The Beginning Of The End Takes A While To Get Going

Online Ed: Another flurry of late goals sees Arsenal defeat Hammers



The Beginning Of The End Takes A While To Get Going


(Ed’s note – I was unable to make the game yesterday, so my thanks to Charlie Ashmore for covering for me)

Was this the dawning of a new age of Arsenal FC as the media sought to portray in the build up? As I walked to the ground at around half an hour before kick off it certainly seemed to be a lot busier than recent games at a similar time and on arrival at my seat there seemed to be a general air of expectation with a hubbub around the ground again far in excess of the general torpor that had preceded recent games. Or was it my imagination? Sometimes the perception is influenced by the expectation but if there was any expectation of an uplift in performance from the team, the perception throughout a first half in which nothing much seemed to work was that this was very much a continuation of what has been going before it.

The stadium was not full but it was certainly fuller. It seemed as if the crowd wanted to be positive but, in keeping with the season so far, the players were doing their very best to squander that feeling. I don’t think there was any lack of effort but nothing seemed to be working – final balls just off, shots going wide rather than on target. Ramsey, who was involved in much of what was good about our play throughout the game, tried throughout the half to make things happen but appeared to be having one of those days where a lot of good work was undone by the quality of the final ball.

In fact West Ham had a number of good chances and that they did not score was down to their own profligacy, one extremely good recovery tackle by Mustafi and a good save by Ospina.

At half time the sense of frustration was palpable but unusually for the recent mood at the Emirates there was no booing as the players went off. The first half had seen a couple of renditions of “There’s Only One Arsene Wenger” which reflected the general positivity but if anyone expected a sudden outpouring of love for him after the toxic atmosphere of recent home games they were going to be sadly disappointed.

The second half was a much more sprightly affair. We seemed to take to the pitch with renewed energy and a desire to take the game to West Ham. A desperate tackle by Zabaleta on Welbeck only failed to see a red card produced because of the distance from goal.

Elneny’s injury looked nasty and when he was stretchered off I couldn’t help wondering what our midfield was going to look like at Old Trafford next week for a game which is sandwiched by the infinitely more important double header against Atletico - the outcome of which will dictate the manner of Wenger’s departure and the atmosphere at his last home game. I still have nightmares about results at Old Trafford with young teams being fielded.

Anyway the goal when it came was relatively simple but no less exciting to watch – a corner towards the penalty spot and a crisp clean strike from the ever dependable Monreal. A flurry of activity at the other end starting with a spectacular and entirely appropriate stretching punch clear from Ospina followed by a blocked shot eventually saw the ball fall to an unmarked Arnautovic (our next manager is going to have to address our propensity for leaving any opposition’s danger man unmarked in our own box!) and he slammed it home.

The rest of the game was largely one way traffic. Excellent saves by Hart from Xhaka and Welbeck kept them level before a piece of comedy defending saw their centre half Rice duck under a Ramsey cross completely taking Hart by surprise and leaving the ball to bounce into the far side of the goal.

A spring in the step now and West Ham’s defence was on the rack. Some lovely interplay involving Welbeck, Aubamayeng and Lacazette saw the latter thump home from a tight angle and he followed that up with a little turn away from the defender after Ramsey slid the ball back for him opening his body and the goal up for number four.

The crowd was noisy in the second half, dusting off a few highlights of the Wenger years – 49 undefeated, Sol Campbell’s double, Lasagne and winning the League at White Hart Lane got an airing and there was one especially rousing chorus of the manager’s name.

So a nice scoreline to start the Wenger farewell with. Six, maybe seven games to go. It is undoubtedly time that these players who have consistently let him down to turn up for him (though please do not take that as absolving him of blame – rather a correcting of the balance as to date he has taken all the blame and the players have had a free ride). An unbeaten finish to the season is unlikely given the focus on Europe and the effect that will have on selection, particularly next weekend. But if that focus delivers a trophy and Champions League football, then the players will reward his faith in them by allowing Wenger to leave on a high.

For my part, it has been an emotional couple of days. A long-time Wenger supporter, my turning point came in the Leicester title season. Since then I have accepted the need for change but have been unwilling to publicly demand his head. Others have done that and I do not criticise them for doing so. Fault lines have developed amongst the Arsenal support which at times appeared beyond repair. My feelings on Friday were part relief that necessary change was now coming and part sadness that a 22 year relationship was coming to an end.

