Close Season Musings Part 1

Online Ed: Some thoughts on football stuff and a lost friend



Close Season Musings Part 1

Arsène – One more year? (Charles Williams www.madeup.org)


Where to begin? Well, let’s start with a piece of gossip that briefly excited me a lot more than the Higuain stories. The news that Paris St Germain are only recruiting a new manager for one season (although finding it tough to recruit a big name that will accept such terms), on the assumption that Arsène Wenger will honour his contract at Arsenal before taking over at PSG in the summer of 2014. On one level, it makes sense. Wenger has established links with the club’s owner and it seems a perfect fit. Long term, Wenger, a man who has admitted he does not make the most of living in London, would surely prefer Paris.

One thing we should also remember is that Wenger’s remaining obsession is to win the Champions League. It is a glaring omission on his CV, and his team selections in the variety of competitions around the time of the spring knockout matches reflect this, with players rested even for Premier League matches on occasion, and certainly in the likes of FA Cup semi-finals. Might the mananger, counting down the seasons to his own retirement, feel he would have a better chance of landing the trophy at a club like PSG rather than Arsenal? This on the basis that they simply have a stronger playing roster due to resources? Those are the arguments that might confirm the possibility. Certainly the idea of PSG offering a one year deal is an unusual one.

However, on another level it simply does not add up. Having been openly critical of “financial doping” in the past, it would be quite a turnaround for the Arsenal manager to cross the ideological divide and join up with a free-spending concern. Additionally, he has not always demonstrated a willingness to work with already-made star names who do not owe any part of their reputation to him. I would love to be a fly on the wall in any interactions between Wenger and Zlatan Ibrahimovic concerning footballing matters. This remember, was the player who would have signed for Arsenal but refused after Wenger requested he spent a trial period at the club first. Sheffield Wednesday missed out on Eric Cantona for the same reason. Having said that, who is to say Ibrahimovic will still be in Paris by the time Wenger might join? However, there are other stars, and if PSG are to compete with Monaco, one can see the battle between the two in the transfer market escalating like the arms race.

Another question is whether Wenger would move to a club where there is no way he would enjoy the complete control he currently does? From Ivan Gazidis’ recent pronouncements there is a renewal deal on the table at Arsenal. The longer it remains unsigned, the more belief will build that the PSG story is true. Some would be sorry to see the manager go, others would celebrate. I guess it depends on whether you have faith that he is the best man to return the club to winning ways. It’s no secret I lost such belief around about 2009. However, if Arsenal continue playing the ‘result is more important than entertaining’ style they developed towards the end of last season when things begin again in August, then there is always the chance my views will be proved wrong. It will be an interesting opening to the campaign for this reason if nothing else.

On the transfer front, Higuain would be a decent start, although more of his quality would be needed for the club to seriously compete. Ultimately, a change of mentality is what is required. The message that fourth place counts as a success and is acceptable has led to wide-scale complacency at all levels. This really needs addressing, and as long as Wenger remains in charge, the only way I can see this changing is the feeling between the players and effectively an unspoken marginalizing of the manager. The dressing room needs a serious shake-up and the only way this can really happen is if enough experienced winners/leaders are recruited who will sort things out on the field tactically. Will the manager sign enough of these types (and they do not have to necessarily all be marquee signings) to have the desired effect? Wenger is not blind to the faults of the team last season (as the switch in style after the home defeat against Bayern demonstrated), but the real issue is whether he realizes the reasons for the numerous poor performances of 2012/13 and is prepared to do something about them.

On a side note, regular Gooner contributor Matthew Bazell submitted a piece on a meeting he attended this week between supporters and Richard Scudamore of the Premier League, on the subject of fans being priced out of the game. However, a version of it had already been run in The Independent. I told him I would link to that – it’s here – but just a reminder to any contributors that our policy in to run articles on the website and in the printed issue that have not first appeared elsewhere, unless they are archive pieces from way back when in the name of nostalgia.

I’ll wrap up today by expressing my condolences to the family of regular Gooner contributor Alister Campbell, who most regular website visitors will be aware passed away last weekend. Alister had fought serious health battles for a few years, and in truth, his sad death came as no great surprise, in spite of him only being in his mid-40s. I spent an unforgettable two weeks solid in Alister’s company travelling round France watching matches during the 1998 World Cup. He died last Sunday, 16th June. 15 years to the day before we had attended a 1-1 draw between Scotland and Norway in Bordeaux. There are many stories from the whole trip and the memories vivid.

For me, those departed leave their legacy in the memories of those whom they directly affected when they were alive, and Alister lives on in my own mind through the recollections of time spent in his company. I am sure he will not be forgotten any time soon by a very large number of people. For those that knew him, the funeral is next Thursday (27th June) at 1pm at the St Giles Christian Mission, 62 Bride Street Islington, London, N7 8AZ. There will be tea after the service and then from 5pm, a room has been booked at The Hemingford Arms, 158 Hemingford Rd, London N1 1DF. Anyone unable to attend the church service is welcome to attend the wake. Flowers are to be from the family only, with friends asked to consider making a donation to the NSPCC instead. Cheques made out to the charity (no cash please) may be sent by post or given on the day to the funeral directors, who will collate them and send them on to the NSPCC. The address if sending by post is - W G Miller, 93-95 Essex Rd, Islington, N1 2SJ.

Rest in Peace Al.


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  1. Rocky RIP

    Jun 27, 2013, 17:23 #36096

    Highbury Harold of BSM is spot on with his tweets. Follow him. He should work in our marketing department. There's no way he'd sell our image down the river with ill-judged re-branding. We are lucky to have fans like him who are 100% bona fide Arsenal speaking up for genuine supporters.

  2. Rocky RIP

    Jun 27, 2013, 16:17 #36093

    BADARSE - the only feasible option there is out there to stem the tide of hotdog munchers sidelining the old school support is aligning yourself with The Black Scarf Movement or Where has our Arsenal gone? They speak for me 100%. Their numbers are growing by the week and eventually the club will have to listen. They are wildly misunderstood, but anyone who takes the time to research what they are about will find it extremely hard to disagree with them. They offer tangible and realistic proposals too, not merely 'we want the old days back'. Football has moved on and there's no retrieving much of it, but some of the stuff the BSM propose makes perfect and realistic sense. They are aimed at protecting the interests of supporters. Especially those like us who often feel needlessly alienated from the club/game we adore.

  3. BADARSE

    Jun 27, 2013, 2:55 #36066

    Ron, as you will note by the time on this post, my sleeping habits are often off the scale, as is my love of Arsenal. Your last post was a lovely touch. I have a Gooner buddy, we text regularly, often about Arsenal. Invariably, one or the other will eventually bid the other goodnight, almost just as regularly the other will wish red and white dreams on him. Arsenal just seeps into the fabric of the individual. I feel I have to give you especially, a nugget when we exchange, here it is. Back in the day, '67 (?) close season, I went to Vicarage Road, for a Testimonial for Watford's then manager, Ken Furphy. Usual stuff, mixture of regular first team, and an assortment of youngsters. Drab, uneventful game, us trailing 1-0. Few minutes before the end, this rangy kid came on as a sub. He looked like a piece of string, with a knot in it! He was listed in the programme as George Charles. I wasn't sure which was first, or which was second name, though it was suggested it was Charles George. Within a minute he had scored, and rescued the game. A minute, or so later, he scored again. A minute later the whistle blew. We'd won 1-2! That was my introduction to Charlie George; I remember you saying you'd chatted to him, so thought you'd like my tale. This is the story I'd tell him if I ever met him for a chat. Off to bed for some red and white dreams now, Gooner.

  4. Ron

    Jun 26, 2013, 22:25 #36064

    BADARSE - You're more than welcome welcome matey. There is the crew you mention and one or two others and we've had many a reminisce on here my friend, they'll all tell you the same won't you guys?. You never thought you d encounter so many grizzly old school feckers in one place did you!! Good night matey.

