Are Arsenal a big club?

If we stop thinking of ourselves as big club we won’t be so disappointed



Are Arsenal a big club?

A victim of his own success


So, with depressing familiarity, and to howls of “we told you so” from all the usual suspects, our ‘quadruple’ season enters its death throes. All the arguments as to why have been discussed at length in many other articles, and by and large they all draw the same conclusions. We need to strengthen and add experience in all areas of the pitch. This of course means spending some serious money, which is something not seen at Arsenal for many seasons. The arguments then take two distinct paths. Arsene knows best or Wenger out!

The driving factor behind all this debate seems to be the media obsession with the continuing trophy drought. A look back through Wenger’s history will show that Arsenal are a club that have short periods of success, followed by a period of rebuilding and then some more success. The difference this time is that the current rebuilding phase is about to enter its third stage. The only explanation I can think of for the media obsession is the perception that Arsenal are a big club, and as such carry big club expectations with them every year. But in reality are Arsenal currently a big club, and is the expectation every season justified? For me it all depends on what criteria you use to decide if a club is big or not. Here are some of the main arguments about what makes a big club based upon the perceived media big four of Arsenal, Chelsea, Man Utd and Liverpool.

“A big club wins trophies.” Sometimes they do, but since 2002 the League Cup in whatever guise it was at the time, has been won by the big four plus Blackburn, Middlesbrough, Spurs and Birmingham. In 2008 the FA Cup was won by Portsmouth, and this year’s final is between Stoke and Man City. None of these teams are classed as big clubs, indeed some of them have fallen on very hard times since their cup win, yet they all have a recent trophy to their name.

“A big club wins the Premier League.” Yes they do, with one notable exception, Blackburn in 1995. Since the Premiership began in Sept 1992 only four teams have won it, and only four others have been runners up. Two of those - Blackburn and Aston Villa - were both in the first few years, the other two are Liverpool and famously, Newcastle.

“A big club qualifies for the Champions League.” Usually they do, but there have been exceptions. Leeds, Newcastle and Spurs have all played in the CL. Everton lost in a qualifying round.

“A big club is a buying, not a selling club.” Of the big four only Arsenal buck this trend. Many other clubs have far exceeded Arsenal’s spending in the last few years, most notably Man City. In contrast Arsenal have sold the likes of Henry, Toure, Hleb and Abebayor for vast sums and only invested a small proportion of that money back into the team.

Other arguments include ground size, global fan base and gross income. If you take all these criteria and apply them to the last five years, then the only club that could truly be called a big club is Man Utd. Of the other three Chelsea are the nearest, with Arsenal and Liverpool in third and fourth place. However it is a different story if you go back ten years, when Arsenal and Man Utd were neck and neck, Liverpool were more or less where they are now and Chelsea were still awaiting a sugar daddy to bail them out of their financial mess. I think it was this period of success culminating with the Invincibles, that has been a big club millstone around our neck ever since.

It is obvious to all football fans that our recent trophy drought has coincided with the move from Highbury to the E******s stadium. During the last five years the club has dedicated itself to reducing the stadium debt, whilst remaining competitive on the pitch. The fact they have achieved this, even though the global recession seriously reduced the revenue from Highbury Square property sales, is nothing short of a miracle. We are UEFA’s model of how to run a football club. In the same period Chelsea and Man City have been recession proof and spent fortunes. Man Utd have also spent big where necessary, paid for mainly by the world record transfer of Ronaldo for £80m, but they have also been put into serious debt by the Glazers’ takeover.

I don’t agree with the ‘Wenger out’ argument because despite all the upheaval of moving to a new stadium and the global financial problems, we are still perceived as a big club. In achieving this we haven’t spent ourselves into oblivion like Leeds and many others, or needed a sugar daddy bailout like Chelsea, or had a potentially ruinous takeover, yet we are there or thereabouts every year. If we had collapsed like Liverpool the expectations would be much lower, and the media would leave us alone to rebuild. The current media lovefest with Spurs is all the proof you need that moderate success, coupled with low expectation is more appealing to the headline writers than a well run, overachieving but ultimately trophyless club.