I hope that the fault lines can now be repaired and that these coming weeks begin that process. I fear for the future because in the modern world where people are quick to anger, and tolerance is a dying attribute, I suspect that these fault lines are now going to reappear on a reasonably regular basis. There is a demand for instant success and many of those who have been vociferously demanding change may find that change does not bring the instant gratification they expect.

The squad needs an overhaul. That will take time especially if we are not in the Champions League and given we are not suddenly going to start competing for the biggest transfers. How patient will we all be? I can tell you right now if it’s Brendan Rodgers my patience will never begin but therein lies an issue. We are not all going to be happy with the choice of manager. 22 years ago it was a different world and we may have queried the appointment of a relative unknown but we did not take to the streets or the airwaves en masse to berate the club for its appointment. Nowadays the opportunities and the means by which to voice displeasure are many and too many of us have a default setting now of complaint which may be hard to shake off unless the new man starts exceptionally well.

Only time will tell but we approach the end of this season and the end of an era with hope for the future, and the inevitable anxiety that comes with uncertainty. One thing is for sure though, we need an early decision – the World Cup and the closing of the transfer window before the season starts will together reduce the time available for the necessary rebuild to start. Mind you improvement can be achieved simply by getting our existing players to perform to their best, something they have largely and miserably failed to do.

The king is dead. Long live the king (whoever he turns out to be)…

In case you have not heard, the campaign to keep The Gooner going beyond the end of the current season, launched at the start of 2018, proved successful. As a consequence, there is now no longer a deadline for subscriptions, with all details on this form which you can download and print out if need be, or hit the links if you are viewing it on your computer or smartphone.

The current issue of The Gooner will be on sale for the remainder of this season’s matches and can also be bought online here for £3.60 including postage. The price is higher if you are outside the UK due to the extra postage costs.

Alternatively, you can simply pay £3.60 (postage included, UK addresses only) – via online bank transfer to –
Account name: The Gooner
Sort Code: 20-76-90
Account Number: 03004112
Please use the reference ‘271YourSurname’ on the payment – eg ‘271Smith’ and follow up the payment with an email to [email protected] stating your name and address, and the reference that you used for payment (e.g. 271Smith or whatever).


NEW! Subscribe to our weekly Gooner Fanzine newsletter for all the latest news, views, and videos from the intelligent voice of Arsenal supporters since 1987.

Please note that we will not share your email address with any 3rd parties.


Article Rating

Leave a comment

Sign-in with your Online Gooner forum login to add your comment. If you do not have a login register here.

51
comments

  1. mbg

    Apr 24, 2018, 18:20 #108947

    Five jokers and Oh how he's longed to be, and would love to be one of them, but has to settle for the joke. WGOAB.

  2. Yes its Ron

    Apr 24, 2018, 10:19 #108905

    i think its A fair point made by TOOAW to ask exactly who our Board have the strength to appoint. Its a concern. Theyve been very much feather bedded by having AW around for so long who has followed their financial lead slavishly for so long without public utterances of any type in that respect. AW has been unique in that regard and they've been lucky, though perhaps have bought his silence by the salary paid to him. The risk in appointing a hard nosed, successful, good CV backed Coach is that his only concern will be whats out there on the pitch or how to improve whats out there so as not to tarnish his CV. Its a culture shock this Board might have a problem with. On this basis fans should brace themselves i feel for a less than exciting and untried lesser light to take Wengers place. Arteta keeps being mentioned. He may fit the Boards bill. I think Arsene Wenger will counsel them on this aspect of things too. If its attractive to such as Arteta such a man has to ask himself if its a bit of a poisened chalice. MA seems well regarded in the game now and hes on a trajectory we assume, leading to a top post some where i would guess while doing his tutelage under PG. Is it wise to take what on the face of it is a very attractive job but to agree to try and work with the same constraints as AW has for so long? Its a risk for him given he has no experience in the hotseat to help him i think. Arteta is a top bloke i feel. Always liked him even before we signed him. I wouldnt like to see him become a Moyesesque type fall guy. Much to ponder for him and hes much to lose (or any man like him has too) and AFC as well. The club is very much in virgin territory and that can often lead to disjointed decisions.

  3. David1

    Apr 24, 2018, 10:18 #108904

    Baddie - Soupcon? glad to see that reading the work of others has expanded your vocabulary. That's grade 7 stuff. Your objective for a grade 8: demonstrate the ability (in less than 70 words) to write with brevity.

  4. A Cornish Gooner

    Apr 24, 2018, 10:03 #108903

    Wenger is going, but our anus horribilis rumbles on, Bashful as ever.