  5. BADARSE

    Jun 26, 2013, 21:15 #36062

    Gaz, I have said before that I am always looking, often searching for those silver linings. Let me point something out to you fella. Your post said, 'Ron, Radfordkennedy, Tony Evans, GoonerPete, maguiresbridge gooner, me, and of course your moniker showed as you sent it. What a clan! Just over a week ago I knew no one, had never posted. I looked and saw such disenchantment and disagreement. Then I thought I might try to pull some of my family together, just a little, by posting and pointing out similarities,giving my take on matters, teasing, admonishing, joking and reminiscing. It's been as much of a success as I could ever have imagined. I have really connected with some of you guys, it's been nice. Stay with it Gooners. All the time we have breath in our lungs we are the Arsenal!

  6. Gaz

    Jun 26, 2013, 16:38 #36059

    Ron, Badarse, RadfordKennedy, Tony Evans, GoonerPete, maguiresbridge gooner.... sitting here just sadly nodding my head in agreement with everything you're all saying. As I said earlier it just feels like I'm trying to enjoy a 'product' (was going to call it a game but its not really anymore is it) that I just dont 'get' anymore. Perhaps I never will and I'm consigned to simply telling my own kids how much better it all used to be in the old days...

  7. maguiresbridge gooner

    Jun 26, 2013, 14:38 #36055

    Tony Evans, good point about the team being popular with other fans,as well as the Manager

  8. Tony Evans

    Jun 26, 2013, 14:17 #36054

    Ron, Gaz, Badarse, RadfordKennedy and 6oonerPete. Looks like we all feel the same way right now and are all missing the match day buzz we used to enjoy so much. Not just the buzz, I think, but also the 'we are the Arsenal mentality' when most other fans hated us; either because we were successful, or because we didn't take any prisoners during a match, or best of all both. I can't get used to Arsenal now being seen as a soft touch and being liked by all and sundry. If your team is popular with other supporters then something has gone badly wrong!

  9. BADARSE

    Jun 26, 2013, 14:09 #36053

    Here's one for you Gaz. You go out to something billed as an entertainment experience, paying pricey admission. Often the product offered is sub-standard. You are charged over the odds for USA-style food and drink. Many of the others present, often behave as if they suffer from ADHD, or some other attention or behaviourally-linked disorder. They are often talking about, or concentrating on other things, as you try to stay focused on the purpose you came for, in the first place. The general behaviour of some of the others is one of disrespect, and lends itself to a disrupted and nullified occasion for yourself. Sound familiar? A visit to the Grove? How about a visit to the cinema? Leaving the theatre, wading through knee-deep piles of popcorn, sliding over the plastic, shiny surface of the foyer, to once more emerge into fresh air, and escape from this pandemonium. See any similarities? As I keep harping on, it's happening all around us buddy.

  10. Ron

    Jun 26, 2013, 13:53 #36052

    Radford/kennedy and Gaz - The comments you both make are so right. Its true that any of us who mention yesteryear often get the put down for being out of touch or whatever, but i take the view that we know what supporting the Arsenal was like then and they who doubt it now, dont as they know nothing different. Theyre the ones whove missed out basically. Highbury and Arsenal was in a nutshell a unique matchday experience and had substance and spirit. it had a feel, an aura and a togetherness that could withstand anything. Other fans, the media the lot were riddled with envy of the Club (that still exists to a far lesser degree) but we didnt care, we were the Arsenal and all that the Club did reflected it. The players knew who they represented and that sweating blood for the shirt was the basic minimum. We were no shrinking violets or soft underbellied southerners as others thought, either on or off the pitch. Other London Clubs were exactly that by and large. We commanded respect as a Club and the spirit of it was tangible in and out of the stadium. The modern set up is geared to kids and teenagers and those in the mid 20s in my view. Its a shallow lot overall, full of lightweights on the pitch who dont care for the Clubs traditions or what we are in the game and the modern fan actually reflects SKY tele! Theyre like little SKY created robots sent to the ground to assist their masters.They even talk like theyre pre programmed by Murdoch. The Club panders to them as they carry their cameras to the ground and buy bagfulls of the crap from that atrocious store. I ask you, a freaking camera and filming in a football ground? Its pathetic. The imitation kits they wear are pathetic. Do they know how utterly stupid they look in the ill fitting things? I think not. Many of them once in the ground sit there like lemons talking about holidays in the Seychelles etc or work or business deals or cars or worst of all frigging golf, often with a dumb looking bored woman/girl/bimbo with them who they deign to kiss on the cheek every so often as she looks round to see whose looking at her in her shades (even if it is January!). Theyre not football fans, theyre posers on a trip whose knowledge of the game maybe matches what i know about russian doorknobs. Its ever likely the atmosphere in the place is like a visit to the dentists foyer.Its a good job the away fans have a presence there! Sorry to rant, but the whole place reeks of passive, matter of fact, shoulder shrugging. Thankfully we still still have a good rump of away day supporters and trust me, many think how i do of the homers.

  11. Gaz

    Jun 26, 2013, 12:30 #36049

    Sadly I have to agree with Ron and Tony Evans (in particular) that theres just something about football nowadays that turns me off big time. And whilst I'm hoping a few big buys or a change of manager might change that opinion I regret to say that even if that happens the game I fell in love with forty years ago is long gone and I doubt I'll ever feel that passionate again. Only went to three games last season and if I'm honest I never enjoyed two of them! If you'd told me ten years ago Id only go to three games a season (by choice) I'd have said you were barking mad! Perhaps the simple fact is I've been left behind by a game thats changed but changed for the worse. Good news is all that money I saved went on a new set of golf clubs...FOOOUUUUR!!!!

  12. BADARSE

    Jun 26, 2013, 12:29 #36048

    Oh, Radfordkennedy, just mentioning those names quickens the pulse, Raddy, Frank, Ray, Snout and Simmo. Such majesty, and that isn't a rose-tinted view of yesteryear. That camaraderie, esprit de corps you talk of, binds us together. It leaves an indelible print on us. Making us who we are, or who we perceive ourselves to be.It is different now, but we can still experience it, given a certain set of favourable circumstances. I still recall Freddie talking recently of his relationship with Lauren. If anyone kicked Freddie then Ralph was on the case, as his protector. There is always hope of reliving the dream, Gooner.

  13. Reality Bites

    Jun 26, 2013, 12:18 #36047

    The rumours from PSG next year grow and grow, why else would you take a decent manager and only give them a year? The fact is, though Wenger will be offered a contract extension to stay, he is actually, by his terms on a very sticky wicket. The reason - we all know it was the assistant manager, and the team spirit that emerged on his close season elevation that saved our season. The players for the most part had not bought into the way Wenger wanted them to play. the kamikaze defending was sapping team confidence and morale, players were rumoured to be siding with Bould when he went to Wenger on this. Groups of players had meetings with Wenger to change things. And just look at the results of this change after the Bayern Blackburn Spurs debacles. Yes, Wenger has been offered an extension, but Gazidis is far from the fool some of Wengers schemes make him appear to be. Any contract extension will have conditions, buy top players, keep the defence in the healthy state it was for the most part at the end of last season, let our assistant assist, sort out the keeper coaching, use the youth policy as it was intended, to supplement the squad, not the all encompassing Wenger youth policy which has failed and was always going to do so. And above all, compete, reward our generous new found sponsorship deals. Wenger was exposed last season in a way all could see. If he cannot or will not change, there is no point in him staying, he knows it, Gazidis knows it and PSG know it. Call me a blind optimist but this could be win win, at best, a new manager relatively soon, at worst, a manager who was once decent reined in and made accountable. The second option is not great, but better than we have suffered in recent years.

  14. Radfordkennedy

    Jun 26, 2013, 9:57 #36046

    BADARSE..Ron...A lot of people put us older fans down for being boring old farts for harping on about the 'good old days',but its not wanting to return to the days of queueing up for a warm bottle of Worthington E that we miss its the spirit of yesteryear that we miss.Watching the debacle against Fulham at home last season i could not help thinking that Captain Frank would of torn Peter Simpson a new arsehole for not picking up his man,and Storey wouldn't let anyone go past him twice.I understand that memories can be selective and that with the present so disappointing and the future so unsure that we seek solace in the past just hankering for that old feeling of all being in it together is what i miss really.Im sure Tony Evans and Ron know what im getting at

  15. maguiresbridge gooner

    Jun 25, 2013, 22:55 #36045

    Ron, a good prediction on Club level changing and it really wouldn't surprise me in the slightest, having been in it a few times over the last couple of seasons courtesy of a mate who had a seat, now he hasn't renewed i doubt i'll be back.Your right it really is about the munchers up there with their seasonal dining paid for in advance with their tables reserved before,juring,yes juring, and after the match, how anyone can go to the ground and not at least watch the match preferring to stay at their dining table and stuff their face is beyond me, surely they can't be Arsenal supporters, but like you say that's the kind of people we have now and the club want.There are a lot of genuine supporters up there who probably like my mate could afford it, but even he has pulled the plug saying it's nowhere near worth the money or even half the amount, even if we were still being successful and i'm sure there's a lot like him.