When I weigh up all the arguments I have to conclude that at the moment Arsenal are not quite in the big club league, and the expectations placed upon Arsene Wenger and the team are unjustified. To a large degree we are the victims of our own success. The unbeaten season was an achievement that many thought impossible. Arsene Wenger didn’t. He predicted his team would do it and was only a year out. Since then his every move has been unfairly compared to that unique season. In the face of all the media scrutiny and the growing chorus of discontent from the fans, he has stuck to his principles and has only just fallen short. I think he has done a remarkable job, and deserves the chance to reap the rewards of five years’ groundwork over the coming seasons. AKB.


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  1. Cawillemat

    May 07, 2011, 0:03 #6371

    We are the biggest club in the biggest city in Europe. If we cant make that work then we need to question what the hell our manager and non-entity of a chief executive are being so handsomely rewarded for.

  2. Simon Lloyd

    May 05, 2011, 23:12 #6273

    Thanks for all the comments so far. some interesting points. The aim of the article was to take a look at the current Arsenal as a whole, and not focus on individual factors. I will answer some of the points raised. How much you pay to watch is not indicative of a big club as the Man Utd ticket prices prove. The ticket price is high because we will pay it, and we pay it because we like the product on offer. The History debate is an interesting one, because for large parts of the Seventies and Eighties we had some very moderate crowds and very limited success. When the George Graham double team won the league in 1989 it was our first title since 1971, which itself was the first title since 1953. Also in that time only one more FA cup was delivered in 1979 and one league cup in 1987. A six year wait for a trophy is very much part of Arsenal's history. We haven't won the Champions league. No, but including 2006 we have lost to Barcelona 3 times and Man Utd once. It usually takes the best to beat us. Crowd size is another debatable point because before Hillsborough most grounds had large standing areas and walk up crowds. Many top flight clubs got bigger gates in those days, and the ground capacity was usually dictated by how many you could squeeze in on the day. This also woked both ways because a poor run of bad weather would significantly reduce the gate. take a look at some of Arsenal's crowds in the eighties. The Amount of money spent doesn't guarantee success. A look at the current Real Madrid team is confirmation of that. Also reckless spending by Man City, Chelsea and Man Utd have pushed the price of mediocre players up to superstar levels. When you look at the minimal success of Seventies and Eighties, it could be argued that we were only considered a big club because we were from London. Throughout that period Spurs could claim to be equally as big as us for the same reason. George Graham started us on the big club path and Arsene Wenger took us to true big club status between 1998 and 2004. Since the move to Ashburton Grove the club has not been able to compete financially and as such I believe we are not currently at big club status. I share the frustrations of all fans, and would like to see some silverware in the trophy cabinet. I think we as fans need to be realistic about the clubs status. Man City have spent more on players in 2 years than we have taken through the gate,(Based on £3M a game x 25 games a year = £150M.) and they are still below us. A manager who has taken us this far knows what he is doing, and knows what is required to win silverware. When the right player is available for the right price he will make his move.

  3. Dan

    May 05, 2011, 23:08 #6272

    Yes we are the 3rd most succesful club ever in England but we are miles behind Manchester Utd and Liverpool in trophy wins.And this is a Liverpool who havent won a league in 21 years.Here's a stunning stat since Ferguson won his first trophy for Utd in 1990 there has only been FOUR seasons since then that they havent wont a trophy,Four seasons out of 21 that they have been trophyless.And the AKB's tell us Wenger is doing great to get us to a 3rd place finish again,get real he gets paid more than Ferguson

  4. phil

    May 05, 2011, 22:58 #6271

    Well said pal! Finally an honest and true article that doesn't jump on any bandwagons. In arsene I definatly trust!