  5. Exeter Ex

    Apr 24, 2018, 9:40 #108902

    It's a strange worldview Badarse has. For him, with his writing style, to accuse others of being 'obtuse' is most odd. And to accuse others of being 'cowardly' and 'dim' when they are the ones that have been making the call for change - making actual succinct points to that end, something utterly beyond Badarse - whilst he's been desperate to see the status quo remain, continued to back a manager who has led the club through decline and doubtless would've continued to back no matter how bad it had got, is twisted to say the least. And then he wonders why people think he supports the man over the club. Badarse's original purpose on coming onto the site - I recall him stating this more than once - was to point how wrong we were to want Wenger gone, how we were failing to see the bigger picture and just needed to keep the faith, and he was going to make us see the light. Now that even the club itself - 'my Arsenal' as he calls it - have lost that faith in the face of incontrovertible evidence, still Badarse, though proven wrong, retains the high-minded, superior attitude towards those who were proven right. All his pro-Wenger allies have fallen by the wayside as the evidence against has mounted, to the point where all he has left is the absurd, barely literate Toady, and keeps making largely ignored overtures to Ron - a man who has wanted Wenger out since 2011 - such is his desperation to gain some sort of foothold on this site. Badarse - it's over. You failed. Time to move on.

  6. markymark

    Apr 24, 2018, 9:19 #108901

    Another interesting editing wobble after pantheon turned into panthers , wound up turned into round up. Anyway I’m sure the point is made

  7. markymark

    Apr 24, 2018, 9:05 #108900

    Baddie I can always tell when we’ve round you up the size of your postings . Line after line of meandering waffle. By the way you lost..... despite your obvious self confessed genius. Ps can you answer Toadies point of confusion , he thinks Wenger just resigned , bless him. I know you’re a sophisticate , a man once involved in the vanguard of change, even dare I say it a man who reached a pinnacle of Senior Negotiating courses., Can you explain it to him , just a little ?

  8. Badarse

    Apr 24, 2018, 8:58 #108899

    There is a clique of five on this site-nay not a rabble. These jokers rant and froth, snipe and trawl, misunderstand, misinterpret and present either fake news as a given, or are so obtuse with a soupcon of arrogance that their take on matters and posts is beguiling. All are cowards and salacious, some are grubby and coarse, and a couple quite dim. Work that one out yourselves fellas. As a pointer, to believe that another is as corrupted in his mind as they are speaks volumes. To suggest that I await the failure of a future Arsenal manager, tacitly meaning my Arsenal are failing on the pitch, and will celebrate the fact is so wide of the 'mark' to qualify as a 'Narkism'. It displays in clear evidence the dark places that exist within the individual's mind, Dark Moanie places. Incidentally I note a MAYDUP post using racist French-'Speerit'-Oi don't know if that's allowed in Nark's world, is it? Incidentally the fanbase will never come together, like after the result of the referendum. There has always been a split in society what the technology and circumstances have high lighted is that split. If you know that there are microbes and bacteria on your faces it is academic, if you can visibly see them it takes on a different dimension of thought and reaction. This is a constant damaging effect in the world today, and it ain't going away too soon. The outlook will just eventually lie dormant, but will easily be aroused and prominent once more at every changing circumstance, and that is in all walks of life, not just with the Arsenal. Can anyone volunteer to explain my words to the Nark and MAYDUP man, please? I always found at the Virtual Online Gooner Knitting Circle that by calling Nark 'Sunshine' and MAYDUP man 'Blossom', really grabbed their attention. Just to rile the natives I have tried not to mention Ron for damaging his standing, or at least attracting tacit criticism, but I have to break that soft intention as some of his recent posts are a cut above. Very astute Paddington, very sensible views, methinks.

  9. markymark

    Apr 24, 2018, 8:24 #108898

    ToOaW “he took your 11m with him” interesting choice of words that. Why not yours as well? After all you do support Arsenal don’t you ? C’mon Toad surely not ? Say it ain’t so? Are you suggesting that Baddie the greatest Arsene Supporter ever!!! Gave a Spurs fan Supporter of the year? My god Toad , you are going on Thursday surely ? C’mon toad you do go don’t you?

  10. Exeter Ex

    Apr 24, 2018, 8:20 #108897

    "Are you relieved?" "No, I was not tired" That isn't the response of a man who chose to retire. I know Toady is a troll but how strange that he's still trying to score points in a game that is over, in which his 'side' suffered the most complete defeat. He even tries to make it sound like a sort of victory for Wenger "He took your £11 million". And isn't that 'your' telling. Toady the superfan has just told us he doesn't put any money into the club.