  16. BADARSE

    Jun 25, 2013, 22:53 #36044

    I understand where you are coming from JAMIE, but Ron is closer to the truth on this one. Yes when we look back it is dangerous because our vision gets slightly blurred. We tend to remember the good, and blank out the bad, just as you infer. However we can work on this, and try to be objective when remembering. It was a slower time. We were all more focused. In those days a programme on TV was watched by most of the country. It would be a talking point in tea rooms up and down the country. There was a unifying feel about most aspects of life. Now everyone seems as though they are away with the fairies. One group talking of celebrities waistlines, over there people talking of Ipods, peapods, and odds and sods. Society has fractured. Now take that synopsis and apply it to Rocky RIP's 'fans'. Some munching on hotdogs and grinning for photos as Arsenal are losing, and right next door another wanting to obliterate them. Now if that doesn't signify a fracture, then I don't know what does. The globe's economics has a blueprint for success, it discounts human satisfaction. We become richer, but work no less. Statistics will show that when our wealth was doubled, we didn't begin to work half the time, to enjoy our lives. No, we worked to amass money to spend on needless things, to work more, to acquire more money to spend on more needless things. No one is growing happier. Everything is damaged along the way in a reckless pursuit of wealth. The suggested equation is, we have more money, can buy more things, therefore we must be happier. We are not! We have to say goodbye to many things held dear, including our Arsenal. Mine, your's JAMIE, and your's Ron. Way back, I could go to Highbury, pay at the gate, go up onto the North Bank, sing my heart out(with the worst voice ever), and come home glowing if we'd won. Jumping up and down with strangers if we scored, it was just an absolute joy. We will only ever see fleeting glimpses of that from here on in, trust me. That part of football has all but died, and will never be resurrected. We move on guys. Yet those memories were golden, weren't they Ron?

  17. Ron

    Jun 25, 2013, 21:23 #36043

    Fair and true to a point Jamie. Thing is that those of us who have seen the past and lived the present are able to compare and form a view. Experience i suppose informs. Lack of it, leaves one grasping at straws so what you have is all that you know and is therefore what you cherish most. Everything changes though and for many of us, we don't like what Arsenal have become although we accept that they've had to become what they are to survive.It doesnt make it right or good and it doesnt mean that some of the changes arent good ones either. I do think though that if you took a straw poll of say 100 match going people over 35 and asked them if supporting the Club is as fulfilling now as it was say even 20 years ago, not many would say yes.

  18. JAMIE

    Jun 25, 2013, 20:46 #36042

    The general empathy most people feel is not just in football it's the same in the whole of society. Man generally thinks that the more money the more comforts the more pleasure he has the happier he will be. The Emerites is just a vision of Eutopia that Arsenal created for themselves. Though when he has it he longs for what he had before. Man in general always thinks the past is better, generally because the good times are remembered and the bad forgotten, also the days of a persons youth are normally his most cherished because the world is more exciting and his health better, pessimism comes with age.

  19. Ken

    Jun 25, 2013, 19:21 #36041

    What big club would put up with a manager who have not won a trophy in 8 years? But some Arsenal supporters still think of past events, Being loyal is one thing winning trophy's is another GET REAL.

  20. BADARSE

    Jun 25, 2013, 18:28 #36039

    Thanks for the reply maguiresbridge gooner. Your response really saddened me, that must be my bipolar kicking in. You see as I said, I am troubled by much in modern life. The superficiality of many things, people just skimming over the surface. It is like trying to turn back the tide, as the waves crash in. The overall situation has been lost for a long time. That is my humble opinion on general matters. People don't want to engage, it is too demanding for them. The kids never learned how to interact very well at school, and now are like butterflies, flying from one place to the next. The older heads, who do know different, if not better, are throwing in the towel, so the situation worsens. Here is a rather subdued, 'Good old Arsenal.' Going upstairs to crawl under my bed, with my security blanket.

  21. Ron

    Jun 25, 2013, 18:13 #36038

    Gooner Pete - a lot of my old freinds still in London do that matey and all say the same as you. Ive actually travelled into N7 and joined em in the pub and not bothered going into the ground for the reasons you say. Ive 2 mates who ve never stepped inside the Grove and say they never will. Home and away fans before the shift. Its a poor state of affairs but Arsenal couldnt give 2 f---s.

  22. Ron

    Jun 25, 2013, 17:59 #36037

    maguiresbridge - That stadium is all about the munchers though matey. The garbage food at obnoxious prices and the watered down 'beer' plus the tacky merchandise the Club sells is the vital ingredient from the Clubs point of view. Up in that Club level, its the bar and the food that a high proportion of them go for. The footie is a poor second.sometimes get to theri seats 20 mins after KO and then they stumble over each other scrummaging and rucking for the free 'beer' and appalling coffee etc at half time, not realising theyre paying for it in the Club membership fee of xxxxx thousand pounds plus each season, but hey ho theyre as happy as sandboys with the free programme they get, without which many wouldnt know their own team and wouldnt even know who the hell the opponent is. Not all like it true, but trust me, many are. One day, that Club level will end as people stop paying and i can see the time when it becomes some sort of 'A' grade seat section for standard season ticket holders, but at a far reduced price from the fees paid now. Arsenal do genuinely panic at not selling those seats, some must now be £6 - 7000 quid a season on half way lines, thats why the virtual trophy is so vital to them. Drop from the top 4 and those Club levels will empty for sure, leaving Arsenal to sell to others at a price that at least gives them some thing. They ll take a massive hit. You saw it last season, that section was half empty for many games. Some buy them and NEVER go!

  23. 600NER PETE

    Jun 25, 2013, 17:54 #36036

    Ron and Tony, unfortunately I agree 100%. Jacked in my season ticket 4 years ago and I haven't even bothered to renew my red membership this year. Things have never been the same since the North Bank was pulled down.Past memories have kept me hanging on in there, but with over expensive prices for poor entertainment and hardly any atmosphere, after 45 years of supporting Arsenal I'm resigned to watching them in the pub instead. Much more atmosphere there anyway and you can sit or stand with your mates!

  24. maguiresbridge gooner

    Jun 25, 2013, 15:05 #36035

    BADARSE, yes times have changed alright and so has the game and a lot of fans are, and have been left behind,for whatever reason and there's plenty of those,some good, some not,and for quite a few it's of their own choosing which in a way is sad,and says something that they see fit to take this course of action, and must be very very hard to do when you've been supporting the club all your life, i certainly couldn't do it,and never will,but there's a hell of a lot of fans who are not prepared to just keep in step any more and say nothing (maybe because to do so would bring on madness) and they've been growing and getting louder season after season and if there's no changes this season i think it would be fair to say there will be a hell of a lot more reasonable and sensible fans out of step and raging at the system. I'd be more inclined to call the hotdog munchers a nuisance, and agree there's nothing really that can be done, but you'd think they could at least wait until half time then full time, maybe if they would have done that in the past they wouldn't need them as often now.There's also nothing that can be done about loo visits but maybe the couple of gallons of coke to accompany the hotdogs might have something to do with it.

  25. Ron

    Jun 25, 2013, 14:50 #36034

    Tony . Im the same. I keep renewing the Slver but only did 5 home games last Season and i was literally nearly asleep in one of them ie B Rovers - FAC (theyre great for in somnia - we played them 6 or 7 years back in Cup didnt we and it was a 0-0 at Arsenal? Recall the dreadful boredom then!! Others get its use for now though and i do a few away days. Even if the games a poor one, its a day out and a few laughs usually. Ill never rekindle the passion mate. Football for all of its glitz speed and fitness levels is a pretty sanitized product now, ridden with its participants tolerance of each others cheating,conning and diving and for the price of a ticket its a product unworthy in my view. Ive better things to do now since i stopped going. Frankly, spending my hard earned to see some skiving,often bottling, journeyman getting over 80-100 K a week without as much as muddying his shorts isnt something i can accept anymore.