  5. Judge Me in May

    May 05, 2011, 21:44 #6270

    Biggest load of nonsense I have read in some time, quite an achievement! It's such a ridiculous article you can slice and dice it any several ways you choose. If we're not a big club, why does the manager spend every pre-season talking about how we're gonna win the league and CL? Hmmm? Which small club says the FA Cup doesn't count as a trophy? I don't hear Pulis or Mancini saying that kind of bollox! What small club has a wage bill of £110 mil? Which small club can afford to pay a dud like Eboue £60k a week and a joke like Rosicky £65k a week? And Chamakh £80k a week? What kind of small club has EIGHTEEN players out on loan? If Arsenal aren't to be considered a big club, why is their non-performing manager paid more than Alex Ferguson and Pep Guardiola? If Arsenal aren't a big club why were they the third biggest club in England BEFORE Wenger turned up? The biggest club, in the biggest city, in the richest league in Europe. A club with bigger matchday revenue than Barca, Bayern, Real and AC Milan. And you are trying to degrade Arsenal's standing by trying to make Arsene Wenger seem like a competent manager!!!! How low, how poor, how desperate and how pathetic. Well guess what? EPIC FAIL. You've convinced no one (with a brain that is) that Wenger is actually over-achieving. No smart person will buy that B.S. Not on that salary! You are so brainwashed that you would sooner try and re-write history, and sully the club's global standing, than sooner open your deluded eyes and realise that Wenger is a past-it, overpaid, dishonest, farce of a manager. It's quite sad, quite worrying and quite hilarious all at once.

  6. StuartL

    May 05, 2011, 21:30 #6268

    I think most fans accepted that the stadium move would limit the amount of money available for team spending, but for how long ? The debt has lowered considerably and is at a manageable level within our financial ability to repay without too much of an effect on our overall team spending, so now there really is no excuse to not purchase the top quality, experienced, winners that this team needs to fulfill (finally) its potential. We never seem to be able to grasp the initiative - we were the club that knocked Liverpool of their pedestal that they had been perched on for 20 odd years and they haven't recovered. Unfortunately we let Utd take over the mantle and despite being their equals for several seasons we have yet again fallen down the pecking order behind Chelsea and with Man City's spending power the danger is that we will fall further away unless we become more bullish and actually try to win the league rather than be content to finish in the top 4.

  7. Robert Exley

    May 05, 2011, 21:20 #6267

    'When I weigh up all the arguments I have to conclude that at the moment Arsenal are not quite in the big club league' - we're the third most successful side in English football history and qualified for every champions league since 1998. Are Arsenal a big club? Does a bear **** in the woods?

  8. john

    May 05, 2011, 18:41 #6265

    manures dearest season ticket over £900. Arsenals around £1900. Absolute joke. Arsenals true fans getting more isolated and unable to support the club they love at the Emirates. we are a financial business now not a genuine football club. Football spectators may attend the Emirates but not true Arsenal fans. As far as i am concerned the Arsenal board can .... off. 11 Reply

  9. kev g

    May 05, 2011, 17:27 #6263

    The problem is wenger and the board every year announce they want to win prem league and champs league. These are huge targets to achieve and therefore fans rightly have high expectations. Secondly the board and now even wenger say there is piles of cash to spend on players. Wenger even said he has the financial muscle to compete with chelsea back in November. Whether any of this is actually true or not is beside the point. They are saying this and getting the fans hopes up. Couple all this with the fact that wenger even states he's in the market for experienced class we've all been craving for ages and the fans have very very high hopes indeed. Is rather they honestly come out every year and told the truth. We are paying off debt for another x years and 4th is our sole aim with anything else a bonus At least then we would know