  11. Seven Kings Gooner 1

    Apr 24, 2018, 8:19 #108896

    Does three titles in 22 years make Arsene Wenger Arsenal's greatest ever manager? I think Arsenal's world wide image could do with a boost - like challenging again for the top honours.

  12. markymark

    Apr 24, 2018, 7:07 #108895

    Moscow Gooner - Wenger’s speach was part slanging job to us , happy to see we did get under his skin and cause his demise . Part Miss World Speach “I want to help the children of the world” . As you say winning league titles is most important to worldwide supporters. So I suspect Wenger’s helped diminish that.

  13. Moscowgooner

    Apr 24, 2018, 5:41 #108894

    I lot of oddities about AW's departure - long overdue though it was. Blaming fans for damaging Arsenal's image overseas is absurd: I travel extensively - in the last few years I've seen fewer Arsenal shirts (and more Chelsea/City and now PSG shirts) in places as different as Vietnam, Thailand, the Maldives, Mauritius, Laos, South Africa and Nigeria (and the US). Might that possibly have more to do with a relative lack of success on the field than with 'fan divisions'?? The FA Cup doesn't mean a lot in markets like Asia, the US and Africa: it's all about the Premiership and the Champions League.

  14. mbg

    Apr 23, 2018, 23:08 #108893

    markymark, like I said, just like his messiah, in complete denial, he probably thinks his messiah was offered a new contract and turned it down, or accepted it, lol. WGOAB.

  15. markymark

    Apr 23, 2018, 22:00 #108891

    ToOaW - if you believe that you’ll believe anything.there really is one born every minute. No one on here is begrudging Wenger being paid off it’s part of the deal. so what? Ask yer mate badbum if he thinks it was totally and absolutely Wengo’s decision with no input from Stan or Ivan.

  16. TOOAW

    Apr 23, 2018, 21:44 #108890

    Great to see that the haters are desperate to engulf the minds that Arsene was sacked. He resigned fellas and took your £11 million with him. Yet another blow up story to make the feel goodies feel good. You know your gonna get your Arsenal back boys. But which Arsenal is it???? Only time will tell. One false move by the board whom most were getting irate about last month now have their fingers crossed that it doesn't go pear shaped. Ancelloti is the only manager who is possible of emulating something worthwhile and on a par with Arsene. Do the board have the balls to appoint him?????

  17. mbg

    Apr 23, 2018, 20:29 #108889

    CORNISH GOONER, much the same as the last two racist jokes of the site had their chance to come on and be gracious in defeat after their messiah got his comeuppance and was sacked, it would have gone a ways for lightning up on both sides, and a bit of respect for him (wenger) and them, but just like him carrying on regardless being an egoist and arrogant and in denial to the last, they didn't take it either and didn't want to know, also carrying on regardless with their racist quips and insults to all those who proved then wrong, bitter or what, mostly in gobbledegook or Martian, so while the rest of us make plans to move on and pull together and start supporting and getting behind the club these two village idiots are still out in the cold with no mates with just their racism to amuse themselves(along with their right hand of course) and nowhere else to go, because like wenger it's way to late for them now also, like wenger and his send off, WGOAB.

  18. Bard

    Apr 23, 2018, 20:00 #108888

    the playing mantis; agree with you mate. No one here believes that a change of manager will bring unending success. What I want is a team that puts in a shift and tries its heart out. Gives it a go and if they fail then so be it, no problem. Not this 'maybe I will maybe wont' attitude thats been a trademark of Wenger's teams for years. Incidentally since when did the Community Shield become a trophy. I keep hearing how many he won. I thought it was the equivalent of a pre season friendly. Looks like its going to be a bloody parting of the ways. Lets hope that Wenger's ire isn't going to damage the brand in Africa and China.

  19. CORNISH GOONER

    Apr 23, 2018, 19:23 #108887

    AW's post match comments are unbelievable. Wiggy & the Board, for all their many failings gave him the opportunity for a gracious farewell, a face saving, celebrated exit from the Club. Spitefully, he has declined it. HE WAS SACKED let there be no doubt of that & at any other major club that would have happened several years ago. It must be his monumental arrogance that makes him act this way but he is being very foolish because for most supporters this turning on them will be seen as unforgivable. Spike Milligan once said that he would like to be given the opportunity to prove that money doesn't make you happy - I think AW is demonstrating that quite clearly!!

