is a fundamental tenet of the philosophy of the right.

  45. OneBardGooner

    Feb 01, 2017, 18:39 #97649

    So as expected (Sadly) the first wheel come's off the Wenger Wagon in January 2017, only another 3 to go the CL Wheel, the FA Cup wheel and then (and there is every chance of this happening this season) The Scum Finishing above THE Arsenal wheel. As Jumpers for Goalposts So Rightly said, it doesn't matter what players we have as long as Wenger in charge we are Doomed. #WENGER OUT. No doubt the narcissistic despot will come up with the usual lame, tired excuses (all lies of course) but hey He is getting paid £9.3million per annum PLUS Bonuses.

  46. NickT

    Feb 01, 2017, 18:23 #97648

    The only thing that surprises me about Arsenal these days is that there are still supporters out there who believe AW is the right man for the job – begs the question what (or perhaps who) they actually support. Personally I can’t believe this is the same person who walked through the marble halls 21 years ago, revolutionised English football, blitzed the transfer market, had the entire media and Fergie on a piece of string and put together the greatest English league side of all time including the then best player in the world (could any other English club genuinely lay claim to that??) - we ALL worshipped him once, it should never have come to this!!

  47. jeff wright

    Feb 01, 2017, 18:18 #97647

    AKB, it could be worse your old pal Jamerson could still be here ! Anyway when comes to PMT you obviously are not taking your medication. I don't support Trump by the way. I think his banning all Muslims from certain areas of the middle east is stupid and counter-productive .My comments were about the protestors in this country having other issues that they could protest about seeing as Brit muslims are affected . By the way I have some Jewish relatives in fact my wife is off to Tel Aviv for 3 weeks in the morning . So I find your remarks about the holocaust offensive. Regarding the usual lefty suspects protesters these people in my view are not really that bright although always very angry about something or other and often violent with it. Sad cases really all that angst and rage that drives them to go on demos.How is Corbo getting on with his support for Brexit ? Self interest at work again there but hey with the lefties ain't that always so >?

  48. Arseneknewbest

    Feb 01, 2017, 18:04 #97646

    Jeff - I'm intrigued. Do you have some sort of right-wing menstrual cycle where every 28 days you feel obliged to post some egregiously reactionary clap-trap on here? Only you and your swivel eyed ilk could blame an ethnic minority on your idol Trump's rise to power. Hey, maybe 6 million Jews were to blame for the holocaust as well? We're all angry about WTF-ord, and wenger's complete ineptitude, but somehow using that as a forum for channelling the orange monstrosity is a bit extreme, even for you. By the way, how did ya gal Teresa M get on last week in the land of the free? I hope her feline parts are in tact otherwise you'll all have a fit at tory party conference this year. Power to the people comrade.

  49. jeff wright

    Feb 01, 2017, 17:33 #97645

    Thanks for the advice EG, you obviously read tabloids so are able to arrive at those conclusions! I'm no mug punter though and actually yesterday warned punters not to back Wengo at 8-1 to win the league the true odds were easily double that .Not that helps if Wengo can't win the bet for them. However, I have no desire to get engaged in futile arguments and in any case I was commenting on something that was posted on here about Wenger and Trump protesters.

  50. Exeter Gunner

    Feb 01, 2017, 16:35 #97644

    A modicum of pressure or expectation and the team falls apart likes soggy paper. Almost reassuring in turbulent times to have this year on year constant. What's almost surprising is Wenger seems to feel he can use this 'not prepared' excuse as if it exonerates him, as if preparation is nothing to do with him. Perhaps at AFC it isn't. Perhaps preparation for matches is left up to the players themselves, like so much else it seems. jw - lifting opinions on world affairs directly from tabloids makes a man look like a mug punter - bit like an AKB in fact. You're better off sticking to subjects where you're able to join up the dots yourself, like AFC, which you do very well.

  51. John F

    Feb 01, 2017, 15:49 #97643

    Reg I think Wengers microphone was linked up to the fourth officials ear piece.