  10. Nick

    May 05, 2011, 17:00 #6262

    Just when! did wenger say we WOULD go unbeaten i watched the interview he gave on sky and he was asked if he thought we could go unbeaten and he replied quote"i wouldnt be SURPRISED" not the same thing as saying "my team WILL go unbeaten" at all and as for THE Arsenal not being a big club dont make me laugh weve been regarded as a big club since the days of Herbert Chapman and in the 47 years ive been supporting Arsenal there has ALWAYS been expectations of us winning trophys teams like blackburn ,villa, newcastle WERE big teams and if we are prepared to accept 2nd best then well wind up like them and thats not something i want to see happen to our club

  11. Rocky RIP

    May 05, 2011, 15:51 #6259

    Arsenal are probably the biggest club never to have won the champions league. Arsenal are the 3rd biggest club in England (behind Man U & Liverpool.) Size should be measured chiefly on trophy haul & fan base. (Wealth is important, but misleading.) Chelsea are a medium sized club that fell into a vast sum of money & has grown, but they are still far behind us. Sept 2007 - Champions League - Chelsea v Rosenborg, attendance: 24,973. That is inconceivable at Arsenal. So yes, we are big.

  12. Phil

    May 05, 2011, 15:26 #6257

    Big club with the ambition of a small club on the pitch.Finishing 2nd is called success by our manager.Building the stadium we were told was so we could compete with our major rivals.Surely competing means winning some trophies.Wrong.22,000 more bodies in the stadium means more money.Thats what Arsenal is all about making money.The fans are supposed to be happy when the club annouces record profits.Has the move from Highbury actually made us a better team? And with Citeh getting a top 4 place will we fall further behind.Its a sad thing to say but the only time things will change is when we drop out of the top 4.As long as we finish top 4 do you really think Kroenke will do anything to change things.Finally would a big team have a keeper such as Almunia starting the season as number 1 and have deadwood like Eboue Denilson Diaby and Bender on mega contracts?

  13. Ian

    May 05, 2011, 14:59 #6255

    We as fans are in a constant state of fear. It is glaringly obvious to all that follow the club what areas are in need of improvement, but we as loyal fans of the club have no direct input into the running of the club but sit and hope that the powers that be make the decisions to affect change where needed. Some look at our manager as someone so blinded by his own arrogance and belief systems that he can no longer act in the best interest of the club. I believe that he is not blinded but that there are many variables that affect his ability to do what needs to be done. He has a multi****al role in many matters that are Arsenal and is under enormous pressure to hold it all together. This still begs the question as to when will it all come together? We who love Arsenal have patiently waited based on what we have been told by the board (five years of rebuilding, we will be able to compete in the transfer market, etc...) But times up... we want to be proud of our club, witness our achievements and be inovative pioneers in football. Close we are, but now is the time for results. We have the fundamental ingredients for ultimate success with the talemnts in our current squad but there needs to be a mental shift. I believe that a winning mentuality starts with the manager and then is imparted to the team. Wenger needs to realign himself and re-gain a winning mentaility, make the necessary signings and cuts to bring us back to our rightful place at the summit of the league and innovators of world football.

  14. Graham

    May 05, 2011, 14:53 #6254

    How dare you say we are not a big club.Is this how far you Wenger faithfuls are willing to go to mask his failings,by degrading the club.How many clubs in the whole of England has more domestic silverware than Arsenal??? 2 I think,Man U and Liverpool.Arsenal are a way bigger club than Chelsea,bigger fan base,bigger history,bigger capacity,bigger everything.Arsenal is currently the 3rd richest club in the WORLD.The highest ticket prices in the league and we are not a big club??????Ha.Stop denying the fact that Wenger is past it and please stop pulling down Arsenal to protect Wenger

  15. Raj

    May 05, 2011, 14:34 #6253

    Man utd in debt Chelsea sugar daddy Man city sugar daddy Liverpool almost bust Barcelona threw UNICEF out to get a shirt sponsor Real Madrid - dont know where there money keeps coming from Arsenal - if this was a financial test, we'd be number 1. Relatively low debt, bigger stadium, competing at the top levels, and profitable. Upside: need to expand the brand to Asia, US and we'll be the biggest club in Europe