  20. mbg

    Apr 23, 2018, 19:20 #108886

    Up for grabs, yes maybe if these fans would have got their heads out of the sand (and other places) and seen what was going on a lot sooner like a lot of us did we might not be in this mess now, and have this over hall, upheaval, rebuild well out of the way and behind us now, with our new manager well settled in and taking the club in the right direction, now thanks to their devotion to their beloved wenger we still have it all ahead of us.

  21. the playing mantis

    Apr 23, 2018, 17:53 #108884

    ron, my beef is mr ashmore in typical akb fashion, claiming those who want hi gone do so because all of a sudden hes not been successful. what rubbish its been a decline for years and no one expects instant gratification under a new man, neither did they under AW. thats my point.

  22. Yes its Ron

    Apr 23, 2018, 17:37 #108883

    the playing mantis - i cant really see whats wrong with the view that the top trophies wont be flooding into Arsenal merely because AW has gone and im one whos wanted him to resign since August 2011 - the 8-2 debacle. ECL s and PL titles arent coming to The Emirates for quite some time in my view. In fact, as matters stand it may well be many. many years before we win a title. AFC arent going to hand over 450 million to a new Coach as per Man Citys cash dedication to PG. Some fans need to wise up and accept that theres no quick fix at Arsenal. Its no longer possible. If we can generate the feeling amongst opponents that they dont fanct playing Arsenal again over the next year or so and then progress to a top 4 and maybe runners up with a very bold challenge to the title winners in the next 3 years, thats progress and as good as Arsenal are going to have in that period in my view. Whats more, the new Coach coming in may not work out. It might need 2 changes of Coach. In my opinion, Arsene is going to able to wear one of his trademark smug grins for quite a while yet. the guts departure is only a tiny stepping stone to the glories he once habitually presided over.

  23. mbg

    Apr 23, 2018, 17:36 #108882

    So TOF expected us all just to sit on our arse and do or say nothing as he destroyed the club and brought it down and made it into a laughing stock (there were enough AKB p****s doing that, and still would be) what an egoistic arrogant old fraud, good riddance. WGOAB.

  24. Yes its Ron

    Apr 23, 2018, 17:18 #108881

    1971 - right with you. Rafa would be a good fit in the mould you describe. Hes a classy guy too. Would very much suit Arsenal though many wouldn't be very animated by his appt i know. The modern match goer would celebrate Terry Henry. Some have mentioned the dreaded Rodgers. Anybody but him surely. I d go so far to say, i d accept Sam Allardyce before him.

  25. the playing mantis

    Apr 23, 2018, 16:36 #108880

    akb to the last...no one is demanding instant success, or instant gratification just a stop to continued decline. rubbish as ever mr ashmore

  26. 1971 Gooner

    Apr 23, 2018, 16:29 #108879

    I do hope the speculation linking Brendan Rodgers with our vacant managerial position is no more than simply that. We've just purged our club of a semi-deluded, self-obsessed egomaniac; the last thing we need is another from the same mould. Personally I would sacrifice all out attack for a manager who would prioritise the fine art of defending properly, including bringing in new personnel more adept at it than the current bunch.

  27. David1

    Apr 23, 2018, 16:26 #108878

    I wonder if they'll make AW do a handover to the new guy?

  28. Badarse

    Apr 23, 2018, 16:23 #108877

    He awoke early and hopped out of bed-he'd put both feet in one leg of his PJ's the night before. He was a man who called a spade a shovel. He looked at his square jawline but realised it was only a small mirror and he couldn't see his chin. He felt happy that at least he could see his nose unlike his mentor AKB (and he knew what the B stood for, Bonzo). He wrapped his two-team scarf around his neck, looked at his wiry, ginger, curly hair and decided to wrap it around his head Rocky-style instead. He'd played Pontoon with the MAYDUP man the evening before. He hated the 'Stick or twist' part of the game. Decisions were things he wasn't sure if he liked or not, he hadn't made that decision yet. He took a sip of cold coffee from his Barcelona mug, well it did have Fabregas' face on it, and his eyes crossed-just a little better than Theo ever did. 'Go placidly amid the noise and haste and remember what peace there may be in silence.', he screamed at the top of his voice, and chuckled to himself when he thought of his neighbours. They, like himself thought that he was such a wag, it was just the definition they held which was different. He sat, but within a minute was feeling uncomfortable; he called it 'uncomfortable' because he always kept it in his back pocket, which was no place for an organ, especially a mouth organ. He was dressed for more puerile exchanges with his clique-never a rabble-knowing he was one of TOOAW and Badarse's 'Five a day'. He put on his bashball cap back to front. The new kid on the block was ready with more lies and fake news to pedal.