  52. RegW

    Feb 01, 2017, 15:39 #97642

    Nice to see the 4th official got a night off!

  53. Exiled gooner in Pt

    Feb 01, 2017, 15:33 #97641

    Liam Brady is back as an ambassador for the Arsenal foundation with a focus on helping with the development of youth players again. With any luck he will take over again from Jonkers when he leaves at the end of the season. No shock at the lack of youth talent since Liam lefthopefully that will start to change again. the man is a true Legend

  54. SilverGooner

    Feb 01, 2017, 15:17 #97640

    It is difficult to find anything new to say that hasn't been said over the last few seasons, but I am truly mystified as to what exactly Steve Bould is doing? How any self respecting coach can sit on his arse for 45 minutes while his players are putting in a truly shocking performance is beyond me. As Kevin and several others have commented, it just about sums up the way the club is being run. A toxic mixture of arrogance and complacency.

  55. Redshirtwhitesleeves

    Feb 01, 2017, 15:09 #97639

    Mbg- yeah that looks like Brady to me, he is regularly on a podcast called the stand talking about Arsenal. He speaks with a lot of class and dignity, so obviously a 'real' Arsenal man and always will be. Always refers to Arsenal as 'us' or 'we'. The way he was treated at the end was awful wasn't it but you won't hear him bad mouthing Wenger or the club. What a legend.

  56. mbg

    Feb 01, 2017, 15:05 #97638

    Yes it looked more mentally we weren't ready, so there we are, it was Ceri Evans fault then, (as if he had prepared them perfectly in every other department) another scape goat again, it's always someone else's fault, what an old arrogant egoistic waste of space wenger is. Go now wenger your an embarrassment.

  57. Exiled gooner in Pt

    Feb 01, 2017, 14:51 #97637

    Usual crap same old same old, as you say Kevin problem is we are the only ones that care but that does not matter all the time the board stays the same. Identity was lost the day we believed in the dross of bigger stadium we can then compete with Europe's biggest and best!!! We are still waiting and just to add insult to more insult in that time Chelski won the C.L and Leicester won the league!!! The worst thing is most of us knew that would happen last night and the most embarrassing bit is people still talk about us as if we are involved in a title race. No pace no commitment no desire never thought i would see one of the famous G.G back five be involved the club set up and be so uninterested or tow the line to a man like Wenger! I pray for Allegri but i cannot see it as he is a winner and our board are not interested in that........

  58. mbg

    Feb 01, 2017, 14:46 #97636

    Surprise Surprise ? and we have our own Cilla sitting up in the stands looking fooking clueless, no surprise whatsoever we the WOB's all told everybody what would happen, it was evitable, and there's worse to come AKB's, Clueless, arrogance, complacency, thinking they just had to turn up, a useless bunch of nice smelling premadonnas (and useless at that) them and their clueless past it old manager stinking the place out. Is that Liam Brady sitting in front of him ? what must he be thinking after developing and nurturing a fantastic youth set up then seeing it destroyed by an egoist who didn't like him getting all the praise for it (fair play to Brady he resigned over/because of it) I bet he has stories to tell and beans to spill, and cone man pat who stayed and allowed his reputation to be destroyed. As Isaid last night lets hope we're watching the death throws of this past it old manager. wenger out now.

  59. Moscowgooner

    Feb 01, 2017, 14:32 #97635

    First Watford triumph at Arsenal since the Graham era?? What about last season in the Cup - a very similar game? We seem to believe that we are obliged to give Watford a two goal start each time we meet. Depressing result, but oh so predictable - as is the thrashing we will get at the Bridge. (And the defeat to Bayern.) Suggest AW field his best choice eleven at Sutton: not to 'respect the Cup' but to ensure we have a chance of some silverware this season. A tough away draw in the Sixth Round and that dream will be gone as well. What a way to bow out - sad.