  16. dan

    May 05, 2011, 14:12 #6251

    hahhaha the rewards,we are not going to be rewarded,all they are doing is fleecing the fans,in arsenal we rust

  17. WestUpperRed

    May 05, 2011, 13:52 #6250

    I agree we are not in the big club leagues but i dont think the expectations on Wenger are too high. Wenger makes the same failings to improve us where he is able too repeatedly and has the best interests of his own philosphy underlying this. Thats not too high an expectation - get the simple things right! Dont confuse a big club argument with keeping Wenger or not as he has to change his approach or go.

  18. no. 1 is perry groves....

    May 05, 2011, 13:44 #6249

    not a big club? have you seen our ticket prices!!!!!!!

  19. cyril

    May 05, 2011, 13:18 #6247

    13 league titles spanning back to 1930's, 14 consecutive years in the Champions League and depending when our accounts are registered, we are placed as the third biggest club in the world by Forbes. However, i take your point !

  20. Scoot

    May 05, 2011, 13:14 #6246

    What a pile of drivel. Obviously paid too much and wants to watch the selfless, clueless, overpaid prima donnas achieving nothing. Whilst Wenger is at the helm NOTHING will change. CHANGE or BE CHANGED!

  21. chris dee

    May 05, 2011, 13:11 #6245

    Another depressing article from another supporter who with cap in hand ,would tug his forlock if Hill Wood or any other board member walked by. Another dream supporter for our board. You know the type ,let's be happy with our lot,we know our station in life. Let forget about joining the elite clubs of Europe, lets be happy with being a reasonably successful club who win trophies every now and then,let others win the Premiership consistently. It is a scandal we have never won the Champions League ,but hey,we leave that to the 'big clubs'. What a lack of ambition,what complacency,what a lack of back bone. And what bull****,Chelsea are nearer to United in terms of ground size,fan base and income. Go back to bed mate!

  22. Jason

    May 05, 2011, 13:01 #6242

    I will always say Arsenal can never be considered a big club unless they achieve success at the highest level.The champions league(the same goes for Chelsea as well).Do big clubs look on just qualifying for the CL every season as success.We cant compare with United under Ferguson,even if they dont win the title they compensate by winning domestic trophies.We have finished 4th three times in the last 6 years.We have gone from 8 seasons of being in the top two to 6 seaons of being no higher than 3rd.The problem is we failed to build on the success of the Invincibles.The fans have high expectations and rightly so but that is not the same for the manager or the board.Does Kroenke want Arsenal to be the best team in Europe or is he just happy for things to carry on the way they are now.The early signs are not good.At a big club the manager should always be under pressure of losing his job.In recent years managers of big clubs Rijkaard(Barcelona) and Van Gael(Bayern) have been sacked although they brought success to their clubs, at Arsenal they would have a job for life.

  23. Westie

    May 05, 2011, 13:00 #6241

    We are a big domestic club due to our fanbase, domestic trophy history, and our financial situation. We are the third most succesful club in English history - how could this mean we are anything but a big club? In total Europe terms, we are not in the big club league because we have consistantly failed in the big European competitions. A couple of CL wins would change that.

  24. venerander mutambi

    May 05, 2011, 12:55 #6240

    Arsenal is a big club but if Wenger doesn't want to spend on buying players LET him Not sell any of Arsenal star and i'm 100% sure he will win tropheis next season let him take each game serious stop this issue of having injuries without better substitues then we shall stop dreaming of next season we are fed up but still srong Arsenal funs.