  29. markymark

    Apr 23, 2018, 15:38 #108876

    How long will it take the two super fans ( I prefer the term whackjobs ) Toady and Baddie to turn on the new manger? 12 years of slavish devotion for Wengo. Probably 6 months before the sniping starts with the new man in charge

  30. MAF

    Apr 23, 2018, 15:17 #108875

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luis_Enrique_(footballer) LUIS ENRIQUE CLUBS MANAGED 2018 ONWARDS IT SAYS CHELSEA..

  31. markymark

    Apr 23, 2018, 13:55 #108874

    Wenger’s arrogance or at least belief system really was a two edged sword. It provided him with longevity and a power base . I’m absolutely convinced that Arsenal would have sacked other managers in this time. However as the same cycles went through rinse and repeat . The fanbase effectively snapped. At this point unwilling or unable to see or act upon change. His very strength became his weakness. It would not surprise me at all if the board had to actual spell out the level of discontent to him.

  32. Perryashburtongroves

    Apr 23, 2018, 13:51 #108873

    Everybody wants to win things but nobody expects instant success. Those calling for him to go were mostly bored and fed up with the same **** year aftre year and the man's refusal to change. We won't be demanding instant trophies or wins every game, we wanted change and a new direction. The new man will be given time and support because for once, it's a sign of ambition and there's just the hope that things will get better. Wenger had killed the hope.

  33. mbg

    Apr 23, 2018, 13:37 #108872

    Exeter Ex, yes mate, no talk of great menteel strength, and speeritt now, just more arrogance, excuses, and blame, that's all we'll hear from him right up until the very end it's always been me me me with him, good riddance, WGOAB

  34. Yes its Ron

    Apr 23, 2018, 13:30 #108871

    Cameron - very good points. RA arriving at Chelsea and then the Man C money really knocked AFCs continuity after the move. We used to exchange views on here saying that the club just needed to be honest and explain that lower priced players were coming in to take us forward while the debt was serviced and as you say, to acknowledge that our competitive edge would lake a hit etc etc etc. Instead it was spin spin spin. AW in fairness to him became the lightening rod for a dull cowardly Boardroom who clearly didnt fancy making forthright statement to fans. Arsene was paid well to take the media and fan hits though, knowing his football facets of his job had been watered down to managing the accounts equally as much. That Board there did him no favours leaving him to hang out. Honesty would have harnessed a lot of patience by the supporters back around 2007-2011 time. They decided though that sponsors needed massaging and that the truth could be kept from the fans. Rather insulting, but clubs have long thought fans are an unthinking, easily pleased, lower level than themselves and there to be disregarded at will. Arsenal slipped up by not recognising that our fan base is actually pretty switched on and intelligent. The AFC fans base always has been. They lack fervour and passion maybe at times, but in my view we are thinking fans and differ a lot from many other clubs support in that way. Arsenal were wrong to think that they could bullshine their way through torrid times but its understandably the case that they needed to keep the business interests reasonably happy. I think in time, the downward pressures and Wengers instructions on dealing with Arsenals finances the yrs after the ground shift will be shown to quite alarming. Ultimately, AW was happy to trade off football ambition for financial reasons. He should have been allowed to explain his position had the Board have had the respect for him that they love to profess to have.

  35. mbg

    Apr 23, 2018, 13:21 #108870

    The beginning of the end indeed, isn't it fooking great, the sun was out at the Emirates everybody relieved (apart from some die hard AKB's no doubt wherever they were)and all low key too just the way it should be, and still TOF was his egoistic arrogant self, excuses, it's somebody elses fault, he still thinks he's done nothing wrong, do us a favour wenger and piss off now. what a fraud. WGOAB

  36. TonyEvans

    Apr 23, 2018, 13:14 #108869

    Agree completely with Up For Grabs. Not one ounce of humility from Wenger (not that I expected any) and sniping at the fans is just so typical of the man. Arrogant to the last and unable to accept one iota of blame for his demise. Some of the outpourings from the likes of Wilson, Keown and Dein beggar belief. Keown, for example, reckons Wenger would be a good fit at PSG, where he might help them achieve more in the CL! Yeah right of course he would! As for life after Wenger, yes it will take the new manager time, such is the God awful mess Wenger will be leaving behind, and I am completely prepared for that - the word 'hope' will keep me going which, under Wenger, had disappeared years ago.