  26. Tony Evans

    Jun 25, 2013, 14:02 #36033

    Ron - I know you go back with Arsenal even longer than me - I have been a fan since 1970 - and like you I also doubt the newer supporters, that have taken to Arsenal since 1997, will last even half that time. For myself I am not sure if I will ever rediscover the passion I had for the club. I certainly won't under Wenger and am 'treading water' until he leaves. Never thought it would be possible for me to be so disinterested about something that has been such a large part of my life. As you say though it is not just Arsenal, but football in general that is such a turn off at the moment.

  27. Ron

    Jun 25, 2013, 13:26 #36032

    Hi Tony - Yes, old sods arent we!! Seriosuly though, football has cleansed itself but in doing so has sold itself to the new type 'fan' and bared its back side to the whimsy of the TV companies who now 'own' football in truth, hence the new type Club owner comes in and panders to the new fan and the TV and the players in turn extract the max from the booty available. Its a bubble that will burst as sure as houses and i cant wait till it does. By then many, if not most, of the fans who've stuck by the Club for decades will have long since gone and wont be willing to go back.Its a given that a large section of the modern fans arent there for life, arent there via Dads and Unc s etc, theyre there cos its trendy to be at football and to add the 'im an Arsenal fan' label to their well heeled corporate or otherwise nondescript persona. They ll be gone in a puff of wind, believe me. Many already have, but right now a new set of tarquins is still stepping up to fill the void they leave still, to a degree,duped by the Clubs spin and balls. I had some use of that Club level for a couple of years after it opened and by end of 07/08, hardly any of the originals were using it (could have been poisened by appalling that free 'beer' i suppose!)Lsst year the Club e mailed red members trying to flog season tickets in the rubbish seats, 2000 miles above the earths surface at top prices. It will be interesting to see if the same reds get the same offer soon. A mate of mine whos a silver (24 years a fan) never had an offer, such is the lunacy of that membership scheme they run. Such is my dissilusionment with football generally, not just Arsenal, that ive been listening to Tony Admas comments lately and for a fleeting few moments thought he was talking sense. There s a first! Hope im not in terminal mental decline mate!!

  28. BADARSE

    Jun 25, 2013, 13:10 #36031

    Hi Ron, both you and Tony Evans echo my sentiments, and, dare I be so bold, those of probably all older Gooners, but also of many not so old too. Even the young, who have seen no different must think we are talking, and reflecting on something good. These are the ones to pity. In all things the young are short-changed. The powers that be, everywhere, know humanity rides a moving conveyor belt to oblivion. Once they get rid of the current crop, the newcomers will know no better. It's an oft repeated scenario, and will continue to be so. In this I am not saying surrender. I have said before, if I was about to be run through with a lance, and certain death was coming, I would still try to spit in the person's eye. No surrender! However recognise your strengths and weaknesses. What you may achieve, and what you definitely will not. With all the criticism on here about Arsene Wenger's poor management skills, we must have an army out there who know exactly how to manage such a simple problem.

  29. Tony Evans

    Jun 25, 2013, 12:44 #36030

    Ron - I think many older supporters will agree with what you say. Football has changed enormously since I used to attend on a regular basis - many good changes of course but when I think of the amazing atmosphere on the North Bank compared to the sterile environment we have at the Emirates now it makes me yearn for times gone by.

  30. Ron

    Jun 25, 2013, 10:12 #36029

    Hi Lads. The stuff on the modern fan is indeed very apt. Stick to the away games guys as there you ll see the last remnants of what support used to be about, minus the violence of course. I dread the day when most of the Clubs have new stadia and as such become as souless and sterile as the Grove is as going to away venues still creates the gritty and earthy feel of what football should never have been allowed to lose.Lets face it, the very name 'the emirates' speaks volumes about whats priority for the Club and how the fans are secondary. Just my view guys. I know times have changed and in some ways for the better, but surely not in every way for the 'ordinary' fan, as he endures his 'match day experience'. What a joke that is!

  31. BADARSE

    Jun 25, 2013, 7:54 #36028

    And maguiresbridge gooner, you are definitely not a 'goner', in my opinion, haha. As stated a number of times on these posts, I am in accord with the urgency of many, who I don't exactly share identical opinions with, on some issues. I do recognise the passions that drive them though, they are mirror-images of my own. You figure high in my esteem buddy.

  32. BADARSE

    Jun 25, 2013, 7:38 #36027

    Morning campers! Rocky RIP, maguiresbridge goner, let me stress, in case a vital understanding is missed. I am with the pair of you, in terms of irritation. In fact beyond you! At different times over the years have been regarded as a 'Victor Meldrew,' a 'Grumpy Old Man', and any teasing, sometimes cutting appellation available.I wear two main hats. The reasonable, logical and sensible observer, and the crazed, impatient individual, raging at the system. Both are me, and both are being dragged kicking and screaming into the future, when I am still at war with lots of the present. Rocky RIP, you would like to rid our stadium of the troublesome types you describe. I do understand, but you would only rid them from our stadium, they would still exist, and would seep back in under a different disguise, one way or another. Be careful of draconian measures, this is how the Nazis began their power-surge, by offering palliatives in one hand and holding a claw behind their backs. Ban? Prohibit? Outlaw? How would either of you combat the problem? That is your task for the day. Either of you, knowing I dislike the situation, charge you to find a solution, without taking away liberty. Remember, the governments of the world, including, and often especially our own, are trying their damndest to remove any freedoms we enjoy, all under the cloak of security, (this is the description I gave of the Nazis' modus operandi). So don't rid them on my behalf, if it means I can't leave my seat during a match if I need to, or cannot return with a snack, etc. Think this may be a tricky one for you, guys. Imagine I am your buddy who is beside you, who desperately needs a toilet visit, or have come straight from work, and am starving.

  33. Rocky RIP

    Jun 24, 2013, 22:49 #36026

    @maguiresbridge - absolutely spot on about the hotdog. How can people think about food when the pit of your stomach is churning with nerves in a big game?! I know of a dedicated fan who's been banned for a few years for using one-off industrial language. (At football? No way!) Personally, given the choice between banning a) someone shouting a brief volley of expletives at Adebayor during a NLD, or b) banning someone for persisting in arriving late and placing greater emphasis on the hot dog than the game, (and also grassing up person a) via the revolting text service at our club.) The choice is obvious. b) is far, far more offensive and I'd love to rid them of our home games. BADARSE - the effort to rid the game of a certain element has also seen off a number of a certain calibre of more passionate, vocal fan. Many people don't appreciate paying a fair whack to sit in a sterile atmosphere and be told to pipe down by the new breed calling the shots. That's where I have a beef. I refuse to bend to the will of these people who weren't around when football was unfashionable. As you say, things evolve. Hopefully the game will discover the value of its connection with its core supporters. Or risk games being played in an increasingly tepid atmosphere.

  34. BADARSE

    Jun 24, 2013, 22:45 #36025

    Well maguiresbridge gooner, as I said to Rocky RIP, the world has turned, and will continue to rotate. Many will fall off the merry -go- round, some may jump. The ones left behind will be just that, left behind! The acceleration of change is the crux of the problem. We are used to our hair growing imperceptibly, so slowly that we cannot tell, if it suddenly sprouted and began growing to our shoulders, we would automatically be immediately alarmed. The speed of change is 'doing' for us all. If you went a hundred years into the past, it would be an alien world. Forget the romanticism, you would be different to the rest and they would stone you, out of fear. It's what's happening all around right now, but in an insidious fashion, and at seemingly, the speed of light. Frightening? You bet! The only remedy is to try to assimilate. Absorb as much as you can, get used to it, understand why it happens and keep in step with it. The only other alternative is madness. Now, back to whether Arsene should go, or stay...