  25. Richard Ansell

    May 05, 2011, 12:54 #6239

    You are right, Simon, in that Wenger has done a remarkable job keeping us top four and getting to the latter stages of the CL. I just wince at the thought of what might have been had he just deviated from his pet project just a little to add the few quality and experienced players we desperately need to turn potential in to trophies. You say he needs to be given a chance to reap the rewards of his groundwork over the last six years but all I see ahead is more and more of the same flirting with success but never achieving it. He is too inflexible and is a victim of his own making

  26. GoonerRon

    May 05, 2011, 12:51 #6238

    Simon - I congratulate you on this article, it echoes my thoughts exactly. I wouldn't consider myself an AKB in as much as I think Wenger clearly has faults (some transfer activity, some team selections, some substitutions, some selective sight, some over-use of the words 'mental' and 'strength') but he has clearly been hamstrung by the stadium move (a net transfer profit in the time we've been there), yet has kept us competing in cup finals and league run-in's at the same time. Man City have spent the best part of half a billion and are still playing catch up with us. The stadium move was clearly a project to take the club forward over the next century and Wenger is feeling the short term pain of it. That said, I wouldn't disagree with people who say what money we have had available should have been invested in experience for the squad. The Spuds this year have shown how difficult it is to get into the CL and stay there - something Wenger says is an achievement yet we take largely for granted. We need some tweaks to the playing staff and to our approach in certain games and we will undoubtedly win trophies, and with Wenger at the helm.

  27. fozzys mate

    May 05, 2011, 12:45 #6237

    This article sums it up. We are a big club but since I started going in the early 80s have been run at board level as a medium sized club lacking the ambition to be the dominant force that manure and before them Liverpool once had. With the funds we have now post the move and all it brought including charging the highest prices in the world and rising and refreshments to rival Claridges prices we must become a giant of the world game or at least try to be.

  28. 6ooner Pete

    May 05, 2011, 12:44 #6236

    Of course we're a big club. Only Utd and Liverpool have won more trophies. It's just we don't behave like a big club at the moment, apart from charging extortional prices for everything. We don't work properly on basic defending or have any game plan except tippy tappy. We pay ridiculous wages to non-big team players.We fail to address basic weaknesses in the team.Sky money has made the rich clubs richer and has certainly helped us in keeping us where we are BUT we should have made more of our global image while we behaved like a big club and were winning things.If you spend money on quality players and win trophies you get money back plus your image around the World develops. At the moment we are a big club behaving like a lesser premiership team. We need a change of focus NOW before actually behaving like a small team becomes a reality.

  29. Bob

    May 05, 2011, 12:43 #6235

    If you want to take account of history, in the 1930s there was no bigger Club in the world than Arsenal. If you want to disregard history and focus on today, we charge our customers (no longer supporters) absolute top dollar - far more than any other team in Britain, if not Europe. Either way, Arsene's strategy and aspirations (top four each year is good enough...) is totally inconsistent with the reasonable expectations of generations of Arsenal followers, old and new.

  30. Kharadonha Mbalu

    May 05, 2011, 12:39 #6234

    we are a big club and the reason media keeps talking about us is bcoz of our recent achievement. I believe we have won the league more than 13 times which means we not that far from ManU and Liverpool in England history of football. Obviously when a big club is not doing well the media looks to intervene and tries to get the fact right, why this team is not doing what it used to? those are first questions that media guys asks themselves. Arsenal has a huge support around the world and it continues to grow which is a great thing, and the fans really loves Arsenal not bcoz of Arsene but bcoz their blood is red and white (Arsenal colors). I'd love to see the players start treating this team as a big team just like our former players. I'm not going to give names but when you play for a team like this one, all you must have in mind is to win no matter what. when the board is not challenging the team and manager. probably they'll think they are doing a great job by finishing 4th every season as Arsene claims. When Arsene took over the reigns, Arsenal were a big team bcoz of the players we had at a time but ever since he changed it, it has became more like Aston Villa and Everton where glory is not a must. Only Arsenal fans who recognises that Arsenal is a big club, you can check Forbes Magazine where's Arsenal on the list of richest clubs in the world. I'd say 3rd but nothing to show that we are a big club. To all Arsenal players (senior players to junior players)don't forget this is a big club. South African Gooner 4ever

  31. Goonerjon

    May 05, 2011, 12:07 #6230

    Yes,we are that big club but will Nasri and Fabregas see it that way in the summer? And will the players we want as their replacements (plus others) see us as a big club? One thing's for certain,we're the biggest club in North London.