  37. David1

    Apr 23, 2018, 13:07 #108868

    That's the problem with AKB criticism - very few Arsenal fans who have wanted Wenger out for the last 8-10 years are demanding instant success (in the manner of Abramovich), but that the club has a genuine sense of direction/a new lease of life/an end to the stagnation. On the matter of AWs standing - well in the end he never achieved the one thing that would've raised him above GG: Winning the CL. Time to take a risk, start again, try something new. There are no guarantees that he will, but maybe Luis Enrique (or whoever) might make Arsenal competitive in the PL again and even win the CL. Worth getting excited about.

  38. cameron326

    Apr 23, 2018, 13:04 #108867

    If the board and manager had treated the fans with a little bit of respect over the past few years things might be a lot better now. Talking through the challenges of competing with Man City and Chelsea rather than making it sound impossible. Acknowledging that 4th place is not an outstanding finish but merely an acceptable one. Public statements, thanking the fans now and then for their continued support despite eye-watering ticket prices. Acknowledging the fans disappointment at not competing for league titles having left Highbury to do just that, rather than just sticking fingers in ears and blathering about the great state of the club. Everything that's come out of the club this past decade has been for the ears of the 0.1% shareholders rather than the 99.9% normal fans who give the club value, as nobody makes money off a team playing in front of an empty stadium.

  39. Alsace

    Apr 23, 2018, 12:59 #108866

    Charlie, no one wants to go back to arguing about the football more than me. Wenger is both history and toast and the civil war will disappear as quickly as he does.

  40. Up For Grabs Now

    Apr 23, 2018, 11:46 #108865

    In many ways Charlie you are lucky, because in effect you have only wanted Wenger gone for a mere two years. Try and imagine the frustration and anger so many of us have felt, from varying longer time periods (Myself 2008 v Birmingham) or those after the 8-2 Old Trafford humiliation in 2011. I have been banging my head against a brick wall now for ten years for Christ sake, a totally wasted decade in my opinion in footballing terms. Hence there is now no sadness whatsoever about Wenger’s 22-year period now finally ending. Had it done so back in 2014 after the lucky FA Cup win v Hull, then I too might have been a bit more reflective. Now I would admit I am very bitter towards Wenger, something that is not normally within my nature, because even now he thinks we fans should have just let him continue ad-infinitum, judging his post-match comments, the arrogant egotistical pr**k.

  41. Yes its Ron

    Apr 23, 2018, 10:57 #108863

    Ex - I do agree with you that he does seem to hold an elevated view of his own sense of propriety and is stubbornly behind his own opinions and football methods as being without fault. That mindset has ironically been his biggest fault as i ll remember AW.

  42. Exeter Ex

    Apr 23, 2018, 10:51 #108862

    Ron, yes he has the right of freedom of expression, but his argument is totally specious is what I mean, groundless. I don't think he'll see this with time. I think this is the mindset of the man. He'll always believe he is right in everything he says and does and it's only unfair external forces stopping him realising the perfection of his vision. I bet his eventual book reflects that mindset. The big plus from the presser though was the confirmation he's having no input into next manager and is not going upstairs. So once he actually goes in the summer the 'debate' will finally be over and we can all refocus on Arsenal and the football.

  43. Yes its Ron

    Apr 23, 2018, 10:39 #108861

    Ex - i think he does have the right to say as he wishes as we all do. Youre right, he chose to carry on. Maybe out of power lust, maybe out of duty, maybe out of having nothing much else to do but it was mainly because he was asked and allowed to carry to carry on by the Board. The reality is that he really thought his ideas would eventually bring football honours to the new stadium. It wasn't to be, but the only reason the discussion carries on now is because of his longevity and largely due to him staying on for far too long and not recognising his time had passed. In time, i think he see it that way as he reflects. At the moment hes still too embroiled in it all to read the situ with real perspective, so naturally he ll have a few words to utter that eventually he ll wish he never made. Its natural.

  44. Exeter Ex

    Apr 23, 2018, 10:32 #108860

    "We've all been staunch Arsene backers in our time" that's right, Ron, we all were, but why did we stop being so? Wenger talks like the fans became 'hurtful' out of nowhere, on a whim. It's all results driven. Far from 'vitriol' I'd say overall he had a very easy time for it for many years. Only very recently the MSM turned on him in any way and it's been a very gradual process from the fans themselves, with to this day many remaining beguiled by him. Any other top 6 club, he'd have been out nigh on a decade ago. And if the 'vitriol' really was too much, no one forced him to keeping picking up £8m a year to put up with it. He's got no right to have a go about a situation that he caused and fans then reacted to - not the other way around.