  35. maguiresbridge gooner

    Jun 24, 2013, 22:19 #36024

    Rocky RIP, of course nobody condones violence, but it was something similar that got me going on this, were any of these guys from the 80's still around,what was their story, you could be standing beside them in the pub or in the ground (providing their still not banned) and not know it, and if i did i wouldn't be treating them as heroes or celebrities but i'd have no problem in having a pint with them as i'm sure they wouldn't be like the typical fan of today you mention. (you forgot to include going out every fifteen minutes for another hotdog)maybe these are the real JCL'S that we keep hearing about.

  36. BADARSE

    Jun 24, 2013, 20:26 #36023

    Rocky RIP. Thanks, a nice response. I know you weren't glorifying violence, or getting excited by it. It does quicken the pulse though, thank our genetics for that! Yes the two types you describe exist, of course. The day tripper is a natural phenomenon nowadays, not just in football, but in many other areas, sporting or otherwise. Life is being marketed; most think their lives are a widescreen production, and demand a 'once in a lifetime!' event, over and over. So it's quite normal to go to the Arsenal, especially if you are a tourist with 'plenty of cash to splash'. It only affects you - us, as it becomes more common, that's true of everything, from depletion of fish stocks, to depletion of the ozone layer. We have moved on. The days of the flatcap have vanished, so too has the time of the bootboys, whether passionate or not. We are living a passing fancy, which is traumatic and saddening, if you cannot move, and change with the times. You have to try to shake free buddy. You can mourn for what was, but that damned clock keeps ticking. You are a bright kiddy Rocky RIP, it's obvious in your posts, and I'm probably not telling you anything that you don't already know, the best I can do is shine a light on the subject, and stand with you. We had to rid ourselves of one, and it invited in the other. Dynamics at play! Remember the bootboys were newcomers once. They too disturbed the natural order. Things, football included, will continue to evolve, new 'types' will drift onto, and off the scene. You just have to keep perspective, and ride with the punches. Passion comes in many guises, as do all human emotions. One for you. My mum, dead now, was taken to hospital. My wife and I had tickets for '95 Parc des Princes Final. We kept it from her, but had to go. We visited her in hospital, drove straight to Paris, watched the game, drove straight back to hospital. She was unaware we'd been. Now that's not a 'quickening of the blood' passion, but it was of it's genre. Then there was that last minute goal to come to terms with, am still working on that one!

  37. Rocky RIP

    Jun 24, 2013, 19:30 #36022

    Also - I didn't intend to steam roller over messages of condolences to Alister Campbell. Sorry if it seemed disrespectful, I was just following on from a conversation in another thread and hadn't fully read this article. I never knew or met Alister, but I'd like to add my condolences.

  38. Rocky RIP

    Jun 24, 2013, 18:55 #36021

    @BADARSE - fair comments mate. The conversation began with me referencing fond Highbury memories, and mentioning a not so pleasant one in May '82. I wouldn't call it a 'sneaking admiration', as I find the glorification of people such as the Krays and The Richardsons or other violent criminals completely misguided. It's a fascinating topic I suppose, but when you see films about them or the great train robbers, (one who coshed a train driver so that he never recovered from head injuries and died a few years later)and they are portrayed as heroes, then it's misguided. In the case of notorious members of the herd from the 1980s, I was just wondering who was still around. Many of our hardcore lot have been banned/driven out of home games. Our fanbase has changed so much, the game from back then seems so far removed it's become unrecognisable. Given the choice between a typical fan today who arrives 10 mins late chomping on a hot dog clutching a bag of merchandise, sits on their hands all game, offers no vocal support, takes pictures of their grinning mate as we are losing 1-0 on 78 mins, tells someone to sit down and leaves 10 mins early with their back to the game..or...a fan who is so passionate it has spilled over into trouble and they are prepared to fight for their club. I've grown to dislike the former so badly, that the latter don't seem quite so bad. I know of one guy (rightly) banned by the club, who has his passport removed for European aways. He booked a holiday in Greece when we played in Paris 2006, so that he could have his passport back, claiming he was going somewhere sunny with the family, when really he was off to Paris. He was prepared to fork out on a holiday flight he was never intending to go on. Nobody will convince me this guy doesn't care passionately about Arsenal. Now, I'm not condoning violence, or even thinking it's one v the other. I'm merely comparing the two breeds of fan and am left wondering who I'd rather have around in the stadium. One that is dispassionate, leave their seat empty most of the season, likely to groan, leave early and dampen the atmosphere; or one that is vocal, edgy and intensely passionate. I know it's not a straight forward choice, but the modern breed of fan that has found its way into The Emirates has left me wondering which I'd prefer. With the dark days came a solidarity among fans so lacking now and intense atmospheres I really miss. The ideal is passionate, die hard fans without the violence, I know, but in an effort to rid certain types of fans, we've invited in another all together different breed.

  39. maguiresbridge gooner

    Jun 24, 2013, 13:10 #36020

    LJB,It's spin mate just another excuse for failure,and it's still being lapped up.

  40. BADARSE

    Jun 24, 2013, 10:00 #36019

    I disagree Nilz21.A Champion's League win is not all it's cracked up to be,a Europa Cup win is even less;as an FA Cup to a League Cup win,perhaps.A cup win can degenerate into a lottery.You can qualify,by what would have been considered default,when I was younger,by finishing fourth!A champion?No,as the pundits on this site will be only too happy to tell you,an also-ran!Group games loaded in your favour,seeding,then the real test.Yet against whom?The usual suspects!The moneymen,the high-rollers,or put another way,the advantaged.You play,as you play,on the night.Even penalties can come to your aid,with a garland denoting,'Champions of Europe.'It's pretend.Wonderful to win,great to parade it on your C.V,even as a fan,but to put you into an exclusive,career-defining group,to acclaim you as,'One of the best in the world',I think not.Remember,'A cat can always look at a king',(they remain a cat though).

  41. BADARSE

    Jun 24, 2013, 9:42 #36018

    Rocky RIP,your post to maguiresbridge gooner talks of an Arsenal circumstance that I know little about,apart from when reality came crashing in around me, on a few occasions over the years,whilst supporting the Arsenal.I have a wider knowledge,stretching into other grubby and dark areas,both of physicality,and mentality.You would not want to go there,trust me buddy.Yes the mild-mannered persona is often evident, in an everyday existence, in many of these people,that is a key element that makes them so dangerous.They don't follow the rules,they operate to different guidelines,and accepted standards.These are elementary descriptions of a deep psychosis.Lack of empathy figures high on the list,smiling,buying you a drink doesn't.The good lad cheering next to you happens to be a wife-beater,the other one is a religious nut,he is a racist.Rational,or irrational behaviour in different situations is a capability of all,those who carry it to the extreme are often damaged products.Step back from a sneaking admiration Gooner,people like you are the ones to be admired.

  42. Nilz21

    Jun 24, 2013, 9:36 #36017

    A champions league medal or international silverware is required for any manager to be claimed as one of the best in the world. That is all

  43. BADARSE

    Jun 24, 2013, 9:22 #36016

    A nice and simple perspective JAMIE. We know how easy it is to take facts,overlay our points and produce a supporting conclusion.Skewing the facts with an air of,'...ah,yeah but..',just muddies the waters.I think what we see on these pages,is the exchange of posts from opposite poles.Perhaps the best we might attain is some kind of recognition that people see things differently,a mutual respect is given,albeit reluctantly,and the discussions seem that we are speaking with less cottonwool in our mouths.

  44. LJB

    Jun 24, 2013, 0:31 #36015

    I don't know where this propaganda that Wenger has had no money to spend comes from, but the fact is that he spent almost 70 mill (yes,the same amount he supposedly has this summer) in 2011, and 40 mill last summer.The problem is he spent it on inferior players.I mean Santos was so bad he had to buy another LB,Gervinho is garbage,Giroud dreadful,Mertesacker,Poldolski and Arteta way passed their best and the Ox he never plays.In addition,he should have bought ISCO last summer from Malaga instead of Cazorla.I cannot believe that there is another manager who would buy such a ridiculous collection of players with the amount of money available to Wenger over recent seasons.He has completely lost his eye for a player and is being outwitted by younger men like Rodgers and AVB.Still,lets keep our soon to be bus pass carrying manager, with his outdated style of management and inability to adapt to the tactics of the modern game, because he once won a few trophies almost a decade ago. Whats the betting he even f**ks up the Higuain deal over a few million quid,and goes with Sanogo the postman instead,who was rubbish in the u20WC,definately no better than Afobe so whats the point? Still,Miyachi and Joel campbell will win us the League,yawn.