  32. ren vassilliou

    May 05, 2011, 12:02 #6229

    We are a Big Club and our expectations are not too high , we do deserve to win trophy's and we should be winning them now, we moved from Highbury because we felt we may be left behind , we did that got into a stadium with sixty thousand to compete with the other Big Clubs , our Ticket prices keep going up , when when will it end , The person who thought about the design of the Emirates got it all wrong ,that should have been 100000 seater because we have the supporters that way they would not be rising prices every year , So don't say we are not a big club ....We are bigger then even the Owners Know .... Fact ... we deserve to have some silverware in the cabinet .... NOW ....

  33. Dave

    May 05, 2011, 11:58 #6228

    My comments and a few simple questions (sorry if I sound harsh!) 1) How many years without a trophy do you look back & say, yeah we probably should have changed manager. Do you give Wenger 1, 3, 5, 10 more years & always justify his failure by stating the success in 2004 2) Its hard to have confidence in a man who thinks Almunia is the best keeper for AFC of all world goal keeping players. Does hardly any set-piece defending in training, has only 2 tactics - tippy tappy passing 99% or 1% extreme negative to get penalty shoot outs. Wont recognise that the defence is not good enough or that RVP will get injured every season. 3) Your also not factoring in the following: Our squad will improve by x amount next year. BUT Utd, Chelsea, man City will buy to improve by 2X. As in, even if Bendtner improves by 10% he'll never get to Rooney, Tevez, Torres or any bought in world-class player standard. 4) I believe we are an under-achieving big team. Don't agree with your argument because: If we lose to Man U or Chelsea I'm not too bothered once we are competitive. We are losing to Birmingham, west Brom, Bolton etc thru a lack of defending, motivation & of course!! Mental strength. Any thoughts?

  34. Jack the Lad

    May 05, 2011, 10:58 #6225

    Great article but you seem to have missed some major points. Before Liverpool's immense success in the 80s, Arsenal was the most successful club in English football, so the club does have the history. Since then Arsenal has been "second" to Liverpool in the 80s then ManU in the 90s, right up till the 2004 invincible season (arguably the single greatest achievement in club football). Off the pitch you also failed to mention that Arsenal are the 3rd most valuable club in the world, with the 5th highest revenue. (source: Forbes and Deloitte). So is Arsenal a big club? IMO yes Then there is

  35. Tasos

    May 05, 2011, 10:42 #6223

    Simon A very well thought-out article, proving that big headlines or rash statements make very little sense once we intelligently analyse all the variables of our recent trophy-less years. One day Wenger will receive the credit he undoubtedly deserves. His loyalty, vision and hard work will reap its rewards and give the club a solid base, a foundation to form a competitive challenge for honours on the field year after year whilst guaranteeing stability within and a healthy future for many generations to come. Genius.

  36. Joolz The Gooner

    May 05, 2011, 10:29 #6222

    So now its 5 years groundwork. And next season 6? How about the year after? We were sold a lie that we had to move from Highbury to the Sporting White Elephant to take us to the "next level" and that our transfer budget wouldnt be affected. Just because we are not a "Big Club" doesnt mean we have to put up with the rhetorical nonsence spouted by the manager and the lacklustre displays from the majority of the squad. We dont need to "spend ourselves to oblivion like Leeds" we just need to buy what is neccessary. The fact the manager is failing to do so simply to massage his own ego (ie. trying to do a Barcelona with the blooding of youngsters but failing miserably) has now become unacceptable.