  60. jeff wright

    Feb 01, 2017, 14:20 #97634

    Hi Bob, point taken but my one is that demonstrations by the rent a crowd anti-Trump ones are all carried out by protesters who are in accord with one another .They are all probably Remoaners anti-Brexit as well .Whereas the AFC support base is very divided with some AKB's actually using violence toward Wenger out ones and of course banners other than those supporting Wengo are banned in the stadium. There is certainly a lot of apathy around regarding Wenger with many happy or just accepting his rat going around on a wheel to nowhere management.

  61. Bob Bayliss

    Feb 01, 2017, 13:46 #97633

    Hi Jeff - to clarify my Trump analogy: I am not for one moment suggesting that those who are protesting about him are justified, simply that they are motivated enough to do so loudly and passionately even though the subject of their protests is not going anywhere four at least four years. What disappoints me is that so many of our fanbase seem to be victims of "Learned Helplessness" (being conditioned to give up....) If anyone's interested enough, google a guy called Martin Seligman. Too many of us are responding to another groundhog season like the dogs in his maze, lying down and giving up instead of trying to find our way out of the maze.

  62. TonyEvans

    Feb 01, 2017, 13:38 #97632

    Everything was in place last night for a classic Wenger team implosion: easy home game, tick; league leaders face tricky away game, tick; league leaders next up and points gap could be down to two with a win, tick. The writing was on the wall that his team of lightweights wouldn't even make the first hurdle and so it proved to be. We have had many of these scenarios these last 10 years or so, the only difference now is that we totally expect it all to go horribly wrong and Wenger never disappoints in that respect!

  63. Bard

    Feb 01, 2017, 13:10 #97631

    Losing is no disgrace but not turning up and being at it when a title is on the line is unforgivable. It points to something being very wrong in the dressing room. A loss at the Bridge will cause panic at Boardroom level. How are they to convince the fans that things are moving forward ? Even Ivan will have trouble spinning that one. His comments before and after about mental readiness are an embarrassment.

  64. TonyEvans

    Feb 01, 2017, 12:54 #97630

    For the life of me I can't see anything changing. I would be amazed if Wenger walked, ditto enough fans not turning up to make a shred of an impression and ditto any meaningful match day protests. As Blakey would say on On The Buses - I hate you Wenger!

  65. jeff wright

    Feb 01, 2017, 12:46 #97629

    I can't see any comparison with Wenger and the Trump situations.I think that the Trump protesters should concentrate on protesting about injustices such as those committed on women here in the UK by Muslim men .Trump has not banned any Brit ones anyway. I note that Mo Farah who is an Arsenal supporter and a dual nationality Brit/Somalian athlete funded by the UK actually lives in America with his family and made a rather revealing comment to them when he thought he was banned from returning when saying Daddy can't come HOME. You couldn't make it up.

  66. Alsace

    Feb 01, 2017, 12:05 #97628

    I have a client who refers to Arsenal as the Chocolate Teapots. This disappointment was bound to happen. It has just taken a little longer than usual. Just a few impressions remain. The excellence of Iwobi and Sanchez, and the farce of keeping Walcott but especially Ramsey in employment. I don't think that Ramsey was injured. I think that he was taking himself off the field. He kicked the ball off the field before collapsing in a heap. He needs a new challenge elsewhere. When George Graham took over in 1986-7 (?) he quickly disposed of a shedload of wasters. How I long for a new manager to come in and sideline then offload the Walcott's and Ramsey's of this world. We still live in hope that this season will be Wenger's last. Saturday will see our team come up against a proper manager. If we are defeated, then Wenger will give the standard Merkel Response. What we are doing isn't working, so let's do more of the same.

  67. GSPM

    Feb 01, 2017, 11:37 #97627

    It would be easier to copy and paste any post from the last 5/6years for what happened yesterday, time & time again we have these defeats 2 or 3 times every season, putting an end to our hope of making a real challenge for the PL title. Why wenger made so many changes from our FA cup win I don't know, but his excuses are downright insulting to most of us...."mentally ready " before game, "mentally unready" after.........Shambles, when will it all end.