  45. MAF

    Apr 23, 2018, 10:27 #108859

    wenger will just behave as we surely come to expect. a very selfish man who leverages on the Club when he doesnt get his own way. it down to wenger that there is no succession plan in place plus the lack of strength from very weak owners and Management who allowed wenger to act like god and now they are in the limelight we are going to see what our owners and Management are really all about. i do really fear they are out of their debt running this great Club. Liverpool's owners are also USA but on Player deals and Management acquisitions there seems to be a guiding Radar + DNA. lets see how our guys get on but i am worried. however i am also pleased we have finally reached this point

  46. Yes its Ron

    Apr 23, 2018, 10:27 #108858

    Hi Bard - i didnt use the word 'greater', i just mentioned his values, whatever they are. We all have them and theyre usually indefinable arent they. Wenger is an idealist, not necessarily for all of the right reasons as idealists rarely are, so in my view he seems think all of his efforts and work should be respected universally. Its unrealistic of course it is, but thats how he seems to roll in my view. We dont agree with all hes said and done. He dont agree with how hes been hammered by whats been only a small section of the fans base. Rightly or wrongly hes entitled to his say,thats my point. Ultimately, nobodies view matters too much. Hes going and looks toward a lifestyle that we can only dream about. Good luck to the bloke.

  47. RobG

    Apr 23, 2018, 10:08 #108857

    "I can tell you right now if it’s Brendan Rodgers my patience will never begin but therein lies an issue" Yes ! I get your point. although I don't think you need worry on that account. Also,|I think Arsenal fans will be patient with the new guy. It was only after intense provocation that things turned against Wenger. And Terry Neill a whole generation before that. This is a rebuild job. And no one can seriously suppose that it will take less than two to three years.

  48. Bard

    Apr 23, 2018, 10:02 #108856

    Ron; where are these 'greater values' then. He cant have it both ways.

  49. Yes its Ron

    Apr 23, 2018, 9:59 #108855

    We ve all been staunch Arsene backers in our time. Nobody in the right mind wouldnt have valued him for the larger part of his career. On yesterdays comments by him, i think AWs philosophies and his notions of humanistic behaviour has always underpinned his management style and his own ideas on values etc etc have perhaps been too much at the forefront of his mind for football and not really of best help to him while in the job. I think thats where his comments came from in all fairness. Lets be honest, if we were subjected to the vitriol hes had this last few years, how many of us wouldn't take the chance to have a dig back at an appropriate time? Im guessing Arsene Wenger has lots more to say about the behind the scenes events this last 10 years than ever he has to say about silly football supporters, most of whom these days who are as fickle as its possible to be thanks to the way the modern game is presented to them vis wall to wall TV spewing out its largely mindless soundbites, dressed up as 'news' and its so called 'expert' opinion. As i see it, hes took flak, so we as fans should be big enough to take some back off him too if he sees fit to throw some. Its all part of football and many other coaches have aimed barbs at fans as they've left a club.

  50. Bard

    Apr 23, 2018, 9:45 #108854

    Charlie; yes the fans need to come together and I for one would like that. But as Exeter posts it doesn't seem as though Wenger is going to help that process. His spiteful and graceless dig at the fans yesterday won't make the coming together easier. He cannot see that worrying about the Arsenal brand in Africa isn't our number one priority. The reason he had to leave was poor results. His attempt to lay the blame on disgruntled fans is exactly why we have been on the slide. He cannot take responsibility for his own failings. I have always thought his status as a human being was way over egged yesterday was the clincher for me. It was nothing more than a tantrum.

  51. Exeter Ex

    Apr 23, 2018, 9:28 #108853

    More interesting than the match was the post-match press conference. Wenger appeared to be suggesting the problem was he didn't have 100% backing from the fans, that this is more important than results and he should be unconditionally backed no matter what happens on the field for the good of the 'image' of the club. Unfortunately for him we're not all Badarse and Toady types. This is supposed to be high level competitive sport. He doesn't work for an NGO. Indeed modern AFC is the opposite of that, a profit driven corporation. It's really not hard - results have declined over a very protracted period, meaning you lose much of the fanbase for sporting reasons and the owner for financial reasons. It really is that simple and it's a shame he can't be more realistic now he's going.