  45. JAMIE

    Jun 23, 2013, 22:18 #36014

    Two versions but the same outcome. 1.Arsenal finished the season off in terrific form first they outclassed and destroyed the to be European Champions Bayern Munich on their own soil before going on a devastating run of ten games in which only the champions Man Utd and high flying Everton managed a point against them.Their defence was the best in the Premiership away from home all season and they were the only team to register 4 players hitting double figures in goals scored. They look dead certs for a real challenge for the title next season. Or scenario 2.(The AMG view) Arsenal were outclassed by an awesome Bayern Munich at the Emerites the second leg was all but a formality and not really worth playing. They also limped to fourth in an unconvincing end of season, which saw them beat a list poor nothing teams with the 8-2 defeat 2 seasons ago against Man Utd still reverberating in the back of their minds. Wenger should be ashamed that he cannot brush aside paupers like Chelsea, Man City and Man Utd and the clueless man should resign as he will definitely finish 11th next season as he only signs second rate French Ligue One players.

  46. BADARSE

    Jun 23, 2013, 19:49 #36013

    R C Sproul,it is far easier to break a window,than to make one.What may appear a persuasive argument on the surface is not always relevant.Much is made of the negatives,if that is the remit of the poster concerned.In all honesty,most of the points are perhaps valid,or in a ballpark area,it's the remedy I generally disagree with.If my wife listed all my failings and faults,then every woman may think I'm a clot,wheras if she listed my good points everyone would realise I am an absolute charmer.It will remain easy to tear down,rather than build up.Anyone can rattle cages,just as I am doing.

  47. R C Sproul

    Jun 23, 2013, 19:44 #36012

    Boring Boring Peter Wain.

  48. Peter Wain

    Jun 23, 2013, 19:40 #36011

    Well Sproul if you read you will see that I did not say we lost 8-2 to United this season. The players we bought such as Giroud and Podolski were major signings for us when they were bought. They cost over £20 million in total and were the main purchases last year. Also people like you who make a virtue of gaining 26 point out of 30 and do not consider either the performance or quality of opposition are naive to assume that this shows improvement and that we can challenge for the title next year. The fact is any reasonable assessemnt of last seasons squad would show that unless considerable investment takes place we will not be challenging for honours in the immediate future. What ever way you spin it Bradford and Blackburn results happened last season under this management and the 8-2 happened in the previous season.

  49. BADARSE

    Jun 23, 2013, 19:38 #36010

    R C Sprout,you are not alone.

  50. R C Sproul

    Jun 23, 2013, 18:20 #36009

    Peter Wain and his ilk even like to turn an end of season 26 out of 30 points haul into a negative. In fact there's some folk on here who never come out with any thing positive or uplifting about Arsenal. He also calls it spin to have achieved this feat, yes something that was actually achieved is spin, it's quite remarkable. Whilst he himself predicts a mid-table finish for Arsenal which even the most pessimistic fan would find amazing. Another favourite of these people is to trot out results that never even happened last season ie. the 8-2 and go through the squad players as failures as if they were major signings. If folk like Wain gave a fairer appraisal the more would be willing to listen until then it's you sir who are the master of spin.

  51. John Gooner

    Jun 23, 2013, 11:27 #36008

    If Wenger is planning to leave he certainly isn't the right person to be leading the club's transfer dealings.

  52. BADARSE

    Jun 23, 2013, 10:26 #36007

    HowardL,it seems '3',really is the magic number.I floated a question the other day on a post,asking which three positions should we endeavour to strengthen.I think three is a reasonable,and expected number.The quality has to be right,of course,but at last the posts are beginning to sound a little more positive.Let's hope Higuain puts pen to paper,as many are starting to deem his transfer a 'nailed on',certainty.We could have a recoil reaction if it falls through.Not quite'holding breath'time at the moment,but we can all sense a stirring.

  53. Peter Wain

    Jun 23, 2013, 9:35 #36006

    For all the people on this board who say careful what you wish for and Arsene is a great manager as PSG want him I would ask when should he be accountable. On the basis of the last eight years he is responsible for purchases of a succession of below average players, indecision in the transfer market and rank misjudgements of horrendous proportions. How else can you descibe the purchases of Chamak,Gervinho, Squllaci, Arshavin,Giroud, Podolski and fatty Santos. Lots of money spent on poor quality players given long contracts on high wages which means they are unsaleable and stupid statements made about the quality of the squad the difficulty of signing players and the impossibility of signing better quality than we already have. Couple this with an abysmal academy and some truly awfull results such as 8-2 at Old Trafford and this seasons capitulation at Old Traffold and I wonder why people get so upset about questions concerning the manager. Is he not responsible for all of the playing and coaching staff? Poeple say we have not had the money but what we have spent we have wasted andw e have paid too much in salaries to dross such as Bendtnerand Denilson. Once again we are having to suffer the spin of the last 10 games undefeated when in reality we were poor and fortunate against Fulham, awful against a weak QPR side and the two games we did not win were against the two quality sides we played Everton and Man United and both were at home. Again the manager used these statistics to argue we do not need much and seemingly not learning from repeated mistakes Wenger goes out and gives a 4 year contract to a young striker who has suffered two broken legs.Now this maybe an inspired selection but based on the past 8 years you have to doubt it. I presume the purchase is made so that Diaby has someone to talk to in the recovery room. Despite all of the pr by the snake oil salesman the fact is we have not bought anyone of any significance for many years and this transfer window is remarkable as it is so similar to the previous four six or eight. Lots of talk pre-season ticket renewal about how we have learnt from previous windows we are going to do our business early ( i think that means on the 30 August rather than the 31 August) and how we can buy anyone we want. Links with a succession of players and doubts from Wneger concerning their valuation. Is Fellani worth £23 million Wenger doubts it so we dither. Will we buy Higuain? And are these the only two players we are after. Why are we not bidding for the Dortmund centre forward why are we not buying a decent goal keeper when Begovic and Mignolet are available. Where is the world class defender we so deperately need when we have a manager who clearly has no idea about defensive tactics or the inclination to coach the defence. So will we meander along to the end of the transfer window and end up panic buying what is left and what is not very good? Buying Higuain must be the first step in rebuilding the first team squad but with this manager you get the feeling that the only other additions will be French second division players. I despair of the management of the club I have watched since the 50s as I can see nothing but mid table mediocrity beckoning over the next three years with Wenger in charge. Careful what you wish for indeed!!!

  54. HowardL

    Jun 23, 2013, 9:18 #36005

    I agree Higuain, Fellaini, possibly Rooney - maybe even "The return of Cesc" would give a massive uplift and certainly justify my season ticket renewal. Otherwise the Ticket Exchange may find itself overworked.

  55. ppp

    Jun 22, 2013, 20:52 #36003

    It's really important we make 3 big sigings and probably at least 2 more that aren't well known but who Wenger trusts as back up. If we do - it's going to be a far far better season than we've become used to recently. I'm trusting Arsene and the club to make it happen.

  56. BADARSE

    Jun 22, 2013, 16:35 #36001

    JAMIE,I just want to say this,the balance of negativity on this site, a 2:1 ratio against the views we roughly share,is not representative.Most of the people on here are definitely Gooners,if not all,one or two rascals may fly in under the radar,but that is all.I have found pretty much all of them to be on the ball in general,when it comes to assessing our state at AFC.I just disagree on minor points and the way we need to approach that problem.Some are pretty savvy,make no mistake,but again I stress they are not representative in their numbers.Tacky?Oilers,Chavs,Barstardlona,Franco's Real,the Russian mobsters,now PSG and Monaco,it's a quagmire of corruption,(wow,I sound like Ian Paisley,and I am a humanist),and I don't want my Arsenal sullied.So no Usmanov,or Kroenke spending to buy success.We can gripe if we want,but I prefer to see what any transfers may bring.Stay with it Gooner.

  57. Danny

    Jun 22, 2013, 16:01 #36000

    kevin, good article as always. Wenger will never leave and buy great players, not until we get all FANS chanting his heads at each game plus the AST has given him a 70% approval rating. Idiots! the summer is going to be painful,as the only signings will be Youths and Wenger signing his contract. may the good lord help us!, because this season it be is going to the same.