  68. Bob Bayliss

    Feb 01, 2017, 11:14 #97626

    We know what Wenger will do, or Arsenal as long as he is in charge. The only question is, what should we do? Yes, all but an increasingly deluded minority believe he should sling his hook, but do we simply accept that he is here for as long as he chooses to be or do we take a leaf out of the anti-Trump protesters' book and ramp up the protests inside and outside the stadium? After all, he is not going anywhere for at least four years, but there are plenty of people ramping up the protests, which is at least causing questions to be asked about his suitablity... So, what's it to be? "We take what we're given" or we get out there with the banners in what remains of our season and see if one more heave might do the trick?

  69. Redshirtwhitesleeves

    Feb 01, 2017, 11:02 #97625

    Kev and Fozzy have nailed it there. Can there be a single Arsenal fan waking up this morning and still thinking Wenger is the right man for the job? He is finished and has been for years, only his ego and 8million quid a year are blinding him to the obvious. Those saying it's up to the fans to now force him out are spot on. I've done my bit, gave my season ticket up in 2009, saw the writing on the wall and resented being ripped off and haven't been back since. Plenty of others have done the same. Incredibly there are still brain dead sheep happy with this endless, predictable groundhog situation, still forking out to watch a pantomime where everyone can predict the outcome year after year. Failure on top of failure. The club as it is stinks, its rotten, obsessed with money and profit and doesn't give a damn about its true supporters. I hate what football and Arsenal in particular have become. Please let the Allegri rumours be true, we need someone asap to give us back our identity. This club is unrecognisable from the one I and many thousands of others grew up with. We want our club back. Wenger, kroenke, gazidis out

  70. Gunner Rob

    Feb 01, 2017, 10:38 #97624

    5 years ago I said on here that until season ticket holders stopped renewing their tickets that nothing will change. 5 years on nothing has changed, and is unlikely to do so in the immediate future.

  71. Gaz

    Feb 01, 2017, 10:19 #97623

    I'm sensing we've been down this long boring predictable road before. I blame the fans who even now the majority of want Wenger to stay on. What on earth has happened to this once great Club.

  72. The Man From UNCLE

    Feb 01, 2017, 10:18 #97622

    Hey look on the bright side. At least we didn't have to wait till Feb 1st for the yearly capitulation - this time we got it in a day early. Surely that's progress of a sort worthy of another statistical breakdown.

  73. Time for change

    Feb 01, 2017, 10:07 #97621

    If Wenger is given a contract after this......

  74. Up For Grabs Now

    Feb 01, 2017, 9:51 #97620

    From match reports like this one, to thousands of comments over the years, we are just going round and round in circles. Until the fans consistently harass Wenger week in week out regardless of any result, even say winning at Chelsea or Spurs (Unlikely I know) nothing is going to change. All of us, myself included, can moan on the internet on forums like this one as much as we like, Wenger is not leaving unless he is forced. Simple as that, and as there still appears after a decade of this farce to be no real desire to get rid of him by the majority whom attend home games, results like last nights will just keep being repeated ad infinitum.

  75. John F

    Feb 01, 2017, 9:50 #97619

    Good posts although depressing written with the passion we all feel.I was surprised by Wengers post match interview, normally he is a bit agitated after a defeat but he was calm almost detached.Maybe this was a reaction of a man who really is moving on and hopefully the rumours of Allegri coming are true.Allegri is a hard task master and will certainly upset a few of our players who do not pull their weight especially Ozil.

  76. Jumpers For Goalposts

    Feb 01, 2017, 9:43 #97618

    It no longer matters which players wear the shirts, what the formation is or who the opposition is - as long as Wenger remains we will always collapse when the pressure games come around. The man is so many years past his sell by date!!

  77. RobG

    Feb 01, 2017, 9:41 #97617

    The paragraph about Bould says it all about him, the Club and - sadly - Sanchez. I await with trepidation the news of the midfield at Stamford Bridge.