  37. CD

    May 05, 2011, 10:25 #6221

    Sorry but your conclusions do not allow for rank bad loyalty to players like Almunia, Denilson, Bendtner, Eboue, Vela, Rosicky, Diaby, Fabianski, Squilachi etc by AW. This is before we even start on suspect defending by Clichy or headless running into blind alleys by Walcott. Then we have the lack of leaders in this team, and a manager whose tactical acuman would fit onto the back of a fag packet. He did not need to spend crazy amounts of money to get better players than these, and had he done what we all have been able to see (despite most of us not even having half a days experience) for over 6 years now, I guarantee you our trophy cabinet would have had plenty more in it, and then low and behold we would be classified as a big club again using your theory. The most reliable indicator about the size of any business is turnover, and we have consistantly been in the top 5/6 in the world for a few years now, and hence yes we are a big club, but sadly have a small club mentality. That is the key difference, as we are hostage to one mans fantasy project who is now only interested in trying to prove a point of not spending a penny and hoping to be seen in history as the greatest manager ever. However even this now does not appear to be on his agenda anymore as he would now be happy to come second for the next twenty years! The point is had he been ruthless and replaced the dross who are all on ridiculous wages and got some leaders in on even the same wages it would not have cost us an extra penny but in all probability would have seen us over the finishing line on numerous occasions and hence have the trophies to back up our true big club status.

  38. Michael

    May 05, 2011, 10:24 #6220

    Blimey! A sensible piece of writing on Arsenal. Well done. It certainly makes a change from the pathetic drivel and self-pitying ****e that spews from the keyboards of the thousands of people who know the game and the business of footbal better than Arsene Wenger.

  39. Ross

    May 05, 2011, 10:18 #6219

    What a pointless article. There is no point trying to argue that Arsenal isn't a big club. You mention how weaker teams have qualified for the Champions League and won the Premier League, of course that's going to happen but none of them do it consistently or to a greater degree than other clubs. Arsenal does and are a global brand recognised worldwide. You clearly haven't a clue. Being a big club doesn't depend on just the last 5 or 10 years, the whole history of the club has to be taken in to account. That's why Arsenal is still a bigger club than Chelsea and that's why the fans expect trophies. Did you just feel you wanted to blog today and decided to write whatever crap came in to your head??

  40. Pearson

    May 05, 2011, 10:16 #6218

    You are right. The Arsenal moving from Highbury did not automatically make them a "big" club. I think the stadium move needs another two years to have it's effect

  41. adrian

    May 05, 2011, 10:13 #6217

    I think that the stadium debt issue has been a bigger handicap than many thought. This has stopped investment in the team. Arsene has done a good job in keeping arsenal in the top echelon during this time. But he is not without fault, in that some of his transfer deals have not been the best. The central issue of defensive weakness has not also been addressed. He has already achieved a great deal, but needs a trophy to continue his success.

  42. Mark

    May 05, 2011, 10:11 #6216

    given the success that GG had and then AW we had every right to expect the club to grow in terms of global brand name and coverage, power to attract top players etc. but it is my contention that the management apart from David Dein were simply not driven by this ambition. hill woods etc are not the same as the people who live and breath man u, barca, real, liverpool, chelsea, ac milan, inter. Hill woods were detached business people who paid themselves very well and did not care about much else. consequently we are behind where we should be in terms of brand name, global coverage and being seen by players as a really big club who will challenge for trophies every year. i would put us in the 2nd group of teams but about No 8 if there was a points system that encompassed all these criteria. i contend that the board should have done a better job given the rate that trophies were coming in the door between 1988-2005

  43. Jekyll

    May 05, 2011, 10:09 #6215

    Well, if we're not a big club we should be - highest ticket prices in the world and rising, and historically the biggest club in London, one of the biggest, most famous cities in the world. So something is amiss. People are tiring of Wenger because he keeps repeating the same mistakes and we keep seeing the same result - end of season collapses. That's the nub of it.