  58. JAMIE

    Jun 22, 2013, 16:01 #35999

    Too much negative bull it seems everybody has an opinion on everything these days. Better sometimes to just sit back and let thing's unfold. Tacky teams like Madrid, Barca, Chelski, City change their managers every year because that is what their plastic fans desire. Arsenal have their own plastics known as AMG's who would like Arsenal to join in with this madness. Lucky for us most Arsenal fans have their feet firmly on the ground and would never like to see Arsenal go the way of these quick fixers. I would still trust the Arsenal hierarchy more than any others in the modern game.

  59. BADARSE

    Jun 22, 2013, 11:53 #35998

    Gaz,you and me too buddy,'Forward'.

  60. Izuchi Enyinnaya

    Jun 22, 2013, 10:48 #35997

    My only response to the AMGs is simple Be careful what you ask for,you might just ge it. God help you if it goes all awry after he must have gone that is not to say Arsene is the best coach in the world,but I can't count many who could churn out results with the crop of players we have at the moment. They are average players and I accept that,but I hope you can muster the kind of cash that will attract the likes of morinho to coach Arsenal when he(Arsene) is gone By the way I don't believe a word about the PSG stuff,we've been hearing these stories since 2005 and that shows you that Arsene is a great manager and always touted by top European clubs. But I have reason to believe that Wenger will retire at Arsenal just like Fergie....and he is not the kind of man that runs when the going gets tough. Someone said we had the money all along but wenger refused to spend...Seriously? Do you believe yourself? Or have we been blinded by pure hatred for a man who has done nothing but bring Arsenal to be accounted amongst the tops in Europe and kept us at respectable position in the league even at the most critical time of our club (as a result os servicing loans for the Emirates stadium) Arsene has gone down in the History as Arsenals most successful manager. his legacies are there for all to see and am sure it will take some beating. Finally,the clubs fortune is turning around,we are close to signing sponsorship deals worth millions of pounds,and the future is looking bright. Am sure Arsenal will be a force to reckon with in the next 2 to 3 seasons. That's your problem if you don't share in my excitement. But the future is bright,and the future is with Arsene because he orchestrated everything and the least AMGs could do is give him some credit not to frustrate him out of office. Finally, a house divided against itself cannot stand. It is time for us all to bury the hatchet and support the team whole heartedly to the next level Izuchi( In Arsene we trust) Enyinnaya

  61. garyfootscrayaustralia

    Jun 22, 2013, 4:52 #35996

    @Howard L - I have no idea if Spurs fans can write. Monkeys can type something legible, if not necessarily coherent, when stationed at a keyboard for long enough though (cue Bale gag).

  62. Alsace Lorraine de Totteridge

    Jun 21, 2013, 22:34 #35995

    Kevin, I'm very sorry that you lost your friend. The Great Hornby says that everyone thinks that they will die at the end of the football season, but most don't. What a shame that he didn't live to hear that there is hope that Wenger will be gone this time next year. On the other hand, of what importance is football compared to the loss of a friend. On another matter, I learned this evening that the EPL is seeking an Order to shut down a Swedish Website that streams live EPL matches for Free. One wonders idly whether they have any conception of how very much they and their bloated buddies, the players, their agents and the pay per view broadcasters are hated. Not content with stealing the working man's game, they want to wrap it up all for themselves. I hope that the Court tells them to get stuffed. I look forward to the day when the lot of them are skint, and we go back to watching football for fun.

  63. maguiresbridge gooner

    Jun 21, 2013, 22:18 #35994

    ApolloGooner, excellent couple of shouts especially the first.

  64. Gaz

    Jun 21, 2013, 21:08 #35993

    @BADARSE: I just hope we make these signings or this love-in will come to an abrupt end!!!

  65. Gaz

    Jun 21, 2013, 20:45 #35992

    @Apollogooner: Can't argue with any of that. Agree with every single word.

  66. BADARSE

    Jun 21, 2013, 20:36 #35991

    Gaz,you are on the money,champ.You haven't given too much of yourself away,rightly so,but you have left that big,heavy wooden door ajar.You know what?I don't think we will ever know for sure the financial machinations,which have existed within the club these last few years.I also believe Arsene's inflexibility has compounded the problems.Yet I do believe he is a victim of circumstance.The world has turned,the ground has shifted,and what he once knew suddenly became unfamiliar to him.The cries for him to fall on his sword are naieve and unrealistic.Would you,or any of those howling for his blood,like banshees,have walked away from a challenge?A man of strong convictions always believes he is close to turning the tide.Perhaps this season he will.His place in AFC history is assured.It would be nice to have a golden gleam on his contribution, as he walked away for the last time,rather than a ternished one.The future will tell us,and that future is accelerating towards us as we post.

  67. ApolloGooner

    Jun 21, 2013, 20:35 #35990

    Gaz, I totally agree it would be great if we could all forget our differences. This split between fans is something I never envisaged would happen and it is perhaps the saddest thing of all that it did ... and that it has lasted so long. I see your point about both sides being able to say they have been proved right if we finally buy quality this summer. My personal view is that the money has been available to spend for a long time However, I accept I could be wrong on this. But then if I am wrong - and if the money wasn’t there to spend – then surely that was all the more reason surely for Wenger to have spent more time on the training ground working on tactics and motivation, getting 100% from his players etc. to maximise our chances of success. The effort and application part of the game is totally free so there is no excuses for how Wenger and his players have failed so often in that respect. I am tired of the fighting between us though and clearly you and others are too. It would be fantastic if something positive was to happen that would unite us all and stop the bickering and point scoring. The only thing I can think of in recent years that did this was the Ramsey injury. Lets hope the club finally delivers in the transfer market this summer to take our minds off the negativity that, in truth, the club are mostly to blame for.

  68. Big Andy

    Jun 21, 2013, 20:06 #35989

    I've got a feeling that those reports about Wenger to PSG next year are spot on. He prides himself on the fact that he has never broken a contract, but I think he wants to go home and to a club where he could realise his dream of winning the Champions League. A year more at the Grove then he's off. But the club shouldn't allow it. He should either sign a new contract this summer or go now. Personally, I would prefer it if he went now. By the way: Higuain alone will not solve our problems. We need at least three more top-quality players to turn us into potential champions.

  69. Gaz

    Jun 21, 2013, 19:47 #35988

    @Apollogooner: The point you make about Kev 'being proven right' is an interesting one and its something we were discussing at work earlier. For me if we buy really well I'm hoping it gives fans from both ends of the 'support' to think they were right and then perhaps we could start getting along again! I mean the 'pro-Wenger' lobby could say they were right all along to wait and the 'anti-Wenger' lobby could say the Club have finally started doing what they've wanted for the last three years! I'm sure we'll argue whether the money's been there or not for those three years and of course there's the question as to whether or not Wengers managing is-and always has been-the main problem all along anyway. Whatever happens I know this. IF-and I'm still scepticle-we sign Higuain AND Fellani (and/or Rooney) the buzz it'll give the whole Club might just make us forget about our differences for a while.

  70. Peter Wain

    Jun 21, 2013, 19:45 #35987

    the only good thing about this transfer window so far is that we have let a lot of dross go and Marseille may bid for Gervinho. Personally I give him away he is that bad.

  71. BADARSE

    Jun 21, 2013, 19:44 #35986

    Seven Kings Gooner,I know we disagree on the fundamental issue of 'should Arsene stay or go?'but I have to compliment you on your last post to Wez.You put out some difficult to answer criticisms,and put the case well.I think it's about more than just listing the demerits,but I do understand how,with your view,shared by the majority who post,how frustrating the current situation appears.C'est la vie! as we say in the Arsene camp.(only teasing buddy).

  72. Carlos

    Jun 21, 2013, 19:34 #35985

    @38735. We have no edge over Chelsea, Man Utd or Man City. So who exactly does Wenger give us an edge over? Spurs, Liverpool, Everton? With our financial clout we should be miles in front of these teams, not looking over our shoulders come the run-in to every season. A good manager would give us the edge over teams like the three that finished above us. When discussing the validity of measuring wages against achievement, the manager's apologists conveniently forget two things. Firstly that Utd under Ferguson have consistently out-performed their neighbours and Chelsea over the last 10 years despite having leeches as owners, and also that there was a time when we competed with Utd. We had a top manager back then.

  73. Arsenal4Life

    Jun 21, 2013, 18:53 #35984

    If we lose Wenger to PSG it would be a bigger catastrophy than the loss of Cesc, Van Persie and Nasri combined. Losing Wenger, who is still the best manager in Europe, would take the last edge we have over the other Teams....

  74. Seven Kings Gooner

    Jun 21, 2013, 18:30 #35983

    Wez : It is about opinion, just because I disagree with you it does n't mean I'd accuse you of being on Arsenal's payroll. Not everyone with a different opinion to you, about Arsenal, are Spud's supporters. I happen to think that Kev is spot on about the current state of Arsenal, I arrived at that opinion a few years ago after our 1-2 defeat at Stoke, we were awful that day but that was not the reason I stopped going to Arsenal matches after that day. I stopped attending matches, because that afternoon we were cowards, we were frightened of Stoke and that was enough for me. I am not going back until we have a team of real men, I can put up with losing and finishing outside the top four, providing we graft and battle. The last 10 games were an improvement, but be fair, we played teams who we should have beaten. We played two teams at home who were in the top 6 and dropped points against both of them, so there is still much to do and many of us think that someone else, other than Wenger, will have to do it.

  75. ApolloGooner

    Jun 21, 2013, 18:09 #35982

    Kevin, a good read as always. But with regard to Wenger proving you wrong, it cannot happen mate. That is because what we've seen in the 4 years since 2009 has ALREADY proved you were right! If Wenger spends money on quality this summer (a big IF), introduces some proper tactics & organisation, plays a different system which gets the best out of his players, makes sure they are fully motivated for every game etc. ... then has a successful season as a result of all this ... it is WENGER who should be eating humble pie, not his critics! Because those are some of the things we have been desperate for him to do all along. And he had enough chances and enough resources to have done them all. He chose not to and also decided against freshening up his coaching staff. He has failed miserably since we moved stadiums and at the same time had a detrimental effect on the ethos and culture of the whole club. Even many of our fans have a losing mentality which is why he still has so many willing to back him. I want to club to succeed whoever the manager is. But the past few years of failure cannot be re-written or wiped out by the future, no matter what happens.

  76. HowardL

    Jun 21, 2013, 17:33 #35981

    Can Tottenham fans write?

  77. Wez

    Jun 21, 2013, 16:27 #35980

    I find your constant scathing of wenger strange. It clearly goes beyond the football side of things. The man has done an incredible job of keeping us competitive at a time of growth by the club. Growth can only be sustained over a long period by meticulous planning and sensible management. I stopped buying the gooner when the whole atmosphere of the publication changed three to four years ago. It is no longer a fanzine, and you no longer represent the views of the fans. It used to be a lighthearted look at life as an arsenal fan, with some good articles thrown in to make it accessible for all. Now the agenda is so anti-arsene and anti-arsenal that it could almost be written by tottenham fans. I saw this link and thought I would see if anything has changed. It has not. So along with many others, my belief is that the gooner is no longer worth the server or paper it is written on.

  78. Tobias

    Jun 21, 2013, 16:00 #35979

    Kevin. Arsene claims he is against financial doping but do you know, that it was Wenger who advised PSG on the Qatar takeover? Do you also know he still owns shares in the club? Strange for a man of 'such principle' hmmm? If Arsene Wenger does go to PSG, I will drive him to the Eurostar myself and it will go down as the happiest day of my life in football! Kevin one thing: Arsene can never 'prove you wrong'. Any manager that goes over 8 years without winning a single thing, and who is trailing managers like Alex McLeish, Steve McLaren, Roberto Martinez and even useless Redknapp in trophy tallies over that period...well the argument is dead. Higuain? He alone is nowhere near enough to make a difference IF he signs. It does not address the pathetic goalkeeper. It does not make Mertesacker run any faster. It does not make Walcott a better crosser of the ball or make Podolski able to beat a man. Arsenal's full backs are both mediocre (Sagna was once great). In defensive midfield it is a total shambles and I do not see the point of Arteta. It will need defensive midfield like Fellaini. And it will also need another quality striker because Giroud is utter rubbish. Higuain is often injured and IF he signed, once he is injured it is back to Giroud or Klingon Gervinho. The whole MENTALITY is the key thing here though Kevin. Wenger's 'shift' in mentality only came when his precious 4th place virtual trophy was on the line. Why did he not adapt it after losing 8-2 at Old Trafford? Or after Bradford? Or after Blackburn? Or after Norwich away? Or after Chelski away? He waited until his virtual trophy was in danger. He will NEVER CHANGE! Wake up. Get real. 8 years of doing the same arrogant incompetent nonsense - what will change? He is unaccountable, paid a ridiculous 7.5 mil salary for winning nothing and mismanages the squad tactically. Cesc said this week he had to 'step up a level and learn tactically' the minute he went to Barca. Tells you EVERYTHING. Wenger Out please in 2014. I will gladly pack his bags and dump him on the Eurostar. Eight Years ZERO TROPHIES. AKBs chat away, every close season the AKBs come out with newer and funnier b.s. I will look at the Facts thank you. (8 years, no trophies yet banked 56 mil in salary!)

  79. maguiresbridge gooner

    Jun 21, 2013, 15:55 #35978

    Callum, all this emotion on the pitch and players brought to tears,and this great tightness,mood change,and belief since the invincibles was it before the defeat to Blackburn and Bradford or after.

  80. jjetplane

    Jun 21, 2013, 14:31 #35977

    Wenger after all these years of acting the banker for Arsenal is simply incapable of joining in with the big spenders. For an overpaid employee I imagine he is very frugal away from the Emirate strong box. The PSG stuff is more media muppetry to fill the chasm football is now becoming but maybe Wenger is greedy enough to jump into a bed more soiled than Chelskis' and Citehs' pushed together. As an Arsenal supporter who was there for some of our truly great moments I ask; 'Who gives a flying fudge ..'

  81. CT Gooner

    Jun 21, 2013, 14:04 #35975

    @ Callum, sorry pal, but I don't care what belief the team has in itself, I have no belief in this team. Still no back bone, with many players at their prime or past it. No, Wenger needs to spend all of this war chest (which comes from the most expensive tickets in world football) on quality additions. I've been much happier with the talk of getting rid of the dead weight, but I won't be celebrating til they are out the door....

  82. maguiresbridge gooner

    Jun 21, 2013, 13:57 #35974

    The recruiting of a manager for only a year sounds unusual or maybe not,maybe there's a deal done, an agreement reached and if not it's PSG's way of saying we want you Arsene and we're prepared to wait. What sounds more unusual is if Wenger was going to join them next year why wait, there's a hell of a lot of rebuilding to do at Arsenal before we reach the heights we were once at,and the achievement of his Holy Grail, and he can't hope to do it in a season although with the proper players it would be a lot easier, and certainly Higuain would be a good start but only a start, and the agreement would give him one last tilt at getting it right and he could go out on a high.

  83. Nam

    Jun 21, 2013, 13:30 #35973

    I feel you completely understand the idea of financial doping, which is injecting capital artificially from a wealthy benefactor, beyond the natural means of the club. This idea and definition is why the financial fair-play model took on the shape it did, with the idea of the clubs means at the core of things. Arsenal will be spending well within their means by sensibly using funds developed with care and good business practices and not an "injection of artificial outside capital" which financial doping clearly implies (see Chelsea, QPR, Rangers, Portsmouth, PSG and Manchester City for examples of financial doping).

  84. Callum

    Jun 21, 2013, 13:25 #35972

    I personally don't think you've done enough research on more then enough articles I've read with people from inside the club stating that the mood has completely changed in the emirates and that they haven't seen the same belief in the team since the invincibles. Apparently the team has never been tighter. Have you not witnessed the emotion on the pitch from the players such as Whiltshire brought to tears. They fact that Walcott could have left yet he didn't and the core of our team all signing new contracts. Also with Kos apparently turning down the chance to play at Barcelona and Sagna also apparently turning down psg. I believe in our team and for all the right reasons I now feel the team believe in themselves. A bright and successful future is ahead.